Trump Presidency

[Cackalacky2.0]

As someone who deals with this type of thing regularly with Real Estate developers, the biggest things here is how incompetent DB was in this whole thing. How do you as a major bank, let this kind of thing happen? Surely there will be some sort of charges against them too. The loan compliance department must be in complete shambles because they spend years working on the due diligence of these types of deals.

1) The appraisal of the property is immaterial to this. These sorts of things are done on purchase of the property, and the allocation of the purchase price is done immediately and follows pretty standard guidelines for that area. So there really shouldn't be anything there, other than maybe Trump allocated a disproportionate amount to the building to take advantage of the depreciation in comparison to the land portion which doesn't get any depreciation.

2) The crux of this all is the misrepresentations made by Trump Co. The profitability of the properties was likely investigated for occupancy rates and signed agreements supporting the rent roll amounts. If Trump had shady tenants, or tenants with alternative arrangements these would not be on any supporting schedules for the rent roll. Likely leading to a discrepancy, but wouldn't be material unless there was a decent portion of the tenants part of this.

3) There is likely arrangements that are between multiple Trump co's as tenants that were used to beef up the total rents at these locations. But on tax filings these related co's likely didn't record the same rent figure on their financial statements.

4) The fact the accountants are participating in this is the complete death knell to this case. If he had a shred of credibility they would have been on his side, but they had to release statements saying they were dropping him as a client. I will be interested to see if Trump can find any expert witnesses to try and come up with a valuation to support his figures.

tldr - he is getting GG'd because he and his family are incompetent criminal morons who couldn't run the business his father gifted him. He had to resort to criminal behavior because his other business ventures were so bad that he had to commit fraud on properties in the most valuable spots in the world. Saying this was done for "political misdirection" is copium, a lawsuit like this is built on hard evidence and not brought without that.

So I’m ignorant on these types of thing but if you misrepresented the property value for tax Purposes (lower liability) and misrepresented the value to obtain better financing ( higher property value) isn’t that two separate crimes? Defrauding a lender and also defrauding the IRS?

 

[TorontoGold]

So I’m ignorant on these types of thing but if you misrepresented the property value for tax Purposes (lower liability) and misrepresented the value to obtain better financing ( higher property value) isn’t that two separate crimes? Defrauding a lender and also defrauding the IRS?

You're likely going to have different values between - property tax assessment done by the Gov vs the amount shown on the tax return. Your tax return value shown is going to just be the acquisition cost, you're not going to reassess the value each additional year otherwise you could claim a higher depreciation rate on your returns going forward. The defrauding of the IRS would be done if you had a much higher allocation of the acquisition cost to the depreciable assets (roof/building/parking lot) than what is standard for that property. Any IRS defrauding would be easier to prove than the bank.

TLDR - If he spent $500M on a property and said the land cost was only worth $200K then that would be insane and wrong. Typically I use 5% of purchase price to allocate to the land. So if I looked at his tax filings I would hope to see 5% allocated to his land values.

For the defrauding of the bank that is done with more qualitative inputs such as rents/projections since the value of the property is more dynamic and can be valued at any time. It should be less serious than the IRS defrauding because of how subjective it is, and personally if a bank gets defrauding by billions of dollars that is more of an indictment of horrible that bank is. I just have very little sympathy for how stupid a bank is to fall for this, with how predatory they are with regular folks and the light slap on the wrist they got for 2008/2009.

Obviously crime is bad, but this is like watching Madoff scam WorldCom just a complete shit show of incompetence.

 

[Cackalacky2.0]

I bet they used quicken

 

[Cackalacky2.0]

You're likely going to have different values between - property tax assessment done by the Gov vs the amount shown on the tax return. Your tax return value shown is going to just be the acquisition cost, you're not going to reassess the value each additional year otherwise you could claim a higher depreciation rate on your returns going forward. The defrauding of the IRS would be done if you had a much higher allocation of the acquisition cost to the depreciable assets (roof/building/parking lot) than what is standard for that property. Any IRS defrauding would be easier to prove than the bank.

TLDR - If he spent $500M on a property and said the land cost was only worth $200K then that would be insane and wrong. Typically I use 5% of purchase price to allocate to the land. So if I looked at his tax filings I would hope to see 5% allocated to his land values.

For the defrauding of the bank that is done with more qualitative inputs such as rents/projections since the value of the property is more dynamic and can be valued at any time. It should be less serious than the IRS defrauding because of how subjective it is, and personally if a bank gets defrauding by billions of dollars that is more of an indictment of horrible that bank is. I just have very little sympathy for how stupid a bank is to fall for this, with how predatory they are with regular folks and the light slap on the wrist they got for 2008/2009.

Obviously crime is bad, but this is like watching Madoff scam WorldCom just a complete shit show of incompetence.

I mean I guess I’m curious as to what the criminal exposure is here then because Weiselbwrg plead guilty to 15 felonies related to this investigation. I’d assume he didn’t do anything without being directed by the Trumps.

 

[TorontoGold]

I mean I guess I’m curious as to what the criminal exposure is here then because Weiselbwrg plead guilty to 15 felonies related to this investigation. I’d assume he didn’t do anything without being directed by the Trumps.

So looking at this scorecard this goes towards what I was saying before. A lot of this is just straight up braindead behavior of the Trump org part.

A) This one is going to be tough, as ownership of these properties is likely setup through 10's of webs of org structures so it might be tough to do. Can prove this using a record book produced by his corporate lawyers.
B) This one is qualitative and tough to measure, who knows how far this goes.
C) This is jokes af if true, what a ridiculous claim if they can prove it.
D) How can this even be possible? Does anyone at DB have a pulse?
E) Again - this looks worse and worse for DB, they should be ashamed of themselves for getting duped.
F) This could be up to interpretation but easier to prove given market transactions.
G) Should be fairly easy to prove
H) This is jokes, what a farce
I) See G & H
J) .....how do you not use a DCF model? Literally the value of the company is from continued operations with cash generating units
K) This is jokes, because I'm guessing the value is based on some garbage figure provided by DJT
L) This is where the IRS comes into play, the bank/Gov will look at his tax filings to reconcile his reported income. If he is including speculative income his is inflating his taxable income (which he would never do) so he likely has a significant variance in his tax filings and the valuations. There are deductions he could take if he has deferred income, if he took those deductions without including the total sum of revenue then he would be committing tax fraud.
M) This is something a fresh CPA could identify as an issue. Fixed asset approach is horrendous.
N) Not sure I understand this one. Depends on the purchase deal if it was asset vs share based.
O) Fragile ego led to him committing some light fraud lol
P) This one is the one that'll hit all his businesses because he'll report related party transactions within all the companies but it'll likely not reconcile and screw all his businesses. As well should have some IRS implications here too.

 

[Cackalacky2.0]

So this response is great.

 

[Cackalacky2.0]

So looking at this scorecard this goes towards what I was saying before. A lot of this is just straight up braindead behavior of the Trump org part.

A) This one is going to be tough, as ownership of these properties is likely setup through 10's of webs of org structures so it might be tough to do. Can prove this using a record book produced by his corporate lawyers.
B) This one is qualitative and tough to measure, who knows how far this goes.
C) This is jokes af if true, what a ridiculous claim if they can prove it.
D) How can this even be possible? Does anyone at DB have a pulse?
E) Again - this looks worse and worse for DB, they should be ashamed of themselves for getting duped.
F) This could be up to interpretation but easier to prove given market transactions.
G) Should be fairly easy to prove
H) This is jokes, what a farce
I) See G & H
J) .....how do you not use a DCF model? Literally the value of the company is from continued operations with cash generating units
K) This is jokes, because I'm guessing the value is based on some garbage figure provided by DJT
L) This is where the IRS comes into play, the bank/Gov will look at his tax filings to reconcile his reported income. If he is including speculative income his is inflating his taxable income (which he would never do) so he likely has a significant variance in his tax filings and the valuations. There are deductions he could take if he has deferred income, if he took those deductions without including the total sum of revenue then he would be committing tax fraud.
M) This is something a fresh CPA could identify as an issue. Fixed asset approach is horrendous.
N) Not sure I understand this one. Depends on the purchase deal if it was asset vs share based.
O) Fragile ego led to him committing some light fraud lol
P) This one is the one that'll hit all his businesses because he'll report related party transactions within all the companies but it'll likely not reconcile and screw all his businesses. As well should have some IRS implications here too.

All this stuff is so far beyond me. I d think stuff like this could land you in jail maybe I’m wrong.

 

[Cackalacky2.0]

This just seems criminal

 

[Irish#1]

Saying this was done for "political misdirection" is copium, a lawsuit like this is built on hard evidence and not brought without that.

Good read, thanks. On the above, not saying it’s not without merit. It’s the timing of the PC to keep the focus on Trump.

 

[ab2cmiller]

I'm mostly convinced that Trump's flirtation with running again, is mostly financial so that his supporters will pay his legal bills. Who knows with him though. It's not like he thinks rationally.

 

[TorontoGold]

Good read, thanks. On the above, not saying it’s not without merit. It’s the timing of the PC to keep the focus on Trump.

If you look at it rationally, any extra day they wait to announce it looks worse. So I think it's best if it comes out ASAP.

 

[Cackalacky2.0]

Good read, thanks. On the above, not saying it’s not without merit. It’s the timing of the PC to keep the focus on Trump.

I’d say there is never a good time to have an announcement you are being brought up on bank and tax fraud.

 

[Irish#1]

I’d say there is never a good time to have an announcement you are being brought up on bank and tax fraud.

Agree. If you're the one being brought up, no there's is no good time.

If you look at it rationally, any extra day they wait to announce it looks worse. So I think it's best if it comes out ASAP.

Not sure I agree with this. Heard on the radio they had enough to make this announcement a month ago. There's a lot of politics involved in this.

 

[Cackalacky2.0]

Agree. If you're the one being brought up, no there's is no good time.


Not sure I agree with this. Heard on the radio they had enough to make this announcement a month ago. There's a lot of politics involved in this.

Re timing two things I know happened recently relates to this specific case was that Weiselbwrg recently plead guilty to 15 felonies related to this case and he got a very light sentence with the expectation he cooperated. Secondly Trump Org proffered a settlement with NY recently as well and NYAG declined. I’d think those things would have had a huge implication on when things were decided upon and how to proceed.

 

[Jiggafini19Deux]

Poor Tiffany. She is, once again, left out of everything.

 

[Cackalacky2.0]

Lol

 

[Cackalacky2.0]

Interesting.

 

[Cackalacky2.0]

 

[Cackalacky2.0]

https://www.cnn.com/2022/06/02/politics/read-mark-meadows-texts-january-6-capitol-riot/index.html

It was a coup

 

[Cackalacky2.0]

 

[Cackalacky2.0]

 

[Cackalacky2.0]

Per the latest DOJ inventory list released Trump had 43 empty folders labels as Classified in his possession.

Begs the question….. where are the documents.

 

[ab2cmiller]

LMAO. It's all about the ratings man.

 

[Cackalacky2.0]

LMAO. It's all about the ratings man.

Safety first

 

[ab2cmiller]

Safety first

I guess they do have one committee member from Florida who's district is around Orlando.

 

[TorontoGold]

Safety first

Safety is a woke leftist ideology.

 

[Cackalacky2.0]

 

[Irish#1]

Safety first

They’re not meeting in DC?

 

[Bishop2b5]

The smoking gun Cack has dreamed of for so long...

 

[ulukinatme]