Trump Presidency

[Sea Turtle]

People throw around the Nazi term way to flippantly.

We are talking about the Naionalist Socialist party of Germany. A government that is responsible for killing over 100 million people from 1936-1945. Including over 6 million jews in ovens, gas chambers and mass shootings.

It's disgusting, offensive to the victims and frankly, getting old seeing this term get hung on people.

Even the very few of the 'neo nazis' that exist today are no 'real' nazis. They are troubled youth who are outcasts and looking for somewhere to belong. They would be aghast, vomit and end up in tears if they saw in person what the Naziis(and the soviets in the east)were doing in the 1930's and 1940's.

 

[Cackalacky2.0]

People throw around the Nazi term way to flippantly.

We are talking about the Naionalist Socialist party of Germany. A government that is responsible for killing over 100 million people from 1936-1945. Including over 6 million jews in ovens, gas chambers and mass shootings.

It's disgusting, offensive to the victims and frankly, getting old seeing this term get hung on people.

Even the very few of the 'neo nazis' that exist today are no 'real' nazis. They are troubled youth who are outcasts and looking for somewhere to belong. They would be aghast, vomit and end up in tears if they saw in person what the Naziis(and the soviets in the east)were doing in the 1930's and 1940's.

Estimates that 22 million or 9 percent of Americans are pro neo nazi. It’s not just troubled youths. It’s all ages and all demographics of economic success. And it’s global. Most developed countries have some sort of pro neo nazi organizations.

I recall a GOP ticket a few years back in Illinois where an actual Nazi won the primary. It was in a heavily Democratic area but hey…

But anyway don’t let that spoil a good narrative. I’ll throw it around when I see actual people waving nazi flags at political events. Hey you got nazis at your political event. I seen the video with my own two eyes. Hey a nazi won a GOP primary. Probably ought to do something about that. Like for real.

22 million Americans support neo-Nazis, new poll indicates

Survey was conducted in the wake of deadly violence which ravaged Charlottesville

www.independent.co.uk

 

[GATTACA!]

Estimates that 22 million or 9 percent of Americans are pro neo nazi. It’s not just troubled youths. It’s all ages and all demographics of economic success. And it’s global. Most developed countries have some sort of pro neo nazi organizations.

I recall a GOP ticket a few years back in Illinois where an actual Nazi won the primary. It was in a heavily Democratic area but hey…

But anyway don’t let that spoil a good narrative. I’ll throw it around when I see actual people waving nazi flags at political events. Hey you got nazis at your political event. I seen the video with my own two eyes. Hey a nazi won a GOP primary. Probably ought to do something about that. Like for real.

View attachment 3051111

22 million Americans support neo-Nazis, new poll indicates

Survey was conducted in the wake of deadly violence which ravaged Charlottesville

www.independent.co.uk

Not everyone on the right is a Neo Nazi, but every Neo Nazi is on the right.

 

[Cackalacky2.0]

GOP got Orban scheduled to speak soon.


I mean 😂 If you are gonna normalize and give a platform to Orban then you trending in the wrong direction.

 

[Sea Turtle]

Estimates that 22 million or 9 percent of Americans are pro neo nazi. It’s not just troubled youths. It’s all ages and all demographics of economic success. And it’s global. Most developed countries have some sort of pro neo nazi organizations.

I recall a GOP ticket a few years back in Illinois where an actual Nazi won the primary. It was in a heavily Democratic area but hey…

But anyway don’t let that spoil a good narrative. I’ll throw it around when I see actual people waving nazi flags at political events. Hey you got nazis at your political event. I seen the video with my own two eyes. Hey a nazi won a GOP primary. Probably ought to do something about that. Like for real.

View attachment 3051111

22 million Americans support neo-Nazis, new poll indicates

Survey was conducted in the wake of deadly violence which ravaged Charlottesville

www.independent.co.uk

There will always be contrarian bigots, trolls, spoilers. We aren't talking about people who hold some sort of a cross between feeling white people or culture are better, anti Muslim views or just racist in general.

We are talking about actual people who want to implement what the Third Reich did. Do you understand what they actually did? You think we have 22 million people.....do you think the WORLD has 22 million people who want to do that?

If you do, it certainly explains a lot about your obsession with everything right of center.

I mean, in your world, one in ten people you meet on the street everyday is just waiting to round up jews, non whites, gypsies and homosexuals and send them to concentration camps. Then, starve them, force them into hard labor, then line them up and shoot them, gas them and burn them. That must be why they want people too have an ID to vote.

Then, they want to conquer the world and kill every citizen and soldier that they come across along the way. Like the 20 million slavs who just happened to be on the way to the Soviets.

It sounds pretty freaking crazy, Cack. Like, paranoid and nuts. Think I'm going to disengage here.

---

 

[Cackalacky2.0]

There will always be contrarian bigots, trolls, spoilers. We aren't talking about people who hold some sort of a cross between feeling white people or culture are better, anti Muslim views or just racist in general.

We are talking about actual people who want to implement what the Third Reich did. Do you understand what they actually did? You think we have 22 million people.....do you think the WORLD has 22 million people who want to do that?

If you do, it certainly explains a lot about your obsession with everything right of center.

I mean, in your world, one in ten people you meet on the street everyday is just waiting to round up jews, non whites, gypsies and homosexuals and send them to concentration camps. Then, starve them, force them into hard labor, then line them up and shoot them, gas them and burn them. That must be why they want people too have an ID to vote.

Then, they want to conquer the world and kill every citizen and soldier that they come across along the way. Like the 20 million slavs who just happened to be on the way to the Soviets.

It sounds pretty freaking crazy, Cack. Like, paranoid and nuts. Think I'm going to disengage here.

---

Disengage away. In the meantime I’ll post this. Yes neo nazis want in whole or in part to revive the Nazi party ideals and Hitlers ideals. It’s not paranoid or crazy or anything else. Simply a fact. No one believes they have the political capital or ability to commit such atrocities but that does not mean they don’t want it. History has shown what this ideology was capable of given the political capability to do so.

“The term neo-Nazism describes any post-World War II militant, social or political movements seeking to revive the ideology of Nazism in whole or in part.[4][5]

The term 'neo-Nazism' can also refer to the ideology of these movements, which may borrow elements from Nazi doctrine, including ultranationalism, anti-communism, racism, ableism, xenophobia, homophobia, anti-Romanyism, antisemitism, up to initiating the Fourth Reich. Holocaust denial is a common feature, as is the incorporation of Nazi symbols and admiration of Adolf Hitler.

Neo-Nazism is considered a particular form of far-right politics and right-wing extremism.[6]”

You can peruse the link to discover just how many global groups there are and what they say.

Neo-Nazism - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

Here is a non comprehensive list of neo nazi groups in the US

• Atomwaffen Division – United States
• American Front – United States
• American Nazi Party – United States
• Aryan Brotherhood of Texas – United States
• Aryan Brotherhood – United States
• Aryan Circle – United States
• Aryan Guard – Canada
• Aryan Nations – United States and Canada
• Aryan Republican Army – United States
• Battalion 14/Connecticut White Wolves[2][3] – United States
• The Daily Stormer – United States
• Heritage Front – Canada
• Identity Evropa – United States
• Libertarian National Socialist Green Party[4][5][6] – United States
• Maryland National Socialist Party[7][8] – United States
• National Alliance – United States
• National Socialist Liberation Front – United States
• National Socialist Movement – United States
• National Socialist Vanguard – United States
• National Vanguard – United States
• Nationalist Front – United States
• Nationalist Social Club - United States
• NSDAP/AO – United States
• Northern Order – Canada
• Partido Nacional-Socialista de México[9][10][11] – Mexico
• Orden Nacional Socialista Pagano - Mexico
• Renegade Tribune – United States
• Resistance Records – Canada
• The Right Stuff – United States
• The Order – United States
• Nationalist Front of Mexico[12] – Mexico
• Traditionalist Worker Party – United States
• Vanguard America – United States
• Vanguard News Network[13][14][15] – United States
• Werewolf 88[16][17] – United States
• White Aryan Resistance – United States
• White Devil Social Club[18][19] – United States
• White Order of Thule[20] — United States
• Rise Above Movement – United States

 

[GATTACA!]

There will always be contrarian bigots, trolls, spoilers. We aren't talking about people who hold some sort of a cross between feeling white people or culture are better, anti Muslim views or just racist in general.

We are talking about actual people who want to implement what the Third Reich did. Do you understand what they actually did? You think we have 22 million people.....do you think the WORLD has 22 million people who want to do that?

If you do, it certainly explains a lot about your obsession with everything right of center.

I mean, in your world, one in ten people you meet on the street everyday is just waiting to round up jews, non whites, gypsies and homosexuals and send them to concentration camps. Then, starve them, force them into hard labor, then line them up and shoot them, gas them and burn them. That must be why they want people too have an ID to vote.

Then, they want to conquer the world and kill every citizen and soldier that they come across along the way. Like the 20 million slavs who just happened to be on the way to the Soviets.

It sounds pretty freaking crazy, Cack. Like, paranoid and nuts. Think I'm going to disengage here.

---

They call themselves Nazis. I think your disagreement is with them not Cack.

“When people show you who they are, believe them the first time.”

 

[Bishop2b5]

You missed Sea Turtle's point. You're lumping lots of people in with actual Nazis who are anything but. Please tell me you don't really think 1 in 10 people want to do the things the Nazis did.

 

[GATTACA!]

You missed Sea Turtle's point. You're lumping lots of people in with actual Nazis who are anything but. Please tell me you don't really think 1 in 10 people want to do the things the Nazis did.

Forgive me for missing a moving target. First Cack was wrong because all the Nazis that show up to RNC rallies are paid leftist plants. Then when Cack came back with receipts it changed to them not actually being Nazi's and that calling them Nazis is just an overreaction to right wing contrarians. When it was pointed out that they call themselves Nazis now you want to defend them (?) because they're not as bad as real Nazis from the 30s?

My head is spinning.

 

[Cackalacky2.0]

“When people show you who they are, believe them the first time.”

Bishop also likes to make George Wallace out to be a not so bad guy. Misunderstood even. Lol

 

[Sea Turtle]

Forgive me for missing a moving target. First Cack was wrong because all the Nazis that show up to RNC rallies are paid leftist plants. Then when Cack came back with receipts it changed to them not actually being Nazi's and that calling them Nazis is just an overreaction to right wing contrarians. When it was pointed out that they call themselves Nazis now you want to defend them (?) because they're not as bad as real Nazis from the 30s?

My head is spinning.

How many call themselves Nazis?
You think it's 22 million? You think it's 9% of the US population?

Looking at that definition, anyone who borrows from the original nazi ideas, is a neo nazi.

I'm anti communist? Does that make me a nazi?

The guy down the street doesn't like gays. Is he a nazi?
Is everyone who is generally racist a Nazi?

According to that definition, we all just might be apparently.

There will always be some idiots out there who will call themselves Nazis. Maybe 22,000 in this country. Not 22 million.

 

[Cackalacky2.0]

How many call themselves Nazis?
You think it's 22 million? You think it's 9% of the US population?

Looking at that definition, anyone who borrows from the original nazi ideas, is a neo nazi.

I'm anti communist? Does that make me a nazi?

The guy down the street doesn't like gays. Is he a nazi?
Is everyone who is generally racist a Nazi?

According to that definition, we all just might be apparently.

There will always be some idiots out there who will call themselves Nazis. Maybe 22,000 in this country. Not 22 million.

You don’t read so well. No where did I say 22 million people call themselves Nazis. I did say that based on poll conducted in 2017 that estimates indicate 9 percent of US citizens hold pro neo nazi ideals. You can also check out the links I provided above and come to your own conclusions. Otherwise you can continue to be incredulous. I don’t care.

I’ll agree with Gattaca that I don’t think your problem is with me. It’s likely the fact that there are right wing extreme it’s groups showing up publically to GOP political events showing you who they are and who they support. Not my problem just Calling a spade a spade.

 

[Sea Turtle]

There are 500 people who are currently in the US Nazi party.

 

[Bishop2b5]

No, ST and I are saying that most neo Nazis are misfits and social outcasts who are certainly contemptible, but pale in comparison to actual Nazis, and that claiming everyone you disagree with is a Nazi and that 10% of the people in the US actually want to do real Nazi stuff is asinine made up baloney.

 

[Sea Turtle]

You don’t read so well. No where did I say 22 million people call themselves Nazis. I did say that based on poll conducted in 2017 that estimates indicate 9 percent of US citizens hold pro neo nazi ideals. You can also check out the links I provided above and come to your own conclusions. Otherwise you can continue to be incredulous. I don’t care.

I read fine and I see what the are doing with their definition.

That first group you mentioned has 80 members. The largest has 500. Those are the ones who call themselves Nazis.

 

[Cackalacky2.0]

There are 500 people who are currently in the US Nazi party.

Wrong. Lol I provide you a list of neo nazi groups above. Conveniently you ignore those.

 

[Cackalacky2.0]

Disengage away. In the meantime I’ll post this. Yes neo nazis want in whole or in part to revive the Nazi party ideals and Hitlers ideals. It’s not paranoid or crazy or anything else. Simply a fact. No one believes they have the political capital or ability to commit such atrocities but that does not mean they don’t want it. History has shown what this ideology was capable of given the political capability to do so.


You can peruse the link to discover just how many global groups there are and what they say.

Neo-Nazism - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

Here is a non comprehensive list of neo nazi groups in the US

I’ll post again so you don’t miss It this time. At this point you are being deliberately obtuse

 

[Sea Turtle]

No, ST and I are saying that most neo Nazis are misfits and social outcasts who are certainly contemptible, but pale in comparison to actual Nazis, and that claiming everyone you disagree with is a Nazi and that 10% of the people in the US actually want to do real Nazi stuff is asinine made up baloney.

This is exactly what the left is doing. Anyone, who dares to disagree with anything that they believe or has any problems towards other is a fucking nazi and must be treated as such.

As if the Nazis even invented racism, anti communist, anti gay, nationalism and anything anti social to begin with.

 

[GATTACA!]

I'm anti communist? Does that make me a nazi?

Do you call yourself a Nazi?

The guy down the street doesn't like gays. Is he a nazi?

Does he go to rallies and wave a Nazi flag?

There will always be some idiots out there who will call themselves Nazis. Maybe 22,000 in this country. Not 22 million.

It's not 22 million. It's also almost certainly higher than 22k. That's less than 500 people per state.

 

[Sea Turtle]

Wrong. Lol I provide you a list of neo nazi groups above. Conveniently you ignore those.

American Nazi Party - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

The arryan brotherhood has by far the most of any group with 15 -20 thousand. Most of them are in prison, of course.

 

[Bishop2b5]

“When people show you who they are, believe them the first time.”

Bishop also likes to make George Wallace out to be a not so bad guy. Misunderstood even. Lol

Remember one day last month when I absolutely roasted you alive for hours for intentionally misrepresenting what I and others say, and for being IE's most flagrant user of strawman arguments? That's an example of why.

 

[Cackalacky2.0]

American Nazi Party - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

So you are committed to just acknowledging this one group. Ok we are done. Not gonna dishonestly argue. You have no intent in arguing honestly.

 

[Sea Turtle]

Do you call yourself a Nazi?

Does he go to rallies and wave a Nazi flag?

It's not 22 million. It's also almost certainly higher than 22k. That's less than 500 people per state.

The largest group has 15,000 to 20,000. And they are mostly in prison.

The American Nazi Party has 500.

The Aryan circle has 1,400.

That first one he listed has EIGHTY. 80!

It's not very many. Maybe 50,000 total. There are probably more flat earthers.

 

[GATTACA!]

The largest group has 15,000 to 20,000. And they are mostly in prison.

The American Nazi Party has 500.

The Aryan circle has 1,400.

That first one he listed has EIGHTY. 80!

It's not very many. Maybe 50,000 total. There are probably more flat earthers.

I bet a venn diagram of those two groups looks like a circle.

 

[Cackalacky2.0]

The largest group has 15,000 to 20,000. And they are mostly in prison.

The American Nazi Party has 500.

The Aryan circle has 1,400.

That first one he listed has EIGHTY. 80!

It's not very many. Maybe 50,000 total. There are probably more flat earthers.

I’m guessing reading comprehension is hard. These are people who openly claim to be members of a nazi group. If you think that is all of the people in this country who are sympathetic Or share some or most of their ideals then there isn’t anything else to discuss. Those numbers survey don’t include spouses or their other family members who share or raised these members in the first place. That poll stated that it estimates 9 percent of the population say it’s ok to be a nazi.

There are over 1000 known hate groups in this country. Idk what else to say.

 

[ulukinatme]

Estimates that 22 million or 9 percent of Americans are pro neo nazi. It’s not just troubled youths. It’s all ages and all demographics of economic success. And it’s global. Most developed countries have some sort of pro neo nazi organizations.

I recall a GOP ticket a few years back in Illinois where an actual Nazi won the primary. It was in a heavily Democratic area but hey…

But anyway don’t let that spoil a good narrative. I’ll throw it around when I see actual people waving nazi flags at political events. Hey you got nazis at your political event. I seen the video with my own two eyes. Hey a nazi won a GOP primary. Probably ought to do something about that. Like for real.

View attachment 3051111

22 million Americans support neo-Nazis, new poll indicates

Survey was conducted in the wake of deadly violence which ravaged Charlottesville

www.independent.co.uk

I've seen that ABC poll following Charlottesville. Also, it's not quite 9 percent like WaPo and Independent.co.uk reported. It's 3% strongly agreed it was acceptable to have pro white supremacist views and 5% somewhat agree. It's certainly higher than I thought it would be, and much higher than I'd like it to be (0 preferable), but it's also a poll of 1000 people with a 3.5% error margin conducted by WaPo(If you can still believe polls in the last 6 years).

The survey is among the first to measure support for the alt-right. Some 10 percent of adults support the movement, including similar shares of Democrats and Republicans. While it has gained greater attention after the Charlottesville protests alongside Nazi and Ku Klux Klan demonstrators, just about 4 in 10 Americans think the alt-right holds neo-Nazi or white supremacist views. About 2 in 10 say it does not, while another 4 in 10 have no opinion on the movement.

I think the big problem here is much of the country is ill informed and the definition of alt-right is loose. According to Wiki info Alt-Right has only been a term for about a decade, and it's ill-defined having been used a variety of ways in media, academics, and politics. It mentioned how it's sometimes used as a "catch all" for far right ideology whether it fits or not. So you've got 8% of the people polled that say it's acceptable to have those views, but 40% of the people polled have no opinion or no idea if alt-right and white supremacists have some similar views. 40% is a big chunk that have no idea what is going on. If there were 22 million Neo-Nazis running around it would mean almost 1/10 of all Americans is part of it. I don't buy it. If that was true, you're talking a group of people that are 2-3 times larger than the LGB population but they're all deeply in the closet.

 

[Cackalacky2.0]

I've seen that ABC poll following Charlottesville. Also, it's not quite 9 percent like WaPo and Independent.co.uk reported. It's 3% strongly agreed it was acceptable to have pro white supremacist views and 5% somewhat agree. It's certainly higher than I thought it would be, and much higher than I'd like it to be (0 preferable), but it's also a poll of 1000 people with a 3.5% error margin conducted by WaPo(If you can still believe polls in the last 6 years).



I think the big problem here is much of the country is ill informed and the definition of alt-right is loose. According to Wiki info Alt-Right has only been a term for about a decade, and it's ill-defined having been used a variety of ways in media, academics, and politics. It mentioned how it's sometimes used as a "catch all" for far right ideology whether it fits or not. So you've got 8% of the people polled that say it's acceptable to have those views, but 40% of the people polled have no opinion or no idea if alt-right and white supremacists have some similar views. 40% is a big chunk that have no idea what is going on. If there were 22 million Neo-Nazis running around it would mean almost 1/10 of all Americans is part of it. I don't buy it. If that was true, you're talking a group of people that are 2-3 times larger than the LGB population but they're all deeply in the closet.

Yeah this is a very reasonable post. Thank you. I absolutely did not say there were 22 million nazis in the US.

I don’t use the alt right moniker. I agree it’s kind a faddy new boogeyman vatchall term that isn’t defined well. I tend to stick with the metrics the FBI and SPLC use to identify hate groups.

Even at 3% that’s what 11 million ok with with nazis?

 

[Sea Turtle]

Remember one day last month when I absolutely roasted you alive for hours for intentionally misrepresenting what I and others say, and for being IE's most flagrant user of strawman arguments? That's an example of why.

I’m guessing reading comprehension is hard. These are people who openly claim to be members of a nazi group. If you think that is all of the people in this country who are sympathetic Or share some or most of their ideals then there isn’t anything else to discuss. That poll stated that it estimates 9 percent of the population say it’s ok to be a nazi.

There are over 1000 known hate groups in this country. Idk what else to say.

How many call themselves Nazis7

You don’t read so well. No where did I say 22 million people call themselves Nazis. I did say that based on poll conducted in 2017 that estimates indicate 9 percent of US citizens hold pro neo nazi ideals. You can also check out the links I provided above and come to your own conclusions. Otherwise you can continue to be incredulous. I don’t care.

I’ll agree with Gattaca that I don’t think your problem is with me. It’s likely the fact that there are right wing extreme it’s groups showing up publically to GOP political events showing you who they are and who they support. Not my problem just Calling a spade a spade.

And the poll you keep quoting says pro neo nazi ideals. That includes anti communist, generally being a racist, being anti gay, anti gypsy, anti Semitic, being a white supremacist, etc.

Let's be honest, there are a lot of people who hold one or two of those views. Their BLACK supremacists out there. It doesn't mean that any of those people who hold one or two of these views are a freaking neo nazi.

 

[ulukinatme]

Yeah this is a very reasonable post. Thank you. I absolutely did not say there were 22 million nazis in the US.

I don’t use the alt right moniker. I agree it’s kind a faddy new boogeyman vatchall term that isn’t defined well. I tend to stick with the metrics the FBI and SPLC use to identify hate groups.

Even at 3% that’s what 1.1 million ok with with nazis?

I gotcha. Yeah, surprising number still if it's 1.1 million, but it's at least more believable and less depressing than 22 million. 1.1 million is in no way tolerable still.
Honestly I was pretty surprised by the poll, but there's also a lot of confusion obviously among those polled because of the terms. The nice thing is since Charlottesville the movement is on the decline apparently, so some good came out of the tragedy.

 

[Cackalacky2.0]

How many call themselves Nazis7

And the poll you keep quoting says pro neo nazi ideals. That includes anti communist, generally being a racist, being anti gay, anti gypsy, anti Semitic, being a white supremacist, etc.

Let's be honest, there are a lot of people who hold one or two of those views. Their BLACK supremacists out there. It doesn't mean that any of those people who hold one or two of these views are a freaking neo nazi.

And while we are being honest political ideologies are almost always a moxture of social and political courts but the one common thing with hate groups is who they hate.

Right wing extremist groups have a clearly defined cohort of things they hate. Yes there is overlap say as in anti communism. Sure most Americans are anti communismas am I. but they are anticommunist and anti Jew and anti black, and White and Christian and think that there should be political steps taken to harm these cohorts and secure a white Christian nation That’s what makes these people dangerous whether they publically identify as a NAZI or not.These individuals you seem stuck on came from a background where they likely were raised this way and are also currently sharing and passing it on to their nuclear family units. So one individual in the Aryan brotherhood likely has a dozen people that share these ideologies without being public about it.

Getting hung up on the 50 people in the Peoples Front of Cour delane misses the forest of all the people in their orbit that sympathize and perpetuate without publically calling themselves a moniker.