Jerome Bettis sold crack...

[Who'saWildManNow]

These "best football players" are still getting admitted into ND (a lot of them).. It's getting booted out that's the problem.

 

[IrishLax]

These "best football players" are still getting admitted into ND (a lot of them).. It's getting booted out that's the problem.

Not really. Take the ESPN300, cut it in half and that's the pool of "top" players that the coaches think can get in. Then through the process another 50 or so get crossed off. In the end, has a pool of about 100 4 guys they can even offer.

And then you have to consider guys like Prentice McKinney, Bo Wallace, Nile Sykes, Deontay Greenberry, Tee Shephard, Isaiah McKenzie, etc. etc. that actually commit and then have an academic issue rear its head (before or after signing the LOI) where ND admissions ends up saying "thanks but no thanks."

You're right, obviously, that staying eligible/not getting booted out is an even bigger problem. The school does an awful lot to help players graduate, but does almost nothing to keep them "eligible" with easy classes like most schools. Most schools don't care about graduation of their players and therefor make sure they take lots of GPA boosting joke classes that won't help them get a degree but will keep them above NCAA minimums.

 

[Irish YJ]

The Bus overcame an environment that destroyed the lives of many others in the same situation. Notre Dame gave him the opportunity to be something much greater. He grasped the opportunity and put in the work to make his life better. There's nothing to criticize in that. He openly admits his mistakes and doesn't try to hide from his past.

and that is all you can ask, of anyone.
he should teach a class at ND that's mandatory for all young athletes.

 

[Irish YJ]

Not really. Take the ESPN300, cut it in half and that's the pool of "top" players that the coaches think can get in. Then through the process another 50 or so get crossed off. In the end, has a pool of about 100 4 guys they can even offer.

And then you have to consider guys like Prentice McKinney, Bo Wallace, Nile Sykes, Deontay Greenberry, Tee Shephard, Isaiah McKenzie, etc. etc. that actually commit and then have an academic issue rear its head (before or after signing the LOI) where ND admissions ends up saying "thanks but no thanks."

You're right, obviously, that staying eligible/not getting booted out is an even bigger problem. The school does an awful lot to help players graduate, but does almost nothing to keep them "eligible" with easy classes like most schools. Most schools don't care about graduation of their players and therefor make sure they take lots of GPA boosting joke classes that won't help them get a degree but will keep them above NCAA minimums.

we need a RKG major.

 

[Bogtrotter07]

and that is all you can ask, of anyone.
he should teach a class at ND that's mandatory for all young athletes.

What a great idea. Reps!

(No, I wasn't going to say, "What a pregnant idea!")

 

[magogian]

people that aren't desperate do stupid things too. and all desperate people don't do stupid things... I guess only the folks that aren't desperate should get caught and sent to jail? let's not totally remove freedom of choice and individual responsibility just because people are poor, grow up in a bad neighborhood, or are raised in a single parent home.

there's enough people who don't get caught that are doing fine learning how to be serious criminals.

You should read Ta-Nehisi Coates's "Between the World and Me." It is making liberals swoon everywhere.

Here's the relevant part of the book in one sentence: every time a black man kills a black man in a city controlled by black politicians and black cops, this act of "destroying the black body" is completely the fault of those "who think of themselves as white."

So, I'm not really sure why people are talking about Jerome Bettis selling crack and whether it should impact our view of him. He had no agency.

 

[Irish YJ]

Anything that blames government, blames conservatives, blames business, blames the system, blames the past, blames the "fill in the blank", and calls for more tax dollars will make liberals swoon.

I'm all for prison reform, but tired of people making excuses for why people are there in the first place. There are too many people that lift themselves out of bad situations to solely put the blame on bad situations. I know a lot of those people (who have taken other paths). I also know plenty of people who chose to do nothing about their disposition.

 

[PLACforever]

 

[dublinirish]

i read Donald Driver's autobiography and he pretty much did all the same things growing up, stealing cars and selling drugs etc in impoverished neighbourhoods in Houston but then when he was an upperclassmen that he got his shit together. never was in any trouble as a pro and founded a great charity that gives back to many people.

 

[Bogtrotter07]

I am tired of blatant racism and classism masquerading as some kind of homespun, overarching, catchall truth.

As if it is more than a false truism that can be used to hide the human weaknesses and failings of a group of people.

Here is my bold proof :

I have worked with too many stroke and potential stroke patients to see that what we call personality, can be grossly affected by medical condition and overall health. Individuals with certain conditions can change for the worse, behaviorally, and then return to a more 'acceptable' behavior if the condition is ameliorated. This is something that may be entirely out of their control. Because they usually don't see the changes, and those around them may not have the knowledge to get the help that is needed.

I have worked with enough wounded vets to know that no two bodies, suffering the most similar insults due to trauma, or psychological injury will ever react the same. What is insufferable to one may not be a serious issue to another.

Each of these points, being like a blade in an enlightened conversation serves to form a scissors that cuts through the same old overly simplistic, "Here is the answer, if we only had the courage to enact it," constantly recycled bull shiit that has been out there forever. If there were easy answers to social problems, they would have been accomplished. In fact there are no easy answers. Not when it comes to changing society; only when it comes to changing ourselves, which is always the first step!

The common themes of said bull shiit are; 'white is right!', (in other words the ruling class does things right, and deserves to be in charge,) there is a one size fits all solution, and that logic or intelligence need be suspended for anyone to believe it.

This is usually achieved by playing to a fear, particularly one shared by different groups, more than just the power elite, a common fear that can unite a strong majority against those that are deemed bad people.

For more on "schlechte Menschen," see Nazi Germany.

I don't know about liberals, conservatives, or all of the political issues some may want to tangle in this conversation. I do however carry a S&W 686+ for family and personal protection, and keep a couple of Mossberg 500's (short and long, depending on the club needed for the particular shot) for home defense. (No I do not have my yard wired with Claymores.)

I also tend to vote progressive, populist, and possiblist.

And I believe in the words of Jesus Christ. Literally, those attributed to him.

So what am I besides a colossal pain in the ass? And that too is the point. I am just one bean on the planet that defies simple categorization. From my view, there are billions more.

What do I believe is important in this conversation?

If you want others to be happy, practice compassion. If you want to be happy, practice compassion. –

Dalai Lama

Too much self-centered attitude, you see, brings, you see, isolation. Result: loneliness, fear, anger. The extreme self-centered attitude is the source of suffering.

Dalai Lama

 

[phgreek]

The Bus overcame an environment that destroyed the lives of many others in the same situation. Notre Dame gave him the opportunity to be something much greater. He grasped the opportunity and put in the work to make his life better. There's nothing to criticize in that. He openly admits his mistakes and doesn't try to hide from his past.

I agree. And I'd add...it seems to me Holtz got some kids in and helped them tremendously. He was willing to do more. The admissions folks tightened the noose. Under Kelly, I think we are seeing some more of the same sentiment. I think we could easily dismiss it as totally football centered, and largely due to the power of a charismatic coach to persuade, and work the system. However we come to points in time where some kids get a shot, I like to see it. I think there is room for some missionary work via the Football program hailing from a Catholic University. That would tend to be consistent with outreach to some kids who meet football standards, but need some understanding. I will say though, in order for missionary work to function as it should, the standards within the program need to be as they always were. In order to give someone a handup, you need to "be up".

 

[ACamp1900]

It's super easy for a teenager to fall into certain traps when you grow up in an environment in which the few 'success stories' you really see tend to involve some kind of criminal activity... I suppose some people don't grasp that as they have been fortunate enough to not have to live in that type of environment.