[NFL] vBook: Colts vs Patriots (Deflategate)

Irish Insanity

Irish Insanity

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Wait never mind. That's why they do it. Knowing that it will test out good with the refs and lose PSI before the game down to the preference of Brady. Smart, but still cheating.
 
NDRock

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Irish Insanity said:
Wait never mind. That's why they do it. Knowing that it will test out good with the refs and lose PSI before the game down to the preference of Brady. Smart, but still cheating.
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That's what I would do. It would be easy and technically you could claim that you are following the rules.
 
irishfan

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Belichick made the point that they work the footballs before the weigh-in and that this friction adds an artificial 1.0 PSI to the football.

Mayne Event: Favre's Footballs - ESPN Video - ESPN

Video from 2006 shows Packers' ball boys using sanders and other equipment just 15 minutes before weigh-in. So ya, there could be a missing 1 PSI from the footballs at halftime due to this. Belichick specifically referred to this as being an artificially added 1 PSI.

Again, for every argument saying that the Patriots clearly are guilty, there is a counter to it.
 
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Irish#1

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irishfan said:
Belichick made the point that they work the footballs before the weigh-in and that this friction adds an artificial 1.0 PSI to the football.

Mayne Event: Favre's Footballs - ESPN Video - ESPN

Video from 2006 shows Packers' ball boys using sanders and other equipment just 15 minutes before weigh-in. So ya, there could be a missing 1 PSI from the footballs at halftime due to this. Belichick specifically referred to this as being an artificially added 1 PSI.

Again, for every argument saying that the Patriots aren't guilty, there is a counter to it.
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FIFY
 
A

ab2cmiller

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Drew Brees appears on Conan and helps prove that it's easier to throw and catch an underinflated football.

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/xNEM3WUfGjY?rel=0" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>
 
Irish#1

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So one guy is a Pats fan and refutes the numbers, yet his own analysis isn't that far off. Hmm
 
Rhode Irish

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irishfan said:
NFL didn’t log the PSI of each Patriots football | ProFootballTalk

So ya. This story is pretty much over at this point if the NFL didn't even bother to measure the footballs pre-game.
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This is why I kept saying to Wooly and a few other times that we need to wait and see all the confirmed and documented evidence. People can draw whatever conclusions they want, but if the NFL had the goods they wouldn't have been leaking out selective bits of information that helps their case and leaving out other pertinent information if all the information helped them.
 
Irish#1

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gkIrish

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Irish#1 said:
I'll give BB credit, he's creative. With all of the trick plays and formations he's been trotting out in the playoffs, it makes me think he's not entirely confident his team can win each game.
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That's exactly why I think Seattle is going to demolish NE. The Ravens weren't really even that good this year and Bill still felt the need to run a trick play he saved for 3 years and this entirely new (and illegal, as it turns out) strategy to beat them. And we all know the Colts were simply not that good.

Meanwhile Russell Wilson has probably his worst game as a pro and they still beat GB.
 
phork

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gkIrish said:
That's exactly why I think Seattle is going to demolish NE. The Ravens weren't really even that good this year and Bill still felt the need to run a trick play he saved for 3 years and this entirely new (and illegal, as it turns out) strategy to beat them. And we all know the Colts were simply not that good.

Meanwhile Russell Wilson has probably his worst game as a pro and they still beat GB.
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Its not an illegal strategy if you do it right. Blame the refs for not calling it properly. Could it have cost them the game? Sure. But lets not pretend that the refs had nothing to do with Detroit and subsquently Dallas being heaved because of bad calls too. The question is now in a $9billion league, why is there not full time officials?
 
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irishfan

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gkIrish said:
That's exactly why I think Seattle is going to demolish NE. The Ravens weren't really even that good this year and Bill still felt the need to run a trick play he saved for 3 years and this entirely new (and illegal, as it turns out) strategy to beat them. And we all know the Colts were simply not that good.

Meanwhile Russell Wilson has probably his worst game as a pro and they still beat GB.
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The trick play against Baltimore came right on the heels of the TD drive using the ineligible/eligible guys. Perfect time to bust out a trick play when the D is over-thinking everything. Some desperation involved there being down 14 at one point obviously, but I think they just knew that trick play was the perfect call at the time.

For the Indy game, they were going to win no matter what they did. Carroll has already had discussions with the NFL about the ineligible/eligible thing, and I think Belichick wanted to score with one of those plays so that Seattle would focus even more time on it in preparation. I'd be surprised if they did anything similar this Sunday besides just bring in a 6th OL to pound the ball.

Also, this whole eligibile/ineligible thing is so annoying, cause you see it almost every week in college football, yet people act like Belichick is some sort of genius for busting it out, or that he is using some borderline-illegal trick.

Also, somewhat funny regarding trick plays. SI had an article this week about Belichick's football library (believed to be largest collection), and they had an excerpt from Rockne in one of the books where he writes about the benefit of trick plays.
 
gkIrish

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phork said:
Its not an illegal strategy if you do it right. Blame the refs for not calling it properly. Could it have cost them the game? Sure. But lets not pretend that the refs had nothing to do with Detroit and subsquently Dallas being heaved because of bad calls too. The question is now in a $9billion league, why is there not full time officials?
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Yes it's not an illegal strategy but it was illegally executed DESPITE Harbaugh complaining to the refs. So the Patriots definitely got the benefit of bad officiating. Just another reason why I think they will lose.
 
irishfan

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Irish#1 said:
If the NFL had checked the balls before the game and found them under inflated it would be okay? There's no rule that says you have to catch someone cheating as it is initially happening.

If you steal a car and don't get caught until later its okay?
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According to what I've heard/read on this, it's solely the refs job to approve the footballs, and not the team's responsibility. Which is somewhat odd.

Is it okay for a team to line up .5 a yard offsides if they know the refs wont call it?
 
irishfan

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gkIrish said:
Yes it's not an illegal strategy but it was illegally executed DESPITE Harbaugh complaining to the refs. So the Patriots definitely got the benefit of bad officiating. Just another reason why I think they will lose.
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Which illegal play? The Solder TD was deemed illegal against Indy cause the Pats had another OL go from eligible to ineligble without taking a play off. There were no illegal plays against Baltimore, John's defense apparently just felt the need to cover an ineligible guy every time the Pats gave them this look. The refs said after the game that it was officiated perfectly.

It's funny cause Bruschi hasn't played in years for the Pats, and he said on ESPN that Belichick had them coached that when there are unusual eligible guys, you just audible to some generic Cover-2 man and see what happens. Baltimore just looked like they had never prepared for this situation.
 
gkIrish

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irishfan said:
Which illegal play? The Solder TD was deemed illegal against Indy cause the Pats had another OL go from eligible to ineligble without taking a play off. There were no illegal plays against Baltimore, John's defense apparently just felt the need to cover an ineligible guy every time the Pats gave them this look. The refs said after the game that it was officiated perfectly.

It's funny cause Bruschi hasn't played in years for the Pats, and he said on ESPN that Belichick had them coached that when there are unusual eligible guys, you just audible to some generic Cover-2 man and see what happens. Baltimore just looked like they had never prepared for this situation.
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Oh my bad. I got the two games confused. Again, I've never argued that the Colts would have beat Indy under any circumstance but I do think Baltimore would have won if not for the trickery and this eligible player stuff.
 
irishfan

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gkIrish said:
Oh my bad. I got the two games confused. Again, I've never argued that the Colts would have beat Indy under any circumstance but I do think Baltimore would have won if not for the trickery and this eligible player stuff.
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Agreed there. The D was great the last 25 minutes of the game, but absolutely terrible until then. They needed something big to bail them out. Baltimore is just always a brutal matchup.
 
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