'15 IN ILB/OLB Asmar Bilal (Notre Dame Signed NLI)

[NDBoiler]

How's your AssMar?

Sucks to your Assmar

 

[Irish#1]

I was referring to the staff. Misunderstanding, had nothing to do with you personally

Gotcha!......thx

 

[Irish#1]

From what I know of the recruitments of Barnett, Hilliard, Barajas, and Coney I'd definitely characterize our style as passive vs. pressure.

After Barnett committed, we weren't aggressively fending off other schools and marking our territory. We didn't do a good job of continuing to recruit/sell him and I don't really think our big wigs did a great job of developing a relationship over the 6+ months he was committed. And once things got rocky, we didn't fight and claw to keep him.

Hilliard we didn't turn up the heat on until late. We were always actively recruiting him, but Meyer put on the full court press well before we did and did a better job of actively building relationships with those around Justin before we did. And Meyer neg recruited like a champ... the story of some of the stuff he pitched to Harris/Cornell/Hilliard about Michigan is hilarious. And you better believe he didn't treat ND with kid gloves.

Barajas we treated passively and PSU stole him with aggressive recruiting despite him being an "ND lock"... after that we barely followed up with contact. Were it not for Barajas' heart truly being at ND we don't get him back.

With Coney, we could've tried hard to get him to commit and probably could've secured a pledge. But we chose to instead make sure he took his time and came to the best decision for him. Smart? Probably. I like this approach, personally. But now we're in a dog fight.

All of these are examples of passive recruiting where we let the kid comfortably make the best decision for them. Good news? The kids that sign up are generally going to have a better attrition rate. Bad news? You'll miss on some kids. But it's a big departure from how we approached Tee, Darby, Lynch, etc. in the beginning of Kelly's tenure.

After the problems with Tee, Darby, Lynch, etc., BK probably made the decision that it wasn't worth it to be high pressure salesmen. It's basically the time-share or car salesman routine where they pressure you until you wear out and give in. I don't have a problem with a lower key style, but if what everyone reports is true (not saying it is or isn't since we're not involved), then we probably have to do a better job of closing. ABC baby! Cue the Glen Gary Glen Ross clip.

 

[Wingman Ray]

I agree. You cant just sit back and expect everyone to beat your door down to be with you. That was the TY approach and we saw how well that worked.

ND is a great product for any recruit no doubt but we must all realize that everyone isnt sold on that. BK needs to understand completely that to get who he wants, he has to really work hard. It isnt enough to just throw the hook out there. You would think after Diaco and Ishaq, BK would realize that you have to work to get the good players. Alabama gets who they get because they win big and have won big for a while. ND isnt in that same boat and probably will never consistantly be due to the academic requirements.

Tried to insert the coffee is for closers but the dang thing wouldnt work...

 

[Fbolt]

I think =/= truth. FYI.

 

[koonja]

I have a theory that I don't believe to be true. Meaning, I think it makes sense, but I don't think it's likely to be the case.

BK is getting content with lower rated guys who are more likely to stick to ND because it's ND when he leaves after this year or next. He doesn't want to screw over the next coach by having 4/5 star guys committed who will likely decommit if he leaves. He's going after some big dogs, but not going to fill the class with guys who have offers all over the country. Guys who they think are underrated as 3-stars and don't have a lot of offers, are going to to stick to ND more than the guy with offers all over. I'm on my phone and typed this in like 8 seconds so I apologize if it sounds like it was written by a 3rd grader.

With all of the changes him and Jack have made, I think he stays for a few years, but this idea has crossed my mind.

 

[BleedBlueGold]

I have a theory that I don't believe to be true. Meaning, I think it makes sense, but I don't think it's likely to be the case...

 

[BleedBlueGold]

I think everyone needs to take a breath. I completely agree with IM8. This staff has pretty much put up a wall around IN and has done pretty decent in the midwest as a whole. They won't win them all. With that said, I'm not one to put the staff on a pedestal and with the information provided by TJ and Lucci, along with LAX's examples, I feel the staff may have been a bit arrogant w/ Asmar's recruitment, allowing UM to swoop in. OR maybe he just liked UM better, idk.

 

[Domina Nostra]

I have a theory: right now the kid like Michigan a little better.

 

[BeauBenken]

I don't know what changed from a few weeks back when I (along with other posters who are now complaining) said Michigan was a legitimate threat. There was always a strong possibility he ended up there. It was not as much an "ours to lose" battle as some thought.

 

[Ndaccountant]

I have a theory that I don't believe to be true. Meaning, I think it makes sense, but I don't think it's likely to be the case.

BK is getting content with lower rated guys who are more likely to stick to ND because it's ND when he leaves after this year or next. He doesn't want to screw over the next coach by having 4/5 star guys committed who will likely decommit if he leaves. He's going after some big dogs, but not going to fill the class with guys who have offers all over the country. Guys who they think are underrated as 3-stars and don't have a lot of offers, are going to to stick to ND more than the guy with offers all over. I'm on my phone and typed this in like 8 seconds so I apologize if it sounds like it was written by a 3rd grader.

With all of the changes him and Jack have made, I think he stays for a few years, but this idea has crossed my mind.

Ok, let's pretend for the moment that this is correct, even though on the surface it's asinine. So, BK is planning to leave but he doesn't want the transition to hurt the next coach by having high profile guys leave. Thus, he is recruiting guys that will stick around even if they are perceived to be slightly lesser talents . Well, wouldn't he be hurting the next coach by stuffing a roster full of said lesser players?

 

[Big23Head]

FWIW, Anna still believes ND leads from very recently discussions. Also she was told the Michigan stuff was not true, she was told this by Bilal himself.

 

[BleedBlueGold]

I don't know what changed from a few weeks back when I (along with other posters who are now complaining) said Michigan was a legitimate threat. There was always a strong possibility he ended up there. It was not as much an "ours to lose" battle as some thought.

I think TJ's comments about the staff being outworked or outsold are what kicked the hornet's nest here on IE.

 

[PANDFAN]

FWIW, Anna still believes ND leads from very recently discussions. Also she was told the Michigan stuff was not true, she was told this by Bilal himself.

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[irishog77]

I'd tell Anna anything and everything she wanted to know about me.

 

[koonja]

Ok, let's pretend for the moment that this is correct, even though on the surface it's asinine. So, BK is planning to leave but he doesn't want the transition to hurt the next coach by having high profile guys leave. Thus, he is recruiting guys that will stick around even if they are perceived to be slightly lesser talents . Well, wouldn't he be hurting the next coach by stuffing a roster full of said lesser players?

Not if they're only marginally less talented and are more likely to stick than highly recruited players are (which I believe is true when coaches leave).

I wouldn't want to leave the next coach with a class of 15 if I could leave him with a class of 20 players that I like but might not be at the top of my board.

Like I said, I don't think he leaves, but if he did, this is what I would do as a coach. Find players who are about to stick. JUST MY OPINION.

 

[Ndaccountant]

I don't know what changed from a few weeks back when I (along with other posters who are now complaining) said Michigan was a legitimate threat. There was always a strong possibility he ended up there. It was not as much an "ours to lose" battle as some thought.

That's certainly true and we cannot forget that.

But, IMO, this if much bigger than Bilal. We have gotten beaten to the punch in recruiting over the past two years in a repeatable fashion, especially for the more promising talent. We have secured some bigger names, but the success rate seems to be declining. It's recruiting and you will win some and lose some. But, the current trend of losing, especially for the defensive players, isn't very comforting when we are trying to build a championship caliber team. (And yes, I am aware that BVG's system could attract talent, but that is to be seen)

 

[IrishLax]

The people citing he's set on Michigan are supposedly getting it from sources around Bilal, like his high school HC. No doubt that he's not going to say it publicly to someone who asks him straight up, because that'd put him in an awkward spot. Also, if he was truly 100% set on Michigan he'd have committed already, so just be hopeful he takes it out to OVs.

 

[GoldenToTheGrave]

That's certainly true and we cannot forget that.

But, IMO, this if much bigger than Bilal. We have gotten beaten to the punch in recruiting over the past two years in a repeatable fashion, especially for the more promising talent. We have secured some bigger names, but the success rate seems to be declining. It's recruiting and you will win some and lose some. But, the current trend of losing, especially for the defensive players, isn't very comforting when we are trying to build a championship caliber team. (And yes, I am aware that BVG's system could attract talent, but that is to be seen)

Did you see what happened to our 2012 recruiting class? Half the big name players that committed ended up decommitting, and then we lost a lot of players as transfers. It was a disaster.

 

[Big23Head]

The people citing he's set on Michigan are supposedly getting it from sources around Bilal, like his high school HC. No doubt that he's not going to say it publicly to someone who asks him straight up, because that'd put him in an awkward spot. Also, if he was truly 100% set on Michigan he'd have committed already, so just be hopeful he takes it out to OVs.

Anna also said she talked to people close to him and they still said ND as of a few days ago. For now she is staying ND.

Agree with getting to OVs

 

[Ndaccountant]

Did you see what happened to our 2012 recruiting class? Half the big name players that committed ended up decommitting, and then we lost a lot of players as transfers. It was a disaster.

I have no problem saying we are trying to avoid attitudes that may be similar to a Lynch. But let's not kid ourselves here and believe that shifting a roster more towards "RKG's" will produce more opportunities to challenge for a playoff spot.

 

[ThePiombino]

I have no problem saying we are trying to avoid attitudes that may be similar to a Lynch. But let's not kid ourselves here and believe that shifting a roster more towards "RKG's" will produce more opportunities to challenge for a playoff spot.

Have to agree with this on the surface.

 

[Domina Nostra]

We felt the same way about Bilal a few weeks ago as Michigan does, now. It seems like he likes both schools and is having a hard time choosing. The school he visits last is the one that leads.

 

[arrowryan]

Anna talked to Bilal tonight

"I don't know where that came from. It came out of thin air. Even (Michigan assistant) Coach Mallory asked me if I was going to commit yesterday. I'm not. Michigan is not my leader."

 

[Calabrese's People]

Anna talked to Bilal tonight

Snap! Take that Michigan.

 

[NDhoosier]

Snap! Take that Michigan.

I think I watched the gif for like a full 5 minutes... those reactions are awesome!

However, I am still not sure where all this talk about poor recruiting is coming from... I think it is much simpler than that.

2013 class (we went 12-1 the year before)
2014 class (we had a few disappointments)
2015 class (we shall see)

We win some and we lose some and ND is already at a great disadvantage with admission, class difficulty, school size, and being up North. Most of the elite talent is in the South, where they are on the fast track to the NFL, cruised through HS classes, and want to be the big man on a big campus.

IrishLax, I respect and pay attention to everything you post, but I am not sure where you are getting that information. It almost appears as though you are simply frustrated with recruiting recently and pulling some of that out of nowhere.

 

[Crazy Balki]

God, how did this happen? About a week or two we went from having Coney and Bilal close to locks, and now both of them are trending towards the other schools. I can't even explain the reasoning. Coney? Yeah, UF is close to home and you can't beat the weather (though it's Gainesville, smack dab in the middle of the state, nowhere near either coast), but outside of that, nothing. Muschamp is on the hottest of seats and Florida is coming off a dismal season, and this year isn't look all that much better. Bilal? I've got nothing. Hoke has been a tad bit more successful than Muschamp at Michigan, but that's not saying much. Outside of his fluke '11 season (easiest schedule and BS BCS matchup), he's done nothing to convince anybody that he's a competent coach.

I find it ironic that everybody says "winning cures", yet we're losing battles to two teams that had WORSE records than us last year.

 

[stlnd01]

God, how did this happen? About a week or two we went from having Coney and Bilal close to locks, and now both of them are trending towards the other schools. I can't even explain the reasoning. Coney? Yeah, UF is close to home and you can't beat the weather (though it's Gainesville, smack dab in the middle of the state, nowhere near either coast), but outside of that, nothing. Muschamp is on the hottest of seats and Florida is coming off a dismal season, and this year isn't look all that much better. Bilal? I've got nothing. Hoke has been a tad bit more successful than Muschamp at Michigan, but that's not saying much. Outside of his fluke '11 season (easiest schedule and BS BCS matchup), he's done nothing to convince anybody that he's a competent coach.

I find it ironic that everybody says "winning cures", yet we're losing battles to two teams that had WORSE records than us last year.

I probably shouldn't engage the board's No. 1 green-colored-glasses-wearer but Florida and Michigan both have a lot to offer that goes way beyond their coaches' job security. And it's not like we lit the world on fire last year. Winning 12 games does cure things, but I don't think most recruits make a big distinction between 8-4 and 7-5.
Anyway, good to hear Bilal tell Anna he's not all UM. Would be better to hear this lights a fire under the staff and they get him to commit.

 

[NDinL.A.]

God, how did this happen? About a week or two we went from having Coney and Bilal close to locks, and now both of them are trending towards the other schools. I can't even explain the reasoning. Coney? Yeah, UF is close to home and you can't beat the weather (though it's Gainesville, smack dab in the middle of the state, nowhere near either coast), but outside of that, nothing. Muschamp is on the hottest of seats and Florida is coming off a dismal season, and this year isn't look all that much better. Bilal? I've got nothing. Hoke has been a tad bit more successful than Muschamp at Michigan, but that's not saying much. Outside of his fluke '11 season (easiest schedule and BS BCS matchup), he's done nothing to convince anybody that he's a competent coach.

I find it ironic that everybody says "winning cures", yet we're losing battles to two teams that had WORSE records than us last year.

And yet we're winning battles against teams that had BETTER records than us last year. That's the nature of the beast.

Also, when did Coney commit to FL? When did Bilal commit to Michigan? When did we lose those battles?

 

[TheChosen1]

Remember when the staff got out worked on this one?