Doctor - ADHD does not exist

[IrishSteelhead]

 

[tadman95]

Tried to read this, couldn't focus.

 

[Bogtrotter07]

Tried to read this, couldn't focus.

Tits and ADHD are two different things.

(I can never focus when you have a lot of posts in a thread, either.)

 

[ACamp1900]

Tried to read this, couldn't focus.

This is classic comgin from someone sporting your avatar... lol

 

[A Pac]

I was diagnosed with ADD as a kid. I may not have had it, but I was definitely off the fucking walls hyper. My parents tried EVERYTHING before the doctor recommended pills. I can honestly say I would not have done half as well in school without it. I'm not saying that ADD exists, but there is something that made me hyper.. and yes, my parents tried cutting out sugar.

I never once used my diagnosis as a crutch when I couldn't focus- neither as a child or even now as an adult. I own up to it. Sure I may have trouble focusing but at the end of the day, I control my behavior. I have so many students who tell me they can't do things because they have ADHD and it drives me crazy. Sack up and focus.

 

[Irish#1]

ADHD Does Not Exist Writes Dr. Richard Saul - TIME





Agree completely, my in-laws make fun of how strict I am with the kids bedtimes. I honestly could care less though, sleep is SO important to kids.

We of the older generation managed quite well before it became the "hot diagnosis". We managed it by playing outside and tiring ourselves out.

 

[Crazy Balki]

As someone who exhibits symptoms of ADHD and doesn't take medication for it, shame on this doctor. Most of you might not understand this, but this is a very real condition, and it sucks to have quite often. Many times I can't stay focused, and start getting major headaches when I try to focus harder. It's very much a huge disadvantage in the working world to not stay committed to an assignment/project.

However, based on statistics, I can agree that it might be overdiagnosed. I may not have the actual condition, so what others have may be worse and actually require it, but I highly doubt THAT many people are suffering from it. Regardless, to completely ignore it's existence just can't happen.

 

[irish1958]

We of the older generation managed quite well before it became the "hot diagnosis". We managed it by playing outside and tiring ourselves out.

At my grade school the nuns and priests just kicked them out of the school and let the public schools deal with their problems.
Of course, they were all lazy, undisciplined layabouts anyway. And sinners to boot.

 

[irish1958]

And they probably all ate nothing but sugar.

 

[Bogtrotter07]

That was after they got plenty of rulers across the knuckles, and were told that there was a place in hell reserved for them.

 

[woolybug25]

Saw this on the news this morning:

Childhood use of ADHD medications linked with weight gain in teen years | Fox News

This article, nor the peice on GMA this morning, acknowledged the obvious "chicken or the egg" scenario here. They mention that there wasn't necessarily a chemical link between the drugs and obesity, but rather that studies showed that kids taking them are much higher risk for obesity.

Could it simply be that these drugs have been overprescibed and those parents that are using them on kids that dont need them are the same types of parents that don't make sure that their kids are eating a healthy diet?

It must be the drugs fault... can't possibly be undisclipled parents that look for "easy outs" with unneaded drugs and fast food.

 

[Old Man Mike]

Gentlemen, my addition to the discussion: most of the reason that intelligent folks like on IE cannot rapidly come to a clarity on this is that the medical psychology community doesn't know what it is talking about. This community tries hard but it makes the same labeling errors all the time. Because it cannot simply understand the complexity of the brain [either chemically or structurally] it is faced with issues of diagnosis which it cannot handle. Thus it makes up collective junk-words to cover a wide spread of underlying problems.

These junk words [ex. depression, hyperactivity, PTSD, schizophrenia, even "epilepsy" spreads out over many different things] though they mean well, are merely rough descriptors of surface evaluated behavior and not fundamental causality. But they slowly take on a larger life of their own as if they really mean something. Thus hyperactivity [a behavioral observation and judgement] becomes such a "thing" that it becomes casually accepted and gets its own fancier formal name, ADHD.

Child psychologists who manage to keep their scientific open-minded objectivity have known at least since the seventies [when I had to teach some of this stuff in a human biology class] that "hyperactivity" seemed occasionally related to a real brain chemistry imbalance [maybe "purely biochemical" via a genetic flaw, or maybe structural in the neurons/synapses] and could produce the seriously distracted "off-the-walls" child mentioned in the thread. This would be a true problem and not to be laughed off.

On the other hand, those same researchers [inspired by the already growing horror show of excess Ritalin use] recognized that the tendency was gaining to assess every "active" kid as "hyperactive" and go with a convenient "solution". This early excess wave of diagnosis was found to be due to bad diagnosis in the school system. It quieted classrooms down and mainly-ignorant parents went along --- their homes got quieter too.

The improper use of Ritalin [not the PROPER cases] had the following educational effects: it DID show a marginal increase in the learning of rote learning tasks like brute memorization and repetition tasks. But it markedly suppressed "higher" learning skills and creativity.

That some brains "go too fast" [for whatever reason] is to be expected --- everything in biology [height, build, bone strength ...] gets genetically thrown out there on a Bell-shaped curve. For the most part you want to be near the middle of that curve. Both "wings" usually are dangerous to function if not survival. Some kids are going to be born "going to fast"... BUT THEY WILL BE RARE. The fact that we are happy to diagnose all manner of kids as ADHD and drug them out of our own convenience is a national shame.

In those early studies kids were put on Ritalin when a glass of milk in the morning or not living beneath the El-Train wouldn't have "cured" them.

 

[Irish#1]

Tits and ADHD are two different things.

(I can never focus when you have a lot of posts in a thread, either.)

I'd rep you for that one but I can't. Someone rep this man!

 

[Irish#1]

Gentlemen, my addition to the discussion: most of the reason that intelligent folks like on IE cannot rapidly come to a clarity on this is that the medical psychology community doesn't know what it is talking about. This community tries hard but it makes the same labeling errors all the time. Because it cannot simply understand the complexity of the brain [either chemically or structurally] it is faced with issues of diagnosis which it cannot handle. Thus it makes up collective junk-words to cover a wide spread of underlying problems.

These junk words [ex. depression, hyperactivity, PTSD, schizophrenia, even "epilepsy" spreads out over many different things] though they mean well, are merely rough descriptors of surface evaluated behavior and not fundamental causality. But they slowly take on a larger life of their own as if they really mean something. Thus hyperactivity [a behavioral observation and judgement] becomes such a "thing" that it becomes casually accepted and gets its own fancier formal name, ADHD.

Child psychologists who manage to keep their scientific open-minded objectivity have known at least since the seventies [when I had to teach some of this stuff in a human biology class] that "hyperactivity" seemed occasionally related to a real brain chemistry imbalance [maybe "purely biochemical" via a genetic flaw, or maybe structural in the neurons/synapses] and could produce the seriously distracted "off-the-walls" child mentioned in the thread. This would be a true problem and not to be laughed off.

On the other hand, those same researchers [inspired by the already growing horror show of excess Ritalin use] recognized that the tendency was gaining to assess every "active" kid as "hyperactive" and go with a convenient "solution". This early excess wave of diagnosis was found to be due to bad diagnosis in the school system. It quieted classrooms down and mainly-ignorant parents went along --- their homes got quieter too.

The improper use of Ritalin [not the PROPER cases] had the following educational effects: it DID show a marginal increase in the learning of rote learning tasks like brute memorization and repetition tasks. But it markedly suppressed "higher" learning skills and creativity.

That some brains "go too fast" [for whatever reason] is to be expected --- everything in biology [height, build, bone strength ...] gets genetically thrown out there on a Bell-shaped curve. For the most part you want to be near the middle of that curve. Both "wings" usually are dangerous to function if not survival. Some kids are going to be born "going to fast"... BUT THEY WILL BE RARE. The fact that we are happy to diagnose all manner of kids as ADHD and drug them out of our own convenience is a national shame.

In those early studies kids were put on Ritalin when a glass of milk in the morning or not living beneath the El-Train wouldn't have "cured" them.

Perfect.

To expound a little further, you had teachers diagnosing the problem and suggesting to parents that they have their child evaluated rather than dealing with the student like teachers used to. you are also correct about doctors taking the easy way out and prescribing medication for those that really didn't need more than a little more effort out of the parents.

I believe there are cases that require medication, but not in the volumes we've been seeing for the last 20-25 years.

 

[phork]

Definitely over diagnosed, but I've heard that doctor's were getting kick backs from drug companies back in the day to push Ritalin. I can see where anxiety and/or hyperactivity could be part of the problem. Some of this is behavioral though and can be curbed, its just easier for some parents to dole out pills.

That actually happens?

 

[Irish#1]

That actually happens?

Have you seen some of the ladies drug companies hire as reps? It's not fair.