George Zimmerman Trial

[GoIrish41]

Actual call:

Zimmerman: Hey, we’ve had some break-ins in my neighborhood and there’s a real suspicious guy. It’s Retreat View Circle. The best address I can give you is 111 Retreat View Circle. This guy looks like he’s up to no good or he’s on drugs or something. It’s raining and he’s just walking around looking about. [00:25]

Dispatcher:OK, is he White, Black, or Hispanic?

Zimmerman:He looks black

Dispatcher: Did you see what he was wearing?

Zimmerman:Yeah, a dark hoodie like a gray hoodie. Either jeans or sweat pants and white tennis shoes. He’s here now … he’s just staring. [00:42]

Dispatcher:He’s just walking around the area, the houses? OK.

Zimmerman:Now he’s just staring at me. [00:48]

Dispatcher: OK, you said that’s 1111 Retreat View or 111?

Zimmerman:That’s the clubhouse.

Dispatcher:He’s near the clubhouse right now?

Zimmerman: Yeah, now he’s coming towards me. He’s got his hands in his waist band. And he’s a black male.[1:03]





When is Zimmerman actually racially profiling again? I'll wait....

I'd start with the bolded comments. He didn't say "I think he's black" as you suggested, he said "he looks black". I find it difficult to believe that walking down the street makes someone "a real suspicious guy". What do you suppose made him look "real suspicious?" The walking, the hoodie, the Skittles, or the fact that "he looks black?"

 

[irishpat183]

I do. Show me proof or quit making false claims. Simple as that.

ABC National News, March 18th: “Zimmerman, 28, who is white”
Chicago Tribune, March 19th: “George Zimmerman, 28, who is white”
Miami Herald, March 18th: “fatally shot by a white neighborhood”



Lookd them up.

 

[GoIrish41]

ABC National News, March 18th: “Zimmerman, 28, who is white”
Chicago Tribune, March 19th: “George Zimmerman, 28, who is white”
Miami Herald, March 18th: “fatally shot by a white neighborhood”



Lookd them up.

if everyone in the neighborhood shot him, he must have been doing something wrong.

 

[irishpat183]

I'd start with the bolded comments. He didn't say "I think he's black" as you suggested, he said "he looks black". I find it difficult to believe that walking down the street makes someone "a real suspicious guy". What do you suppose made him look "real suspicious?" The walking, the hoodie, the Skittles, or the fact that "he looks black?"

If he couldn't tell he was black, again only CONFIRMED later in the convo, he definately couldn't tell he was carrying skittles.

And HELL YES someone walking around in dark clothing in the rain at night is suspicious. Again, especially given the history of that neighborhood (which you continue to ignore) Are you kidding or just trying to be a hard head.

I know I take a double look when I see young kids roaming my neighborhood at night.

Now you're just grasping....

 

[irishpat183]

if everyone in the neighborhood shot him, he must have been doing something wrong.

You ***....LOL

 

[GoIrish41]

If he couldn't tell he was black, again only CONFIRMED later in the convo, he definately couldn't tell he was carrying skittles.

And HELL YES someone walking around in dark clothing in the rain at night is suspicious. Again, especially given the history of that neighborhood (which you continue to ignore) Are you kidding or just trying to be a hard head.

I know I take a double look when I see young kids roaming my neighborhood at night.

Now you're just grasping....

It's a wonder nobody shot Zimmerman with all that suspicious walking around in the dark in the rain he was doing.

 

[Emcee77]

This issue of whiteness is equally overblown. Hispanic is not a race, exactly, and you can be both white and Hispanic, but it's undeniable that as a matter of convenience people in this country use "white" and "Hispanic" to refer to different ethnic groups. So I have to agree with the spirit of Wooly's post, even if there may have been a more artful way of putting the first sentence:

I'm pretty sure that most reasonably intelligent human beings new that Zimmerman wasn't a white guy the first time they saw a photo of him. I knew I did. I'm unaware of this "oops" moment that you are speaking of nor of it's relevence.

Still... what point are you trying to make? Regardless of his race, if he targeted TM because of the color of his skin, then it was an act of racism that is no better than if a white dude did the same thing.

 

[woolybug25]

George Zimmerman was originally identified as white. Then his family said he was Hispanic. Which is it?

Zimmerman is identified as "white" in the original police report. However, according to CBS News investigative producer Pia Malbran, who has been reporting from Miami, police in Florida routinely label Hispanics who don't have black skin as "white," even if they have ethnic facial features. The Associated Press reports that Zimmerman's mother, Gladys, is originally from Peru. Both she and George Zimmerman identified themselves as "Hispanic" in their voter registrations. Robert Zimmerman, George's father, lists himself as "white."

Trayvon Martin shooting: What do we know? - Crimesider - CBS News


I remember it being reported in the news programs early on when this was all being reported. I will check for other links Wooly but you might be able to find it too, check out Wesh 2 News and Channel 13 Brighthouse Networks.

So the Police Officer referred to him as white and the "evil media" actually corrected the misconception by reporting that the FL police routinely refer to hispanics incorrectly as white. I don't see anywhere in that article where they make the claim that a) Zimmerman was in fact white nor 2) This is a white on black crime.

Again... still haven't seen a reputable news agency make the claims that several people on this thread are claiming are everywhere. Shoot... I even turned on the TV as Pat suggested, guess he watches different channels.

 

[jmurphy75]

Link?

Like I said. The first time I heard about it, they showed a picture of Zimmerman, who is clearly someone with minority heritage, clearly evident by his photograph imo. Seriously, are any of you really saying that when you saw the picture of Zimmerman (which was VERY early after the incident) that you thought he didn't have some type of minority heritage?

and not to continually beat a dead horse..... but the accusations of racsism are have nothing to do with Zimmerman's race.

Sorry Wooly no link I just remember the news...I live in the area and it was constantly played morning noon and night.

 

[GoIrish41]

You have no point at all. Again, this is a losing battle for Martin's defense. It might as well been a fast food drive thru person "advising" Zimmerman.

Had an acutal cop told Zimmerman not to follow someone? Different story.


Do you know how much BAD advice 911 operators give as well?

It's not about the degree of authority of the person who he was talking to. It was his singleminded will to continue following Martin that portrays a man looking for a confrontation.

 

[jmurphy75]

If he couldn't tell he was black, again only CONFIRMED later in the convo, he definately couldn't tell he was carrying skittles.

And HELL YES someone walking around in dark clothing in the rain at night is suspicious. Again, especially given the history of that neighborhood (which you continue to ignore) Are you kidding or just trying to be a hard head.

I know I take a double look when I see young kids roaming my neighborhood at night.

Now you're just grasping....

I'm with you on this and to give everyone an idea about the area take a look at this site. Sanford was in the middle of a "redevelopment" when the economy tanked, so there are some really nice areas that border some really bad ones.

Sanford FL crime rates and statistics - NeighborhoodScout

 

[woolybug25]

ABC National News, March 18th: “Zimmerman, 28, who is white”
Chicago Tribune, March 19th: “George Zimmerman, 28, who is white”
Miami Herald, March 18th: “fatally shot by a white neighborhood”



Lookd them up.

You literally cut and pasted that from "Counsel of Conservative Citizens" homepage word for word. They offerered no links and when I google any of them, none of them show up. I even went to the Miami Herald and searched their site and came up empty. Again, give me a LEGITIMATE link of an article or news agency claiming that he was white or that it was a white on black crime. Once the picture of Zimmerman was released, there was no room for mistaking him as white.

Give me a break with quoting the Counself of Conservative Citizens as a reference and not even linking it... and you claim that others are "grasping at straws".

 

[FLDomer]

You literally cut and pasted that from "Counsel of Conservative Citizens" homepage word for word. They offerered no links and when I google any of them, none of them show up. I even went to the Miami Herald and searched their site and came up empty. Again, give me a LEGITIMATE link of an article or news agency claiming that he was white or that it was a white on black crime. Once the picture of Zimmerman was released, there was no room for mistaking him as white.

Give me a break with quoting the Counself of Conservative Citizens as a reference and not even linking it... and you claim that others are "grasping at straws".

flip a page back i linked some things from local sources.

 

[jmurphy75]

It's not about the degree of authority of the person who he was talking to. It was his singleminded will to continue following Martin that portrays a man looking for a confrontation.

GoIrish just trying to get a sense of where your opinion is coming from, do you own a home? Do you have kids? My mindset comes from me working hard everyday to support my family and keep a nice home. This first makes me want to protect my home from someone taking my families things, because they are too lazy to work for their own. Secondly if I'm attacked I will no longer take the chance of serious injury, and why should I suffer the pain, medical bills, missed work and effect on my life. These are the thoughts that create my opinions that I would've followed someone suspicious in my neighborhood and if attacked shoot them. It's unclear still exactly how the physical altercation began, but someone following you is no reason attack someone physically, it's a choice made by the person.

 

[woolybug25]

flip a page back i linked some things from local sources.

Your first link stated that the police said that he was white and they corrected that notion and mentioned that he was in fact hispanic. I responded to this post already. It actually goes to my point. That article does not make the claim that he is white in any manner.

I didn't see your second link, but that writer for the Sentinal indeed called him white. So I give you that one. That being said, that article came out on March 19th, 2012. The Zimmerman mugshot didn't come out until early June of 2012. So how was the author suppose to know that Zimmerman was hispanic if the police report stated that he was white?

Everybody is quick to blame the media on this when the police were the ones that put it in the report. Furthermore, the linked article is the only one that I have ran across that claimed it, and how were they suppose to know that he was hispanic?

 

[GoIrish41]

GoIrish just trying to get a sense of where your opinion is coming from, do you own a home? Do you have kids? My mindset comes from me working hard everyday to support my family and keep a nice home. This first makes me want to protect my home from someone taking my families things, because they are too lazy to work for their own. Secondly if I'm attacked I will no longer take the chance of serious injury, and why should I suffer the pain, medical bills, missed work and effect on my life. These are the thoughts that create my opinions that I would've followed someone suspicious in my neighborhood and if attacked shoot them. It's unclear still exactly how the physical altercation began, but someone following you is no reason attack someone physically, it's a choice made by the person.

I own a home and have four kids, and feel the same as you about hard work and taking care of my family. My oldest son is about the age Travon Martin was when he was killed that night. I don't want anyone to come into my house and take my things either, but I'd be far, far more crushed if some dumba** with a gun decided he didn't like the way he looked and shot him around the corner from my house. I would hope that the person on the neighborhood watch where I live would also want to avoid serious injury, pain, medical bills, missed work and the affect on his/her life, too. The easiest way to do that is to not instigate a physical confrontation. I think it is easy for person carrying a weapon to feel brave enough to approach someone who they think is suspicious. That doesn't make him smart enough to avoid that situation in the first place. TM was not there to rob a house. That was a case of wild unsubstantiated speculation on Zimmerman's part. IWhile I have offered alternative suggestions as to Zimmerman's account of the events, I do agree with your last sentence. As you said, we don't know what happened. What we do know is that it wouldn't have happened if Zimmerman wasn't being a dumba**. And we know that his story is probably the only one that will keep him out of jail for killing a kid. He very well could be lying.

 

[FLDomer]

Your first link stated that the police stated he was white and they corrected that notion and mentioned that he was in fact hispanic. I responded to this post already. It actually goes to my point.

I didn't see your second link, but that writer for the Sentinal indeed called him white. So I give you that one. That being said, that article came out on March 19th, 2012. The Zimmerman mugshot didn't come out until early June of 2012. So how was the author suppose to know that Zimmerman was hispanic if the police report stated that he was white?

There is more and frankly I don't have the time to dig through. I mean to pick no argument but for some to make the claims (acting as authorities almost) that some are making is like a person that has been to Afghanistan being told by someone not there or even close that they are wrong because they saw or read it on the national media level. Jmurphy and I live here, I watch the local news and read the local papers...It was presented that way at 1st and the groups like the NAACP and Black Panthers jumped in and riled the racial issue even further. Even after the reports came up that he was Hispanic, did not get the news or spot light like the "white" claims did and at that point the damage was done.

 

[Irish Houstonian]

There is more and frankly I don't have the time to dig through. I mean to pick no argument but for some to make the claims (acting as authorities almost) that some are making is like a person that has been to Afghanistan being told by someone not there or even close that they are wrong because they saw or read it on the national media level. Jmurphy and I live here, I watch the local news and read the local papers...It was presented that way at 1st and the groups like the NAACP and Black Panthers jumped in and riled the racial issue even further. Even after the reports came up that he was Hispanic, did not get the news or spot light like the "white" claims did and at that point the damage was done.

Right. People shoot people all the time in metro areas, and the stories barely make the local news. The only reason this got any national traction is that it was first reported as a "white man" shooting a "black kid" (remember all the photos of Martin when he was like 10 years old?) and "getting away with it" under Florida law.

 

[GoIrish41]

Right. People shoot people all the time in metro areas, and the stories barely make the local news. The only reason this got any national traction is that it was first reported as a "white man" shooting a "black kid" (remember all the photos of Martin when he was like 10 years old?) and "getting away with it" under Florida law.

I think the reason it made the news is because the police didn't do anything about it. If Zimmerman would have been taken into custody, which is what any reasonable person would have expected, then it wouldn't have been such a source of national outrage.

 

[irishpat183]

It's a wonder nobody shot Zimmerman with all that suspicious walking around in the dark in the rain he was doing.

Zimmerman was in his car until he spotted Martin, I believe?

 

[GoIrish41]

SANFORD: Judge to decide if jurors should hear of Zimmerman’s previous calls to cops - Trayvon Martin - MiamiHerald.com

 

[irishpat183]

You literally cut and pasted that from "Counsel of Conservative Citizens" homepage word for word. They offerered no links and when I google any of them, none of them show up. I even went to the Miami Herald and searched their site and came up empty. Again, give me a LEGITIMATE link of an article or news agency claiming that he was white or that it was a white on black crime. Once the picture of Zimmerman was released, there was no room for mistaking him as white.

Give me a break with quoting the Counself of Conservative Citizens as a reference and not even linking it... and you claim that others are "grasping at straws".

That's what I found. Everyone else deleted the videos off their websites (ABC nightline)

Again, they deleted them. Just like MSNBC fired that editor that dammed Zimmerman with his cutting and pasting.


And what about the 78 year old white guy that was beat up by a group of black guys for "payback" for Trayvon?? While they did it they shouted "trayvon lives".

Or what about these: First Trayvon Martin- George Zimmerman related hate crime reported in Chicago | Washington Times Communities


How would they get that idea?? Why not beat up a hispanic?? Come on Wooly, open your eyes. You're ignorant to what is going on around you. This was positioned by the media and activists from DAY ONE.

 

[irishpat183]

Right. People shoot people all the time in metro areas, and the stories barely make the local news. The only reason this got any national traction is that it was first reported as a "white man" shooting a "black kid" (remember all the photos of Martin when he was like 10 years old?) and "getting away with it" under Florida law.

Exactly.

When's the last time a hispanic killing a black person got this much coverage?

Again, the media cashing in on the ignorants of society

 

[irishpat183]

I think the reason it made the news is because the police didn't do anything about it. If Zimmerman would have been taken into custody, which is what any reasonable person would have expected, then it wouldn't have been such a source of national outrage.

sure......

Police don't do **** about shootings in the hood. Where is the outrage?


Again, this was race pimped out to the public. Once Rev Jesse or Sharpton get involved, it's all downhill

 

[irishpat183]

SANFORD: Judge to decide if jurors should hear of Zimmerman’s previous calls to cops - Trayvon Martin - MiamiHerald.com

Dude takes his postion seriously, I guess...

But what does that prove? Hell, this would be good for the defense. He's consistant. He targeted trayvon like he did everyone else.

 

[Cackalacky]

Dude takes his postion seriously, I guess...

But what does that prove? Hell, this would be good for the defense. He's consistant. He targeted trayvon like he did everyone else.

I'm pretty sure most of the calls were about black people from what I read. Not sure about the validity of that though. The judge already stated that "racial profiling" could not be used in court but "profiling" could. If the calls do in fact show that GZ called multiple times and they were the majority about black people, 1) I don't think it looks good for GZ, and 2) I don't think the judge will allow it. Seems like the judge is trying hard to keep race out of the court room.

 

[Bogtrotter07]

IrishPat, as hard as it might be for you to understand, some people think of things only in terms of, "white, black, and Hispanic." They are in a distinct minority, and they are found in each racial group.

In my experience, there are more people in a second group, one that has a membership that can't understand why people think that way. There are more that can't understand thinking that way, than think that way.

The reason this is a national case is because it is because it took so long for authorities to charge GZ.

The reason there is a problem with this case, is because of a third group, those that think everyone (else) breaks things down on a racial basis, and that is the core reason there is so much strife. When in reality, this case is not about race at all, (even though profiling took place.)

Anyone who has a homeowner association that would let an untrained civilian patrol with a gun, should be sued out of existence, one member at a time. THAT IS THE ISSUE; People with property regarding their property as more important than human life.

People get the real reason wrong for things most of the time. And they surely have a lot of help!

 

[Redbar]

IrishPat, as hard as it might be for you to understand, some people think of things only in terms of, "white, black, and Hispanic." They are in a distinct minority, and they are found in each racial group.

In my experience, there are more people in a second group, one that has a membership that can't understand why people think that way. There are more that can't understand thinking that way, than think that way.

The reason this is a national case is because it is because it took so long for authorities to charge GZ.

The reason there is a problem with this case, is because of a third group, those that think everyone (else) breaks things down on a racial basis, and that is the core reason there is so much strife. When in reality, this case is not about race at all, (even though profiling took place.)

Anyone who has a homeowner association that would let an untrained civilian patrol with a gun, should be sued out of existence, one member at a time. THAT IS THE ISSUE; People with property regarding their property as more important than human life.

People get the real reason wrong for things most of the time. And they surely have a lot of help!

Wow, great post. I would only add one point that people in that third group are missing: men hurt women every day, there is sexual violence everyday in every city many times the victims are killed, and their stories never make the news, but if there is a serial killer targeting women the Feds are called in and it is a national story. There is something about crimes involving a predator that raise the national attention, irregardless of race. I am not saying GZ is a predator but there is enough here to raise that fear. The fact that the institutions of justice did so little digging initially allowed segments of the population to lose faith in those institutions, and have to plea for justice. They have their day in court, they deserve this day in court, I can't understand why there is on one side such a feeling that they didn't deserve it or that GZ is being hosed by having to account for this. Imagine it was your kid, you would want this day.

 

[FLDomer]

IrishPat, as hard as it might be for you to understand, some people think of things only in terms of, "white, black, and Hispanic." They are in a distinct minority, and they are found in each racial group.

In my experience, there are more people in a second group, one that has a membership that can't understand why people think that way. There are more that can't understand thinking that way, than think that way.

The reason this is a national case is because it is because it took so long for authorities to charge GZ.

The reason there is a problem with this case, is because of a third group, those that think everyone (else) breaks things down on a racial basis, and that is the core reason there is so much strife. When in reality, this case is not about race at all, (even though profiling took place.)

Anyone who has a homeowner association that would let an untrained civilian patrol with a gun, should be sued out of existence, one member at a time. THAT IS THE ISSUE; People with property regarding their property as more important than human life.

People get the real reason wrong for things most of the time. And they surely have a lot of help!

To the bolded, people/society doesn't value human life like they should, period.

 

[irishpat183]

I'm pretty sure most of the calls were about black people from what I read. Not sure about the validity of that though. The judge already stated that "racial profiling" could not be used in court but "profiling" could. If the calls do in fact show that GZ called multiple times and they were the majority about black people, 1) I don't think it looks good for GZ, and 2) I don't think the judge will allow it. Seems like the judge is trying hard to keep race out of the court room.

But what if most the people in his neighborhood (and I don't know the area) in the streets at night are black people?

I mean, in fear of being labled a "profiler" you just don't call the cops anymore if you see something suspicious?

Don't you see where this is headed? We're literally letting polical correctness dictate how we utilize our public servants.