My Top 20 Quarterbacks heading into the 2013 season

[IrishFBfanatic]

The thing is that your story continues to change with every post you make. Your BYU comment above doesn't make a lick of sense (Golson didn't play against BYU), I have no idea what point you are trying to make anymore. So I am guessing the post above is the exact point where you went off of the ledge into insanity.

yeah my bad that was supposed to say pitt. but im sure you knew that.

 

[IrishFBfanatic]

I mean Everett Golson has huge upside and all this but how did he have a better year than Devin Gardner? I am asking what are you judging that in? Wins= Golson, Stats= Gardner

You play to win the game. Winning=Success and Golson wins. Gardner has some good stats, but some are pretty padded...Iowa 6TDs. How can you really compare that when Hoke didn't pull him after the comfortable lead like Kelly did with Golson. Golson plays all of wake, miami, navy, he has a ton more stats. If stats matter the most, why isn't Rakeem Cato on the tops of lists? He has better stats than most!

If stats matter most, the teams playing cupcakes always win...I don't even know why I'm arguing this...it's comical some people truly believe it.

 

[IrishFBfanatic]

but in all honesty, what do I judge it on? Watching games....I've seen them both play. I take Golson every time as my starter. No question. and there are 20-30 other qbs i take ahead of Gardner every time no question.

 

[GBdomer]

but in all honesty, what do I judge it on? Watching games....I've seen them both play. I take Golson every time as my starter. No question. and there are 20-30 other qbs i take ahead of Gardner every time no question.

dudeeeeeeeeeeeee come on 20-30 QB's over Gardner is laughable. I hate Michigan as much as anyone but don't be disrespectful the man was playing WR all spring and all fall practice gets thrown into QB and has a great year. Now that he is the man at QB he will be a stud.

 

[IrishLax]

Guys, as much as I love him, I'd ask the same question about Golson.

Which is why, as you'll note, I said nothing about Golson.

 

[IrishLion]

dudeeeeeeeeeeeee come on 20-30 QB's over Gardner is laughable. I hate Michigan as much as anyone but don't be disrespectful the man was playing WR all spring and all fall practice gets thrown into QB and has a great year. Now that he is the man at QB he will be a stud.

I thought Gardner got moved to WR in the fall, just as a way to see the field. I thought he had been Denard's backup since Tate the Great left though (or for however long he's been on campus). Gardner had plenty of reps at QB coming in to the season. He was not some position-change revelation.

And by no means am I taking away from him. As I said in an earlier post, he should have been Michigan's QB all year with how poorly Denard played.

 

[IrishJayhawk]

You play to win the game. Winning=Success and Golson wins. Gardner has some good stats, but some are pretty padded...Iowa 6TDs. How can you really compare that when Hoke didn't pull him after the comfortable lead like Kelly did with Golson. Golson plays all of wake, miami, navy, he has a ton more stats. If stats matter the most, why isn't Rakeem Cato on the tops of lists? He has better stats than most!

If stats matter most, the teams playing cupcakes always win...I don't even know why I'm arguing this...it's comical some people truly believe it.

Let's be clear about Gardner's losses. His team lost by five points twice. The first was to one of the two undefeated teams in the country who finished the year ranked 3rd in the AP poll. The second was a 2 loss SEC team who finished the year ranked 8th.

And those "padded stats" in the Iowa game...Gardner threw one pass in the 4th quarter that was intercepted. He rushed once for five yards. Huge padding there.

 

[IrishFBfanatic]

dudeeeeeeeeeeeee come on 20-30 QB's over Gardner is laughable. I hate Michigan as much as anyone but don't be disrespectful the man was playing WR all spring and all fall practice gets thrown into QB and has a great year. Now that he is the man at QB he will be a stud.

Eh....did you see him vs. OSU? I don't think that's disrespectful at all. I think there are 20-30 QBs who have shown they are legit QBs who play the position much better. Maybe after camp he will develop into a QB, but right now he's still very raw as an athlete.

I know Michigan fans who truly believe Gardner won't be their starting QB next season (and truly hope he isn't).

 

[STLDomer]

Eh....did you see him vs. OSU? I don't think that's disrespectful at all. I think there are 20-30 QBs who have shown they are legit QBs who play the position much better. Maybe after camp he will develop into a QB, but right now he's still very raw as an athlete.

I know Michigan fans who truly believe Gardner won't be their starting QB next season (and truly hope he isn't).

Name the 20-30 QBs then

 

[IrishLion]

Okay, I did my research. Gardner has been listed as a backup QB since 2010. So everyone should quit using his position change from WR as an argument.

He moved from QB to WR this season to see reps on the field, but has always been Robinson's backup.

 

[woolybug25]

I know Michigan fans who truly believe Gardner won't be their starting QB next season (and truly hope he isn't).

I grew up in Michigan, have a step brother that went to Michigan and have talked with a great deal of Michigan fans about Gardner. I don't know a single one of them that aren't psyched about the kid. I don't know who you are talking to, but I would think most rational football fans from any angle would pretty much put Gardner as a lock for their QB. Your buddies are definitely outliers.

 

[GBdomer]

My two best friends are die hard Michigan fans, family has season tickets and never miss a game and they couldn't be more excited about Devin Gardner. There is nothing to not like because he is a stud. I am not looking forward to playing him for the next 3 years.

 

[IrishJayhawk]

Okay, I did my research. Gardner has been listed as a backup QB since 2010. So everyone should quit using his position change from WR as an argument.

He moved from QB to WR this season to see reps on the field, but has always been Robinson's backup.

Robinson was the starter. He was having success. Gardner came in after he was already established. And Wooly is right, Denard was being talked about as a Heisman hopeful. It's actually remarkable that he was unseated.

 

[IrishFBfanatic]

Let's be clear about Gardner's losses. His team lost by five points twice. The first was to one of the two undefeated teams in the country who finished the year ranked 3rd in the AP poll. The second was a 2 loss SEC team who finished the year ranked 8th.

And those "padded stats" in the Iowa game...Gardner threw one pass in the 4th quarter that was intercepted. He rushed once for five yards. Huge padding there.

And Golson was pulled in the 3rd of his blowout games and given run plays to pound the game out. No need to pad stats. Obviously Gardner was still throwing in the 4th...doesn't sound like they took their foot off the gas, does it?

And let's be clear. Gardner lost 2 games... That's a 60% win percentage. Golson only lost to one team. The #1 team in the country. So you're telling me Gardner lost against two teams that were worse than the one team Golson lost to....and he only beat one team with a winning record...that makes him elite?

 

[returnofthemack]

Never thought I'd see the day where posters on this board were attacking each other and denigrating an ND QB, with others falling over themselves defending a michigan QB. Disgusting.

 

[IrishJayhawk]

My two best friends are die hard Michigan fans, family has season tickets and never miss a game and they couldn't be more excited about Devin Gardner. There is nothing to not like because he is a stud. I am not looking forward to playing him for the next 3 years.

Good thing he's only got a year of college left. Am I missing something?

 

[IrishFBfanatic]

I grew up in Michigan, have a step brother that went to Michigan and have talked with a great deal of Michigan fans about Gardner. I don't know a single one of them that aren't psyched about the kid. I don't know who you are talking to, but I would think most rational football fans from any angle would pretty much put Gardner as a lock for their QB. Your buddies are definitely outliers.

My two buddies in school at the University of Michigan? My buddy with connections to players on the Michigan football team who is an absolutely lifelong die-hard fan? Which buddy is the outlier?

 

[GBdomer]

Good thing he's only got a year of college left. Am I missing something?

Two i am sorry. He is getting a red shirt.

 

[GBdomer]

Never thought I'd see the day where posters on this board were attacking each other and denigrating an ND QB, with others falling over themselves defending a michigan QB. Disgusting.

This is a great thread with some really good debates so far.

 

[STLDomer]

My two buddies in school at the University of Michigan? My buddy with connections to players on the Michigan football team who is an absolutely lifelong die-hard fan? Which buddy is the outlier?

Who do they want to be QB then?

 

[IrishJayhawk]

And Golson was pulled in the 3rd of his blowout games and given run plays to pound the game out. No need to pad stats. Obviously Gardner was still throwing in the 4th...doesn't sound like they took their foot off the gas, does it?

And let's be clear. Gardner lost 2 games... That's a 60% win percentage. Golson only lost to one team. The #1 team in the country. So you're telling me Gardner lost against two teams that were worse than the one team Golson lost to....and he only beat one team with a winning record...that makes him elite?

He threw one pass. One. On the second play of the quarter. And it was an interception. They ran three more offensive plays in the quarter...all runs. He scored his last TD with about 5 minutes left in the 3rd quarter.

I don't think "padding" means what you think it means.

 

[IrishJayhawk]

Never thought I'd see the day where posters on this board were attacking each other and denigrating an ND QB, with others falling over themselves defending a michigan QB. Disgusting.

I'm truly just trying to be honest about our players. I could very well be wrong and Golson becomes a top 10 QB immediately. I HOPE I'm wrong. I just think we tend to overrate our guys because we like them so much.

 

[IrishLax]

winning a Rose Bowl ,beating 4 straight top 25 teams and winning at Autzen isn't a bad start. But i agree not top 20 yet.

Yeah, this is how I look at it...

Rose Bowl? Well, strip the glitter off, and he struggled against a 6 loss team from possibly the worst major conference in CFB throwing for only 123 yards and 0 TDs.

2 of those top 25 wins? UCLA, a team that wasn't actually very good, finished the year with 5 losses including a blowout to Baylor, and actually was unranked when all was said and done. In those games? Only threw for 156 YPG and 1 TD a game. That's really unimpressive.

The other games?

Oregon - 211 yards, 1 TD, 1 INT
Colorado - 284, 2 TD (does this even count as a game?)
Oregon State - 254, 3 TD, 2 INT

Of his six games... not once did he throw for 300 yards... he had 4 straight up bad games... 1 "good" game against CoLOLarado... and 1 mixed bag game against Oregon State.

So I reallllllly don't understand Hogan getting any props whatsoever right now. Not only has his performance not warranted it, but he hasn't even shown flashes of brilliance that make you think he could really blow up next year. Devin Gardner is an example of a guy I don't mind people making a case for being slotted high because he has tremendous upside.

 

[GBdomer]

I agree with what you said Lax. I didn't put Hogan in there but he was a 3rd string QB. He has great upside and could be a real pain in the *** with more experience.

 

[IrishFBfanatic]

Who do they want to be QB then?

Shane Morris. They want a QB who can pass the ball. They're ready to see Hoke's system. They love Gardner, think hes a stud, but don't think he's much of an upgrade passing the ball...they're ready for a "real" QB (their words, not mine)

 

[GBdomer]

Shane Morris. They want a QB who can pass the ball. They're ready to see Hoke's system. They love Gardner, think hes a stud, but don't think he's much of an upgrade passing the ball...they're ready for a "real" QB (their words, not mine)

I would love life if Shane Morris starts at QB next year. Devin Gardner will be the QB and Michigan has a chance to be really good next year.

 

[woolybug25]

My two buddies in school at the University of Michigan? My buddy with connections to players on the Michigan football team who is an absolutely lifelong die-hard fan? Which buddy is the outlier?

I think you are lying... There, I said it...


That, or your friends are idiots. Tell them that I will bet them both $1,000 that Gardner is there starting QB next year. I know a ridulous amount of Michigan fans that would take that bet with them too.

 

[STLDomer]

Shane Morris. They want a QB who can pass the ball. They're ready to see Hoke's system. They love Gardner, think hes a stud, but don't think he's much of an upgrade passing the ball...they're ready for a "real" QB (their words, not mine)

Shane Morris looked like absolutely awful in the UA game and every other event I saw him in. So if they want him to start please I hope your "sources" are spot on.

 

[IrishFBfanatic]

He threw one pass. One. On the second play of the quarter. And it was an interception. They ran three more offensive plays in the quarter...all runs. He scored his last TD with about 5 minutes left in the 3rd quarter.

I don't think "padding" means what you think it means.

No, I understand padding stats. I don't think you understand that sometimes players are pulled before the 4th quarter and padding doesn't always happen in the 4th (because you can be winning big before then).
Winning by 25 and Gardner throws 7 times, and rushes twice...52% of their plays when winning big.

Golson was never given opportunity to pad stats. 0% of plays.

 

[IrishFBfanatic]

I think you are lying... There, I said it...


That, or your friends are idiots. Tell them that I will bet them both $1,000 that Gardner is there starting QB next year. I know a ridulous amount of Michigan fans that would take that bet with them too.

Haha of course you think I'm lying. When would you actually know anything about a real source? LOL

I have no problem with it. Gardner is not much of an upgrade passing the ball from Denard. The thought of a freshman QB starting over Gardner is way less insane than the thought of Gunner taking the reigns from Golson...yet there are plenty of uninformed/illogical ND fans with the opinion that that is really a possibility