Tommy Rees - Offensive Coordinator

[NDIrish1988]

Really? Because back in March a LOT of fans were saying that Dante Moore was worth waiting for, even though some of us did think it was a risky move and didn't trust it. This is what happens when the admin doesn't want to play the NIL game though, the coaches did everything they could on their end to nail him. Hindsight is 20/20 and all that.

Imagine dating someone for 3 months, but they don’t want to be seen in public with you. That’s what ND was to Dante Moore. Only an idiot wouldn’t pick up on something shady going on.

 

[NDIrish1988]

So to sum up everything we haven’t had a legitimate QB since what? Clausen?

Coan wasn’t developed in our system so that’s a pretty long drought. The Mississippi is going dry, something has to change soon. Some fresh rain in Jackson Arnold would be a start.

Yes, they should absolutely continue to visit and give him love. Ignorant not to. By all indications he’s likely our best shot at a legitimate QB this cycle. It also seems that he still has real interest.

Yes, I do think Carr could be the QB of the future. But, NO, I do not think Tommy boy can utilize these two to their potential. It has to be a glaring statistic that Freemen cannot avoid.

Maybe I’m too quick to write Rees off, but he’s had his hand in this for a loooong time. It’s time for show me!!!

He’s been QB coach since ‘17, OC since ‘20. He’s had enough time.

 

[NDisme]

- When Pyne committed in April 2018 for the 2020 Class--before we landed a 2019 QB--this is what the roster looked like:

• Wimbush - expected starter for 2018 and 2019
• Ian Book - 2018, 2019, 2020 eligibility
• Phil Jurkovec - 2018, 2019, 2020, 2021, 2022

- When Drew Pyne committed as a Junior, there was hope that he would grow. For 2019, they wanted Mertz who had offers from all the big boys, but landed Clark late in the cycle because they didn't think they needed anyone.

- This was when Chip Long was the OC, and he and Kelly had primary responsibility for who was given a scholarship at QB.

- We also all agree that Kelly was very little help recruiting.

- Then they landed highly-rated Buchner quickly March 2019, with eligibility until 2024. Buchner then tragically lost an entire season of development when stupid California cancelled his season. THIS IS AN UNDERRATED ISSUE.

- During the weird Covid recruiting year, Rees wanted Gavin Wimsatt or Angeli, and ended up with Angeli. Angeli looks the part so far.

- Rees also very wisely took Jack Coan last year, they won 11 games with him!

- This year, Rees wanted Moore, and almost landed him, but lost him to NIL by almost every account.

- It is unclear why they did not take a transfer QB this year. That seemed, and seems, like a bad decision.

- The OL stunk in game 2 and the first half of game 3.

So I think it is really hard to judge Tommy Rees, based on how bad the team looks with Pyne as QB--when Pyne is playing poorly. He seems very, very smart sometimes, but has a little Charlie Weis in him too: calling plays that are great on paper, but his players don't execute.

My thing is at the end, ”unclear why they didn’t take a transfer” I don’t think there were many guys out there that were going to be ok having to fight with Buchner for the job. A Slovis or JT Daniel’s or equal were all definitely told, you are the guy if you come here. ND wasn’t going to do that cuz they like Tyler.

 

[Dale]

You think he was their top target? No. He was a contingency plan for them.

This is the incorrect response to mentioning Pyne’s offer list. The correct rebuttal, if you’re going to go that path, is many of those offers were early. You remember Pyne getting these offers because he was a schools backup plan? Wasn’t the case.

 

[NDIrish1988]

My thing is at the end, ”unclear why they didn’t take a transfer” I don’t think there were many guys out there that were going to be ok having to fight with Buchner for the job. A Slovis or JT Daniel’s or equal were all definitely told, you are the guy if you come here. ND wasn’t going to do that cuz they like Tyler.

It was so clear how dumb it was to hinge so much on Tyler Buchner. Everyone wants to oversimplify things to make themselves feel better about ND’s situation, but it should’ve been clear Buchner was an extremely risky bet.

 

[NDIrish1988]

This is the incorrect response to mentioning Pyne’s offer list. The correct rebuttal, if you’re going to go that path, is many of those offers were early.

Look at how many players ND offers with no real intent of taking them. Casting a wide net is part of recruiting.

 

[Dale]

Look at how many players ND offers with no real intent of taking them. Casting a wide net is part of recruiting.

But you’re clearly just tossing out things without any actual recollection of Pyne’s recruitment.

 

[NDIrish1988]

But you’re clearly just tossing out things without any actual recollection of Pyne’s recruitment.

Pyne was never their top target, even early in the recruitment. The Offer list is important when you want to evaluate a recruit, but it’s not the full story.

 

[WilliamWallace]

He’s been QB coach since ‘17, OC since ‘20. He’s had enough time.

No disagreement

 

[Free Manera]

So did Alabama, Florida State, Penn State, Missouri, Ole Miss, Auburn, Baylor, Miami, Syracuse, and Arizona to name a few. He also had visits from Ohio State and others. Lots a lot of poor company to keep.

Ehhh not really. They all offered him when he was a freshman or sophomore. Then he didn’t grow or progress and everyone except Arizona and ND went radio silent on him during his junior and senior year. His only official visit was to ND I believe.

 

[Domina Nostra]

Personally, I think the idea of QB development is overblown. Look at Clemson, did Dabo and company "develop" Taj Boyd (#3 in class) and Deshaun Watson (#1), forget how to develop Hunter Johnson (#2) and Chad Kelly (#5), remember again with Trevor Lawrence (#1), and then forget again with DJ Uiagalelie (#1).

Did Saban and company develop Bryce Young (started as Sophomore over everyone being developed by Alabama), Tua (saved NC as freshman), and Hurts (started as Freshman over all upperclassmen), but forget with Blake Barnett and Cooper Bateman?

I am on record for years disliking the Pyne offer--he's too small not to be an elite athlete or thrower. But no QB coach would have turned him into anything different.

We can't ND for making it hard to recruit and Coach Kelly for being lazy, and then blame Rees for not being able to bring in a blue-chipper into an already crowded QB room.

For whatever reason, no one has been able to land an elite QB at ND since Clausen. And only Quinn and Kizer looked like potential NFL QBs. (Golson was the greatest disappointment.)

I don't think Rees can do no wrong, I just think its silly to pretend someone else would be doing better in this situation and don't think he is solely to blame for getting us here. I do agree that he better land a good one this year (I am not an Avery Johnson fan).

 

[TNUtoNotreDame]

And does anyone believe Buchner will be an elite QB? I don’t see it.

If Rees stays? Not a chance in hell. Likely no

We’re

We’re in Day 2 of the Tommy Rees Cycle where some people reconvince themselves that Tommy isn’t responsible for anything that happened on his watch.

We’ll be back here next Tuesday after Tommy lays an egg in the Carrier Dome.


No QB looking for a new home in the off-season should be afraid of Buchner. You can’t be afraid of a QB who has only shown he can run, overthrow receivers and get hurt through two seasons.

Can set a clock by it. A lot of people refuse to admit Tommy is the issue. Not just play calling, it is development, interaction and refusing to learn. Same people, same excuse, same damn channel.

Personally, I think the idea of QB development is overblown. Look at Clemson, did Dabo and company "develop" Taj Boyd (#3 in class) and Deshaun Watson (#1), forget how to develop Hunter Johnson (#2) and Chad Kelly (#5), remember again with Trevor Lawrence (#1), and then forget again with DJ Uiagalelie (#1).

Did Saban and company develop Bryce Young (started as Sophomore over everyone being developed by Alabama), Tua (saved NC as freshman), and Hurts (started as Freshman over all upperclassmen), but forget with Blake Barnett and Cooper Bateman?

I am on record for years disliking the Pyne offer--he's too small not to be an elite athlete or thrower. But no QB coach would have turned him into anything different.

We can't ND for making it hard to recruit and Coach Kelly for being lazy, and then blame Rees for not being able to bring in a blue-chipper into an already crowded QB room.

For whatever reason, no one has been able to land an elite QB at ND since Clausen. And only Quinn and Kizer looked like potential NFL QBs. (Golson was the greatest disappointment.)

Oh goodness, anything to protect Tommy. At minimum QBs on average should improve year over year. We lack in that area.

 

[stlnd01]

Ehhh not really. They all offered him when he was a freshman or sophomore. Then he didn’t grow or progress and everyone except Arizona and ND went radio silent on him during his junior and senior year. His only official visit was to ND I believe.

Pyne also committed to Notre Dame in April of his sophomore year of high school. He took unofficial visits to Auburn and Penn State and three times to (Lincoln Riley's) Oklahoma in the months leading up that (per 247). He had big-time interest. But then he committed early to his "dream school," stopped growing/developing, and we didn't recruit over him.

Maybe that last bit was a mistake. Though as Domina pointed out, at the time we were looking at a Wimbush-to-Phil handoff which would theoretically have carried us through this season, and then had Buchner commit in the class below Pyne months before Pyne even got to Signing Day. It made sense at the time to take a project/placeholder. IMO the biggest mistake was taking them back-to-back in Clark and Pyne.

Either way, here we are. Should've brought in a grad transfer this year, someone willing to compete with Buchner for the job. Alas. There's always next year.

 

[Domina Nostra]

If Rees stays? Not a chance in hell. Likely no

Can set a clock by it. A lot of people refuse to admit Tommy is the issue. Not just play calling, it is development, interaction and refusing to learn. Same people, same excuse, same damn channel.

Oh goodness, anything to protect Tommy. At minimum QBs on average should improve year over year. We lack in that area.

You can say whatever you want about what QBs "should" do. They don't. Some get marginally better. Many get marginally worse. Some make big jumps. Some regress. It happens all across the college landscape to every team.

And how do you know Pyne isn't leaps and bounds better than his freshman year?

The failure at QB is an evaluation and recruiting issue, not a development issue.

 

[TNUtoNotreDame]

You can say whatever you want about what QBs "should" do. They don't. Some get marginally better. Many get marginally worse. Some make big jumps. Some regress. It happens all across the college landscape to every team.

And how do you know Pyne isn't leaps and bounds better than his freshman year?

The failure at QB is an evaluation and recruiting issue, not a development issue.

Fine, I will use your measurement, Tommy failed at evaluating and recruiting. Cool?

 

[ulukinatme]

Imagine dating someone for 3 months, but they don’t want to be seen in public with you. That’s what ND was to Dante Moore. Only an idiot wouldn’t pick up on something shady going on.

I realize you probably weren't here back in March, but you're preaching to the choir. I was one of the first people to question why we shut down QB recruiting, I didn't trust Moore, I didn't like all our eggs in one hidden/silent basket. Again, the coaches were all on board until Moore kept pushing his recruitment date back . Most of the fans were happy to wait too if it meant a big time QB. Then the coaches pulled the trigger on Carr and called Moore's bluff. He went with the bag, we weren't going to give him the big bag. Pretty hard to fault the coaches for that one when their hands were tied, but lesson learned right?

 

[Domina Nostra]

Fine, I will use your measurement, Tommy failed at evaluating and recruiting. Cool?

Cool. But, he was a young QB coach, under an OC and an experienced HC when Pyne, Clark, and Buchner committed. So he can't take all the blame.

You have to think Long and Kelly should have been very involved.

 

[TNUtoNotreDame]

Cool. But, he was a young QB coach, under an OC and an experienced HC when Pyne, Clark, and Buchner committed. So he can't take all the blame.

You have to think Long and Kelly should have been very involved.

Excuse, after excuse. I'm done , have a good day.

 

[irishff1014]

Excuse, after excuse. I'm done , have a good day.

You are right. They want to talk about accountability but nothing is his fault. Freeman needs an OC that can adapt on the fly, can recruit and develop a QB.

If Freeman chooses not to his head coaching job at ND will be short lived.

 

[NDIrish1988]

I realize you probably weren't here back in March, but you're preaching to the choir. I was one of the first people to question why we shut down QB recruiting, I didn't trust Moore, I didn't like all our eggs in one hidden/silent basket. Again, the coaches were all on board until Moore kept pushing his recruitment date back . Most of the fans were happy to wait too if it meant a big time QB. Then the coaches pulled the trigger on Carr and called Moore's bluff. He went with the bag, we weren't going to give him the big bag. Pretty hard to fault the coaches for that one when their hands were tied, but lesson learned right?

No, I fault them for trusting Moore. It should’ve been obvious when he kept pushing off his commitment, they were being played.

 

[NDIrish1988]

Cool. But, he was a young QB coach, under an OC and an experienced HC when Pyne, Clark, and Buchner committed. So he can't take all the blame.

You have to think Long and Kelly should have been very involved.

IDGAF. Anyone who recruits those 3 to be staring QB isn’t worth a damn at their job.

 

[IHateMarkMay]

No, I fault them for trusting Moore. It should’ve been obvious when he kept pushing off his commitment, they were being played.

So, at what point do you not recruit over a kid? For example, let's use Drayk Bowen. He's committed, he seems to be all in. Do we keep recruiting guys to play his position just in case he has a change of heart? If Moore committed, would the staff be able to trust him in your eyes? Even if you publicly commit, you can play the part and take secret visits. So either you trust a recruit who commits to you (public or not, he commits to the coaching staff) or you can never trust a recruit until he signs.

Other argument, I will beat the drum of being able to sign whenever you want to a school and if you want out, it's your one free transfer for your college career. Would make committing a bit more serious and make kids think twice.

 

[NDIrish1988]

So, at what point do you not recruit over a kid? For example, let's use Drayk Bowen. He's committed, he seems to be all in. Do we keep recruiting guys to play his position just in case he has a change of heart? If Moore committed, would the staff be able to trust him in your eyes? Even if you publicly commit, you can play the part and take secret visits. So either you trust a recruit who commits to you (public or not, he commits to the coaching staff) or you can never trust a recruit until he signs.

Other argument, I will beat the drum of being able to sign whenever you want to a school and if you want out, it's your one free transfer for your college career. Would make committing a bit more serious and make kids think twice.

If he PUBLICLY committed, yes, but the fact he was a “silent” commitment for so long should’ve raised red flags.

 

[NDMatt91]

If he PUBLICLY committed, yes, but the fact he was a “silent” commitment for so long should’ve raised red flags.

Hopefully Freeman and whoever the next OC is learn from the Dante situation. If a kid is a "silent commit" for months but he refuses to pull the trigger and you're in good/decent position with other solid QB's who may want to come, you tell the "silent commit" that if he publicly commits he'll be the only QB you take but if others want in and declare before he does you'll need to honor that but will also take him if he wants to publicly commit.

 

[IHateMarkMay]

If he PUBLICLY committed, yes, but the fact he was a “silent” commitment for so long should’ve raised red flags.

So, just to be sure here, you wouldn't have recruited someone to fill in for Keeley when he was publicly committed but taking visits elsewhere?

 

[NDIrish1988]

Hopefully Freeman and whoever the next OC is learn from the Dante situation. If a kid is a "silent commit" for months but he refuses to pull the trigger and you're in good/decent position with other solid QB's who may want to come, you tell the "silent commit" that if he publicly commits he'll be the only QB you take but if others want in and declare before he does you'll need to honor that but will also take him if he wants to publicly commit.

That’s common sense. What reason could a player have for being a silent commit for so long other than he’s shopping himself around.

 

[NDisme]

It was so clear how dumb it was to hinge so much on Tyler Buchner. Everyone wants to oversimplify things to make themselves feel better about ND’s situation, but it should’ve been clear Buchner was an extremely risky bet.

Ok but at some point you have to develop a guy you recruited. I’m not saying it was smart but like I stated all these “top” guys that transfer know they are going to be the guy immediately

 

[StPaul_Irish]

Hopefully Freeman and whoever the next OC is learn from the Dante situation. If a kid is a "silent commit" for months but he refuses to pull the trigger and you're in good/decent position with other solid QB's who may want to come, you tell the "silent commit" that if he publicly commits he'll be the only QB you take but if others want in and declare before he does you'll need to honor that but will also take him if he wants to publicly commit.

Or the Will Shipley situation? Not exactly the same, but similar

 

[NDisme]

That’s common sense. What reason could a player have for being a silent commit for so long other than he’s shopping himself around.

After he came to campus in April with his dad and they rolled out the red carpet and he still wouldn’t go public. That was definitely the time to cut bait

 

[Free Manera]

If silent commit means “don’t tell anyone I committed because I want to have a big announcement but I’m done taking visits to other schools and I’m not listening to other coaches”, cool.

If it means “hey I want to take other visits but I’m committed”, well no you aren’t. And I’m telling the kid that if one of our other top choices commit publicly and shut it down, we’re taking them. You can’t play this game. It’s not like it was between Moore and Pyne. It was Moore and other very good QBs like Vizzina. This seems like a common sense business like approach and it blows my mind someone making 2 million dollars a year would get duped like this.