Immigration

[drayer54]

Biden is either doing this on purpose or wholly incompetent:

 

[IRISHDODGER]

 

[Irish#1]

Passing the buck. It's not our fault, it's Texas fault. lol

 

[drayer54]

Democrats are 100% responsible for this problem. Ship them to the democrats.

 

[Sea Turtle]

Passing the buck. It's not our fault, it's Texas fault. lol

If texas would just bend over and take it, everything would be fine.

 

[PerthDomer]

Fetterman defends 'reasonable' border talks as fellow Dems fume

The Pennsylvania progressive's comments follow his staunch support for Israel's war in Gaza, which has also befuddled some of his typical allies on the left.

www.politico.com

Who expected the pragmatic common sense deal maker arc for John Fetterman?

“I hope Democrats can understand that it isn’t xenophobic to be concerned about the border,” Fetterman said in an interview. “It’s a reasonable conversation, and Democrats should engage.”

“Honestly, it’s astonishing. And this isn’t a Fox News kind of statistic. This is the government’s,” he said. “You essentially have Pittsburgh showing up there at the border.”

 

[IRISHDODGER]

Fetterman defends 'reasonable' border talks as fellow Dems fume

The Pennsylvania progressive's comments follow his staunch support for Israel's war in Gaza, which has also befuddled some of his typical allies on the left.

www.politico.com

Who expected the pragmatic common sense deal maker arc for John Fetterman?

“I hope Democrats can understand that it isn’t xenophobic to be concerned about the border,” Fetterman said in an interview. “It’s a reasonable conversation, and Democrats should engage.”

“Honestly, it’s astonishing. And this isn’t a Fox News kind of statistic. This is the government’s,” he said. “You essentially have Pittsburgh showing up there at the border.”

Not me. But kudos to him. Sadly, it’s coming far too late but better late than never.

 

[PerthDomer]

Not me. But kudos to him. Sadly, it’s coming far too late but better late than never.

If you look at the composition of the Senate, you can probably get an immigration deal that gets more R votes than D ones. All the moderates and plenty of team players like Fetterman want to look tough on the border. The real question is whether that even gets a vote in Mike Johnson's House.

 

[drayer54]

If you look at the composition of the Senate, you can probably get an immigration deal that gets more R votes than D ones. All the moderates and plenty of team players like Fetterman want to look tough on the border. The real question is whether that even gets a vote in Mike Johnson's House.

Lots of Democrats know they are sitting on top of a turd sandwich given to them by the Biden WH.

A better read on this would be offered by looking at the middle. Republicans see Chinese nationals, 15k daily unverified people rolling across the border, as a problem. Dems aren't admitting it until they are arriving in their cities. I suspect Mike Johnson is not even close to the problem here. It wasn't Mike Johnson who decided opening the border was a good idea. GOP is holding onto the border, and I hope they continue to do so.

 

[PerthDomer]

Lots of Democrats know they are sitting on top of a turd sandwich given to them by the Biden WH.

A better read on this would be offered by looking at the middle. Republicans see Chinese nationals, 15k daily unverified people rolling across the border, as a problem. Dems aren't admitting it until they are arriving in their cities. I suspect Mike Johnson is not even close to the problem here. It wasn't Mike Johnson who decided opening the border was a good idea. GOP is holding onto the border, and I hope they continue to do so.

The most recent reporting I've seen is that Biden is to the right of the dem senate caucus on immigration. A lot of the dealmaking is done by negotiation blow ups (similar to the debt ceiling). The two sides are back to negotiating after calling everything off yesterday.

Biden knows that long term how Ukraine shapes up is probably a big or the biggest thing in his legacy. The more he compromises on immigration, the more it neutralizes the salient of the issue in 2024. I'm pretty confident something gets out of the senate. The only question is whether the house will act on that bill.

 

[Polish Leppy 22]

Regardless of what happens with the Senate, Biden should be impeached for dereliction of duty because of what he's allowed to happen at the southern border.

 

[PerthDomer]

Regardless of what happens with the Senate, Biden should be impeached for dereliction of duty because of what he's allowed to happen at the southern border.

Did we impeach GWB over the border? Crossing in his presidency were quite high and dwarfed Obama/Trump/Biden until recently.

 

[IRISHDODGER]

If you look at the composition of the Senate, you can probably get an immigration deal that gets more R votes than D ones. All the moderates and plenty of team players like Fetterman want to look tough on the border. The real question is whether that even gets a vote in Mike Johnson's House.

I look at the composition of the US Senate & remind myself how bad we need term limits…or at least age limits. Blame Johnson or whomever else, but nothing of any substance will be done about the border until it’s far too late. Probably already is.

One day when we least expect it some small town(s) in flyover country will get a terrorist attack and the US will have a 9/11-like response which is too say an over reaction that adversely affect US citizens vs actually making us safer. And at that point, no Americans will feel safe b/c Iran (Hezbollah, etc) will have shown America that no city is too small or large to destroy in the name of Allah.

These idiots say they don’t want Trump but their actions are guaranteeing another Trump or Trump-like leader.

 

[Polish Leppy 22]

Did we impeach GWB over the border? Crossing in his presidency were quite high and dwarfed Obama/Trump/Biden until recently.

1) No. Wouldn't have bothered me if we did.

2) If you're gonna make that claim, show your homework.

3) The numbers we've seen in the past 2 years blow away anything we've seen before. 12,000 in one day isn't immigration. It's invasion.

 

[PerthDomer]

1) No. Wouldn't have bothered me if we did.

2) If you're gonna make that claim, show your homework.

3) The numbers we've seen in the past 2 years blow away anything we've seen before. 12,000 in one day isn't immigration. It's invasion.

Border patrol encounters in the U.S. 2025| Statista

The number of illegal border crossings reached an all-time high in 2022, with over 2.2 million migrant encounters registered by the U.S. Border Patrol.

www.statista.com

We surpassed last years numbers in 2000 and matched it a few other years.

Why is it an invasion? They're coming here and lawfully claiming asylum. If you want to change the system change the law.

12k a day is 0.004% of our population per day.

Also, shouldn't we be trying to get more refugees fleeing China? They're obviously go getters and are fleeing Xi. It weakens the CCP. Seems like a win win.

 

[PerthDomer]

I look at the composition of the US Senate & remind myself how bad we need term limits…or at least age limits. Blame Johnson or whomever else, but nothing of any substance will be done about the border until it’s far too late. Probably already is.

One day when we least expect it some small town(s) in flyover country will get a terrorist attack and the US will have a 9/11-like response which is too say an over reaction that adversely affect US citizens vs actually making us safer. And at that point, no Americans will feel safe b/c Iran (Hezbollah, etc) will have shown America that no city is too small or large to destroy in the name of Allah.

These idiots say they don’t want Trump but their actions are guaranteeing another Trump or Trump-like leader.

Every big terrorist attack we've had has been US citizens, or legal residents. Everyone from 911 was legally here. Hell, we didn't even go after their home country (Saudi Arabia).

Fortunately for us, the countries these people are fleeing tend to be more culturally similar to us than the refugees Europe gets. Latin Americans just don't have a big terrorism impulse and they're Catholics or Evangelicals.

Our ports are easier to get into. And for people with money it's easy enough to get a student or tourist visa.

On the Sentate, it's a much more productive body than the house. It tends to reach more deals/bipartisan stuff comes out of there with more give and take. It has better legislators than the house. The house has fewer competitive elections, and has more of a revolving door leading to more idiots being there. Institutionally the senate tends to empower moderates more and the house the extremes, at least with polarized parties and slim majorities.

 

[drayer54]

1) No. Wouldn't have bothered me if we did.

2) If you're gonna make that claim, show your homework.

3) The numbers we've seen in the past 2 years blow away anything we've seen before. 12,000 in one day isn't immigration. It's invasion.

It’s Chinese nationals, Africans, Middle East nations, etc. The Chinese nationals part really raises an eyebrow to people not turning away from it.

Fortunately for us, the countries these people are fleeing tend to be more culturally similar to us than the refugees Europe gets. Latin Americans just don't have a big terrorism impulse and they're Catholics or Evangelicals.

Our ports are easier to get into. And for people with money it's easy enough to get a student or tourist visa.

On the Sentate, it's a much more productive body than the house. It tends to reach more deals/bipartisan stuff comes out of there with more give and take. It has better legislators than the house. The house has fewer competitive elections, and has more of a revolving door leading to more idiots being there. Institutionally the senate tends to empower moderates more and the house the extremes, at least with polarized parties and slim majorities.

Who has passed more legislation this term— House or Senate?
Last term?

What about the invasion of Chinese nationals? Middle East? Africa?

 

[PerthDomer]

It’s Chinese nationals, Africans, Middle East nations, etc. The Chinese nationals part really raises an eyebrow to people not turning away from it.

Who has passed more legislation this term— House or Senate?
Last term?

What about the invasion of Chinese nationals? Middle East? Africa?

People are fleeing China. The rich have come over on visas they set up long ago for a day like this. The poor fly to Ecuador and take a months long trip across South America to get to the border and seek asylum. Their approval rate is really high (70ish percent vs under 30 overall). We want those people.

Any legislation that becomes law gets through both houses. The house tends to pads messaging bills that goes nowhere (think dems post 2018 under teump, R's now). Deals tend to happen in the senate.

I treat a lot of kids whose parents are refugees from Africa/the Middle East. I want those people here. Salt of the earth.

 

[Polish Leppy 22]

Border patrol encounters in the U.S. 2025| Statista

The number of illegal border crossings reached an all-time high in 2022, with over 2.2 million migrant encounters registered by the U.S. Border Patrol.

www.statista.com

We surpassed last years numbers in 2000 and matched it a few other years.

Why is it an invasion? They're coming here and lawfully claiming asylum. If you want to change the system change the law.

12k a day is 0.004% of our population per day.

Also, shouldn't we be trying to get more refugees fleeing China? They're obviously go getters and are fleeing Xi. It weakens the CCP. Seems like a win win.

The numbers are record setting, and those don't include the getaways.

12k a day is unsustainable for any nation, and that percentage to our population is irrelevant.

You should research what factors constitute asylum. Hint: being poor isn't one of them. Asylum seekers should be seeking refuge at the nearest nation, which in many cases no our southern border isn't the US.

Guess what empowers the CCP...bringing in Chinese spies to the US

 

[PerthDomer]

The numbers are record setting, and those don't include the getaways.

12k a day is unsustainable for any nation, and that percentage to our population is irrelevant.

You should research what factors constitute asylum. Hint: being poor isn't one of them. Asylum seekers should be seeking refuge at the nearest nation, which in many cases no our southern border isn't the US.

Guess what empowers the CCP...bringing in Chinese spies to the US

The border is a much harder way for Chinese spies to get in. Legal mechanisms are far easier.

Those crossings also count people for each time they cross and are sent back. The population of illegal immigrants living in the US are below prior highs.

And in general for everything, absolute number is less important than proportion coming over. Our population of immigrants was far far higher back in the early 1900s and the line between legal and illegal was quite blurry back then.

Everyone agrees the asylum system is broken. R's won't sign off on just upping staffing/throughput so that the wait time to adjudicate isn't stupid long. They want bigger changes/a pound of flesh. The real question is how big that pound of flesh is.

 

[drayer54]

I want those people here. Salt of the earth.

How many of them do you want? NYC and Chicago used to say the same thing.

 

[PerthDomer]

How many of them do you want? NYC and Chicago used to say the same thing.

We settled a lot of refugees in Western Wisconsin where I grew up. I did fellowship in Seattle which has a ton of people from the horn of Africa that do fine. I currently live in the DC area which integrates a lot of people from the Middle East.

I'd say NYC's failure is more down to their broken housing policy and our policy of barring asylum seekers from getting work while their status is in limbo. If those guys could get legal employment your social services wouldn't be so overwhelmed.

But again, you need to streamline the asylum process and tighten definitions. If it took a month to process and get sent home for 80% of people coming over the stream of people would slow.

 

[Polish Leppy 22]

The border is a much harder way for Chinese spies to get in. Legal mechanisms are far easier.

Those crossings also count people for each time they cross and are sent back. The population of illegal immigrants living in the US are below prior highs.

And in general for everything, absolute number is less important than proportion coming over. Our population of immigrants was far far higher back in the early 1900s and the line between legal and illegal was quite blurry back then.

Everyone agrees the asylum system is broken. R's won't sign off on just upping staffing/throughput so that the wait time to adjudicate isn't stupid long. They want bigger changes/a pound of flesh. The real question is how big that pound of flesh is.

I'm sure you do good work but your bleeding heart is blinding your view of reality at our southern border.

I've never heard one person say the asylum system is broken. It's pretty black and white, as are our immigration laws. This federal admin is simply choosing not to enforce them.

 

[PerthDomer]

I'm sure you do good work but your bleeding heart is blinding your view of reality at our southern border.

I've never heard one person say the asylum system is broken. It's pretty black and white, as are our immigration laws. This federal admin is simply choosing not to enforce them.

When I say the asylum system is broken I mean it's understaffed such that abuse of the asylum system is allowing people to stay here.

The difference between illegal immigration under Bush and now is that in the early 2000s people coming over knew they'd be deported so they tried to cross and evade border patrol. Now that the asylum system is clogged people show up and say rule on my case. The backlog is something like a decade so they're home free.

To me the solution is finding a way to process through those requests faster. Your other option is making the process of getting over here worse than home country conditions. And that's pretty hard to do.

 

[Polish Leppy 22]

When I say the asylum system is broken I mean it's understaffed such that abuse of the asylum system is allowing people to stay here.

The difference between illegal immigration under Bush and now is that in the early 2000s people coming over knew they'd be deported so they tried to cross and evade border patrol. Now that the asylum system is clogged people show up and say rule on my case. The backlog is something like a decade so they're home free.

To me the solution is finding a way to process through those requests faster. Your other option is making the process of getting over here worse than home country conditions. And that's pretty hard to do.

The first option for anyone seeking asylum (regardless of their home country) is to seek refuge in the closest neighboring country.

What's most hard of all to do is caring for America's poor, homeless, wounded vets, etc. while taking in millions of migrants from third world countries.

 

[drayer54]

We did it, Joe!

 

[drayer54]

Somehow, Biden’s border is getting worse.

 

[PerthDomer]

The first option for anyone seeking asylum (regardless of their home country) is to seek refuge in the closest neighboring country.

What's most hard of all to do is caring for America's poor, homeless, wounded vets, etc. while taking in millions of migrants from third world countries.

You need to change actual laws to get the enforcement you're seeking out.

Granted if we let them work right away they wouldn't be the drain they currently are. Someone willing to chance the Darien Gap will do most anything to survive.

 

[drayer54]

Over 300k in December.

 

[Irish#1]

Being a white male boomer, I admit, it's all my fault. Now can we move on from assigning blame to figuring out some common sense solutions?