BYU Postgame

[Dale]

Needs to be a real conversation during bye between Freeman - Denbrock - Carr. Denbrock needs to be step it up on tendency beaters and variation to the offense. Carr needs to not check out of half the plays for quick game. That “boring” or not creative feeling people are getting is some Carr checking to quick game calls. That is by definition, simplifying the call, and often making it into a half field read. The relationship between the two are not in balance. The balance between avoiding negative plays and gaining explosive plays is not in balance.

 

[IRISHDODGER]

Maybe some of these guys are playing through injuries but some of the stalwarts from the past few years are having their worst performances at the same time.

I only recall KVA (yes I know he has a hand injury) being mentioned once whereas both of BYUs LB were making plays throughout the game. And Glasker was allegedly playing hurt or at least questionable coming into game.

no reason to think Knapp was nursing an injury. Even so, he got worked by BYU which shocked me.

Moore looked like a shell of himself. I hope the week off leads to him getting close to 100%

poor Shuler. Is he playing thru an injury? We can’t forget he just lost his dad, either.

is Bowen basically a pre-2014 Navy Joe Schmidt? that was typed tongue in cheek but I think we all expected more from him as well.

Was the reason Bryce Young neutralized due to Ash mostly rushing 4 while BYU had 6-7 staying back to block? I had hoped he would flash when Traore was ejected

 

[PutuporShutup]

Because he was scared all game one of the mugged LBs would drop back in coverage. Gilbert was open. The protection rolled to the right means he was never gonna look left.

This..... they are taking the "take what the defense gives you" wayyy too far. They're defining that pre snap instead of post snap and the other teams know it. You need to dictate to the defense at times. I'm fine with the slot fade as one of the options but Faison was a decoy and didn't run a route allowing his defender to help a little. if he runs a slant to the middle where greathouse is vacating, now you have 2 options AND his corner can't as easily help. Also, what a thought, if they're in man like they obviously were, MAYBE the defenders run into each other and you get an actual open WR. It's just moronic at this level with this caliber of players, game on the line to try to not even get someone open. There's a TON of stress on everyone in that play, try to help BYU into some mistakes, like BYU did to ND all night.

 

[PolishDomer]

One last thing...why are our coordinators not up in the box like other teams?

 

[IRISHDODGER]

Needs to be a real conversation during bye between Freeman - Denbrock - Carr. Denbrock needs to be step it up on tendency beaters and variation to the offense. Carr needs to not check out of half the plays for quick game. That “boring” or not creative feeling people are getting is some Carr checking to quick game calls. That is by definition, simplifying the call, and often making it into a half field read. The relationship between the two are not in balance. The balance between avoiding negative plays and gaining explosive plays is not in balance.

Bingo. CJ clearly enjoys the chess match part of his game. From a laypersons perspective, it’s gotten to be like “pre-snap read Tourette’s” to the point MF had to burn a TO b/c play clock was nearing 0. When Denbrock went hurry-up in the final quarter. Carr neutralized their advantage. BYU looked as out of position as ND did at times on D. Problem was, CJ kept changing the play long enough to allow BYU D to get set. Paralysis by analysis. Land the plane!!

 

[NDMatt91]

"If you can't get more than 3 WR in a game then you're not doing a good enough job." -Mike Frank

Worth noting that in Brown's 2 WR classes so far that not a single WR that he recruited is in the rotation. So based on only playing 3, there are a few possibilities:

1. The other WR on the roster aren't very good.
2. The other WR on the roster aren't ready.
3. Mike Brown is incompetent.

If it's #1 or #2 that would indicate that Brown is not a good evaluator and developer.

 

[PutuporShutup]

Needs to be a real conversation during bye between Freeman - Denbrock - Carr. Denbrock needs to be step it up on tendency beaters and variation to the offense. Carr needs to not check out of half the plays for quick game. That “boring” or not creative feeling people are getting is some Carr checking to quick game calls. That is by definition, simplifying the call, and often making it into a half field read. The relationship between the two are not in balance. The balance between avoiding negative plays and gaining explosive plays is not in balance.

CJ even said the last play wasn't the play call, it was the check if they got a specific look. Well, you got that look about 7 times throughout the night and weren't successful on it. I'd love to know what the original call was? The corner covering faison knew exactly where the ball as going and forced a bad throw, now it was still blatant PI, but greathouse was pretty much double teamed due to byu knowing exactly what was coming. Pre snap, when carr see's the corner on faison at the goal line, he can't check to that even though the slot corner was pressing. IF faison slants to the middle there's so many options as they had only 2 defenders to defend 2 wrs.

It's just so bad after a timeout

 

[Blazers46]

First Half - Defense sucked, offense wasn’t awful, they just only had 4 possessions. FG, TD, Punt, SpikeFumble…

3rd quarter is where ND blew it.

BYU only had 2 possessions for 39 yards. A muff and a bad fake. Essentially 2 bad ST turnovers.

ND had 4 possessions, 21 plays for 51 yards. BYU survived the 3rd quarter.

ND lost because of 3 FGs and a spike fluke. BYU did all they could to lose the game in the 3rd but the ND offense shit the bed.

As awful as the defense played in the first half, I thought they played great until that last drive in the second half.

 

[RDU Irish]

🤣Goodnite sweet prince!

Even SEC sites see ND shafting by officials now. High ROI "mistake" by B12.

IMO we miss Raridon and Fields more than Price and Love on offense. Greathouse has the catch radius of an armadillo - amazing he can put up such numbers when he may as well not even own fingers with how he catches the ball. Running fades to him might as well punch yourself in the dick. Frosh/Soph WRs have enough talent to contribute and failure to develop them to compete in October/November is some low T shit.

 

[Dale]

CJ even said the last play wasn't the play call, it was the check if they got a specific look. Well, you got that look about 7 times throughout the night and weren't successful on it. I'd love to know what the original call was? The corner covering faison knew exactly where the ball as going and forced a bad throw, now it was still blatant PI, but greathouse was pretty much double teamed due to byu knowing exactly what was coming. Pre snap, when carr see's the corner on faison at the goal line, he can't check to that even though the slot corner was pressing. IF faison slants to the middle there's so many options as they had only 2 defenders to defend 2 wrs.

It's just so bad after a timeout

CJ would have never thrown a slant there because of the backers. If he did confirm it as a check, I assume they initial play was a Greathouse out route with Faison vertical/short post

 

[MacIrish75]

One last thing...why are our coordinators not up in the box like other teams?

I’ve said this repeatedly. DC I don’t have a preference either way. But I want my OC in the box so you can actually see how plays unfold, how defenses adjust to your motions and formations in real time, see what your QB is seeing, as opposed to waiting until after the drive on an IPAD.

 

[Blazers46]

Also not sure if it been mentioned but the slot fade worked in the end zone one of those times, I think the first one… Faison just simply dropped it and it doinked right off his shoulder pad. I do t recall the ball being tipped or anything, just a miss

 

[MacIrish75]

Also not sure if it been mentioned but the slot fade worked in the end zone one of those times, I think the first one… Faison just simply dropped it and it doinked right off his shoulder pad. I do t recall the ball being tipped or anything, just a miss

I think the biggest miss in the entire sequence was bringing Graham in cold off the bench and then running a corner/fade for him off motion.

 

[Dale]

Also not sure if it been mentioned but the slot fade worked in the end zone one of those times, I think the first one… Faison just simply dropped it and it doinked right off his shoulder pad. I do t recall the ball being tipped or anything, just a miss

That is the thing with the slot fade debacle. It worked, multiple times in concept. Larsen it worked. Flanigan it worked. It DID work. And one singular hit is a W. The chemistry was off and idk if it was the moment or the air or what, but he simply missed them. That is why I find myself slightly sympathetic to Denbrock after this and hard on CJ. If he simply connects on some misses, you’re taking a 31, 35+ point performance.

 

[MPClinton22]

One last thing...why are our coordinators not up in the box like other teams?

I’ve wondered this constantly at least about Denbrock. It feels like coaching malpractice to give up the view from the box when trying to adjust and scheme against a defense. Just makes no sense

 

[RDU Irish]

I think the biggest miss in the entire sequence was bringing Graham in cold off the bench and then running a corner/fade for him off motion.

That mistake was the culmination of 59 minutes without a rotation.

 

[RDU Irish]

That is the thing with the slot fade debacle. It worked, multiple times in concept. Larsen it worked. Flanigan it worked. It DID work. And one singular hit is a W. The chemistry was off and idk if it was the moment or the air or what, but he simply missed them. That is why I find myself slightly sympathetic to Denbrock after this and hard on CJ. If he simply connects on some misses, you’re taking a 31, 35+ point performance.

Raridon and Fields would have two more TDs on the board for the good guys. TE is well below ND standards this year and our WR room lacks any 6-4 rebounder types. Hell work up OBrien or Talich for that route before T-rex Greathouse.

 

[pumpdog20]

Also not sure if it been mentioned but the slot fade worked in the end zone one of those times, I think the first one… Faison just simply dropped it and it doinked right off his shoulder pad. I do t recall the ball being tipped or anything, just a miss

I wonder if he would have been OOB though.

 

[pumpdog20]

That is the thing with the slot fade debacle. It worked, multiple times in concept. Larsen it worked. Flanigan it worked. It DID work. And one singular hit is a W. The chemistry was off and idk if it was the moment or the air or what, but he simply missed them. That is why I find myself slightly sympathetic to Denbrock after this and hard on CJ. If he simply connects on some misses, you’re taking a 31, 35+ point performance.

I think it's the talent he's throwing to. They don't high point any catches, at least not on 50/50 balls. Not consistently anyways.

 

[Giddyup]

No deep shots basically all game. But with refs letting their cb’s hold like they are reffing a narduzzi game I knew it’d be hard for a guy to get free over the top.

TBH, I’m not even sure we have a burner at wr that could make a deep, deep shot happen against a top 10 team

 

[allenm5333]

No deep shots basically all game. But with refs letting their cb’s hold like they are reffing a narduzzi game I knew it’d be hard for a guy to get free over the top.

TBH, I’m not even sure we have a burner at wr that could make a deep, deep shot happen against a top 10 team

Carr took a lot of deep shot. what are you talking about?

 

[Giddyup]

Past 30 yards? I can only remember one or two off hand

 

[NDFAN2008]

Carr took a lot of deep shot. what are you talking about?

No play action over the top shots

 

[NDFAN2008]

I think the biggest issue with this offense is we tend to run first and get 2nd and 3rd or 4 and decide to throw a 15-20 yard sideline fade. 85% of the time the fade doesn't work. Why not just run it again?

 

[Dale]

I think it's the talent he's throwing to. They don't high point any catches, at least not on 50/50 balls. Not consistently anyways.

Can’t high point balls that sail over your head

 

[allenm5333]

Can’t high point balls that sail over your head

We need 1. Infusion of team speed. 2. A big "my ball" type of WR 3. Our "star" qb to not piss down his leg and give receivers a chance

 

[Blazers46]

I think it's the talent he's throwing to. They don't high point any catches, at least not on 50/50 balls. Not consistently anyways.

I watched a podcast the other day and the gave a PFF stat where end zone fades are more 30/70… so essentially we kept throwing low percentage balls in high stakes situations. Not ideal.

 

[GoldenToTheGrave]

I think it's the talent he's throwing to. They don't high point any catches, at least not on 50/50 balls. Not consistently anyways.

As much as Jaden Greathouse's performance is getting galzed he proved again that he doesn't attack the ball whatsoever.

 

[IrishinSyria]

That is the thing with the slot fade debacle. It worked, multiple times in concept. Larsen it worked. Flanigan it worked. It DID work. And one singular hit is a W. The chemistry was off and idk if it was the moment or the air or what, but he simply missed them. That is why I find myself slightly sympathetic to Denbrock after this and hard on CJ. If he simply connects on some misses, you’re taking a 31, 35+ point performance.

yeah, I don't get the denbrock hate. this remains an offense that has produced at levels we could never have dreamed of during basically the entire 2010s and early 2020s, and while it didn't look great on Saturday things look a lot different if we simply execute to the level we've been executing at all year. They were playing a lot of man, we threw up a lot of balls to bigger players in single coverage, and those players didn't catch those balls at the rate you would expect.

 

[IrishinSyria]

I watched a podcast the other day and the gave a PFF stat where end zone fades are more 30/70… so essentially we kept throwing low percentage balls in high stakes situations. Not ideal.

That's an NFL stat though. In college, in theory, your hit rate should be higher if you can get favorable mismatches, which, in theory, we should be able to do against BYU.