2020 Elections

[dublinirish]

I was waiting for Pence to answer the tough questions but he rarely did.

this is what he has always done. he's never been a straight talker. He's a bluffer

 

[IrishLax]

She avoided some as well. In particular about packing the SC.

By far Pence's best move, IMO, was holding her feet to the fire on that.

 

[tussin]

I know the narrative is that Pence was evasive, but I don't feel like he was really asked any tough questions? I think most of the time when he didn't answer a question it was because he felt it was more important to continue addressing a prior topic (versus not having an answer to the given question). That's a strategic decision rather than an evasive one.

 

[Cackalacky2.0]

I know the narrative is that Pence was evasive, but I don't feel like he was really asked any tough questions? I think most of the time when he didn't answer a question it was because he felt it was more important to continue addressing a prior topic (versus not having an answer to the given question). That's a strategic decision rather than an evasive one.

Its not the narrative.... its what he did. Anyone can see it. He had his chances to answer the previous questions. He didn’t answer specific questions asked if him. That’s not only evasive but also a missed opportunity. Either way I found him not answering the specific questions as a turnoff. He didn’t gain any ground with me.

Yes yes yes, Kamala did too on a few but Pence didn't answer many more of them directly.

 

[IrishLax]

I know the narrative is that Pence was evasive, but I don't feel like he was really asked any tough questions? I think most of the time when he didn't answer a question it was because he felt it was more important to continue addressing a prior topic (versus not having an answer to the given question). That's a strategic decision rather than an evasive one.

The three questions I distinctly remember him dodging were:
1. The abortion one. They asked him point blank if he would like to see Indiana ban abortions. He responded by talking about Iran or some shit, I forget, but my wife said "what the fuck does any of this have to do with abortion?" And that's why I remember it.
2. The one about Trump's age and health, and if they'd had conversations about it (Harris dodged the same question). I remember this one because he wouldn't touch it with a ten foot pole and talked about a completely different topic.
3. The one about peaceful transfer of power. This one was really bad and possibly his low point of the night.

Everything else is a blur, but they were both evasive. Pence maybe a little more so, but nothing to write home about. And I think he was skilled in how he handled his evasions.

 

[Irish#1]

Its not the narrative.... its what he did. Anyone can see it. He had his chances to answer the previous questions. He didn’t answer specific questions asked if him. That’s not only evasive but also a missed opportunity. Either way I found him not answering the specific questions as a turnoff. He didn’t gain any ground with me.

Yes yes yes, Kamala did too on a few but Pence didn't answer many more of them directly.

Yes mommy. I did steal a pack of gum, but Timmy stole two!

I watched a few clips online this morning. There was no clear winner.

 

[FDNYIrish1]

I feel like I’ve lost 2 debates in a row. I feel the debates are completely useless with each side trying to manipulate “gotcha” moments based off of incomplete clips set up off of slanted media reporting. I need more answers and background on issues. I hate the whole lie narrative the media puts out. Clearly there is nuance to a lot of the issues that we have no real information on. These elections are incredibly frustrating. We have to have better than this.

 

[Cackalacky2.0]

Yes mommy. I did steal a pack of gum, but Timmy stole two!

I watched a few clips online this morning. There was no clear winner.

Agree. I dont even think you call these things real debates anyway so I dont care about winners or losers. I treat these like a job interview and would I want this person representing me or my company. I was able to see who they were and in this instance Kamala made a stronger impression on me as she seemed more genuine, more passionate, less evasive and didnt outright lie several times like Pence did. She also didnt talk over or interrupt Pence and the moderator. Pence abused the time limits, interrupted and talked over the moderator the whole night. I dont like that and it tells me alot about who that person is and how they conduct themsselves.

I also though Pence came off as slick but not in a good way. More like a hagfish way.

 

[Legacy]

Aren't these debates held for voters to make educated decisions on the direction for the next four years? Without that full discussion that involves clear answers without interruption, we don't get that info. Trump and mini-Trump no longer have that appeal of an outsider but a special interest lacky. Pence did not indicate anything would change but praise and adoration for their "achievements." Arizona, Colorado, Nevada, which used to have Rep Senators, may be turning Dem for years to come. Utah is very happy with all mail-in ballots without any evidence of voter fraud.

Pew Trusts: Utah voter turnout vaults from 45th in country to 13th in four years

In the primaries this year, Republican Party turnout was 67% of its members compared to 39% of party members in the 2016 governor’s primary.

 

[IrishLax]

Just voted. Catch you all on the flip side.

 

[Irish#1]

Agree. I dont even think you call these things real debates anyway so I dont care about winners or losers. I treat these like a job interview and would I want this person representing me or my company. I was able to see who they were and in this instance Kamala made a stronger impression on me as she seemed more genuine, more passionate, less evasive and didnt outright lie several times like Pence did. She also didnt talk over or interrupt Pence and the moderator. Pence abused the time limits, interrupted and talked over the moderator the whole night. I dont like that and it tells me alot about who that person is and how they conduct themsselves.

I also though Pence came off as slick but not in a good way. More like a hagfish way.

If that bothered you, you should be outraged by Harris and her past.

 

[Sea Turtle]

China has been really threatening Taiwan lately. Many experts believe they will attack in the next 5-10 years. Whoever wins the election is going to have to deal with this.

 

[IrishLax]

https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/harris-pence-vp-debate-poll/

Some good info here for both sides.

 

[SonofOahu]

I watched with my son and wife. My wife made several comments on this. So did my son. They were both turned off by it. So was I. He also came off as condescending and haughty. She seemed more relatable and passionate.

My wife was listening to Pence talk and basically said the same thing. Pence is, and has been, a lying weasel with nothing but "all hat and no cattle" righteousness. I can't stand his phony ass.

One of my good friends is tight with their family. Fun times.

 

[SonofOahu]

By far Pence's best move, IMO, was holding her feet to the fire on that.

The correct way to answer that question is:

You ask this question as if it is a gotcha question; as if the constitution mandates that the supreme court must forever remain at 9 justices... It is not, and it does not. The Biden campaign will analyze all options as we make sure that America is fairly represented by the third branch of government. If we have learned anything over the last 5 years, it's that the Republican party cannot be counted on to live up to their words, to maintain the balance of power our founding fathers established, nor to stand up for our country when the President, himself, is the one violating the constitution. The Republican party, instead, chooses to hide from their responsibilities like hypocritical cowards.

Will we stack the bench? We will see. Whichever option we pursue, we will view it as stacking the odds in favor of America returning to its place as a just, respected, and honorable country.

 

[IrishLax]

The correct way to answer that question is:

You ask this question as if it is a gotcha question; as if the constitution mandates that the supreme court must forever remain at 9 justices... It is not, and it does not. The Biden campaign will analyze all options as we make sure that America is fairly represented by the third branch of government. If we have learned anything over the last 5 years, it's that the Republican party cannot be counted on to live up to their words, to maintain the balance of power our founding fathers established, nor to stand up for our country when the President, himself, is the one violating the constitution. The Republican party, instead, chooses to hide from their responsibilities like hypocritical cowards.

Will we stack the bench? We will see. Whichever option we pursue, we will view it as stacking the odds in favor of America returning to its place as a just, respected, and honorable country.

The other thing is that Republicans have been attempting to pack courts at all levels for years. From Duke University:
<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">The number of attempts by the GOP in recent years to pack or shrink the size of state supreme courts is incredible.<a href="https://t.co/vHw3sdiktO">https://t.co/vHw3sdiktO</a></p>— Jeffrey Sachs (@JeffreyASachs) <a href="https://twitter.com/JeffreyASachs/status/1314274900954304512?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">October 8, 2020</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

 

[drayer54]

I was looking to see how the Biden folks would support him denying us the information to whether or not he would de-legitimize the third branch of government in a power grab until after the election?

I'd hate for his radical idea to make a headline this close to the election.

 

[IrishLax]

I was looking to see how the Biden folks would support him denying us the information to whether or not he would de-legitimize the third branch of government in a power grab until after the election?

I'd hate for his radical idea to make a headline this close to the election.

When is Donald Trump going to release his tax returns? Why won't Donald Trump release a healthcare plan until after the election? Why won't Donald Trump tell us when he last tested negative for COVID?

Nobody takes Trumpers seriously when they talk about "denying information". Biden has said consistently that all options are on the table if Republicans want to force through a nominee, and it makes sense he's not going to box himself in on this because we still don't know what Mitch is going to do or how the situation may evolve.

Many Americans support Supreme Court reform that includes concepts like term limits and expanding the court. "Court packing" is a gotcha question when Republicans have been attempting "court packing" and manipulation at the federal and state levels for years.

"Elections have consequences"

 

[Cackalacky2.0]

Republicans have gone scorched earth on the judiciary at all levels and it may very well cost them control of the Senate, House and Presidency.

 

[drayer54]

When is Donald Trump going to release his tax returns? Why won't Donald Trump release a healthcare plan until after the election? Why won't Donald Trump tell us when he last tested negative for COVID?

Nobody takes Trumpers seriously when they talk about "denying information". Biden has said consistently that all options are on the table if Republicans want to force through a nominee, and it makes sense he's not going to box himself in on this because we still don't know what Mitch is going to do or how the situation may evolve.

Many Americans support Supreme Court reform that includes concepts like term limits and expanding the court. "Court packing" is a gotcha question when Republicans have been attempting "court packing" and manipulation at the federal and state levels for years.

"Elections have consequences"

You're right. Trumps tax returns and destroying the Supreme Court are equally impactful and relevant.

I'm going to vote for a candidate with good enough ideas to share before the election.

 

[IrishLax]

You're right. Trumps tax returns and destroying the Supreme Court are equally impactful and relevant.

I'm going to vote for a candidate with good enough ideas to share before the election.

Like Trump's healthcare plan? That is always "2 weeks away" but hasn't been revealed for 5 years now?

What are your feelings on Republicans "court packing" at the state and federal levels for years now? Why is that acceptable but Biden saying he'll consider all options depending on what Republicans do is not?

 

[drayer54]

Like Trump's healthcare plan? That is always "2 weeks away" but hasn't been revealed for 5 years now?

What are your feelings on Republicans "court packing" at the state and federal levels for years now? Why is that acceptable but Biden saying he'll consider all options depending on what Republicans do is not?

Trumps healthcare plan is to workout a deal with a Congress. He has done right to try, lowered drug costs, and more as a President. Like the majority of people Gallup polled, I'm better off today than I was four years ago.

Republicans have added good judges, not packed courts. Adding to the Supreme Court to move an unconstitutional agenda is a blatant abuse of power.

 

[tussin]

Republicans have added good judges, not packed courts. Adding to the Supreme Court to move an unconstitutional agenda is a blatant abuse of power.

I don't support it but it's not unconstitutional. It just goes against 150+ years of federal norms.

 

[IrishLax]

Trumps healthcare plan is to workout a deal with a Congress. He has done right to try, lowered drug costs, and more as a President. Like the majority of people Gallup polled, I'm better off today than I was four years ago.

I'm glad you admit that he has no plan, has put forward no policy, and has repeatedly lied to us about his timeline to release his "plan."

Republicans have added good judges, not packed courts. Adding to the Supreme Court to move an unconstitutional agenda is a blatant abuse of power.

I literally just shared a scholarly article about court packing and manipulations they've tried at both the federal and state levels. Your response is to pretend it didn't happen?

To be clear, I'm not talking about appointing judges. I'm talking about shrinking or expanding court sizes to fit their whims.

 

[drayer54]

I don't support it but it's not unconstitutional. It just goes against 150+ years of norms.

On packing the court, yes. The reason they want to pack the court is to move the unconstitutional agenda.

 

[Cackalacky2.0]

Like Trump's healthcare plan? That is always "2 weeks away" but hasn't been revealed for 5 years now?

What are your feelings on Republicans "court packing" at the state and federal levels for years now? Why is that acceptable but Biden saying he'll consider all options depending on what Republicans do is not?

Infrastructure week has been lit for 4 years.

 

[Legacy]

The amount of hyperbole that is conveyed is astounding. A political ad airing I saw included a senior Hispanic female who was beginning to cry because she did not want her country to become socialist in electing Democrats. I thought of the federal government programs from which she, her family and all of us may have benefited, especially in difficult economic times.

Did we become a socialist country when the plurality of Americans voted for a Democratic candidate in 2016?

 

[RDU Irish]

Like Trump's healthcare plan? That is always "2 weeks away" but hasn't been revealed for 5 years now?

What are your feelings on Republicans "court packing" at the state and federal levels for years now? Why is that acceptable but Biden saying he'll consider all options depending on what Republicans do is not?

Trump tried on Healthcare and McCain and a few other Rs screwed him (IMO screwed "us", but I know a lot of people somehow think Obamacare is amazing). Trump can only sign legislation that is put before him. And John Roberts deciding to legislate from the bench to uphold so much of Obamacare didn't help either. Swamp is crafty and resilient. Trump has been much more effective when he gave up on that rabbit hole, IMO.

Third rail of pre-existing conditions makes healthcare an unworkable mess anyway. Nobody is willing to go back to "state insurance" for the uninsurable so the rest of us who are not walking dead can get more affordable healthcare plans. Also - if you have no assets why buy insurance? Just go BK if you get sick, nobody is dying in the streets for being denied care outright.

But I couldn't understand how anyone would hire Obama over Romney or McCain so WTF do I know. Substance and experience have such little bearing on votes. Gotta reduce size and scope of the federal government - clowns are only getting clownier.

 

[IrishLax]

Lindsey Graham refusing to take a COVID test so South Carolina debate is cancelled.

 

[GoIrish41]

Lindsey Graham refusing to take a COVID test so South Carolina debate is cancelled.

Unbelievable. If he didn’t have the virus what could explain such a politically suicidal decision?