2013 Running Back Discussion

[gkautz10]

I think Cam may be focusing more on corner because of the depth at RB. Next year ND will have Amir, GAIII, Mahone, Bryant, and maybe James and Cierre. Those last 2 we will just assume they are gone for the sake of the argument, but if Cierre comes back it will only strengthen what I am saying. You could argue to say that Cam will be in the same position on the depth chart next season as he was going into this season. This year he was behind Theo, Cierre, and GAIII. So he was 4th simply because that was all we had available at the position with Amir being injured and Mahone red shirting. Next year I see the depth chart breaking down like this: Amir, GAIII, Mahone, and then throw Bryant into that mix and Cam will see himself at best 4th on the depth chart. Mahone had a hell of a year from what I have heard and could be the real deal and surprise some people next season. Cam will likely be in the same position he was this year, which he was cross training at corner before the injury to Amir. He even saw some snaps at corner this year so I do not think it is much of a stretch to say he could be moved over permanently. I agree with you Bogs that the depth chart doesn't look much better at the corner spot. This may mean that Cam becomes a kick returner and a next man in role player.

 

[ErieIrish13]

I think Cam may be focusing more on corner because of the depth at RB. Next year ND will have Amir, GAIII, Mahone, Bryant, and maybe James and Cierre. Those last 2 we will just assume they are gone for the sake of the argument, but if Cierre comes back it will only strengthen what I am saying. You could argue to say that Cam will be in the same position on the depth chart next season as he was going into this season. This year he was behind Theo, Cierre, and GAIII. So he was 4th simply because that was all we had available at the position with Amir being injured and Mahone red shirting. Next year I see the depth chart breaking down like this: Amir, GAIII, Mahone, and then throw Bryant into that mix and Cam will see himself at best 4th on the depth chart. Mahone had a hell of a year from what I have heard and could be the real deal and surprise some people next season. Cam will likely be in the same position he was this year, which he was cross training at corner before the injury to Amir. He even saw some snaps at corner this year so I do not think it is much of a stretch to say he could be moved over permanently. I agree with you Bogs that the depth chart doesn't look much better at the corner spot. This may mean that Cam becomes a kick returner and a next man in role player.

Kelly likes Cam a lot. I've said this all along, I believe he will see a good amount of touches at RB next year. He's more complete than GA3 right now (not saying he's better)

 

[NYMIKE6]

gkautz10,
I see your point, but what do we really know about the other running backs on the roster besides the 2 that got most of the carries this season? Once Riddick and Wood leave, It is GAIII who is very inconsistent and struggles with ball security from time to time, Amir who has injury problems, Mahone who preserved a year and was a scout team player.
Cam is the only one that we know can be consistent. He can be a every down back. He has no fear pounding the rock between the tackles, and is shifty enough to make a move and bounce it outside. Plus he is a very important asset on Special Teams. Personally i would find it foolish to bet against this kid.

 

[gkautz10]

gkautz10,
I see your point, but what do we really know about the other running backs on the roster besides the 2 that got most of the carries this season? Once Riddick and Wood leave, It is GAIII who is very inconsistent and struggles with ball security from time to time, Amir who has injury problems, Mahone who preserved a year and was a scout team player.
Cam is the only one that we know can be consistent. He can be a every down back. He has no fear pounding the rock between the tackles, and is shifty enough to make a move and bounce it outside. Plus he is a very important asset on Special Teams. Personally i would find it foolish to bet against this kid.

Not betting against him. I think he is a good player, if this was 4 or 5 years ago, I would agree with you 100%. However, Kelly is bringing in talented players. I agree GAIII does have ball security issues but so did Golson going into the season and look how that turned out. Mahone was on Scout team yes, but he was offensive scout team player of the year and if my memory serves me correctly, Golson won that award last year. Cam has been consistent for the small sample of carries he has seen, who knows how he will hold up pounding it up the middle over the course of a whole season. Amir had sort of a freak injury this year and I don't think he is injury prone. I agree, he is an asset on special teams and he is a great player and an even better person. I assume he will get a fair shake at RB but it is just a hunch that he may see time on the other side of the ball. Especially since he has more reps at the corner position than many of the other unproven players coming in. I suspect he will be used at both positions when needed next year.

 

[Jebediah Springfield]

I'm interested to see how this plays out.

All players have some positives and negatives.

At the end I think GA3 gets the first crack at starting RB.

 

[Old Man Mike]

To my flawed eye, our RB situation next year is nearly a complete mystery. Several things that I "feel" [not enough information to "think"]:

1]. Cierre Wood does not return;
2]. GAIII does not develop into anything but an occasional "gimmick" back for extreme speed and home-run potential; if he doesn't stop fumbling he will not even keep his kick=off return job;
3]. Will Mahone becomes a dependable but not Jonas Gray quality [yet] power back; he gets carries;
4]. Greg Bryant impresses with his potential but redshirts;
5]. Amir Carlisle MUST be good or the USC experience would not have happened; if he is truly healthy and if he can blitz block and not fumble, then he is the starting back;
6]. Cam McDaniel, depending upon those qualifiers for Carlisle, is seen as our best rounded running back; he runs with great vision, effort, and never-quit [and surprisingly powerful] leg-drive; he is the one proven warrior.

So then what?

Scenario A: If Carlisle's ready and meets expectations, he starts and McDaniel and Mahone spell him regularly; GAIII becomes a player used much like Chris Brown was used this year [speed play to try to catch defense off-guard and hit big distances]... I do not think that CBreezy will only be that himself; I think Chris is destined for all-around big things in the receiving game, this was just an analogy based on how Chris was used [and, by the way, how GAIII was beginning to be severely limited as the season went on].

Scenario B: If Carlisle's "ready" but not optimal on the qualifiers above, Kelly splits time more evenly with Cam and Amir and Will. Like with the Riddick/Wood situation as the season wore on, the guy getting the most snaps will be the guy who runs hardest in the middle and catches the ball in the intermediate zone.

That's a baloney analysis by me, and admittedly we are lucky that Coach never calls asking my opinion.

 

[rtrn2glory]

next years depth chart imo:

1. GA3
2. Carlisle
3. Mahone
4. Cam
5. Bryant

subject to change

 

[Irishman77]

If Amir is what I feel he is, I see it like this:
1. Amir
2. Mahone
3. Bryant

I think they all get carriers and stay fresh.

Cam and GA3 are too good to not see the field. They both have played a lot of football already as well. I see them both being ready to jump in at wr or rb if needed. If I were to label them i would call them dual depth players.


As great of a problem this is it is nothing compared to the Holtz rb depth. I won't go through the half dozen full backs they had but imagine this depth and still have Burris and Ismail take a few hand offs....

Ricky Waters
Tony brooks
Dorsey Levens ( ga tech due to this issue)
Rodney Culver
Reggie brooks
Jerome Bettis
Anthony Johnson

 

[anarin]

I think cam gets a ton of play next season. He is shifty and versatile.

 

[Luckylucci]

Not sure how the RB situation works out from a number of reps perspective but personal opinion is that Cam has the same roll as this year. He'll get touches in mop up duty and a situational player. Also I highly doubt we are bringing in Bryant to redshirt. He's very talented and it will take some time to learn the offense but rb's are a little easier to work into rotation than wr. He'll be getting some work.

 

[luckyfc]

I would reserve judgment until we see 1s vs 1s. Also, if gb is uber talented, there is no guarantee he sticks around for 5 yrs b4 nfl if we redshirted him.

 

[QuarrelsomeIrishAmerican]

Next years depth chart imo:

1. GA3
2/3. Carlisle (will see field early, may have to move around to slot in order to accomodate getting Bryant on the filed)
2/3. Bryant (kid is studly)
4. Cam (could get a lot of slot work)
5. Mahone

 

[NoJusticeNoPeace]

He can play offense, defense, and special teams. He'll get playing time all over the place. He will be like Julian Edelman IMO.

 

[NYMIKE6]

He can play offense, defense, and special teams. He'll get playing time all over the place. He will be like Julian Edelman IMO.

**ALERT**ALERT**WHITE GUY REFERENCE** ALERT**ALERT**

 

[ThePiombino]

I am basing it on what people have told me how he has done this year on scout team vs 1s defense. Hearing a lot of buzz about him. And like I said, I think Cam will move to defense so one less guy with experience to beat out.

Based on this logic, Stockton would be overtaking Nix next year as well.

 

[FightingIrishLover7]

Based on this logic, Stockton would be overtaking Nix next year as well.

I'm not so sure about that comparison. I'm not entirely sure how well Tyler did on the line in practice. But I feel bk and staff rewarded him with that award because of his hard work for four years without virtually any playing time. He also never complained once and still seemed to lead the locker room with his use of sense of humor. I'm pretty sure that award was mostly a thank you.

 

[Emcee77]

Based on this logic, Stockton would be overtaking Nix next year as well.

Lol. It's a good point. I mean, Nick Fitzpatrick was offensive scout team player of the year, was he not? Floyd thanked Jalen Brown for all his great work on the scout team last year, and it's not like Brown started this year. I love to hear that young guys are tearing it up on the demo squad, don't get me wrong, but I think there's only so much you can read into that.

 

[Whiskeyjack]

Based on this logic, Stockton would be overtaking Nix next year as well.

I was tempted to respond the same way. Moore has gotten high praise for his work on the scout team as well, but virtually everyone here expects Grace to firmly take control of the MILB position next season.

 

[ThePiombino]

I was tempted to respond the same way. Moore has gotten high praise for his work on the scout team as well, but virtually everyone here expects Grace to firmly take control of the MILB position next season.

Truth!

Whiskey, the ROI beacon has been lit:

http://www.irishenvy.com/forums/notre-dame-football/80116-academic-bcs.html

 

[Buster Bluth]

I think RB discussion may deserve its own thread at this point?

I like that Cam gets all of this love, but to me he sorta just reminds me of Toma. Toma is a fine receiver and can certainly play at a FBS level, but if we were honest with ourselves a guy like Toma would get buried underneath the wave of talent that Kelly has coming in. As a senior he is better than Neal as a freshman, but their ceilings aren't even close.

I just don't see Cam playing as much as some thing he will. Bryant is such an elite talent and will more than likely overtake him.

I think a lot of the depth chart depends on what offense is run next season. If Kelly wants to stick with this multiple offense, Mahone is probably going to put on the pounds and be a most-valuable powerback for this team. But I think the offense will take a sharp turn back to the spread and Golson will be slinging it all over the field, a la Cincinnati. That gives a guy like Carlisle much more value.

 

[chicago51]

I think RB discussion may deserve its own thread at this point?
I like that Cam gets all of this love, but to me he sorta just reminds me of Toma. Toma is a fine receiver and can certainly play at a FBS level, but if we were honest with ourselves a guy like Toma would get buried underneath the wave of talent that Kelly has coming in. As a senior he is better than Neal as a freshman, but their ceilings aren't even close.

I just don't see Cam playing as much as some thing he will. Bryant is such an elite talent and will more than likely overtake him.

I think a lot of the depth chart depends on what offense is run next season. If Kelly wants to stick with this multiple offense, Mahone is probably going to put on the pounds and be a most-valuable powerback for this team. But I think the offense will take a sharp turn back to the spread and Golson will be slinging it all over the field, a la Cincinnati. That gives a guy like Carlisle much more value.

I agree with this

 

[BleedBlueGold]

I think RB discussion may deserve its own thread at this point?

I like that Cam gets all of this love, but to me he sorta just reminds me of Toma. Toma is a fine receiver and can certainly play at a FBS level, but if we were honest with ourselves a guy like Toma would get buried underneath the wave of talent that Kelly has coming in. As a senior he is better than Neal as a freshman, but their ceilings aren't even close.

I just don't see Cam playing as much as some thing he will. Bryant is such an elite talent and will more than likely overtake him.

I think a lot of the depth chart depends on what offense is run next season. If Kelly wants to stick with this multiple offense, Mahone is probably going to put on the pounds and be a most-valuable powerback for this team. But I think the offense will take a sharp turn back to the spread and Golson will be slinging it all over the field, a la Cincinnati. That gives a guy like Carlisle much more value.

I think Kelly has found a successful blueprint at ND and he'll stick with it until further notice. Of course this is just my opinion. I just don't see any scenario where a team with this kind of defense needs to score the amount of points Cincy regularly put up. We have an elite defense, a solid run game, options all over the outside to pass the ball when needed, and QB who will only get better with time. I say keep w/ this game plan. It works. Alabama's recent success proves it.

 

[chicago51]

I think Kelly has found a successful blueprint at ND and he'll stick with it until further notice. Of course this is just my opinion. I just don't see any scenario where a team with this kind of defense needs to score the amount of points Cincy regularly put up. We have an elite defense, a solid run game, options all over the outside to pass the ball when needed, and QB who will only get better with time. I say keep w/ this game plan. It works. Alabama's recent success proves it.

While we are bringing in some good offensive recruits. Most of the difference makers we have brought in and are currently targeting have been on defense. I tend to agree that Kelly will stick with the same blueprint. I do think the run pass ratio may change slightly depending on what BK thinks is best to move the football but I don't think we will see the fast tempo we saw at Cincinnatti and that he intially wanted to implement at ND. Bottom line we are not going be Oregon or West Virginia.

 

[Emcee77]

I keep going back to it ... at one of the press conferences Kelly was asked about this and he said that the defense won't change but the "offense will evolve to fit the personnel" and the offense will change as the quarterback becomes more reliable and more capable of executing more of the offense consistently. Kelly won't take risks as long as our defense is capable of winning games by itself, but as he gains more confidence in Golson he'll start to sling it.

 

[Whiskeyjack]

I think a lot of the depth chart depends on what offense is run next season. If Kelly wants to stick with this multiple offense, Mahone is probably going to put on the pounds and be a most-valuable powerback for this team. But I think the offense will take a sharp turn back to the spread and Golson will be slinging it all over the field, a la Cincinnati. That gives a guy like Carlisle much more value.

Not sure about that. With the OL and RBs we have coming in, it probably makes more sense to rely on a low-risk, ball control offense that eats up a lot of clock, since that style of play complements our suffocating defense better.

Though I am concerned about how we get enough touches to our Z WRs in such a scheme.

 

[Irish8248]

ESPN ranked overall-all players # 27- rb from Florida wont redshirt, just doesnt happen. expect Bryant to be in a 2 back rotation by game 3 if not game 1. See Georgia rbs.

Just like a 5* #1 qb who was an EE coming into a wide open competition was supposed to start?

Edit: forgot Kiel was 20 overall and we had 3 qbs play this year

 

[jimmymac]

Just like a 5* #1 qb who was an EE coming into a wide open competition was supposed to start?

And just like ESPN's number 8 overall player from last year? Davonte Neal ringing any bells? He's really been a big part of our offense this year........ If Bryant plays it wi be because he is ready and better than the other options, not because he has a high ranking or a million stars.

 

[Buster Bluth]

I think Kelly has found a successful blueprint at ND and he'll stick with it until further notice. Of course this is just my opinion. I just don't see any scenario where a team with this kind of defense needs to score the amount of points Cincy regularly put up. We have an elite defense, a solid run game, options all over the outside to pass the ball when needed, and QB who will only get better with time. I say keep w/ this game plan. It works. Alabama's recent success proves it.

Kelly didn't change it up to fit a "blueprint" to win at Notre Dame. He switched the offense because the WRs and QBs are as green as a team can get and the RBs/OLs were the strength of the team.

I would be shocked if the 2014 offense resembled the 2012 offense at all. Hell I don't even think the 2013 will if Wood leaves as expected.

 

[Jebediah Springfield]

IMO comparing Freshman RB to QB isn't good. 2 different situations.

 

[Irish8248]

IMO comparing Freshman RB to QB isn't good. 2 different situations.

is really not though. Both positions have great deal of responsibility. If a rb can't identify blitzes and pick it up he's not seeing the field. The defense will automatically know its a run or they won't care and just blitz the house because he can't do it... Just identifying it its only half the battle. An 18yr old will regularly have pick up 20+ yr old developed players.

Having freshman play their first year is rarely a good thing. Usually means you have no depth or no talent. Few occasions a player is just ready. Bryant has a good chance at st, most of these freshman will see quality time there because as BK said, we have no depth. That being said with GA3 having two years and AC 3 BK may feel staggering his backs will give more balance to future classes.

This was the same conversation we had last year with Mahone. With Jonas gone, wwe needed that big powerful bowling ball back and this kid was going to be a combo of Hughes and Gray. Obviously he RS despite us having the prototypical power back. Thankfully Theo filled that and more for us.