10 Year Reflection: State of the Program

[dublinirish]

somebody explain to me why these classes were so bad? did Ty only recruit good scholars who were mediocre football players?

 

[GowerND11]

somebody explain to me why these classes were so bad? did Ty only recruit good scholars who were mediocre football players?

In my unprofessional opinion I think it was a combination of factors. First I believe these were the types of athletes he recruited while at Stanford. Stanford was not attracting athletes like it is now, so they had to go for low 3 star and 2 star guys and hope to develop them. Second I don't think Ty knew just how hard he needed to recruit at Notre Dame. We make those jokes on here about him golfing more than recruiting and I think his mentality was athletes will want to come to Notre Dame let them come to us.

 

[FightingIrishLover7]

somebody explain to me why these classes were so bad? did Ty only recruit good scholars who were mediocre football players?

He preferred to golf...

 

[phork]

His recruiting trips landed on every golf course in America. Too bad no recruits were on them.

Also, I had no issue with Weis' offense. I think it averaged like 33ppg. It was the defense that stunk.

 

[RDU Irish]

IMO:
Crum > K. Moore
Lambert > J. Brown, J. Atkinson
Walker > Carlisle

I would add all three to the current roster in a heartbeat simply for the above comparisons.

Also, Vernaglia = Tranquill. Vernaglia just didn't have a coaching staff to develop his superior athletic abilities.

Mo Crum was undersized, I don't think Diaco would have recruited him which is too bad because I think he would work his way into the rotation on just about any team. Walker might have been recruited (I forgot he was Georgia Mr. Football) but I think he would be behind lot of folks on today's depth chart. Lambert, might have had both hurdles in front of him. Trading for non-starters is conflating the discussion, would they have been recruited in the first place and would they have been anywhere close to the same productivity.

Vernaglia would have been recruited and hopefully developed better, however there is an abundance of big skill on this team and he might have just as easily been lost in the shuffle. He was unique at the time, now he would be one of many.

 

[Irish#1]

Mo Crum was undersized, I don't think Diaco would have recruited him which is too bad because I think he would work his way into the rotation on just about any team. Walker might have been recruited (I forgot he was Georgia Mr. Football) but I think he would be behind lot of folks on today's depth chart. Lambert, might have had both hurdles in front of him. Trading for non-starters is conflating the discussion, would they have been recruited in the first place and would they have been anywhere close to the same productivity.

Vernaglia would have been recruited and hopefully developed better, however there is an abundance of big skill on this team and he might have just as easily been lost in the shuffle. He was unique at the time, now he would be one of many.

I agree. I know there are a lot of Walker fans on this board, but I was never impressed with him.

 

[dublinirish]

In my unprofessional opinion I think it was a combination of factors. First I believe these were the types of athletes he recruited while at Stanford. Stanford was not attracting athletes like it is now, so they had to go for low 3 star and 2 star guys and hope to develop them. Second I don't think Ty knew just how hard he needed to recruit at Notre Dame. We make those jokes on here about him golfing more than recruiting and I think his mentality was athletes will want to come to Notre Dame let them come to us.

So basically if any recruits were iffy on ND then he didn't bother with convincing them otherwise?

 

[stlnd01]

So basically if any recruits were iffy on ND then he didn't bother with convincing them otherwise?

Also didn't put in the work on the front end, maybe didn't get the importance of building relationships over the course of a year or more?
Remember the Brian Toal story? Blue-chip LB out of New Jersey, son of the coach at Don Bosco, IIRC. Went on to be a highly productive player at BC. Kind of kid we should own, frankly, and one we should never ever lose to BC. Instead of locking him up early, Willingham didn't get personally involved in his recruitment until after Toal lit up the Army All-American bowl. Then he sat in his living room for seven hours on the in-home. Wouldn't leave. Toal went to BC anyway. It's probably somewhat apocryphal at this point, but sums up Ty's' bass-ackwards approach to recruiting.

 

[stlnd01]

Anyway, Willingham's long gone. I like our team better now.

 

[dublinirish]

yeah i heard the Toal story before, i dont wanna know anymore about the Ty regime now, thanks tho!

 

[GBdomer]

I didn't want to start a thread on this just wanted to ask a question. Which player from teams from a few years ago or who played under Kelly from a couple years at ND, would have made a real contribution in this years team if he had 2-3 years in Kelly system?

I feel like that question makes no sense but I can't seem to type it out, hope you understand what I mean. If not please just answer it.

 

[#1rish]

Also didn't put in the work on the front end, maybe didn't get the importance of building relationships over the course of a year or more?
Remember the Brian Toal story? Blue-chip LB out of New Jersey, son of the coach at Don Bosco, IIRC. Went on to be a highly productive player at BC. Kind of kid we should own, frankly, and one we should never ever lose to BC. Instead of locking him up early, Willingham didn't get personally involved in his recruitment until after Toal lit up the Army All-American bowl. Then he sat in his living room for seven hours on the in-home. Wouldn't leave. Toal went to BC anyway. It's probably somewhat apocryphal at this point, but sums up Ty's' bass-ackwards approach to recruiting.

Ironman can vouch for this, but Toal was a beast when I was at Bosco. I honsestly don't know how more D1 college didn't give him more attention. Single handedly won us a state title. Would have been amazing if he made it to ND.

Fun fact: Toal gave me the old "welcome to Bosco baseball slap on the ass" when I was a wee little freshman. Things get weird at all-boys schools.

 

[irishog77]

Ironman can vouch for this, but Toal was a beast when I was at Bosco. I honsestly don't know how more D1 college didn't give him more attention. Single handedly won us a state title. Would have been amazing if he made it to ND.

Fun fact: Toal gave me the old "welcome to Bosco baseball slap on the ass" when I was a wee little freshman. Things get weird at all-boys schools.

Was this before or after y'all played a friendly round of ol' Soggy Biscuit?