'11 CA RB Amir Carlisle (Notre Dame Football Player)

[Emcee77]

Still don't really get this. Why does Carlisle have to play right away while we still have Riddick? Seems like it makes sense for him to sit this year out and then have three years of eligibility remaining before the 2013 season.

 

[Bogtrotter07]

How many running backs and wide receivers, let alone quarterbacks did Kelly use at Cinci in the course of a game?

 

[woolybug25]

Still don't really get this. Why does Carlisle have to play right away while we still have Riddick? Seems like it makes sense for him to sit this year out and then have three years of eligibility remaining before the 2013 season.

Riddick didn't get it done last year, plain and simple. I truly feel that he is poised for a good year, but I dont want to put all our eggs in the Riddick basket. In the limited time Amir saw last season, he looked electric. We need to find a way to get all of our electric guys on the field as soon as possible. Preserving eligibility be damned!

I see your point though, IF Riddick broke out, it would be nice to preserve Amir.

 

[Emcee77]

Riddick didn't get it done last year, plain and simple. I truly feel that he is poised for a good year, but I dont want to put all our eggs in the Riddick basket. In the limited time Amir saw last season, he looked electric. We need to find a way to get all of our electric guys on the field as soon as possible. Preserving eligibility be damned!

I see your point though, IF Riddick broke out, it would be nice to preserve Amir.

And I see yours. Carlisle very well might be a significant upgrade over Riddick. Maybe he really wants to play next year, and the coaches figure they can get him on the field and redshirt Russell.

 

[woolybug25]

And I see yours. Carlisle very well might be a significant upgrade over Riddick. Maybe he really wants to play next year, and the coaches figure they can get him on the field and redshirt Russell.

Touche'

 

[D-BOE34]

Even if he is cleared, we can still save a year correct? Or does it automatically use a year of eligibility for going through the process?

 

[Bogtrotter07]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Emcee77
Still don't really get this. Why does Carlisle have to play right away while we still have Riddick? Seems like it makes sense for him to sit this year out and then have three years of eligibility remaining before the 2013 season.

Riddick didn't get it done last year, plain and simple. I truly feel that he is poised for a good year, but I dont want to put all our eggs in the Riddick basket. In the limited time Amir saw last season, he looked electric. We need to find a way to get all of our electric guys on the field as soon as possible. Preserving eligibility be damned!

I see your point though, IF Riddick broke out, it would be nice to preserve Amir.
__________________
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Quote:
Originally Posted by woolybug25
Riddick didn't get it done last year, plain and simple. I truly feel that he is poised for a good year, but I dont want to put all our eggs in the Riddick basket. In the limited time Amir saw last season, he looked electric. We need to find a way to get all of our electric guys on the field as soon as possible. Preserving eligibility be damned!

I see your point though, IF Riddick broke out, it would be nice to preserve Amir.

And I see yours. Carlisle very well might be a significant upgrade over Riddick. Maybe he really wants to play next year, and the coaches figure they can get him on the field and redshirt Russell.

Everybody see this? This is what it should be about.

You guys are awesome! Your points are even greater because of your cooperation!

 

[irishog77]

Even if he is cleared, we can still save a year correct? Or does it automatically use a year of eligibility for going through the process?

They all wouldn't go through the process of petitioning the NCAA just for the hell of it. The aim is so he can play...right away. If he were granted the hardship (he won't), I seriously doubt the staff would then say, "Let's go ahead and sit you anyway...to preserve a year of eligibility...that may or may not ever come to fruition." And for his response to be, "You got it, coach!"

 

[military_irish]

Even if he is cleared, we can still save a year correct? Or does it automatically use a year of eligibility for going through the process?

He doesn't waste a year just going through the process but like irishog77 said I don't think they would go through the whole process just to sit him.

 

[BGIF]

Even if he is cleared, we can still save a year correct? Or does it automatically use a year of eligibility for going through the process?

You use eligibilty by playing in GAMES. The NCAA allows 5 years to play 4. He's already clocked 1 year of his 5 and 1 of his 4. He's got 3 years to PLAY in the next 4 years.

I still don't understand the grounds for a hardship request as those have been issued for family tragedies not for changing jobs and relocating. IF relocation is the grounds and the NCAA grants it, expect a tidal wave of similar requests so athletes don't have to sit out a year. Parents do it now with HS players so their kid can get into a better program or find more PT due to a more favorable depth chart.

 

[D-BOE34]

Well of course they would want him to play right away but anything can happen. Hell, he could pull a hammy in August and never recover enough or in time to make it worth putting him in.

Thanks for the answer though!

 

[BGIF]

Well of course they would want him to play right away but anything can happen. Hell, he could pull a hammy in August and never recover enough or in time to make it worth putting him in.

Thanks for the answer though!

So could Wood AND Riddick defaulting to Carlisle. Riddick already has a hamstring history.

 

[D-BOE34]

So could Wood AND Riddick defaulting to Carlisle. Riddick already has a hamstring history.

Which is why I hope some way this come through.

 

[Jimmy3Putt]

Wasn't the "back story" that Kiffin told him to find another school due to the lack of scholarships available to SC?

Maybe since he was possibly being forced out clears him next season?

 

[Domina Nostra]

Wasn't the "back story" that Kiffin told him to find another school due to the lack of scholarships available to SC?

Maybe since he was possibly being forced out clears him next season?

They were not trying to get rid of him. He's really good.

 

[Grahambo]

They were not trying to get rid of him. He's really good.

If the waiver is somehow granted, I think all of ND Nation would send the entire world into one massive earthquake.

 

[Emcee77]

Wasn't the "back story" that Kiffin told him to find another school due to the lack of scholarships available to SC?

Maybe since he was possibly being forced out clears him next season?

They were not trying to get rid of him. He's really good.

Yeah, Kiffin said he was surprised and disappointed by Amir's departure. He may have forced other players out because of numbers issues but apparently he did not want Amir to leave.
So what I've always wondered is why would Kiffin release Amir to us? It was reported that Kiffin would not allow Prater to transfer to a Pac-10 school or ND. If that is true (I suppose it may not be ... I can't recall where I heard it), why did Amir get special treatment? It's weird. And now there is this waiver issue ... but if the transfer was totally voluntary, what's the basis for a waiver? Something doesn't quite add up. I'll be interested to know the full story when/if it comes out.

 

[Domina Nostra]

Yeah, Kiffin said he was surprised and disappointed by Amir's departure. He may have forced other players out because of numbers issues but apparently he did not want Amir to leave.
So what I've always wondered is why would Kiffin release Amir to us? It was reported that Kiffin would not allow Prater to transfer to a Pac-10 school or ND. If that is true (I suppose it may not be ... I can't recall where I heard it), why did Amir get special treatment? It's weird. And now there is this waiver issue ... but if the transfer was totally voluntary, what's the basis for a waiver? Something doesn't quite add up. I'll be interested to know the full story when/if it comes out.

Based on nothing, I figured that Kiffin's first instinct was to look magnanimous, but changed his tune after Amir went to ND and Armond Armstead tried. Enough was enough.

Is anyone certain Prater was blocked from looking at ND?

 

[Grahambo]

Based on nothing, I figured that Kiffin's first instinct was to look magnanimous, but changed his tune after Amir went to ND and Armond Armstead tried. Enough was enough.

Is anyone certain Prater looked at ND?

Armond was free to transfer here. He had already graduated and didn't need Kiffy's approval. He just wasn't medically cleared by the ND doctor's or else Armond and Arik would be here.

 

[Bogtrotter07]

Can't a player transfer anywhere? No coach can tell a player where to go. What they can do is release them from their scholly. Then a player can transfer to another D1 (from D1) school without sitting out. Otherwise a lateral transfer costs a year. So Kiffey didn't have anything to do with this, if I am not mistaken.

 

[UmphreakDomer]

Can't a player transfer anywhere? No coach can tell a player where to go. What they can do is release them from their scholly. Then a player can transfer to another D1 (from D1) school without sitting out. Otherwise a lateral transfer costs a year. So Kiffey didn't have anything to do with this, if I am not mistaken.

they dont have to grant the transfer.

charlie weis did not let kids transfer to a school that ND played within the next three seasons.

 

[Bogtrotter07]

Here is my point. The "transfer" is actually the right to play without sitting out a year, isn't it?

 

[irishog77]

You can only play the next year if granted a special waiver by the ncaa (and this has to be applied for, it's not an automatic thing). All others sit a year.

(Graduated students fall into another category.)

 

[Emcee77]

Can't a player transfer anywhere? No coach can tell a player where to go. What they can do is release them from their scholly. Then a player can transfer to another D1 (from D1) school without sitting out. Otherwise a lateral transfer costs a year. So Kiffey didn't have anything to do with this, if I am not mistaken.

they dont have to grant the transfer.

charlie weis did not let kids transfer to a school that ND played within the next three seasons.

hmm, maybe we are on to something here ... I seem to remember Weis having that rule about no one transferring to a school on our schedule ... but I also remember that Konrad Reuland transferred to Stanford anyway, and I heard rumors that Weis was very angry about it.

Maybe the player's promise not to attend a school that the original school plays is in the manner of a "gentleman's agreement" and is totally unenforceable by the coach. So maybe Carlisle promised Kiffin he would not transfer to a Pac-10 school or ND, and then reneged.

All PURE speculation. Maybe someone else knows more about the process?

 

[UmphreakDomer]

Here is my point. The "transfer" is actually the right to play without sitting out a year, isn't it?

dont think so. not positive by any means. transfer is to play for another school under s scholly offered by that institution rather than the original signed contract.

a waiver, for instance in the amir case, is called a "hardship waiver" (i still havent had a chance to look into it yet, but was brought up in the live chat with keith arnold on NSD), the questions abounding are the reasons it is a "hardship"? was it kiffin? was it USC? what makes it qualify, if in fact it does. i would expect if it goes thru, there will be a mention in some presser about it.

 

[me9rob]

FWIW: The consensus at USC is that we don't release players to teams that we play regularly and there's a Pac-12 rule against in-conference transfers for graduate seniors (Prater was told this and it was the reason Armond couldn't transfer to Cal). Amir however was a special case because his family moved. So USC and Pat Haden saw this is a legitimate reason to release Amir to ND. But because his dad moving was good enough reason for USC, i doubt it means that the NCAA will see it as a legitimate enough reason to grant Amir the waiver.

 

[Emcee77]

Can't a player transfer anywhere? No coach can tell a player where to go. What they can do is release them from their scholly. Then a player can transfer to another D1 (from D1) school without sitting out. Otherwise a lateral transfer costs a year. So Kiffey didn't have anything to do with this, if I am not mistaken.

For the record, the bolded part is not quite right. Without fully understanding the mechanics of the process, I think I can say this much with confidence:

The coach/school must release a player from his scholarship, or the player cannot play anywhere else (this was the controversy at Kansas recently; they apparently would not release their QB Berglund after Weis was hired, preventing him from playing elsewhere -- although eventually they relented). Even if he is granted a release, the player must serve a one-year NCAA penalty. The coach has no power to release a player from this penalty. However, the NCAA can waive the one-year penalty in special cases at its own discretion.

 

[Emcee77]

FWIW: The consensus at USC is that we don't release players to teams that we play regularly and there's a Pac-12 rule against in-conference transfers for graduate seniors (Prater was told this and it was the reason Armond couldn't transfer to Cal). Amir however was a special case because his family moved. So USC and Pat Haden saw this is a legitimate reason to release Amir to ND. But because his dad moving was good enough reason for USC, i doubt it means that the NCAA will see it as a legitimate enough reason to grant Amir the waiver.

Ah ok. I was wondering what the USC scuttlebutt was. Thanks for the input.

 

[BGIF]

Can't a player transfer anywhere? No coach can tell a player where to go. What they can do is release them from their scholly. Then a player can transfer to another D1 (from D1) school without sitting out. Otherwise a lateral transfer costs a year. So Kiffey didn't have anything to do with this, if I am not mistaken.

I've already cited the NCAA Transfer Regs in this thread or one of the others on Carlisle and/or Armond. I'm not looking them up again.

Div 1 players that transfer within Div 1 MUST sit out a year unless they have already graduated, get a hardship waiver from the NCAA, of qualify as Upperclassmen during the first year of NCAA sanctions of their school (Carlisle was a freshman). Players transferring down to a lower Div do NOT have to sit out. HOWEVER, schools must approve transfers and many conferences prohibit transfer within the conference and many schools don't permit transfers to team on their future schedules. (Players get around that by tranferring to school "C" and then transferring to school "B" which school "A" wouldn't approve. They still have to sit out a year in they end up in a Div 1 school within the calendar year.)

 

[Grahambo]

Darin Pritchett ‏ @Sportsbeat960

Eric Hansen on SBEAT just mentioned that USC RB Transfer Amir Carlisle will try to waiver the NCAA and play for #NotreDame in '12