Loss of words

[Rhode Irish]

You are correct i was wrong saying races. The religions are the problems. And yes i understand that a long time ago our families came from other places. But what i was getting at the the Mexicans come to american and don't speak any english and don't try to not to mention the come here illegaly. if they want to come here and do it the right way i am fine with that.

Talk about the pot calling the kettle black....

Any time you get into these racial/religious discussions, (1) you are treading in dangerous water and (2) you are dealing with really complex, really layered issues. All I can say is that I totally understand the perspective that says "this is our private institution, if you don't like the way we do things simply leave." On the other hand, I give Beau a lot of credit for asking some reasonable questions.

Most people who are "religious" in a serious, academic way (the type of people I would imagine are teaching and leading at a university like Catholic) tend to be pretty interested in and tolerant of other mainstream religions. From that perspective, having Muslims and Jews at a Catholic University is good for intellectual diversity. So if they are adding something to the campus culture and the academic mission of the school, is it really too much to ask that they have a place to pray where they feel comfortable?

A lot of people in this thread have made the point that if the Muslims don't like being there, they should leave. The counter to that is that if Catholic is not going to make reasonable accommodations to help make non-Catholic members if its community feel welcome, maybe they shouldn't invite them into their private institution in the first place. I don't know. I don't have all the answers. It is a complicated issue, and I'm not totally sure how I feel about it, but I do think sometimes maybe we are little fast to assert opinions. Opinions are fine, but I'd hope they would be more thoughtful and less reactionary.

And Lax, I know its late, so maybe I've misunderstood you. But, were you saying that one reason our society is going to hell is that rich people now can't get away with saying stupid ****, while the unwashed are now permitted more leeway? Seems like a strange idea. I think most people would disagree with you. We sure have a lot of problems, but the least of which seems to be that the powerful are being oppressed and masses are afforded too much freedom.

 

[jason_h537]

I feel like many of you did not even read the article. Sounds like a group of Muslim students wanted a room to pray in without crosses and a Lawyer saw an opportunity to make headlines. Is it too much to ask for a generic room to pray? no. Does a private school have to oblige them? no. That did not stop several posters to take an opportunity bash the Muslim religion in this thread.

It's ****in CATHOLIC University of America!!! Would a Muslim school even allow Christians pray? No way.

To this. several Mosques have opened their doors to Christians, and vice versa, whose churches were destroyed by hurricanes and tornadoes in Alabama, Georgia and Florida. so you should know what the **** your talking about before spouting off nonsense.

 

[irish4ever]

Sounds like the University could have been more kind and let the students form a Muslim group and pray in a room without crosses, but why are Muslims even at the Catholic University?

No, maybe the Muslims should have recognized this during a school visit prior to becoming a student at this university.

 

[ClausentoTate]

Ugh, wrote a long post and got an internal server error. Maybe it's a sign. I'm gonna keep writing anyway.

Why is the Basilica the only place they can pray? Pray anywhere else, including outside or cover the crosses with a rag. Go to a different room that allows you to pray away from Jesus instead of toward him. What's wrong with Jesus for Muslims? He's referenced more in the Quran than the Bible. If anything they should be offended that they need to take mandatory theology classes.

I've known Mormons (one of my best friends is Mormon), Christians of nearly every denomination, Muslims and a Rasta (keep that on the DL) and none of them have had these problems. I'm about 99% sure there is or at least was a Muslim club on campus. I noted it when I was applying to ND years ago. I've literally never seen anyone hazed for believing what they do and have never seen anyone hounded to convert. Quite the opposite in fact, I've seen a lot of people ask about their beliefs and create some really deep conversations. My Mormon friend created a blog while we were in undergrad and his friends from ND told him to explore his beliefs and opinions while his Mormon friends bashed him unmercifully.

I'm assuming these are graduate students. I know for a fact that unless they put one in there in the last 4 days, the Fischer/Grace lounge doesn't have a cross in it and there are numerous ethnic and religious clubs that gather there every week. What's wrong with that location?

The fact that this professor sued against having women's dorms on campus screams that he either hates the University or knows that he'll get publicity for fighting ND on very basic issues.

Christ, am I taking crazy pills?

 

[Kak7304]

Ugh, wrote a long post and got an internal server error. Maybe it's a sign. I'm gonna keep writing anyway.

Why is the Basilica the only place they can pray? Pray anywhere else, including outside or cover the crosses with a rag. Go to a different room that allows you to pray away from Jesus instead of toward him. What's wrong with Jesus for Muslims? He's referenced more in the Quran than the Bible. If anything they should be offended that they need to take mandatory theology classes.

I've known Mormons (one of my best friends is Mormon), Christians of nearly every denomination, Muslims and a Rasta (keep that on the DL) and none of them have had these problems. I'm about 99% sure there is or at least was a Muslim club on campus. I noted it when I was applying to ND years ago. I've literally never seen anyone hazed for believing what they do and have never seen anyone hounded to convert. Quite the opposite in fact, I've seen a lot of people ask about their beliefs and create some really deep conversations. My Mormon friend created a blog while we were in undergrad and his friends from ND told him to explore his beliefs and opinions while his Mormon friends bashed him unmercifully.

I'm assuming these are graduate students. I know for a fact that unless they put one in there in the last 4 days, the Fischer/Grace lounge doesn't have a cross in it and there are numerous ethnic and religious clubs that gather there every week. What's wrong with that location?

The fact that this professor sued against having women's dorms on campus screams that he either hates the University or knows that he'll get publicity for fighting ND on very basic issues.

Christ, am I taking crazy pills?

Yes, because the issue is at Catholic University of America and not ND lol. ND is just being used to relate to the situation.

 

[greyhammer90]

Step 1. Read the article.
Step 2. Get outraged.
Step 3. Decide to read comments thinking "I can't wait to read the well thought out arguments against this legal action."
Step 4. Read...

The thing that really got me was the whole "human rights" thing, of all religions, i'm pretty sure a religion which basically allows women NO rights trying to determine human rights is outrageous.

Step 5.

 

[Jason Pham]

Post intelligently or not at all. I don't like what I see one more time and I shut this thing down.

 

[ClausentoTate]

Yes, because the issue is at Catholic University of America and not ND lol. ND is just being used to relate to the situation.

Wow, I completely read Catholic University as a reference to ND and not the actual University. I need to stop reading things while I'm hung over. I have to assume the same thing can apply to their campus, minus my ND references.

 

[Al H.]

This law suit is offensive. For a University to have to spend $ to defend against it is an outrage. I support countersuits to financially wipe out this verminous `lawyer' and his organization. What a bunch of *******s~

 

[kmoose]

Idk. I'm Catholic, but I don't believe in forcing my views on somebody or oppressing/keeping someone from practicing their own faith.

Do you think the University forced their views on anyone, or oppressed anyone?

 

[DoverShores]

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[BeauBenken]

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Lol. GET 'EM!

 

[BeauBenken]

Do you think the University forced their views on anyone, or oppressed anyone?

I thought I answered this already. No, I don't.