We get SCREWED by playing Michigan early

[phork]

That is all. Over the last 2 years:

1. We lost to Denard led Michigan because Dayne Crist missed a half and, because the game was early in the year, we had no time to get our QBs acclimated. Tommy Rees threw an awful pick on his first pass and we played with NATE MONTANA for the remainder of the half. Denard also got banged up as the year went on and Michigan tanked.
2. We lost to Denard led Michigan, and once again Denard gets banged up ~half way into the season and the team goes to hell.

Michigan plays an unsustainable brand of football and if we just played them later on in the schedule it'd be a completely different game. Every single year they've tried this Denard-do-everything offense it has completely blown up as he picks up injuries. This year will be no different. Just so frustrating.

Call the Wahmbulance. Injuries happen. Get over it.

 

[IrishLax]

*eye roll*

There is a difference between complaining and whining.... and making an observation. I'm making an observation.

 

[Irishnuke]

I've only been on here for a few months, but this may be the dumbest thread I've read on IE. We didn't get screwed. We lost the game. The entire team lost the game.

 

[Who'saWildManNow]

I've only been on here for a few months, but this may be the dumbest thread I've read on IE. We didn't get screwed. We lost the game. The entire team lost the game.

Not by a long shot buddy..

There is some truth to this thread.. Michigan is so dependent on Denard and when he starts breaking down from the hits, Michigan falls apart. The evidence is there..

With that said, we are talented enough to have been able beat Michigan at any point in the season and gave that game away.

 

[Anchorman]

A team gets worse when/if its best player is injured? Brilliant!

This works both ways. Very good chance we lose to USC if we play them before Barkley gets hurt.

 

[IrishLax]

I've only been on here for a few months, but this may be the dumbest thread I've read on IE. We didn't get screwed. We lost the game. The entire team lost the game.

I don't even know where to start. The point is that Michigan plays an unsustainable brand of football. Whenever you have a player take ~40 hits a game he will not make it through the season. Especially not if he is a small thin guy. That is why Mike Vick has only played like 1 complete 16 game season in his entire career. And he only takes about half the hits of Denard. It's also the same concept as running backs breaking down from 25+ hits a game: Effect of Running Back Carries on Future Production - FootballDocs Fantasy Football.

In no way, shape or form am I saying this is "why" we lost a singular game or making an "excuse." I'm making an observation that a guy responsible for 80%+ of his team's offense (I'm guessing more than any other singular player in college football, but too lazy to look it up) breaks down every year around this point because he takes so many hits. Sorry if this offends you for some reason.

 

[IrishLax]

A team gets worse when/if its best player is injured? Brilliant!

This works both ways. Very good chance we lose to USC if we play them before Barkley gets hurt.

It's the difference between "if" and "when"... it's not a forgone conclusion that Barkley will get injured or not. It is a forgone conclusion that Denard will not be in good shape by week 13. So no, it doesn't really matter where we schedule USC and it does matter that we have to play a full strength Denard when no one else will.

 

[phork]

I have a better idea. Lets back end our schedule with all our hard games. That way we can be assured we'll be 100% healthy. In fact I would like to keep our schedule open so we can pencil these teams in as they lose their star players.

 

[North Buffalo Irish]

Yeah, the problem I have with this is that everyone wants to remain independent. That means Notre Dame practically has to schedule at least one or two difficult opponents in the "non-conference" season. The Michigan schools certainly aren't going to move our game(s) to the middle of their conference schedule.

 

[ACamp1900]

He had it coming, that's what happens when you fake being a real quarterback.

So now we are completely and totally owned by guys only pretending to be real quarter backs???

 

[phork]

It's the difference between "if" and "when"... it's not a forgone conclusion that Barkley will get injured or not. It is a forgone conclusion that Denard will not be in good shape by week 13. So no, it doesn't really matter where we schedule USC and it does matter that we have to play a full strength Denard when no one else will.

Besides the fact that thankfully we won't have to deal with Denard after next year.

 

[jmurphy75]

Who cares. We lost.

Exactly....I for one had my big boy pants on and can say we lost. This is not a game of, "if's" and should've wons, it's a game of wins and losses. There is an old expression that my grandpa told me about the "if" game......if my aunt had balls she'd be my uncle!

 

[IrishLax]

Exactly....I for one had my big boy pants on and can say we lost. This is not a game of, "if's" and should've wons, it's a game of wins and losses. There is an old expression that my grandpa told me about the "if" game......if my aunt had balls she'd be my uncle!

I seriously don't get the reading comprehension displayed by some people on this board. You're making:

Michigan plays a style of football that is doomed to fail later in the season as Denard takes more and more hits.

=

Whine whine whine if we played Michigan later in the year we would have won waaaaaah.

I never said anywhere "we would have won if..." or made excuses for the loss this year. Everyone knows whose shoulders the loss this year falls on (multiple guys on ND making crucial mistakes, no need to name). What is wrong with saying that Michigan has a dumb gameplan that only works for half a season? Yet some of you find this thread so appalling. Reminds me of the FSU thread where a couple people post ad nauseum about how wrong I was and how good FSU was and how they weren't overrated.

If you want to argue with the idea that Michigan's about to enter dangerous offensive waters as Denard gets banged up... cool. If you want to post repeatedly "stop whining" then quote + bold the part that is whining. Because right now you're just building up a straw man to tear down.

 

[irishtrinity]

now can we please get a streak of winning against Michigan/USC thats all i want....

 

[jakerbluegold]

I hear people complain about stuff and bicker constantly, but I really think people need to back the f%$# up.

IrishLax is simply making an observation, which is completely, %100, and without a doubt correct. With Denard, we are in a difficult position playing him early in the season. As stated previously, we won't have to worry about it after next year.

I'm just getting irritated by the arguing over someone's opinion.

That's it, his opinion. If you don't like it, don't read it.

No need to pile on a guy for speaking his mind though.

I'm done, and Fusc!

 

[irishtrinity]

i agree as long as your an Irish fan and not bashing the Irish your cool with me... Go Irish Beat USC!!!!!!!

 

[IrishandColts]

If this and if that...

 

[BGIF]

If this and if that...

In all fairness, IF when ... was the question.

 

[General Colon Bowel]

Starting next year and from then on it should not matter who we are playing, where we are playing, what players on the other team are not playing, how experienced our quarterback is, how biased the refs are, etc. etc. etc...
We should have superior talent on both sides of the ball to almost any team we face (We should be about even with Oklahoma, USC, Michigan, Texas). We are finally recruiting on an elite level on both sides of the ball. We have a coach who is building a mentally tough team. We have the ability to win games throwing, running, or with defense. We have great coordinators. Brian Kelly will have our guys believing we can win a national championship. No more excuses.

I hope there comes a time when irishenvy never sees another woulda, coulda, shoulda thread again.

 

[BobD]

We screwed ourself by losing. We were prepared and lost it late in the game. The polls just create drama by giving everyone something to debate. The only true test is on the field, and no matter what day, month or year it is, ya gotta win. Next year........

 

[Riddickulous]

Starting next year and from then on it should not matter who we are playing, where we are playing, what players on the other team are not playing, how experienced our quarterback is, how biased the refs are, etc. etc. etc...
We should have superior talent on both sides of the ball to almost any team we face (We should be about even with Oklahoma, USC, Michigan, Texas). We are finally recruiting on an elite level on both sides of the ball. We have a coach who is building a mentally tough team. We have the ability to win games throwing, running, or with defense. We have great coordinators. Brian Kelly will have our guys believing we can win a national championship. No more excuses.

I hope there comes a time when irishenvy never sees another woulda, coulda, shoulda thread again.

Even with Oklahoma? Have you seen Oklahoma?

And even with Michigan, USC, Texas? None of them are very good this year.

People need to squash this notion that Notre Dame is going to be a national title competitor next season. Listen, I'm optimistic about Kelly, but I see a lot of holes next year. And this "Well everyone else won a national title in their third year" crap is stupid.

We need to find a new #2 running back. We lose perhaps the best wide receiver in school history and we have absolutely no one to replace him. Yes, we have guys with potential, but they haven't proven anything. TJ Jones and Theo Riddick are not true #1, go-to guys.

How about replacing two offensive linemen?

On defense we replace at least five starters with 20+ games of starting experience, including four year starter Harrison Smith, three year starters Darius Fleming and Ethan Johnson, and a pair of corners in Gary Gray and Robert Blanton who should both finish their careers with 25-30 starts. How do you replace that much experience without some growing pains?

 

[Irishnuke]

How do you replace that much experience without some growing pains?

Well if we could just play Michigan at the end of the year...

 

[jmurphy75]

If we could play Michigan at the end of the year, it would be better because maybe Denard is worn down or injured by then. Then when do we play Stanford.... Or USC? It's football you just have to deal with the schedule it is what it is. You play the shedule you have and if you're good enough you win.

 

[IrishinSyria]

For what it's worth, not playing in a conference is what forces us to front-load a lot of our harder games. This keeps us from having a de-facto pre-season like a lot of the major conferences have.

 

[IrishLax]

If we could play Michigan at the end of the year, it would be better because maybe Denard is worn down or injured by then. Then when do we play Stanford.... Or USC?

It doesn't matter because they are normal teams... not teams based around running a 180 lb player every single down and eventually breaking him. I linked something earlier that shows how even big, durable RBs that carry the ball more than 20+ times a game break very rapidly. Now realize that Denard is small and skinny, carrying the ball 20 times a game, and taking a total of 30+ hits a game playing QB. It's not "maybe" or "there's a chance"... it's going to take a freak miracle that defies prior evidence and stats to keep Denard healthy.

It's football you just have to deal with the schedule it is what it is. You play the shedule you have and if you're good enough you win.

It's this train of thought that perpetually plagues Notre Dame. I heard Urban Meyer on ESPN say the three most important things to being a successful coach are: play a manageable schedule, play a manageable schedule, and play a manageable schedule. I believe he said he heard it first from either Lou or Woody Hayes or someone like that and that it was the most true axiom he knows in college football. And if you ever listen to any of the guys on ISD (especially Mike Frank) they say the #1 thing they would change with ND football is our schedule.

Not that any of this is on topic, because the thread is really about Denard Robinson and the fact that their offense is doomed to fail, but saying "the schedule is what it is" is the same attitude that caused ND's athletic facilities to fall so far behind the curve years ago. If you don't adapt and evolve, you fall behind.

 

[BGIF]

It doesn't matter because they are normal teams... not teams based around running a 180 lb player every single down and eventually breaking him. I linked something earlier that shows how even big, durable RBs that carry the ball more than 20+ times a game break very rapidly. Now realize that Denard is small and skinny, carrying the ball 20 times a game, and taking a total of 30+ hits a game playing QB. It's not "maybe" or "there's a chance"... it's going to take a freak miracle that defies prior evidence and stats to keep Denard healthy.

Yet there was a steady cry on this board since the first game for the 180 pound Golson to be ND's starting QB since half time of the first game.

It's this train of thought that perpetually plagues Notre Dame. I heard Urban Meyer on ESPN say the three most important things to being a successful coach are: play a manageable schedule, play a manageable schedule, and play a manageable schedule. I believe he said he heard it first from either Lou or Woody Hayes or someone like that and that it was the most true axiom he knows in college football. And if you ever listen to any of the guys on ISD (especially Mike Frank) they say the #1 thing they would change with ND football is our schedule.

Not that any of this is on topic, because the thread is really about Denard Robinson and the fact that their offense is doomed to fail, but saying "the schedule is what it is" is the same attitude that caused ND's athletic facilities to fall so far behind the curve years ago. If you don't adapt and evolve, you fall behind.

We've discussed this a number of times over the years here usually on deaf ears. The testosterone crowd wants ND to play the #1 toughest schedule every year. Rockne didn't, Leahy didn't, Parshegian didn't, Devine didn't, nor did Holtz. Parshegian actually played the fewest ranked teams per year since the AP started ranking teams.

Look at the glory years for Alabama, FSU, Nebraska, and Oklahoma and you'll find lots of soft opponents. They started out against cupcakes to work out the kinks before facing real opposition. Rarely if ever did they play two tough opponents back to back. In the Big Eight rarely did they play two tough opponents in a season. Frequently there were bye weeks scheduled before the "big game". They had time to gameplan AND more importantly they had time to mend between the big games. Boise St players don't get exposed to the rigors and casualties that pile up when playing teams with 300 pound DLs and 250 LBs and crushing DBs, week after week.

"The schedule is what it is" once the season starts but in the years before the ADs can show some sanity in scheduling. In '00 ND opened against #23 A&M, #1 Nebraska, #13 Purdue, and #23 MSU. During the press conference before the Fiesta Bowl, Oregon's St's Dennis Erickson while commenting on ND's season looked at Davie and said, "Who made out your schedule. He wasn't doing you any favors."

ND does have a problem that the Big 10 doesn't want to play ND in mid-season. But that doesn't mean ND has to open with Michigan either. In '12 ND opens with Navy and plays UM in week 4 after PU and MSU. In '13 ND opens with Temple, then has UM, PU, and MSU.
In '14 ND opens with Navy then PU, UM and SYR. In '15 ND opens with Texas and Michigan.

That's absurd except that in '16 ND opens with Texas, Michigan, Stanford, MSU, PU, and MIA. That schedule is stupid.

Kelly's going to need several Vinny Cerrato caliber recruiting classes in a row to make it through that schedule.

 

[jmurphy75]

I'm not saying it's right, wrong or indeferent. I'm not saying that I like the way that ND makes the schedule, but I'm used to it. That is what ND does, no one else but ND controls their schedule and some will argue that that is one of the things that ND will not compromise.......we're better than those programs that schedule cupcake games. I'm just sayin some years our schedule works for is and some it doesn't. So yes as fans to us it is what it is.

 

[PatsandBostonfan1975]

Dude, George Patton would slap you silly.