Polian & Hart Gone

[IrishJayhawk]

It took Polian about 3 years to start making an impact in Cali. Now Kelly is going to bring in his entire Cinci staff. None of which have any recruiting clout. He isnt even trying to interview any coaches and says that he coaches players up and doesnt worry about ratings. I know that as a coach he should say that but i hope he doesnt seriously believe that he will recruit a bunch of 3 stars to Notre Dame and coach them up because we will be looking for a new coach in 5 years.

If we can't close on at least someone like Barr then i am going to turn into NDOM because i already hate what he is doing

Honest/ignorant question...

I assumed that Kelly would bring in an entirely new staff. Is that not typically how it works? Did Ty keep any of Davie's guys? Did Charlie keep any of Ty's guys? For that matter, did Zook keep any of Spurrier's guys?

I understand that we've had more recruiting success in the last 4-5 years than we previously did, but I was under the impression that a staff pretty much dies with the exiting coach.

 

[NDinL.A.]

It took Polian about 3 years to start making an impact in Cali. Now Kelly is going to bring in his entire Cinci staff. None of which have any recruiting clout. He isnt even trying to interview any coaches and says that he coaches players up and doesnt worry about ratings. I know that as a coach he should say that but i hope he doesnt seriously believe that he will recruit a bunch of 3 stars to Notre Dame and coach them up because we will be looking for a new coach in 5 years.

If we can't close on at least someone like Barr then i am going to turn into NDOM because i already hate what he is doing

IT'S BEEN A WEEK! Step off the ledge! First of all, you have no idea what Kelly is doing behind the scenes. You have no idea who he is calling, who he will hire, or what recruits he even likes. He might have seen a current recruit's film and thought he didn't fit what Kelly wanted to do at ND. You know nothing but what you read from guys on message boards, and guess what, Kelly doesn't tell them either. Again, one week and you're ready to kill the guy???

Second, he kept the entire recruiting staff in tact. I'm talking about the guys behind the scene who set everything up for guys like Polian, Brown, Ianello, etc.

Third, where do you put a guy like Polian??? He wants to coach. Guess what, our special teams sucked last year. Royally. I remember you complaining about them. You only get 9 coaches. If you're Kelly, and you reviewed the tape of last year's team, do you keep a guy who isn't a good coach and isn't one of your guys, thus hurting your team on the field while helping recruiting? We had 4 and 5 star guys that weren't winning games and weren't getting better to the point that it made a difference in the win column. We need better coaching, period. Polian and Weis opened the doors to CA recruiting, there's no reason think that Kelly's guys can't kick it down.

We are a losing football program right now, any way you slice it. The last 3 years have been awful. Out with the old, in with the new I say. And Kelly needs a staff that will work together that he feels comfortable with (need I remind you of the former D-line and O-line coaches???)...

 

[SoJerseyIrish]

Yea, all those recruits from Cali and this is still a 6-6 team.....I love the hoopla and intrigue of recruiting but teams like Ohio State, Oklahoma, etc do pretty well without bringing in a ton of kids from Cali......there is plenty of talent all over the country....but what is just as important is the coaching......

 

[IrishWV]

I for one will be glad to see a whole new staff. This was the most underachieving team in college football. In my opion the head coach is only as good as his assistants.

 

[BGIF]

Yea, all those recruits from Cali and this is still a 6-6 team.....I love the hoopla and intrigue of recruiting but teams like Ohio State, Oklahoma, etc do pretty well without bringing in a ton of kids from Cali......there is plenty of talent all over the country....but what is just as important is the coaching......

Notre Dame doesn't bring in a "ton of kids from Cali" either. Care to put a number on "ton" (regarding recruits and not weight)?

OU may not have many kid from Cali but they sure have a bunch of Texans. And if you'll check the OSU roster you'll find some 5 Star Florida high school athletes on their roster. And if you check UF's current recruiting class you'll find a Cali kid there. If Urban will take a Cali blue chip if he can get him. He's done it about a half dozen times now.

 

[Ben E.]

thank god the o and d line coaches are gone! also, thank god both starting o tackles are gone! they were two(esp. sam young) of the most dissapointing players in my lifetime!!!

 

[Aerosmith777]

After the way this team has played the past 3 years, I can't get all worked up about Kelly deciding to clean house. I would have found a spot for Polian & Powlus, only because Polian is a good recruiter and could take over Ianello's job as recruiting coordinator, and Powlus is an alum and a position coach of one of the few positions that produced over the past 5 years, but that's just me. He wants to clean house? Go ahead Brian.

I will say though, I hope he doesn't just bring his entire defensive staff over. He wants to bring Quinn and the other offensive guys over? Fine. But he now has the resources to attract a new quality of defensive coordinator in my opinion than he did at Cinci, and I hope he uses it.

 

[NeuteredDoomer]

Well... shit. Polian was, by far, our best recruiter. Not enjoying the direction this may head. Especially with Hendrix's potential wavering...

What good does it do to recruit perceived top quality athletes if you can only coach them down to average?

If you've "been there and done it" then you've been there and done it. If you haven't been there and done it...

Special teams were a farce throughout the CW/Polian term. But hey, they recruited great athletes.

 

[IrishJayhawk]

What good does it do to recruit perceived top quality athletes if you can only coach them down to average?

If you've "been there and done it" then you've been there and done it. If you haven't been there and done it...

...then what?

 

[The Polish Irishman]

After 21 losses in the last 3 seasons, it is time to clean house. What good is a coach who can recruit but can't develop players?

 

[NeuteredDoomer]

Then you are learning, rather than knowing what you are doing.

And proving that all you can do is recruit a great team that shows atrocious results on the field.

 

[NDFan4Life]

IT'S BEEN A WEEK! Step off the ledge! First of all, you have no idea what Kelly is doing behind the scenes. You have no idea who he is calling, who he will hire, or what recruits he even likes. He might have seen a current recruit's film and thought he didn't fit what Kelly wanted to do at ND. You know nothing but what you read from guys on message boards, and guess what, Kelly doesn't tell them either. Again, one week and you're ready to kill the guy???

Second, he kept the entire recruiting staff in tact. I'm talking about the guys behind the scene who set everything up for guys like Polian, Brown, Ianello, etc.

Third, where do you put a guy like Polian??? He wants to coach. Guess what, our special teams sucked last year. Royally. I remember you complaining about them. You only get 9 coaches. If you're Kelly, and you reviewed the tape of last year's team, do you keep a guy who isn't a good coach and isn't one of your guys, thus hurting your team on the field while helping recruiting? We had 4 and 5 star guys that weren't winning games and weren't getting better to the point that it made a difference in the win column. We need better coaching, period. Polian and Weis opened the doors to CA recruiting, there's no reason think that Kelly's guys can't kick it down.

We are a losing football program right now, any way you slice it. The last 3 years have been awful. Out with the old, in with the new I say. And Kelly needs a staff that will work together that he feels comfortable with (need I remind you of the former D-line and O-line coaches???)...

One of the most well thought out and concise posts in this thread. Bravo!

I'm willing to give Kelly the benefit of the doubt. Did anyone actually believe that he'd keep coaches/recruiters from the Weis regime? If so, why even bother getting rid of Charlie? I believe he'll bring in the best people he can to build his dream for a winning team. Everybody needs to just chill out and enjoy the ride. Things could be a lot worse.

 

[IrishJayhawk]

Then you are learning, rather than knowing what you are doing.

And proving that all you can do is recruit a great team that shows atrocious results on the field.

Ah...

I've been reluctant to admit it over the past few years, but I hope you're right.

 

[FrankMA]

Well... shit. Polian was, by far, our best recruiter. Not enjoying the direction this may head. Especially with Hendrix's potential wavering...

Vinny Cerrato is available. He was ND best recruiter by far.

 

[NeuteredDoomer]

Jeremy M. I'm definitely right about the "concept." that Utopia is cool to my noggin.

 

[Polish Leppy 22]

Let's hire beano cook

 

[phgreek]

What good does it do to recruit perceived top quality athletes if you can only coach them down to average?

If you've "been there and done it" then you've been there and done it. If you haven't been there and done it...

Special teams were a farce throughout the CW/Polian term. But hey, they recruited great athletes.

...uhhhh AGREE. Best special teams player we had was a 195 pound walk-on...WHY? You can say his desire overcame his diminutive stature...but seriously, its also because the other "athletes" did not play with any passion, or discipline...they were not developed.

recruiting is important, but it also gets easier if you a) develop players (not just talk about it), b) win the damned games you are supposed to win. I am less concerned about the recruiting than I was. Do I think Kelly is "the guy"...not convinced yet, but Jack makes a nice bit of $$$ to do his thing, so we'll see...

I will say we are the posterchild for how little recruiting ratings can mean regarding success, and clearly we made a strong point for the fact that winning begets recruiting...not vice versa.

 

[FrankMA]

...uhhhh AGREE. Best special teams player we had was a 195 pound walk-on...WHY? You can say his desire overcame his diminutive stature...but seriously, its also because the other "athletes" did not play with any passion, or discipline...they were not developed.

recruiting is important, but it also gets easier if you a) develop players (not just talk about it), b) win the damned games you are supposed to win. I am less concerned about the recruiting than I was. Do I think Kelly is "the guy"...not convinced yet, but Jack makes a nice bit of $$$ to do his thing, so we'll see...

I will say we are the posterchild for how little recruiting ratings can mean regarding success, and clearly we made a strong point for the fact that winning begets recruiting...not vice versa.

Agree with most of what you say; however, it is impossible to maintain a top 10 program consistently without strong recruiting. I believe the yearly recruiting rankings compared with the top 15 in the polls every year would bare this out. This of course, requires good coaching also. I quess the concern with coach kelly is that he has never recruited at a national level. The hope of many is that he would have members on the staff who are used to recruiting at a high level natiionally to help with recruiting. Without that he could fail even though he is a good coach.

 

[jason_h537]

The point of keeping someone like Alford or Ianello was to keep the realationships they have built in recruiting. Very few coaches out there can walk in and turn a kid in 2 months. Polian buitl great relationships with the coaches and players in the California private school system and had a greateye for talent. That is why he was being considered and that is why he was on Weis's staff. You can say that Weis recruited and lost but its possible to lose with great talent, its impossible to win against elite competition without talent.

 

[phgreek]

The point of keeping someone like Alford or Ianello was to keep the realationships they have built in recruiting. Very few coaches out there can walk in and turn a kid in 2 months. Polian buitl great relationships with the coaches and players in the California private school system and had a greateye for talent. That is why he was being considered and that is why he was on Weis's staff. You can say that Weis recruited and lost but its possible to lose with great talent, its impossible to win against elite competition without talent.

....someone forgot to tell Navy, and Stanford that whole thing...and BK did ok with his big east schedule with 3 stars...I think his team fairs better with NDs schedule, and beats us head to head...I believe BK was on the verge of pulling some 4 star recruits to cincy consistantly...because he won.

Seriously, I get what you are saying, and I understand the import of recruiting, but I worry less about Kelly's ability to pull 5 stars out of Cali right now, and more about him winning right now...seems to me his MO is wining, and that pulls recruits...I think if he wins we'll all talk about what a great recruiter he is in the years to come...without winning...he has nothing to offer (CW package included an NFL sniff, which kept folks coming even when he lost).