Follow the Money - The Big Business of College Football

[KMac151993]

the post was about regular students transferring and the poster was wondering why that was different then players
I kind of thought that was obvious

There is definitely money involved there. A faculty member can provide student stipends for research work. I have seen a faculty member leave a university and then offer very favorable stipends to entice students to join them.

 

[burmafrd1944]

There is definitely money involved there. A faculty member can provide student stipends for research work. I have seen a faculty member leave a university and then offer very favorable stipends to entice students to join them.

peanuts dude
they throwing around half a million or a million at a time?
then no comparison at all
and REALLY, tell me how often that happens...

 

[KMac151993]

It may not happen often but it does happen. I personally know of a student who received an offer for full tuition and room and board stipend to come work for a specific faculty member at a Big 10 university this after the student had recently had research published at his current institution.

So even one instance, there are likely many that take place, is enough. No less in college football which is a billion dollar business.

Why not offer the Lou Groza winner $100k to kick for the playoffs? The semester is over, he could apply for entry into a school just like any other student for the spring semester. Most schools have an application deadline of either Nov. 1 or Dec. 1 and processed until space is filled. Going back to my first example - say you kick for Kent State...they are 2-8 on Nov. 1...no playoff chance, currently the odds on favorite to win the Groza...haven't missed a FG all year and O$U comes knocking needing a kicker. How much was Jeter's kick worth for Notre Dame?

I am not saying I agree with this but we just saw the courts justify a player who admitted to violating the rules be given temporary relief. You can bet someone has thought of this...

 

[SeekNDestroy]

It may not happen often but it does happen. I personally know of a student who received an offer for full tuition and room and board stipend to come work for a specific faculty member at a Big 10 university this after the student had recently had research published at his current institution.

So even one instance, there are likely many that take place, is enough. No less in college football which is a billion dollar business.

Why not offer the Lou Groza winner $100k to kick for the playoffs? The semester is over, he could apply for entry into a school just like any other student for the spring semester. Most schools have an application deadline of either Nov. 1 or Dec. 1 and processed until space is filled. Going back to my first example - say you kick for Kent State...they are 2-8 on Nov. 1...no playoff chance, currently the odds on favorite to win the Groza...haven't missed a FG all year and O$U comes knocking needing a kicker. How much was Jeter's kick worth for Notre Dame?

I am not saying I agree with this but we just saw the courts justify a player who admitted to violating the rules be given temporary relief. You can bet someone has thought of this...

Ha ha was this on purpose?

 

[Jiggafini19Deux]

I guess one of the comments that many have made is that "regular" students can do this or that and one of the things they can do is transfer after the semester has ended. Semester ends in mid December and the playoffs don't even begin until many schools are already done...no less the spring semester actually begins before the playoffs even end. Isn't this a restriction on them?

Regular students don't have the competitive element attached to them, though. That's the difference.

If someone transfers in for the January semester, they should not be able to participate in playoffs. Spring ball, yes, but I'd put a limit on that if I had a preference as a fan and as someone that still wants there to be some semblance of balance and rules.

This hypothetical is also down the pecking order in terms of things that need addressed and structure.

 

[jerseyborn1971]

If there were physics teams with millions of dollars on the line, they wouldn't be allowed to transfer before the College Physics Playoffs.

 

[burmafrd1944]

hilarious to see someone thinking academic transfers and so called subsidies for them in any way shape or form happens very often and certainly the money involved is PENNIES compared to NIL Money

Now mind you, if Academics were given publicity and salaries commismerate with top level sports and entertainment stars, then maybe the educational system would be better off

talent goes to where the money is in many areas; lawyers for example very rarely settle for working for litte at non profits; even there they make plenty.

 

[TorontoGold]

hilarious to see someone thinking academic transfers and so called subsidies for them in any way shape or form happens very often and certainly the money involved is PENNIES compared to NIL Money

Now mind you, if Academics were given publicity and salaries commismerate with top level sports and entertainment stars, then maybe the educational system would be better off

talent goes to where the money is in many areas; lawyers for example very rarely settle for working for litte at non profits; even there they make plenty.

I look forward to hearing your pitch of how to make math proof competitions fun and worthy of large TV deals.

 

[burmafrd1944]

I look forward to hearing your pitch of how to make math proof competitions fun and worthy of large TV deals.

Not saying its possible
now some here may be dumb enough to think so

But think on this: Harvard has over $20 billion endowment
and it costs like $75,000 a year undergrad
so there certainly IS money in Education

 

[TorontoGold]

Not saying its possible
now some here may be dumb enough to think so

But think on this: Harvard has over $20 billion endowment
and it costs like $75,000 a year undergrad
so there certainly IS money in Education

Think on this - Scripps Spelling Bee pays 50k to the winner. Tough to find academic content better than a spelling bee. Schools aren’t going to fund a sudoku league for millions.

 

[burmafrd1944]

Think on this - Scripps Spelling Bee pays 50k to the winner. Tough to find academic content better than a spelling bee. Schools aren’t going to fund a sudoku league for millions.

The Winner of the National Spelling Bee should get a four year full ride scholarship to the university of his/her choice

 

[jerseyborn1971]

That's not a bad idea. After they win, they can the whole hat game thing. I might actually tune in to that.

 

[jprue24]

I still don't really understand how/why the NCAA is different than any other membership-based organization. If you want to join, you have to agree to their rules. If you don't want to agree to their rules, that's fine, but then you're not eligible to compete for their championships.

Obviously the NCAA has done a very poor job of enforcing their rules - first by going too far and later by ignoring them selectively and then altogether - but I don't fully get how the rules themselves are legally unenforceable. People do not have some constitutional right to get paid lots of money to play college sports.

Short answer, the Sherman Act of 1890.


A bit longer. The members of the NCAA all compete against each other for the same athletes, same fans, and the same money. This makes the schools business rivals. The Sherman Act prohibits business rivals from teaming up and agreeing to limit competition between each other. Courts have determined that schools, through the NCAA, were agreeing with each other to cap compensation.

Just don't join our group or go somewhere else isn't a defense to price fixing. Practically speaking, the NCAA is basically the only path to playing high level college sports, so "don't join" amounts to "don't play at all".

If you are looking for the first legal domino you have to go back to 1984 and NCAA v Board of Regents. That case established that NCAA rules could be challenged under antitrust law.

Edit - NCAA v Board of Regents of the University of Oklahoma* (Dawgs were also a plaintiff) was about control of TV broadcasts and allowed schools to make their own TV deals

 

[PolishDomer]

As a North Dakota State alum, I am pro carrying the minimum number of sports and our shameless use of Title 9 to avoid adding women's sports.

I'll butcher the explanation in some fashion but the gist of it is surveys...from what im told. Every year or so the university sends out surveys to students about their interest in programs on campus, including varsity athletics.

Regular girls on campus aren't interested in being college athletes. If they were, they would probably have attended a different school. The girls on campus who are interested in playing sports are probably already on the team of the sport they are interested in. So the survey ends up telling us that NDSU is offering basically every sport the student population is interested in having, at least on the women's side.

End result, grossly disproportionate participation/scholarships to men's sports since their is no analog to the football team.

Title 9 in this day and age is stupid...time to abolish this idiotic law

 

[burmafrd1944]

Title 9 in this day and age is stupid...time to abolish this idiotic law

with all the biological males trying to get into female sports?
or is that fine with you?

 

[jprue24]

with all the biological males trying to get into female sports?
or is that fine with you?

You choose to be this ignorant, huh

NCAA President Charlie Baker told a Senate panel there are fewer than 10 transgender athletes he is aware of who currently compete in college sports, pouring cold water on an issue Republicans have said is a nationwide problem and one that is increasingly fraught territory for Democrats.

“How many athletes are there in the U.S. in NCAA schools?” Sen. Dick Durbin (D-Ill.) asked Baker during a Senate Judiciary Committee hearing Tuesday on federal regulations around sports gambling.

“Five hundred and ten thousand,” said Baker, a former Republican governor of Massachusetts who has served since 2023 as president of the NCAA, which governs intercollegiate athletics at more than 1,000 colleges and universities across the country.

“How many transgender athletes are you aware of?” Durbin asked.

“Less than 10,” Baker said. He did not say whether that number includes transgender men.



10/510,000
.002%

https://thehill.com/homenews/lgbtq/5046662-ncaa-president-transgender-athletes-college-sports/

 

[burmafrd1944]

You choose to be this ignorant, huh

NCAA President Charlie Baker told a Senate panel there are fewer than 10 transgender athletes he is aware of who currently compete in college sports, pouring cold water on an issue Republicans have said is a nationwide problem and one that is increasingly fraught territory for Democrats.

“How many athletes are there in the U.S. in NCAA schools?” Sen. Dick Durbin (D-Ill.) asked Baker during a Senate Judiciary Committee hearing Tuesday on federal regulations around sports gambling.

“Five hundred and ten thousand,” said Baker, a former Republican governor of Massachusetts who has served since 2023 as president of the NCAA, which governs intercollegiate athletics at more than 1,000 colleges and universities across the country.

“How many transgender athletes are you aware of?” Durbin asked.

“Less than 10,” Baker said. He did not say whether that number includes transgender men.



10/510,000
.002%

https://thehill.com/homenews/lgbtq/5046662-ncaa-president-transgender-athletes-college-sports/

Wow, and I thought you all were for womens rights?
guess not.
but then your kind always talk the talk but never walk the walk
I love how you basically say the women that are penalized are
ACCEPTABLE LOSSES

 

[jprue24]

Wow, and I thought you all were for womens rights?
guess not.
but then your kind always talk the talk but never walk the walk
I love how you basically say the women that are penalized are
ACCEPTABLE LOSSES

Can't believe you were wrong again.

 

[ulukinatme]

You choose to be this ignorant, huh

NCAA President Charlie Baker told a Senate panel there are fewer than 10 transgender athletes he is aware of who currently compete in college sports, pouring cold water on an issue Republicans have said is a nationwide problem and one that is increasingly fraught territory for Democrats.

“How many athletes are there in the U.S. in NCAA schools?” Sen. Dick Durbin (D-Ill.) asked Baker during a Senate Judiciary Committee hearing Tuesday on federal regulations around sports gambling.

“Five hundred and ten thousand,” said Baker, a former Republican governor of Massachusetts who has served since 2023 as president of the NCAA, which governs intercollegiate athletics at more than 1,000 colleges and universities across the country.

“How many transgender athletes are you aware of?” Durbin asked.

“Less than 10,” Baker said. He did not say whether that number includes transgender men.



10/510,000
.002%

https://thehill.com/homenews/lgbtq/5046662-ncaa-president-transgender-athletes-college-sports/

An advocacy group puts the number at 50 in the NCAA, but the number isn't really important. There's no reason a transgendered woman should be competing against biological women, they can and should be competing against the males which matches their gender at birth. It's not about numbers, it's about protecting women's sports. Organizations today are now becoming more restrictive when it comes to transgender women competing against biological women, not less. There's a good reason for that. We don't allow performance enhancing drugs in major sports, nor do we allow college athletes to participate competitively against high school kids. The competition wouldn't be fair, and it's no different when it comes to transgender women and biological women in sports.

The overwhelming trend across both elite and scholastic sports is toward banning transgender women from competing in women's categories. Major athletic and governing bodies increasingly mandate that the women's category is strictly limited to athletes assigned female at birth. [1, 2, 3]
This shift is heavily enforced across several major sectors:

• The Olympics: The International Olympic Committee (IOC) instituted a ban on transgender women competing in women's events, utilizing SRY gene screening. [1, 2]
• International Federations: Major sporting organizations—including World Athletics (track and field), World Aquatics (swimming), and the International Cycling Union (cycling)—have enacted strict policies barring transgender women who went through male puberty from elite women's events. [1, 2]
• U.S. Collegiate Level: The NCAA updated its participation policy, limiting competition in the women's category to athletes assigned female at birth. [1, 2]
• U.S. State Laws: Over half of U.S. states have enacted laws or regulations preventing transgender girls and women from participating in K-12 and collegiate sports based on their gender identity. [1]

 

[jprue24]

An advocacy group puts the number at 50 in the NCAA, but the number isn't really important. There's no reason a transgendered woman should be competing against biological women, they can and should be competing against the males which matches their gender at birth. It's not about numbers, it's about protecting women's sports. Organizations today are now becoming more restrictive when it comes to transgender women competing against biological women, not less. There's a good reason for that. We don't allow performance enhancing drugs in major sports, nor do we allow college athletes to participate competitively against high school kids. The competition wouldn't be fair, and it's no different when it comes to transgender women and biological women in sports.

Ukulele, I was responding to an ignorant bigot firing a stray shot at trans people by implying, in a thread about money in college football, that there are lots of biological males trying to play women's sports. According to the data, there ain't.

 

[TorontoGold]

 

[Bishop2b5]

You choose to be this ignorant, huh

NCAA President Charlie Baker told a Senate panel there are fewer than 10 transgender athletes he is aware of who currently compete in college sports, pouring cold water on an issue Republicans have said is a nationwide problem and one that is increasingly fraught territory for Democrats.

“How many athletes are there in the U.S. in NCAA schools?” Sen. Dick Durbin (D-Ill.) asked Baker during a Senate Judiciary Committee hearing Tuesday on federal regulations around sports gambling.

“Five hundred and ten thousand,” said Baker, a former Republican governor of Massachusetts who has served since 2023 as president of the NCAA, which governs intercollegiate athletics at more than 1,000 colleges and universities across the country.

“How many transgender athletes are you aware of?” Durbin asked.

“Less than 10,” Baker said. He did not say whether that number includes transgender men.



10/510,000
.002%

https://thehill.com/homenews/lgbtq/5046662-ncaa-president-transgender-athletes-college-sports/

So where do we draw the line? When it gets to be 50, or 100, or 5000, or what? What's the point where it's not OK? Tell us what that number is. If we wait until it's 1% to complain, you'll say, "Well, you didn't say anything before. Why is it just now a problem for you?" The bottom line is that anything above 0% is simply wrong. Biological males have a distinct physical advantage on average over women in the vast majority of sports. The numbers may be low, but there's no justification for them at that level, let alone allowing them to climb higher. Sports is supposed to be about fairness in competition in most cases, and letting a biological male compete against women is almost always an unfair physical advantage.

The issue is maybe worse in HS, as we've seen female players injured in competition against males, and it's grossly unfair for some girl who's worked her butt off for years hoping to win a championship or earn a scholarship watch some average male athlete claim to be female and take that from her. Even if it's only one instance, it would still be one too many. "It's only a few" is a poor justification and unacceptable, just as it would be for "It's only a few murders" or "It's only a few rapes." There's no number above 0 that's acceptable.

 

[burmafrd1944]

Can't believe you were wrong again.

says the guy that wants biological males beating up on females in sports

 

[burmafrd1944]

Ukulele, I was responding to an ignorant bigot firing a stray shot at trans people by implying, in a thread about money in college football, that there are lots of biological males trying to play women's sports. According to the data, there ain't.

and you do not care that it is happening
clearly you are a misogynist

 

[jprue24]

So where do we draw the line? When it gets to be 50, or 100, or 5000, or what? What's the point where it's not OK? Tell us what that number is. If we wait until it's 1% to complain, you'll say, "Well, you didn't say anything before. Why is it just now a problem for you?" The bottom line is that anything above 0% is simply wrong. Biological males have a distinct physical advantage on average over women in the vast majority of sports. The numbers may be low, but there's no justification for them at that level, let alone allowing them to climb higher. Sports is supposed to be about fairness in competition in most cases, and letting a biological male compete against women is almost always an unfair physical advantage.

The issue is maybe worse in HS, as we've seen female players injured in competition against males, and it's grossly unfair for some girl who's worked her butt off for years hoping to win a championship or earn a scholarship watch some average male athlete claim to be female and take that from her. Even if it's only one instance, it would still be one too many. "It's only a few" is a poor justification and unacceptable, just as it would be for "It's only a few murders" or "It's only a few rapes." There's no number above 0 that's acceptable.

says the guy that wants biological males beating up on females in sports

UkuleleMorons, I was responding to an ignorant bigot firing a stray shot at trans people by implying, in a thread about money in college football, that there are lots of biological males trying to play women's sports. According to the data, there ain't.

 

[ColoradoIrish]

You guys are so terribly incorrect. Sure trans woman that haven't been on her for any length of time shouldn't be able to compete but all research shows that any advantage is gone after being on her for a few years.

https://bjsm.bmj.com/content/58/11/586

https://www.sf.gov/trans-women-in-sports-facts-over-fear

Integrating Transwomen and Female Athletes with Differences of Sex Development (DSD) into Elite Competition: The FIMS 2021 Consensus Statement - Sports Medicine

Sport is historically designated by the binary categorization of male and female that conflicts with modern society. Sport’s governing bodies should consider reviewing rules determining the eligibility of athletes in the female category as there may be lasting advantages of previously high...

link.springer.com

Sex differences and athletic performance. Where do trans individuals fit into sports and athletics based on current research? - PMC

There are well known sex differences in parameters of physical fitness/performance due to changes occurring during sexual development. Thus, many sport and athletic events have regulations separating male and female participants. However, the ...

pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

That'll be my only comment at this shouldn't even be a convo for over here.

 

[burmafrd1944]

You guys are so terribly incorrect. Sure trans woman that haven't been on her for any length of time shouldn't be able to compete but all research shows that any advantage is gone after being on her for a few years.

https://bjsm.bmj.com/content/58/11/586

https://www.sf.gov/trans-women-in-sports-facts-over-fear

Integrating Transwomen and Female Athletes with Differences of Sex Development (DSD) into Elite Competition: The FIMS 2021 Consensus Statement - Sports Medicine

Sport is historically designated by the binary categorization of male and female that conflicts with modern society. Sport’s governing bodies should consider reviewing rules determining the eligibility of athletes in the female category as there may be lasting advantages of previously high...

link.springer.com

Sex differences and athletic performance. Where do trans individuals fit into sports and athletics based on current research? - PMC

There are well known sex differences in parameters of physical fitness/performance due to changes occurring during sexual development. Thus, many sport and athletic events have regulations separating male and female participants. However, the ...

pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

That'll be my only comment at this shouldn't even be a convo for over here.

and if you bother to check these out, they all have agendas
and is clearly false for those in high school. Just look at what happened in california just a couple of weeks ago

 

[ColoradoIrish]

and if you bother to check these out, they all have agendas
and is clearly false for those in high school. Just look at what happened in california just a couple of weeks ago

Nothing out of the ordinary happened. She won 2 events and lost another. In the two events she won she's not the best nationwide. You're falling for fear mongering about something you don't understand and don't want to educate yourself on. Athletics are never fair, and any biological advantage that might have existed for trans women is gone after being hrt. All the science backs this up.

 

[NorthDakota]

I have opinions on this but I feel like this thread is not the place for it. I know we have plenty of folks with thoughts they'd like to share so please go to the political board where we have threads for that.

 

[Bishop2b5]

You guys are so terribly incorrect. Sure trans woman that haven't been on her for any length of time shouldn't be able to compete but all research shows that any advantage is gone after being on her for a few years.

https://bjsm.bmj.com/content/58/11/586

https://www.sf.gov/trans-women-in-sports-facts-over-fear

Integrating Transwomen and Female Athletes with Differences of Sex Development (DSD) into Elite Competition: The FIMS 2021 Consensus Statement - Sports Medicine

Sport is historically designated by the binary categorization of male and female that conflicts with modern society. Sport’s governing bodies should consider reviewing rules determining the eligibility of athletes in the female category as there may be lasting advantages of previously high...

link.springer.com

Sex differences and athletic performance. Where do trans individuals fit into sports and athletics based on current research? - PMC

There are well known sex differences in parameters of physical fitness/performance due to changes occurring during sexual development. Thus, many sport and athletic events have regulations separating male and female participants. However, the ...

pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

That'll be my only comment at this shouldn't even be a convo for over here.

Not to get into a long discussion here, let alone an argument, but no amount of hormone therapy will reduce the skeletal advantages an adult biological male has,