Marcus Freeman Revisited

[NDFAN2008]

I don’t blame this loss on Freeman one bite if anything I give credit. We lost by 3 points to what will probally be the 3rd ranked team to finish the year out. I’d say they are better than Michigan and Cinn. Michigan just got spanked and Ohio State gave you a crap load of points to Utah. That was the best effort I’ve seen our team come out of the gates in a major bowl game in a while and they did it with our best offensive weapon and defensive player out.

 

[NDRock]

I'm guessing you have a punching bag in your bedroom with the ND logo on it and the first thing you do every morning is give it a good smack before anything else.

Ha. I'm just hoping he doesn't love his kids like he loves Notre Dame.

Scene begins with Sea Turtle in his favorite recliner, watching TV. Little Sea Turtle enters the room

Little Sea Turtle: "Dad, I got a 94 on my math test."
Sea Turtle: "94? Pathetic. Your classmate Kirby got a 96 and Nicky got a 100. Why can't you be more like them!"

Little Sea Turtle runs out of the room crying. Sea Turtle pops the top on a fresh Natty Light, puts his feet up on the recliner and turns the volume up on his favorite show, the Paul Finebaum Show. A look of contentment falls over his face. End scene.

 

[Rasputin]

Rasputin thinks the parallels to Georgia’s transition to Kirby Smart bear an uncanny resemblance to Notre Dame’s transition to Marcus Freeman (“BMF”). Please indulge Rasputin.

First, Georgia.

Mark Richt preceded Smart. Good coach. In 15 seasons he had a record of 145W – 51L for a winning percentage of .739. Richt’s final 5 recruiting classes looked like this:

2012: 9[SUP]th[/SUP]
2013: 12[SUP]th[/SUP]
2014: 8[SUP]th[/SUP]
2015: 6[SUP]th[/SUP]
2016: 6[SUP]th[/SUP]

Stellar Won-Loss record and recruiting results but never quite good enough to win it all so he was replaced by a first time HC in Kirby Smart. Prior to becoming the Georgia HC Smart was a Defensive Coordinator for 8 seasons. Smart’s first season (2016) at Georgia was a rocky one, finishing 8-5 with losses to Ole Miss, Tennessee, Vanderbilt, Florida and Georgia Tech plus close wins over average teams from Nicholls State, Missouri, Kentucky and Louisiana-Lafayette. It seems to Rasputin that Smart was learning on the job that first season. Luckily for Georgia and its fans, the administration was patient with Smart. He proved himself to be a quality recruiter and proceeded to build the following recruiting classes:

2017: 3[SUP]rd[/SUP]
2018: 1[SUP]st[/SUP]
2019: 2[SUP]nd[/SUP]
2020: 1[SUP]st[/SUP]
2021: 4[SUP]th[/SUP]

Since his first year, Smart has gone 57-10, a winning percentage of .850, including 2 CFP championship game appearances (including next week’s game). Smart has not proven himself to be a very good in game coach but he has provided the blueprint for an average to above in game coach to be successful. Jimmies and Joes, Jimmies and Joes.

Now, Notre Dame.

Brian Kelly preceded BMF. Good coach. In 12 seasons he had a record of 113W – 40L for a winning percentage of .739. The exact same winning percentage as Richt. Kelly’s final 5 recruiting classes looked like this:

2018: 10[SUP]th[/SUP]
2019: 15[SUP]th[/SUP]
2020: 18[SUP]th[/SUP]
2021: 9[SUP]th[/SUP]
2022: 7[SUP]th[/SUP]

His recruiting results were good to very good, on the cusp of excellent a couple of times, but not elite. He was never quite good enough to win it all just like Richt so like Georgia fans with Richt, Notre Dame fans were largely happy to see the end of the Kelly era.

Prior to becoming Notre Dame’s HC, BMF was a Defensive Coordinator for 6 seasons (Smart was a DC for 8). Freeman’s first season at Notre Dame might be a rocky one (remember Smart was 8-5). There might be some ugly, inexplicable losses due to in game miscues. But just like Smart, BMF will be learning on the job his first season. Like Georgia, the Notre Dame administration and fans will need to be patient with BMF. He has proven himself to be a quality recruiter and like Smart did at Georgia, he will take his recruiting classes to the next level. Just look at early results for 2023’s class. BMF might not reach the heights of Smart’s classes rankings, but he won’t hit the depths of Kelly’s either. Notre Dame is upgrading its Jimmies and Joes and that’s exactly what’s needed for BMF’s W-L and CFP championship game appearances to rival Smart’s.

This is the right path. Rasputin will be patient.


EDIT - What The Font?

 

[GATTACA!]

Rasputin thinks the parallels to Georgia’s transition to Kirby Smart bear an uncanny resemblance to Notre Dame’s transition to Marcus Freeman (“BMF”). Please indulge Rasputin.

First, Georgia.

Mark Richt preceded Smart. Good coach. In 15 seasons he had a record of 145W – 51L for a winning percentage of .739. Richt’s final 5 recruiting classes looked like this:

2012: 9[SUP]th[/SUP]
2013: 12[SUP]th[/SUP]
2014: 8[SUP]th[/SUP]
2015: 6[SUP]th[/SUP]
2016: 6[SUP]th[/SUP]

Stellar Won-Loss record and recruiting results but never quite good enough to win it all so he was replaced by a first time HC in Kirby Smart. Prior to becoming the Georgia HC Smart was a Defensive Coordinator for 8 seasons. Smart’s first season (2016) at Georgia was a rocky one, finishing 8-5 with losses to Ole Miss, Tennessee, Vanderbilt, Florida and Georgia Tech plus close wins over average teams from Nicholls State, Missouri, Kentucky and Louisiana-Lafayette. It seems to Rasputin that Smart was learning on the job that first season. Luckily for Georgia and its fans, the administration was patient with Smart. He proved himself to be a quality recruiter and proceeded to build the following recruiting classes:

2017: 3[SUP]rd[/SUP]
2018: 1[SUP]st[/SUP]
2019: 2[SUP]nd[/SUP]
2020: 1[SUP]st[/SUP]
2021: 4[SUP]th[/SUP]

Since his first year, Smart has gone 57-10, a winning percentage of .850, including 2 CFP championship game appearances (including next week’s game). Smart has not proven himself to be a very good in game coach but he has provided the blueprint for an average to above in game coach to be successful. Jimmies and Joes, Jimmies and Joes.

Now, Notre Dame.

Brian Kelly preceded BMF. Good coach. In 12 seasons he had a record of 113W – 40L for a winning percentage of .739. The exact same winning percentage as Richt. Kelly’s final 5 recruiting classes looked like this:

2018: 10[SUP]th[/SUP]
2019: 15[SUP]th[/SUP]
2020: 18[SUP]th[/SUP]
2021: 9[SUP]th[/SUP]
2022: 7[SUP]th[/SUP]

His recruiting results were good to very good, on the cusp of excellent a couple of times, but not elite. He was never quite good enough to win it all just like Richt so like Georgia fans with Richt, Notre Dame fans were largely happy to see the end of the Kelly era.

Prior to becoming Notre Dame’s HC, BMF was a Defensive Coordinator for 6 seasons (Smart was a DC for 8). Freeman’s first season at Notre Dame might be a rocky one (remember Smart was 8-5). There might be some ugly, inexplicable losses due to in game miscues. But just like Smart, BMF will be learning on the job his first season. Like Georgia, the Notre Dame administration and fans will need to be patient with BMF. He has proven himself to be a quality recruiter and like Smart did at Georgia, he will take his recruiting classes to the next level. Just look at early results for 2023’s class. BMF might not reach the heights of Smart’s classes rankings, but he won’t hit the depths of Kelly’s either. Notre Dame is upgrading its Jimmies and Joes and that’s exactly what’s needed for BMF’s W-L and CFP championship game appearances to rival Smart’s.

This is the right path. Rasputin will be patient.


EDIT - What The Font?

A post so good it deserved its own font.

 

[brewdog_14527]

Rasputin thinks the parallels to Georgia’s transition to Kirby Smart bear an uncanny resemblance to Notre Dame’s transition to Marcus Freeman (“BMF”). Please indulge Rasputin.

First, Georgia.

Mark Richt preceded Smart. Good coach. In 15 seasons he had a record of 145W – 51L for a winning percentage of .739. Richt’s final 5 recruiting classes looked like this:

2012: 9[SUP]th[/SUP]
2013: 12[SUP]th[/SUP]
2014: 8[SUP]th[/SUP]
2015: 6[SUP]th[/SUP]
2016: 6[SUP]th[/SUP]

Stellar Won-Loss record and recruiting results but never quite good enough to win it all so he was replaced by a first time HC in Kirby Smart. Prior to becoming the Georgia HC Smart was a Defensive Coordinator for 8 seasons. Smart’s first season (2016) at Georgia was a rocky one, finishing 8-5 with losses to Ole Miss, Tennessee, Vanderbilt, Florida and Georgia Tech plus close wins over average teams from Nicholls State, Missouri, Kentucky and Louisiana-Lafayette. It seems to Rasputin that Smart was learning on the job that first season. Luckily for Georgia and its fans, the administration was patient with Smart. He proved himself to be a quality recruiter and proceeded to build the following recruiting classes:

2017: 3[SUP]rd[/SUP]
2018: 1[SUP]st[/SUP]
2019: 2[SUP]nd[/SUP]
2020: 1[SUP]st[/SUP]
2021: 4[SUP]th[/SUP]

Since his first year, Smart has gone 57-10, a winning percentage of .850, including 2 CFP championship game appearances (including next week’s game). Smart has not proven himself to be a very good in game coach but he has provided the blueprint for an average to above in game coach to be successful. Jimmies and Joes, Jimmies and Joes.

Now, Notre Dame.

Brian Kelly preceded BMF. Good coach. In 12 seasons he had a record of 113W – 40L for a winning percentage of .739. The exact same winning percentage as Richt. Kelly’s final 5 recruiting classes looked like this:

2018: 10[SUP]th[/SUP]
2019: 15[SUP]th[/SUP]
2020: 18[SUP]th[/SUP]
2021: 9[SUP]th[/SUP]
2022: 7[SUP]th[/SUP]

His recruiting results were good to very good, on the cusp of excellent a couple of times, but not elite. He was never quite good enough to win it all just like Richt so like Georgia fans with Richt, Notre Dame fans were largely happy to see the end of the Kelly era.

Prior to becoming Notre Dame’s HC, BMF was a Defensive Coordinator for 6 seasons (Smart was a DC for 8). Freeman’s first season at Notre Dame might be a rocky one (remember Smart was 8-5). There might be some ugly, inexplicable losses due to in game miscues. But just like Smart, BMF will be learning on the job his first season. Like Georgia, the Notre Dame administration and fans will need to be patient with BMF. He has proven himself to be a quality recruiter and like Smart did at Georgia, he will take his recruiting classes to the next level. Just look at early results for 2023’s class. BMF might not reach the heights of Smart’s classes rankings, but he won’t hit the depths of Kelly’s either. Notre Dame is upgrading its Jimmies and Joes and that’s exactly what’s needed for BMF’s W-L and CFP championship game appearances to rival Smart’s.

This is the right path. Rasputin will be patient.


EDIT - What The Font?

I am smarter for having read this. Great post!!

 

[Irish#1]

Rasputin thinks the parallels to Georgia’s transition to Kirby Smart bear an uncanny resemblance to Notre Dame’s transition to Marcus Freeman (“BMF”). Please indulge Rasputin.

First, Georgia.

Mark Richt preceded Smart. Good coach. In 15 seasons he had a record of 145W – 51L for a winning percentage of .739. Richt’s final 5 recruiting classes looked like this:

2012: 9[SUP]th[/SUP]
2013: 12[SUP]th[/SUP]
2014: 8[SUP]th[/SUP]
2015: 6[SUP]th[/SUP]
2016: 6[SUP]th[/SUP]

Stellar Won-Loss record and recruiting results but never quite good enough to win it all so he was replaced by a first time HC in Kirby Smart. Prior to becoming the Georgia HC Smart was a Defensive Coordinator for 8 seasons. Smart’s first season (2016) at Georgia was a rocky one, finishing 8-5 with losses to Ole Miss, Tennessee, Vanderbilt, Florida and Georgia Tech plus close wins over average teams from Nicholls State, Missouri, Kentucky and Louisiana-Lafayette. It seems to Rasputin that Smart was learning on the job that first season. Luckily for Georgia and its fans, the administration was patient with Smart. He proved himself to be a quality recruiter and proceeded to build the following recruiting classes:

2017: 3[SUP]rd[/SUP]
2018: 1[SUP]st[/SUP]
2019: 2[SUP]nd[/SUP]
2020: 1[SUP]st[/SUP]
2021: 4[SUP]th[/SUP]

Since his first year, Smart has gone 57-10, a winning percentage of .850, including 2 CFP championship game appearances (including next week’s game). Smart has not proven himself to be a very good in game coach but he has provided the blueprint for an average to above in game coach to be successful. Jimmies and Joes, Jimmies and Joes.

Now, Notre Dame.

Brian Kelly preceded BMF. Good coach. In 12 seasons he had a record of 113W – 40L for a winning percentage of .739. The exact same winning percentage as Richt. Kelly’s final 5 recruiting classes looked like this:

2018: 10[SUP]th[/SUP]
2019: 15[SUP]th[/SUP]
2020: 18[SUP]th[/SUP]
2021: 9[SUP]th[/SUP]
2022: 7[SUP]th[/SUP]

His recruiting results were good to very good, on the cusp of excellent a couple of times, but not elite. He was never quite good enough to win it all just like Richt so like Georgia fans with Richt, Notre Dame fans were largely happy to see the end of the Kelly era.

Prior to becoming Notre Dame’s HC, BMF was a Defensive Coordinator for 6 seasons (Smart was a DC for 8). Freeman’s first season at Notre Dame might be a rocky one (remember Smart was 8-5). There might be some ugly, inexplicable losses due to in game miscues. But just like Smart, BMF will be learning on the job his first season. Like Georgia, the Notre Dame administration and fans will need to be patient with BMF. He has proven himself to be a quality recruiter and like Smart did at Georgia, he will take his recruiting classes to the next level. Just look at early results for 2023’s class. BMF might not reach the heights of Smart’s classes rankings, but he won’t hit the depths of Kelly’s either. Notre Dame is upgrading its Jimmies and Joes and that’s exactly what’s needed for BMF’s W-L and CFP championship game appearances to rival Smart’s.

This is the right path. Rasputin will be patient.


EDIT - What The Font?

Great post, but for love of god, this is not Seinfeld!

 

[Rasputin]

Great post, but for love of god, this is not Seinfeld!

Rasputin's tent has space for all styles and affectations.

 

[DCDomer]

Too funny. This ND was bad. The teams we beat were awful. But losing a bowl game is on the brand new HC... right...

 

[Rogue219]

Very first game as a head coach against a solid Oklahoma State team, and this is the thread that will continue forward, with the very first comment talking about his first game choke job.

Sheesh...

It could have been a post in the game thread itself expressing disappointment and frustration, but what fun is that when you can start an entirely new thread?

 

[chicago51]

It may sound cliche but you often find out more about people after they fail than when they are successful. After failure some people get back to work, some people go on vacation and play golf for 3 months .

 

[Grahambo]

No need to revisit the hire just yet. He deserves a couple of years to figure out how to get ND to the next level. Of course the game ended up a disappointment but just as you shouldn’t overreact to a win, you shouldn’t overreact to the loss.

The game was a great indicator into the problem that has plagued ND the last 4-5 years: quality depth. We couldn’t overcome the loss of one Kyle Hamilton. Let MF bring in a couple of Hamilton’s then we can revisit the hire.

 

[MacIrish75]

It’s been posted, but MFs first game is in September at The Shoe. This was an exhibition, and while we lost, I’m glad he got his first game experience in this game as opposed to next year.

I would rather see him on the sideline gaining experience and coaching his team than in the booth on ESPN claiming that Bostonians do not have an accent.

 

[Rogue219]

No need to revisit the hire just yet. He deserves a couple of years to figure out how to get ND to the next level. Of course the game ended up a disappointment but just as you shouldn’t overreact to a win, you shouldn’t overreact to the loss.

The game was a great indicator into the problem that has plagued ND the last 4-5 years: quality depth. We couldn’t overcome the loss of one Kyle Hamilton. Let MF bring in a couple of Hamilton’s then we can revisit the hire.

The fact we even have to say we shouldn't be revisiting a hire after only 60 minutes of a bowl game having been played really indicates to me we're living in stupid times.

 

[chicago51]

I think with BK we probably don’t blow a 28-7 lead . But I think with BK we don’t get out to a 28-7. Freeman’s competitive fast tempo practices with a lot 1st team vs 1st team reps was a very very big positive. ND should continue to bowl prep this way going forward. I was really encourage when I heard about how Freeman changed practice.

Freeman does have to do a better job in game. Has to do a better job of ensuring the offense and defense are playing complementary football . He’s always going to be a bit more involved with the defenses, as he should. But this game felt like Tommy Rees was head coach of the offense, and Freeman was head coach of the defense, yet Freeman was ssstill less involved with the defense at the same time. I don’t think the offense and defensive game plan complemented each other very well. I don’t mind offense going some tempo but it seemed like it may have not been the best plan for this game when you consider the lack of depth, primarily with the secondary. Our offense going fast along with OkSt offense going fast gassed the defense out.

 

[chicago51]

The fact we even have to say we shouldn't be revisiting a hire after only 60 minutes of a bowl game having been played really indicates to me we're living in stupid times.

Irish Lion said it best a while ago, that we should be waiting 3 plays into the Ohio State game, and I agree. This was too soon fellows.

 

[ab2cmiller]

I think with BK we probably don’t blow a 28-7 lead . But I think with BK we don’t get out to a 28-7. Freeman’s competitive fast tempo practices with a lot 1st team vs 1st team reps was a very very big positive. ND should continue to bowl prep this way going forward. I was really encourage when I heard about how Freeman changed practice.

Freeman does have to do a better job in game. Has to do a better job of ensuring the offense and defense are playing complementary football . He’s always going to be a bit more involved with the defenses, as he should. But this game felt like Tommy Rees was head coach of the offense, and Freeman was head coach of the defense, yet Freeman was ssstill less involved with the defense at the same time. I don’t think the offense and defensive game plan complemented each other very well. I don’t mind offense going some tempo but it seemed like it may have not been the best plan for this game when you consider the lack of depth, primarily with the secondary. Our offense going fast along with OkSt offense going fast gassed the defense out.

Bingo

 

[Rogue219]

I would have loved to have seen them win the Fiesta Bowl. They did not. That being said, I don't know that I am going to be so reactionary to the negative result as it pertains to Marcus Freeman the head coach. It's a sixty minute sample size. Had they pulled it out and won the game, I don't think I would be sitting here now predicting a win in Columbus in 240 days either. Fan is short for fanatic. I think the reaction to the result and the history of the program going back nearly 30 years in these January games has a lot to do with the reaction this week.

A win would have made for a fantastic offseason, but it doesn't erase the fact that they still need to hire a full coaching staff and finish out the recruiting class in a month (if they can add anyone) then get to work on coaching up what they have to be ready for September.

 

[BobbyMac]

We know what playing not to lose with RKG's gets ya.

Lets see what happens when we run 11 Jimmy's & 11 Joe's out there in 2023 & '24

 

[ACamp1900]

No need to revisit the hire just yet. He deserves a couple of years to figure out how to get ND to the next level. Of course the game ended up a disappointment but just as you shouldn’t overreact to a win, you shouldn’t overreact to the loss.

The game was a great indicator into the problem that has plagued ND the last 4-5 years: quality depth. We couldn’t overcome the loss of one Kyle Hamilton. Let MF bring in a couple of Hamilton’s then we can revisit the hire.

Yup,... but it's the offseason... this shit is what we do...

 

[GATTACA!]

The fact we even have to say we shouldn't be revisiting a hire after only 60 minutes of a bowl game having been played really indicates to me we're living in stupid times.

Excuse me, but I created this thread one drive into the 3rd quarter.

 

[GATTACA!]

We know what playing not to lose with RKG's gets ya.

Lets see what happens when we run 11 Jimmy's & 11 Joe's out there in 2023 & '24

Ignore the fact that we already seriously outgunned OSU by every recruiting metric heading into the game.

 

[NDRock]

Ignore the fact that we already seriously outgunned OSU by every recruiting metric heading into the game.

True. The only counter I'll make is OSU's talent is much closer to ours than we are to a team like Bama or Georgia. So much of college football comes down to the "difference makers". Those elite guys who can win you ballgames by making big time plays. We have a lot of nice players but very few elite players. That's what Freeman is trying to bring in. We'll see if it works.

 

[Free Manera]

Ignore the fact that we already seriously outgunned OSU by every recruiting metric heading into the game.

ND has done such a piss poor job of recruiting WRs, CBs, and Safeties that it doesn't matter. It's hard to build a complete roster with no weak link, and no one really does it besides Bama and sometimes OSU. However what ND has at those positions is not a weak link, it is a pit of despair. Can't beat a legit team like that.

 

[Grahambo]

Yup,... but it's the offseason... this shit is what we do...

Hell yeah! All we need now are some good “Buzz Buzz” posts.

 

[BobbyMac]

Ignore the fact that we already seriously outgunned OSU by every recruiting metric heading into the game.

Not ignoring anything. Just wait until the APR goes from 90-91 to 94+.

Now if that translates into a Natty... we'll see? I mean Calipari's only won it once with his Jimmy & Joe approach. But I'm sure everyone here will trade ONE natty for 5+ years of losing to a less talented team on paper in the CFP's. Amarite?

 

[Irish4life]

The Marcus Freeman hire wasn't about winning the Fiesta Bowl, or the 2022 season. It's about 2023 and beyond. He took some lumps against Oklahoma State, and he's going to take more lumps in 2022. He and ND will both be better off for it.

 

[IrishBoognish]

The Marcus Freeman hire wasn't about winning the Fiesta Bowl, or the 2022 season. It's about 2023 and beyond. He took some lumps against Oklahoma State, and he's going to take more lumps in 2022. He and ND will both be better off for it.

Exactly this.

We lost because MF made some critical mistakes. Critical rookie mistakes like not pushing at the end of the 2nd for another 3, not telling Elston to cool it with the blitzes that weren't working and gassing the LBs, and not suggesting to Tommy that we needed TB in there for a drive or 2 to slow things down and keep the clock running with some semblance of a ground attack.

I'm sure he learned from this. As another poster wisely said, there is no way BK drops a 28-7 lead to lose the game... but there is also no way BK has the team so jacked to pull out to a 28-7 lead to begin with.

I, for one, am no less pumped about the future.

 

[BobbyMac]

BK had reached his peak. He'd beat teams he should not by enough and emphatically lose to teams he should... under the lights, in primetime.

That's fine and dandy but I'd rather lose to a 12-2 inferior team every couple of years and have the roster to compete... and beat Bama, Clemson & OSU in Dec/Jan. That only can happen with Jimmy, Joe & Marcus

 

[Irish4life]

Exactly this.

We lost because MF made some critical mistakes. Critical rookie mistakes like not pushing at the end of the 2nd for another 3, not telling Elston to cool it with the blitzes that weren't working and gassing the LBs, and not suggesting to Tommy that we needed TB in there for a drive or 2 to slow things down and keep the clock running with some semblance of a ground attack.

I'm sure he learned from this. As another poster wisely said, there is no way BK drops a 28-7 lead to lose the game... but there is also no way BK has the team so jacked to pull out to a 28-7 lead to begin with.

I, for one, am no less pumped about the future.

.

I am pretty confident that we lose the game 31-13 with BK coaching. In any case, we saw that Tommy is willing and able to open the offense up and be aggressive, and we now know we need help at DB and an outside hire at DC.

 

[ulukinatme]

Excuse me, but I created this thread one drive into the 3rd quarter.

Pfft, you're still riding my coattails! I started the "We tackle like shit, so Freeman must quit" thread after FSU!