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Whoa, for a minute I thought IE had redirected me to another site.
Whoa, for a minute I thought IE had redirected me to another site.
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Bogtrotter07
Guest
I am biased against the kind of individuals who have no empathy for others and are willing to throw their weight around to get what they want, regardless of the cost and consequences. And as the public discourse begins to favor that perspective I become indignant.
The funny thing about the kind of person I am "prejudice" against; once they get caught and are held accountable, they go through every lying excuse to get out of responsibility for their actions, and end up crying like babies. I have even seen them fake or commit suicide to get out of responsibility for their own actions.
Now I don't know if Winston is one of these kind of people for sure, but I am upset that he hasn't had his day in court yet. What I am really upset is the institutional support for these kind of people, or some individuals that may be these kind of people, based upon commerce and manipulation.
Now might be a good time for an introduction in dialectic thinking. Let is get past Greek philosophy, and all technical and correct definitions. So we don't have a technical discussion on dialectic thought.
Let us just exercise our internal conversation holding that opposites can be true. If it is yes, it can be no. If I did well, I could also do better. If we do this and train, we start to see the world in more varying shades, more than just black and white. But the interesting thing is, as we see more shades, we see more complex patterns, and our brain works harder and trains itself to make more distinction, to be more discriminating. Then our thought becomes more complex and discriminating.
Finally, a really funny thing happens. Things simplify. We talk about the analogous equivalent in college football all the time. The game is fast for freshman, and then it slows down. The same thing happens when you train your mind to think, observe, and question. Choices become more simple. Life becomes more easily stated.
For example a group of us, parents were discussing predictors for our child's success. We weren't talking about income or career. We were talking about happiness, good citizenship, and self actualization. We were talking about the ability to thrive.
We all looked at each other first with shock, and then we chuckled, when we realized that what we were all saying was, "the best predictor of our child's success is their ability to love effectively. Think about that for a minute.
Why do I bring that up? Now go back and look at this thread. Apply the concept of love of others and self to what you read. Both about Winston, the victim, authorities and even the posters. Kind of gives a bit of a different perspective, doesn't it?
The funny thing about the kind of person I am "prejudice" against; once they get caught and are held accountable, they go through every lying excuse to get out of responsibility for their actions, and end up crying like babies. I have even seen them fake or commit suicide to get out of responsibility for their own actions.
Now I don't know if Winston is one of these kind of people for sure, but I am upset that he hasn't had his day in court yet. What I am really upset is the institutional support for these kind of people, or some individuals that may be these kind of people, based upon commerce and manipulation.
Now might be a good time for an introduction in dialectic thinking. Let is get past Greek philosophy, and all technical and correct definitions. So we don't have a technical discussion on dialectic thought.
Let us just exercise our internal conversation holding that opposites can be true. If it is yes, it can be no. If I did well, I could also do better. If we do this and train, we start to see the world in more varying shades, more than just black and white. But the interesting thing is, as we see more shades, we see more complex patterns, and our brain works harder and trains itself to make more distinction, to be more discriminating. Then our thought becomes more complex and discriminating.
Finally, a really funny thing happens. Things simplify. We talk about the analogous equivalent in college football all the time. The game is fast for freshman, and then it slows down. The same thing happens when you train your mind to think, observe, and question. Choices become more simple. Life becomes more easily stated.
For example a group of us, parents were discussing predictors for our child's success. We weren't talking about income or career. We were talking about happiness, good citizenship, and self actualization. We were talking about the ability to thrive.
We all looked at each other first with shock, and then we chuckled, when we realized that what we were all saying was, "the best predictor of our child's success is their ability to love effectively. Think about that for a minute.
Why do I bring that up? Now go back and look at this thread. Apply the concept of love of others and self to what you read. Both about Winston, the victim, authorities and even the posters. Kind of gives a bit of a different perspective, doesn't it?
ResLife Hero
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<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" lang="en"><p>FSU panel clears Seminoles CB of wrongdoing related to incident investigated in Winston sexual-assault case: <a href="http://t.co/bTSzEgYr0L">http://t.co/bTSzEgYr0L</a></p>— CollegeFootball 24/7 (@NFL_CFB) <a href="https://twitter.com/NFL_CFB/statuses/474309546861551616">June 4, 2014</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>
Darby got cleared.
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>
Darby got cleared.
ab2cmiller
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LOL ... Did they really have a choice .... how would've it looked if you punish the other two but you don't punish Winston. There would've been all kinds of gnashing of teeth.
I had to share this with you guys. This is how delusional some Seminole posters are. They truly believe this shit.
Thread title is if you were starting a NFL team tomorrow who would you rather have Brady or Winston
Brady ainy shit without Gronk, Hernandez, Welker, Moss etc - he needs elite weapons and a HOF coach. JW is still elite even with average to below average weapons and a coach who was losing to NC st. prior to his arrival. JW turned a fat lazy underachiever in Benjamin into a first rd pick, made 135 lb Greene into a 1,000 yd WR, and tripled our TE's production. JW made an underachieving coach into a champion.
JW>Brady, all Brady has on JW is age
another post by same guy
Brady hasn't won shit in years (since he had a defense / kicker to win games for him.) Meanwhile just this past season JW carried his team to a title in his first year, the same team that couldn't even beat NC State the year prior.
Brady's numbers last year sure didn't look like doing more with less, looked like the old man couldn't cut it without two pro bowl TE's. JW would have been the #1 pick this year if eligible and he would've put up better numbers than Brady this upcoming year.
Again, JW > Brady
Newblood in for another one of his terrible posts
Jameis Winston or Tom Brady.
Jameis, by a long shit IMO. He is clearly better than Tom at this point.
They honestly worship this kid like he is the second coming.
Thread title is if you were starting a NFL team tomorrow who would you rather have Brady or Winston
Brady ainy shit without Gronk, Hernandez, Welker, Moss etc - he needs elite weapons and a HOF coach. JW is still elite even with average to below average weapons and a coach who was losing to NC st. prior to his arrival. JW turned a fat lazy underachiever in Benjamin into a first rd pick, made 135 lb Greene into a 1,000 yd WR, and tripled our TE's production. JW made an underachieving coach into a champion.
JW>Brady, all Brady has on JW is age
another post by same guy
Brady hasn't won shit in years (since he had a defense / kicker to win games for him.) Meanwhile just this past season JW carried his team to a title in his first year, the same team that couldn't even beat NC State the year prior.
Brady's numbers last year sure didn't look like doing more with less, looked like the old man couldn't cut it without two pro bowl TE's. JW would have been the #1 pick this year if eligible and he would've put up better numbers than Brady this upcoming year.
Again, JW > Brady
Newblood in for another one of his terrible posts
Jameis Winston or Tom Brady.
Jameis, by a long shit IMO. He is clearly better than Tom at this point.
They honestly worship this kid like he is the second coming.
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That is one of the more delusional fan responses i've seen ever.
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Bogtrotter07
Guest
Mind blowing.
Huntr
24 Karat Shamrock
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You guys really don't understand what it's like living here. There is not much of a sense of perspective and only by very few ppl regarding fsu football. Almost the entire fan base is that delusional. Not everyone, but the vast majority.
returnofthemack
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I think the only team loaded with more 5-star talent from top to bottom is Alabama. Yeah, Fisher is an underachiever, and I don't think he's an elite coach, but it's not like Winston dragged some scrub team to the National Championship.
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Bogtrotter07
Guest
I think some of us understand pretty well! Our condolences. But maybe that is why we are reading your Seminole opine from elsewhere in the nation.
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Bogtrotter07
Guest
Sometimes.
Huntr
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Hah, no shit.
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Bogtrotter07
Guest
I like that. You have a way with words. I am surprised you cannot redeem some of the FSU faithful.
Huntr
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Too many syllables.
NDWorld247
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The comments GB posted from FSU fans are delusional, but I don't disagree with JW over TFB if you're starting a franchise from scratch tomorrow, and this is coming from a HUGE TFB fan. The greatest QB to ever play the game only has 3-4 years left and his skills will decline. Winston is as safe a pick to be a franchise QB as they come (ala Andrew Luck). It's really not a hard decision.
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Bogtrotter07
Guest
Even if - you - slow - them - down - ?
How can u even possibly say he is an underachiever? I mean come on man he just won a freaking NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIP.
returnofthemack
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They played the most scrub schedule I've seen a National Championship team face. Clemson was the only good team they faced all season, and they let BC put up 34 points! Now in their other games, they thoroughly destroyed the competition, but that comes with having a special (in more ways than one) QB. Look at Chizik with Auburn - they put up crazy points, and then were terrible after Cam left. FSU has ridiculous talent, usually faces a pretty easy schedule that lets them coast to at least 10 wins, and they usually drop some ridiculous game. We'll see what happens after Jameis leaves, but I'm not that impressed. He's not a coach I would trade BK for.
Huntr
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Couple of weekends ago, we're eating breakfast at Cracker Barrel, I'm wearing an Irish shirt. Guy comes up to me and says, "I'd like to welcome you to Tallahassee, home of the National Champion Seminoles. har, har, har." and slaps me on the back.
I said, "Actually, we've lived here for about 9 years and the thing I've noticed in that time is that it's a good thing you guys are good at football. Because if you weren't, that school would be pretty much worthless, wouldn't it?"
He didn't seem to like that...
Got it. But underachiever? No
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Bogtrotter07
Guest
Awesome, dude! See he got all them syllables! REPS, mad reps!
returnofthemack
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That's true, I suppose. There's not much more you can achieve haha
I stopped reading after you said that Brady is the best QB to EVER play the game.
No way he is in the same stratosphere as Montana, and not simply because he went to ND or was the SF QB.
Name one HOF QB that Brady beat in the Super Bowl. Zero. (2-0 vs Elway and Marino, 93-24, btw)
How many NFL MVPs has Brady beaten in the Super Bowl? Zero. (Ken Anderson and Boomer Esiaison)
Name one GW TD drive in the Super Bowl. Zero.
Name one Super Bowl game Brady won by more than 3 points. Zero.
Joe on the other hand, has more SB wins, more SB MVPs, led one of the most iconic Super Bowl TD drives ever, and the list goes on and on.
Brady will never match what Joe did. Even Brady is not that delusional to think he is on the same planet at Joe. Joe also happened to win BOTH the NFL MVP and the NFL Comeback Player of the Year in his career, which is pretty darn remarkable to think he came back after the hit Jim Burt put on him.
Let us also not forget that he Niners were 2-14 his first year as a starter, while the Pats were just two years removed from a Super Bowl appearance under Parcells, so it is not like Brady had to help turn a franchise around from NFL laughingstock to NFL powerhouse. Parcells had already done a lot of the heavy lifting by the time Brady came to Foxboro.
And sure, Rice was his best WR, but his first two SBs were without Jerry Rice. Instead he passed the ball to guys like Renaldo Nehemiah, Mike Wilson, Freddie Solomon and Dwight Clark. So outside of Clark, there was not a legit WR threat...and still he won just as many SBs without Rice as he did with him.
HOFer, yes. Greatest EVER?
Not. Even. Close.
No way he is in the same stratosphere as Montana, and not simply because he went to ND or was the SF QB.
Name one HOF QB that Brady beat in the Super Bowl. Zero. (2-0 vs Elway and Marino, 93-24, btw)
How many NFL MVPs has Brady beaten in the Super Bowl? Zero. (Ken Anderson and Boomer Esiaison)
Name one GW TD drive in the Super Bowl. Zero.
Name one Super Bowl game Brady won by more than 3 points. Zero.
Joe on the other hand, has more SB wins, more SB MVPs, led one of the most iconic Super Bowl TD drives ever, and the list goes on and on.
Brady will never match what Joe did. Even Brady is not that delusional to think he is on the same planet at Joe. Joe also happened to win BOTH the NFL MVP and the NFL Comeback Player of the Year in his career, which is pretty darn remarkable to think he came back after the hit Jim Burt put on him.
Let us also not forget that he Niners were 2-14 his first year as a starter, while the Pats were just two years removed from a Super Bowl appearance under Parcells, so it is not like Brady had to help turn a franchise around from NFL laughingstock to NFL powerhouse. Parcells had already done a lot of the heavy lifting by the time Brady came to Foxboro.
And sure, Rice was his best WR, but his first two SBs were without Jerry Rice. Instead he passed the ball to guys like Renaldo Nehemiah, Mike Wilson, Freddie Solomon and Dwight Clark. So outside of Clark, there was not a legit WR threat...and still he won just as many SBs without Rice as he did with him.
HOFer, yes. Greatest EVER?
Not. Even. Close.
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Irish Insanity
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Here at IE we often drink more than our fair share of green Kool-Aid. This dude skipped the Kool-Aid and went straight for the liquor cabinet. Put the bottle down and step away from the keyboard.
Top 3??
LOL, NO.
Pretty much, Johnny U, Joe Montana, and then everyone else.
Hell, there are number of QBs that I would say that are equal to or surpass Brady, but he is not remotely close to Joe or Johnny U. Those two absolutely stand above every other QB that has come before or since.
Seriously, outside of a four year window, which is frankly severely tainted by the Spygate scandal which honestly calls into question EVERY SB victory the Pats achieved, there is literally nothing Brady has done that comes close to what even Elway or Marino did, especially Elway.
Literally, the Mount Rushmore or QBs is Joe, Johnny U, Elway and Marino/Favre....because none of their achievements were ever suspect or shady (and neither were their coaches).
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