Post Game Observations (BYU)...

[ThePiombino]

Kelly says KeiVarae Russell is one of those "gentleman" who needed to learn to play tougher.— Dan Murphy (@BGI_DanMurphy) November 24, 2013

Dont get this. Russell has laid some of the biggest hits I can recall from the secondary this season.

 

[Irish2155]

I think you might need to scale back the intensity level a bit and approach Notre Dame football with a more logical outlook. I've found it to be much less stressful this way (and my life's been much more enjoyable this year actually, even moreso than last year).

yeah right, ok.

 

[Ironman8]

Dont get this. Russell has laid some of the biggest hits I can recall from the secondary this season.

Don't know if that is saying much, unfortunately haha.

 

[ThePiombino]

Don't know if that is saying much, unfortunately haha.

LMAO good call. I guess any contact could be considered pretty devastating when compared to say, oh I dunno, a Farley tackle?

 

[IrishJayhawk]

yeah right, ok.

I often disagree with Dillon. Not this time. We've had a pretty darn good year, given that we're using our backup QB and have sustained as many defensive injuries as I can ever recall on a team I follow.

 

[irishog77]

I often disagree with Dillon. Not this time. We've had a pretty darn good year, given that we're using our backup QB and have sustained as many defensive injuries as I can ever recall on a team I follow.

Yeah, but at the beginning of the year, the team didn't have all those injuries. To have the expectation, at the onset of the season, that this team (even with Rees) could/should reach a BCS bowl is not setting the bar too high, nor unrealistic, in my opinion.

I think Brian Kelly himself has the expectation of them reaching that level year in and year out.

 

[Irish Insanity]

Year in and year out, our expectations should not change.

You sir, are correct.

I think you might need to scale back the intensity level a bit and approach Notre Dame football with a more logical outlook. I've found it to be much less stressful this way (and my life's been much more enjoyable this year actually, even moreso than last year).

We as fans should have similar expectations as the players do. I doubt you can find a player who ever expects mediocrity. If you do, you'll meet an unsuccessful one. Expect mediocrity and thats what you'll always get. I'd rather expect a BCS bowl yearly, and be disappointed if they don't make it.

 

[kmoose]

yeah right, ok.

You should listen to him. He wasn't condescending to you about it. And he's absolutely right. Saying that our expectations should not change from year to year is to simply ignore reality. This isn't 1950, or 1960, or even 1990 anymore. Parity is WAY more prevalent than it used to be.

 

[Irish Insanity]

What the hell do you guys tell your kids. Temper your expectations in certain situations as do not be disappointed. Don't worry about success or goals in life. Just be happy in a trailer and working at the local gas station.

 

[DillonHall]

What the hell do you guys tell your kids. Temper your expectations in certain situations as do not be disappointed. Don't worry about success or goals in life. Just be happy in a trailer and working at the local gas station.

You try your hardest but if you fail, it's not the end of the world.

 

[Irish2155]

You should listen to him. He wasn't condescending to you about it. And he's absolutely right. Saying that our expectations should not change from year to year is to simply ignore reality. This isn't 1950, or 1960, or even 1990 anymore. Parity is WAY more prevalent than it used to be.

I kind of get, sort of...being generous.

BCS Bowl is our goal/expectations every year. 1950, 60. 70, yada...huh?

 

[Irish Insanity]

You try your hardest but if you fail, it's not the end of the world.

Ex-fucking-zactly. So our expectations at the beginning of every year should never change. But if the end result isn't exactly as we expected form the beginning, its not the end of the world.

 

[koonja]

What the hell do you guys tell your kids. Temper your expectations in certain situations as do not be disappointed. Don't worry about success or goals in life. Just be happy in a trailer and working at the local gas station.

I love you and agree with you for the most part, but this year is really A-typical IMO because yeah, maybe Gunner transferring was foreseeable, but that coupled with Golson getting the boot a month later was way too much to overcome at such an impact position.

After this year, Kelly will have Golson with 2 years, Malik for 4 years, Kizer for 5 years, hopefully Barnett for 6...

There's no permissible excuse for not being in the BCS discussion every year from 2014 on. And I think that with Golson or Keil we're a 1 loss team at best right now.

If our recruiting continues to be successful and we don't win 10+ from 2014 on out, I'd call it disappointing, but this year we're not sitting too bad considering we got absolutely screwed at QB.

And I'm not BK apologist, either. I think he's a top 10 coach, but I disagree with how slow he was to work Folston in, disagree with still playing Farley, disagree with his play calling on 3rd and short in 'no mans land' (30-40 yard line of opponents) all year long, etc. But we'd be a 10+ win team with Golson IMO, and it's not his fault Keil/Golson aren't here.

 

[Irish2155]

I love you and agree with you for the most part, but this year is really A-typical IMO because yeah, maybe Gunner transferring was foreseeable, but that coupled with Golson getting the boot a month later was way too much to overcome at such an impact position.

After this year, Kelly will have Golson with 2 years, Malik for 4 years, Kizer for 5 years, hopefully Barnett for 6...

There's no permissible excuse for not being in the BCS discussion every year from 2014 on. And I think that with Golson or Keil we're a 1 loss team at best right now.

If our recruiting continues to be successful and we don't win 10+ from 2014 on out, I'd call it disappointing, but this year we're not sitting too bad considering we got absolutely screwed at QB.

Golson maybe Keil no. Tommy '13 is better than Keil '13.

Either way I think this team has a loss, maybe two. Rees with three to this date isn't that bad...not good, but ok.

 

[koonja]

Golson maybe Keil no. Tommy '13 is better than Keil '13.

Eh, IDK. We'll never know for sure, but I think if Keil stayed in the system through the spring he would have been better. He could run like a deer, and there's 5-6 passes a game that a guy like Keil can make that Rees cannot.

 

[tommyIRISH23]

I love you and agree with you for the most part, but this year is really A-typical IMO because yeah, maybe Gunner transferring was foreseeable, but that coupled with Golson getting the boot a month later was way too much to overcome at such an impact position.

After this year, Kelly will have Golson with 2 years, Malik for 4 years, Kizer for 5 years, hopefully Barnett for 6...

There's no permissible excuse for not being in the BCS discussion every year from 2014 on. And I think that with Golson or Keil we're a 1 loss team at best right now.

If our recruiting continues to be successful and we don't win 10+ from 2014 on out, I'd call it disappointing, but this year we're not sitting too bad considering we got absolutely screwed at QB.

Reps. I agree. We got screwed in the QB position and that really hurt us along with the injuries. But I will say this; I am more than pleased with our young guys getting serious reps because of the injuries. That will pay off big next season and beyond.

9-3/8-4 isn't bad considering all that went down. With Golson we're 11-0/10-1 right now. Oh well...its life

 

[DillonHall]

Ex-fucking-zactly. So our expectations at the beginning of every year should never change. But if the end result isn't exactly as we expected form the beginning, its not the end of the world.

Sorry to burst your bubble, but your analogy doesn't fit the situation.

In your child situation, "expectations" should be level of "effort" (100%) not the actual "result" (level of success). By applying this analogy to ND football, our only expectation should be that the team plays hard all the time. The record itself doesn't have a place in your comparison (at least in terms of my response to your initial question).

If you're saying that the expectation should solely be that the team tries its hardest every game, then I guess it makes sense (but I don't think that's your point).

 

[Irish2155]

Eh, IDK. We'll never know for sure, but I think if Keil stayed in the system through the spring he would have been better. He could run like a deer, and there's 5-6 passes a game that a guy like Keil can make that Rees cannot.

I don't think so but that's your opinion.

Tommy would be our QB regardless of Keil. And he does not run like a deer. Blake Barnett runs like a "deer"

 

[PJWhitfield]

Maybe that's runs like a Deere.

 

[koonja]

I don't think so but that's your opinion.

Tommy would be our QB regardless of Keil. And he does not run like a deer. Blake Barnett runs like a "deer"

Maybe that's runs like a Deere.

Yeah, deer was a poor choice of word. Barnett is definitely faster, but I'd argue keils running style is still about as effective. Much more of a power runner IMO like Blake bell.

And I edited my op to include paragraph at bottom.

 

[Irish Insanity]

Sorry to burst your bubble, but your analogy doesn't fit the situation.

In your child situation, "expectations" should be level of "effort" (100%) not the actual "result" (level of success). By applying this analogy to ND football, our only expectation should be that the team plays hard all the time. The record itself doesn't have a place in your comparison (at least in terms of my response to your initial question).

If you're saying that the expectation should solely be that the team tries its hardest every game, then I guess it makes sense (but I don't think that's your point).

No, my point was with my children I expect success not just effort. With this team, I expect success, not just effort. If my children aren't as successful in a situation as either of us expected, then its ok to be disappointed but its not the end of the world. Same for the team.

 

[DillonHall]

No, my point was with my children I expect success not just effort. With this team, I expect success, not just effort. If my children aren't as successful in a situation as either of us expected, then its ok to be disappointed but its not the end of the world. Same for the team.

Exactly, they're two different situations, so I'm not sure why you brought up the analogy.

Please refer to other posters (like kmoose) who've already explained why your theory of rigid expectations is illogical. I think they've done a great job, and I don't need to waste more space repeating their posts.

 

[Irish2155]

Yeah, deer was a poor choice of word. Barnett is definitely faster, but I'd argue keils running style is still about as effective. Much more of a power runner IMO like Blake bell.

And I edited my op to include paragraph at bottom.

Blake Bell? OU QB? He's a bulldozer.

 

[IrishJayhawk]

What the hell do you guys tell your kids. Temper your expectations in certain situations as do not be disappointed. Don't worry about success or goals in life. Just be happy in a trailer and working at the local gas station.

Pretty enormous strawman here. Our expectations can influence our children. Our expectations have absolutely nothing to do with the Notre Dame product on the field.

 

[TheTurningPoint]

Gunner was comparable to where Hendrix is now, but with more of an upside.Which is expected for a typical sophmore with no experience. If all went as planned he would have been 3rd on the depth chart behind Rees. Now, from what I gathered prior to Golson leaving...if Golson got hurt short term, Rees was the guy...long term, Hendrix was the guy.

But that obviously changed when there is no timetable on a return at QB and you have time to put in a offense suited for Rees. Im not Rees biggest fan by anymeans and he is frustrating to watch sometimes. But I got to give props to the staff for putting themselves in a position to win each week with the hand they have been dealt. They could have done somethings better, but Folston had been hurt in training camp and didnt get the reps needed to get PT, so they had to work him in. I think they could have done a better job at getting Redfield in this year, but I know why they didnt. ND is pretty young on defense and trying to work 1 freshman in at a key role was tough enough, but working 2 freshman in at key roles would have been hard. Getting Rochell in the is a little different than getting Redfield in. Redfield (as been explained multiple times) does have to make calls in the secondary to the CBs. And having Jaylon not knowing what he is 110% doing along with a first time starter at MLB in Grace...there would have been massive breakdowns. I get the arugement that experience helps with that, but I have feeling that next years defense will be a little bit different in terms of what they do. They will have a chance for some of these freshman freaks to get work in spring ball and will have time prepare for the season over 9 months, and not 3months. They can turn Jaylon loose and not play to help him and if Grace can comeback healthy....I think the defense will be more than able to play at a BCS level.

Jarron needs to show that he can play that way vs good teams. If he plays well vs Stanford then that will go a long way in proving that. But he struggled greatly vs Pitt.

Its just been good to see Butler and Luke on the field and not giving up plays and doing their job. Joe Schmidt bc he worked his tail off and earned the PT. Hardy finally get healthy and show that he can be the safety ND has been missing for awhile. Future is bright and the 2014 class is finally going to give ND depth at positions that it has been lacking probably since Willingham.

I know I have said this a lot, but Kellys building a program. He is probably 1 year behind schedule of where he would like to be, and to be 100% honest if Vanderdoes had shown up, he would probably be schedule. I mean he got ND to the National Title game last year with a redshirt freshman qb, true freshman at CB that never played cb, a redshirt freshman safety that had never played safety, a first year starter at cb that got switched the year before, a run game that could only run to the left side....Things are in a good place with the entire program.

Doing the PTHF video this week, Nd had like 33 seniors...but ND really doesnt lose a lot of talent going forward. Fox/Carlo/Bennett are good players, but there are kids under them that will be ready to go next year. Nix/TJ/Rees are losses but with Golson coming back that helps with all 3 of those.


and BOOM BARNETT COMMITS as im typing this.

 

[N_D_Fighting_Irish]

Exactly, they're two different situations, so I'm not sure why you brought up the analogy.

Please refer to other posters (like kmoose) who've already explained why your theory of rigid expectations is illogical. I think they've done a great job, and I don't need to waste more space repeating their posts.

I don't know what you are arguing about. II simply stated he expects ND football to be successful every year. For ND football, it is a BCS game with a potential championship game..which Kelly himself has implied is the benchmark. Let's set aside the shaky analogy, what exactly do you disagree about? Not to expect much and then be happy if the team performs...dude that is a cynic's attitude.

 

[Bogtrotter07]

Not only are Twinkies back, they're going after new markets.




No truth to the rumor that The Administration is lobbying hard to get the golden treat renamed as "Obamies" and that a box of this essential food group will be sent to the address of record for everyone signing up for an Affordable Care Act Exchange in 2014.

(send your cheers or jeers to the Lep Lounge)

Also, no truth to the rumor BGIF is licking stamps and envelopes right now! He is busy with something else.

 

[palinurus]

Yeah, but at the beginning of the year, the team didn't have all those injuries. To have the expectation, at the onset of the season, that this team (even with Rees) could/should reach a BCS bowl is not setting the bar too high, nor unrealistic, in my opinion.

I think Brian Kelly himself has the expectation of them reaching that level year in and year out.

You sir, are correct.

We as fans should have similar expectations as the players do. I doubt you can find a player who ever expects mediocrity. If you do, you'll meet an unsuccessful one. Expect mediocrity and thats what you'll always get. I'd rather expect a BCS bowl yearly, and be disappointed if they don't make it.

I don't know what you are arguing about. II simply stated he expects ND football to be successful every year. For ND football, it is a BCS game with a potential championship game..which Kelly himself has implied is the benchmark. Let's set aside the shaky analogy, what exactly do you disagree about? Not to expect much and then be happy if the team performs...dude that is a cynic's attitude.

As a fan (and a coach for that matter), one can be generally happy with the direction of the program AND have high expectations for the program AND be dissatisfied when the team loses games they should win. So while I think Kelly is a very good coach, and I see a big difference in this team from the Weis years, and I love the team, it's still aggravating when they lose to Pitt or a crappy Michigan team, or even struggle with teams like Navy and Purdue. A "hey, relax, lay back and enjoy it even if we're the new Wisconsin" philosophy just doesn't do much for me. If any of you want to take that approach, it's fine with me. I don't think it makes you a bad fan or anything (although it seems like some guys take it personally when the team or coach or a player gets some fair criticism from fans who love them, and they feel like they need to scold the critics).

I mean, I'm sorry if anyone thinks it makes me and fans like me ungrateful or unreasonable or spoiled. I've been an Irish fan a long time, if not a visitor to IE, and I'm used to them being a great team and a great school, and having high standards and high expectations. I loved them in the Faust years, and in the Holtz years, and in the Weis years. And I love them now. But I'm not ever going to get used to the Motor City Little Caesar's Bowl, and I'm not going to be happy about it.

 

[IrishLion]

1. I was fortunate enough to be at the game. Sitting in section 17 right in the corner of the endzone. My goodness it was cold. Despite that, I was pleased with the atmosphere/people around me. Everyone stayed invested and cheered throughout, and I didn't get told to sit down at any point (I thought I would as everyone around me was sitting and huddled in blankets).

2. It's hard to judge yardage gained on each play when you're basically at field level, but I was able to see the wide-open holes the o-line was creating for the backs to get through. Folston and Cam were men, which has been discussed plenty. And I agree with Bogs, kind of began scratching my head after Folston was tackled for no gain on a stretch play for the fifth time in a row. GAIII looked like a grown man several times as well, running through tackles and churning the legs.

3. As Khuenja pointed out, Tommy missed two TDs by simply shorting the throws. He should've had a score to TJ, but it was well underthrown. I got realllllly frustrated on the INT in the endzone as well. You're throwing a jump ball to Niklas, so throw the thing to the clouds and let him jump over everyone. Don't try to put it in a window where a DB can undercut the throw. Other than that he played excellent, especially the TD to Davaris. Perfectly thrown football. Also, the 3rd down slant to Baby Admiral was a thing of beauty and super clutch.

4. Even with the red zone INT, this game never felt like it was in the balance to me. Maybe the cold weather just made me numb in every sense of the word, but I did not for one second believe that BYU was going to tie the game or take the lead late in the game. And usually I'm super paranoid throughout games. Even big leads don't feel safe to me. This one did. Maybe it was because, as BK said, they were playing NOTRE DAME FOOTBALL.

5. Someone pissed in everybody's cereal yesterday judging by the first few pages of this thread. The cereal in South Bend was normal and delicious.

 

[DillonHall]

I don't know what you are arguing about. II simply stated he expects ND football to be successful every year. For ND football, it is a BCS game with a potential championship game..which Kelly himself has implied is the benchmark. Let's set aside the shaky analogy, what exactly do you disagree about? Not to expect much and then be happy if the team performs...dude that is a cynic's attitude.

Apparently you haven't bothered to read any previous posts, so I'll summarize for you. Your expectation for each season should vary annually depending on the personnel on the team. You can't realistically expect a BCS caliber season every single year.