Recruitng Linebackers

[Old Man Mike]

I am not a huge fan [yet] of using D-Backs as speed OLBs [ a la Slaughter ], even though this has worked dramatically well for us, but we may see more of that next year as a "substitute" for the typical 3-4-4 if players like Councell, Spond, Shembo, Niklas, Moore, [two of them] can not adequately handle the DOG.

I have an itch that Kelly/Diaco may have dramatic plans for Slaughter beyond mere traditional safety play. Making the "wild assumption" that we solve our needs at corner without thinking of him helping out there [I think that he will NOT be employed there], then because we have Motta and an underrated [I believe] Collinsworth at safety [plus outstanding other prospects like Hardy, Badger, Baratti, Turner, Prosise] to figure in there, Jamoris might play a lot of speed/mystery back, a la WVUs 3-3-5 alignment.

I HOPE that our current [and new] linebackers become space-closing, pass-covering jets, but if two of them don't, Diaco may work the Magic elsewise.

 

[Whiskeyjack]

I am not a huge fan [yet] of using D-Backs as speed OLBs [ a la Slaughter ], even though this has worked dramatically well for us, but we may see more of that next year as a "substitute" for the typical 3-4-4 if players like Councell, Spond, Shembo, Niklas, Moore, [two of them] can not adequately handle the DOG.

Our defense performs quite well against both the pass and the option with Slaughter as the Nickelback; it's essentially move to a TCU-like 4-2-5. Our problem comes when teams start passing on us in our base 3-4-4, because our LBs are dreadful in coverage.

I have an itch that Kelly/Diaco may have dramatic plans for Slaughter beyond mere traditional safety play. Making the "wild assumption" that we solve our needs at corner without thinking of him helping out there [I think that he will NOT be employed there], then because we have Motta and an underrated [I believe] Collinsworth at safety [plus outstanding other prospects like Hardy, Badger, Baratti, Turner, Prosise] to figure in there, Jamoris might play a lot of speed/mystery back, a la WVUs 3-3-5 alignment.

Interesting idea, but I fear that we won't be able to do without Slaughter's exprience at FS. Motta doesn't have the athleticism, and Collinsworth lacks the experience for it. I'm guessing J. Atkinson is going to step in as our Nickelback.

I HOPE that our current [and new] linebackers become space-closing, pass-covering jets, but if two of them don't, Diaco may work the Magic elsewise.

Cat looks good; we've got talent, depth, and experience there between Shembo, Williams, and Niklas. Dog is scary though; we've got talent, but no depth or experience. If Dog continues to be a weakness in 2012, I expect you're right that Diaco will experiment more with a 4-2-5.

 

[jason_h537]

I am not a huge fan [yet] of using D-Backs as speed OLBs [ a la Slaughter ], even though this has worked dramatically well for us, but we may see more of that next year as a "substitute" for the typical 3-4-4 if players like Councell, Spond, Shembo, Niklas, Moore, [two of them] can not adequately handle the DOG.

I have an itch that Kelly/Diaco may have dramatic plans for Slaughter beyond mere traditional safety play. Making the "wild assumption" that we solve our needs at corner without thinking of him helping out there [I think that he will NOT be employed there], then because we have Motta and an underrated [I believe] Collinsworth at safety [plus outstanding other prospects like Hardy, Badger, Baratti, Turner, Prosise] to figure in there, Jamoris might play a lot of speed/mystery back, a la WVUs 3-3-5 alignment.

I HOPE that our current [and new] linebackers become space-closing, pass-covering jets, but if two of them don't, Diaco may work the Magic elsewise.

I would not put too much thought into Slaughter playing LB. One was against an option team where he is bigger than most of the team anyway, and they wanted experience on the field. The other was against a spread team to utilize his speed.

 

[Old Man Mike]

Jason: I understand what you're saying but I'm thinking of this more in a gear-to-the-opponent strategy than a every game same base, or even two alternative bases. To clarify: we will still have to play against options and also spreads. Jamoris seems to help greatly there. If we come against a traditional power team [ex MSU or BC, though these offenses are getting rarer; Pitt for instance is about to join the 21st century], then our less-speedy DOGs aren't as exposed and there is no need to shove Jamoris up there.

It is when we're going against some team that can "traditionally" run at you, but also get to the edges and flats rapidly etc [think USC] that we are in a conundrum. Diaco has to figure out how to juggle and disguise our looks without enough speed personnel or alternately a too-small player at DOG to handle that --- unless, as said, people like Ben Councell can develop to handle it.

I think that Diaco will have to mold the base array and the personnel game-by-game under such circumstances. Fortunately, we will have mostly experienced players, a mighty front line, and very intelligent guys to try to do that. And to a degree, they proved this season that they can rapidly learn new patterns and adjust.

 

[jason_h537]

Jason: I understand what you're saying but I'm thinking of this more in a gear-to-the-opponent strategy than a every game same base, or even two alternative bases. To clarify: we will still have to play against options and also spreads. Jamoris seems to help greatly there. If we come against a traditional power team [ex MSU or BC, though these offenses are getting rarer; Pitt for instance is about to join the 21st century], then our less-speedy DOGs aren't as exposed and there is no need to shove Jamoris up there.

It is when we're going against some team that can "traditionally" run at you, but also get to the edges and flats rapidly etc [think USC] that we are in a conundrum. Diaco has to figure out how to juggle and disguise our looks without enough speed personnel or alternately a too-small player at DOG to handle that --- unless, as said, people like Ben Councell can develop to handle it.

I think that Diaco will have to mold the base array and the personnel game-by-game under such circumstances. Fortunately, we will have mostly experienced players, a mighty front line, and very intelligent guys to try to do that. And to a degree, they proved this season that they can rapidly learn new patterns and adjust.

I think the key is, like you said, how players develop. Currently the staff has 3 Safeties they trust VS 1 OLB in Flemming. Granted ND should adjust to who they play but if say Ishaq and Councell develop like we all hope, I do not see them coming of the field as much

 

[Old Man Mike]

A note about linebackers: the most impressive team in the country year-by-year on pursuit to the ball has been Virginia Tech. Other teams are pretty darn good, but over ten or more years these guys are flying around the field. What are there linebackers like? I know that they run a 4-3, but there are still some thoughts to be had here.

Their middle backer is Big= Taylor at 243 lbs. Their defense shuttles runs to the middle in old style **** Butkus/ Tommy Nobis /Mike Singletary style, and he is stout enough to clean them up. He is the leading tackler. His replacement is 229.

Their sort-of equivalent to a Will is Edwards at 231. His replacements are 228 and 223. Their sort-of equivalent to a Dog weighs either 196, 205, or 189 [I'm not sure which starts]. It's pretty obvious to me that Beamer/Foster are going with speed and aggression, not massiveness.

As an aside, their DEs tend to weigh right at 250, though they occasionally play one at 214. It's a point for meditation at least.

 

[rtrn2glory]

the biggest equivalent to running to the ball deals with having speed on the field...if you get to the ball well as a defense that means you play/are fast. va tech has had solid defense over the years...idk if i'd call them the best at this, i enjoy watching bama and lsu play defense and what separates them is their individual abilities to tackle in space or in the open field. these are two areas i see our defense struggling in presently and something that must be addressed if we are going to be a BCS caliber defense imo