Recruiting Status '10

IrishAddiction

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haha sorry bearGB, i beat ya by an inch. I win!

And terry, that was pretty much just me disagreeing with the post, because i didnt catch your sarcasm font.
 
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IrishAddiction

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Kelly's Recruiting

Kelly's Recruiting

AND IF WE DONT WE CRUCIFY KELLY!!!!!!


okay, not really, but the man is recruiting like a fiend right now. him and his assistants. Go get em coach!
 
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I Dont Miss Charlie

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AND IF WE DONT WE CRUCIFY KELLY!!!!!!


okay, not really, but the man is recruiting like a fiend right now. him and his assistants. Go get em coach!

Oh you mean Coach Kelly winning recruiting battles against Stanford and Vanderbilt for 2 sub-100 ranked prospects at their position?

I'd prefer to wait until signing day to see how good he has done with selling kids on Notre Dame, but I dont see any difference in his progress so far than what Charlie & Corwin would've been doing so far.
 

NDinL.A.

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Oh you mean Coach Kelly winning recruiting battles against Stanford and Vanderbilt for 2 sub-100 ranked prospects at their position?

I'd prefer to wait until signing day to see how good he has done with selling kids on Notre Dame, but I dont see any difference in his progress so far than what Charlie & Corwin would've been doing so far.

See, you're lying. You won't wait until signing day, you've been all over him since he was even mentioned getting hired. When asked about who you would have rather hired that was better than Kelly, someone ND HAD A CHANCE OF GETTING, you clam up. You've hated this hire from the jump, and you've childishly changed your name at least 4 times since, all because ND didn't get Urban Liar or whatever fantasy candidate you foolishly thought we could land.

You talk about CW, who I loved but didn't get the job done. You sound like you wanted him back another year, which is preposterous in its own right, how in the hell do you expect Kelly to get the guys to commit in his month or so on the job that CW couldn't get despite recruiting them for over a year? Don't bring up CW if you can't answer that. And if CW had won, we wouldn't be where we are in the first place. This class would have fallen apart had we kept CW and told the world we accepted mediocrity. At least w/ Kelly, we have a proven winner who has kept us in the ball game on 3 major recruits: Henderson, Jones and Ferguson. We might not land any of those guys, but at least we're in the game. And anybody who knows a thing about recruiting knows there's no way, after ND's 3 years of losing and Kelly's limited time on the job, can you judge Kelly on this year's class. Next year, absolutely.

So let me ask you this: Kelly has been on the job barely more than a month. Now, what stud do you think he could have recruited who hasn't already committed or doesn't already have a long list of favorites that doesn't include ND? You obviously know more about recruiting than Kelly, so who would you like to see him go after? I already know you won't respond, because you never do, because you know you're just here to antagonize and act like a troll. If you truly believe that hate you spew, then answer the questions. And then go look up Urban Liar's first recruiting class at FL, Saban's at Bama, and Miles at LSU. Then talk to me about recruiting...
 

phork

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Not to help this thread jump the tracks, but seriously guys... Kelly has done more in a month than Weis did when he was hired. General rule of thumb is that you can just count on a subpar class after a coaching change. Frankly I think Kelly is killing it. He is holding most of it intact.

If you don't want to play at ND, then good luck somewhere else.

PS: You can start judging Kelly's classes after the 2011 signing day. Although this one is shaping up to be pretty damn decent.
 

FightingIrishLover7

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Not to help this thread jump the tracks, but seriously guys... Kelly has done more in a month than Weis did when he was hired. General rule of thumb is that you can just count on a subpar class after a coaching change. Frankly I think Kelly is killing it. He is holding most of it intact.

If you don't want to play at ND, then good luck somewhere else.

PS: You can start judging Kelly's classes after the 2011 signing day. Although this one is shaping up to be pretty damn decent.



I agree with 100% of what you just said... Some people expect miracles. Some people need to settle down.
 

fortwayne_nd

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Kelly has done more in a month...

Hell, he can still fit in last month's clothes. But back to football...ND has a relatively easier schedule next year than prior seasons. A winning record alone should help with recruiting. The "cupboard" isn't exactly bare (kudos to Chuck)...there is enough talent to be respectable in 2010. Not even Urban nor Saban won a NC first year at Florida or Bama.

People were willing to give Chuck another year or two but cut this guy off after a month, sheesh.
 

IrishInFl

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Hell, he can still fit in last month's clothes. But back to football...ND has a relatively easier schedule next year than prior seasons. A winning record alone should help with recruiting. The "cupboard" isn't exactly bare (kudos to Chuck)...there is enough talent to be respectable in 2010. Not even Urban nor Saban won a NC first year at Florida or Bama.

People were willing to give Chuck another year or two but cut this guy off after a month, sheesh.

Actually, he did.
 

fortwayne_nd

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Actually, he did.

I've been wrong before...many times.

Charlie had five years...I'm willing to give this guy a year, then off with his head!!! Just kidding, its only football. And after the last three years, I'm experiencing lowered expectations.
 

IrishJayhawk

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If you truly believe that hate you spew, then answer the questions. And then go look up Urban Liar's first recruiting class at FL, Saban's at Bama, and Miles at LSU. Then talk to me about recruiting...

This...this...a thousand times this!
 

Brown

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As a contributor here and long time reader, I always thought this forum was at its best when we welcome in all perspectives, ideas, and comments.

The worst thing that can happen to a forum is when people get into "cult-thinking" and start to alienate other fans that view the situation differently. Attack the argument the poster is making, not the poster him/herself. If you feel strongly about an opinion, spend the time to research it and debunk the posters theory. Don't resort to personal flames, it just makes all of us look bad. Especially if the moderators (our community leaders) encourage that.

If we want to look at facts, since we've hired Kelly, we've lost some key nationally-recognized-athletes at multiple positions. These were players that we either had commitments from already, or players that we were favored to get. And we've replaced them with borderline 2/3 star players.

I love Kelly's potential at ND, and realize that it's going to take time for him to become fully entrenched with a new crop of recruits (2011), and he's going to need to sell ND with victories. But if we're being honest, I can't imagine recruiting going much worse right now. Obviously, all of that will change with some big NSD commitments (Henderson, James, Ferguson, Jones, etc.).

And it also stings a little bit--adds insult to injury if you will--that Kiffin is getting the exact opposite results since he took over at USC.
 
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IrishJayhawk

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But if we're being honest, I can't imagine recruiting going much worse right now. Obviously, all of that will change with some big NSD commitments (Henderson, James, Ferguson, Jones, etc.).

And it also stings a little bit--adds insult to injury if you will--that Kiffin is getting the exact opposite results since he took over at USC.

I agree with the sentiment of respect for our colleagues on the board. But, I don't agree that recruiting couldn't be going worse. After Weis left, we had recruits wavering all over the place. Kelly has been on the trail like crazy and secured re-commitments from many of them (Shembo, Hendrix, Moore, etc.).

A few other facts:
- Leuders claims that he would have left even with Weis. "Stanford just seemed like a better fit."
- Gio sounds like he doesn't want to play in a spread.
- Hurd was always a tenuous ND lean. He had many people in his ear about staying in Texas.
- Chris Martin soured on ND long before the coaching change.

I'm very disappointed about Leuders, Barr, etc. But, this class was always going to be a tough one to keep together, even with Weis, because we had a very disappointing year.

As you say, if we get Henderson, James, or Jones, it's a huge success already. If we miss on them, but we throw in Iaone, Massa, Spond, etc, it's a pretty decent class. And, in a transition year, coming off of our last 3 years on the field, a decent class is pretty impressive.

As for Kiffin? Whatever...he's cheating. :)
 

NDinL.A.

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If we want to look at facts, since we've hired Kelly, we've lost some key nationally-recognized-athletes at multiple positions. These were players that we either had commitments from already, or players that we were favored to get. And we've replaced them with borderline 2/3 star players.

I love Kelly's potential at ND, and realize that it's going to take time for him to become fully entrenched with a new crop of recruits (2011), and he's going to need to sell ND with victories. But if we're being honest, I can't imagine recruiting going much worse right now. Obviously, all of that will change with some big NSD commitments (Henderson, James, Ferguson, Jones, etc.).

And it also stings a little bit--adds insult to injury if you will--that Kiffin is getting the exact opposite results since he took over at USC.

Actually, you're wrong, Kiffin has lost some recruits. Go look it up. They lost an O-lineman and a TE, off the top of my head. And Riley was about to commit to SC, but then opened up his recruitment again and now people think UCLA is the leader (although SC will still get the last shot at him). Christian Jones just dropped them. They keep offering more WRs and safeties, when they desperately need LBs and O-lineman. So, he hasn't gotten the exact opposite results, at this point he's gotten the same. He is also in play for some top recruits and i think they will get more than ND, but that's more a product of USC winning huge over the last 8 years. Oh, and Kiffin is a douche who can't coach, but I digress.

Like Jeremy said, I don't see how you can say that recruiting couldn't be going worse. You do realize that when CW came in, he lost nearly 50% of the recruits that Golfingham secured. Kelly lost Hurd (looking for an excuse to leave and he I don't think Kelly wanted him...he didn't pursue him hard at all), Gio (spread offense), and Leuders (that one hurts, and Kelly lost the battle vs Harbaugh for an instae kid)). But he's kept everyone else, and picked up a couple of the types of players that ND fans always are pissed that we didn't go after when they kick our asses as jrs and seniors. We also are in the mix for some studs as well as some 'diamond in the rough' athletes that look like they can get after it. So, I'll disagree with you and say that recruiting really could go MUCH worse.

But I agree, different opinions are great. The only 2 people I have a problem with are guys that rub shit in everyone's faces with their user names and hate EVERYTHING Kelly does simply because they hated the hire, and guys that think they are god's gift to strength and conditioning LOL. Peace...
 
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Hell, he can still fit in last month's clothes. But back to football...ND has a relatively easier schedule next year than prior seasons. A winning record alone should help with recruiting. The "cupboard" isn't exactly bare (kudos to Chuck)...there is enough talent to be respectable in 2010. Not even Urban nor Saban won a NC first year at Florida or Bama.

People were willing to give Chuck another year or two but cut this guy off after a month, sheesh.

Everyone thought 2009s schedule was going to be "easier." The fact is, you never know. There is much more parity in college sports these days and there aren't a lot of "easy games"
 

BearGB

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Didn't really know where to put this, but I just saw a link on DD to Louis Nix' FB page, and I was curious so I followed it. When I was there, I couldn't believe what I saw.

I know that we all enjoy watching the recruiting wars and all, but there are some ridiculous creepy people out there. Like people having conversations about recruiting and about the recruits themselves on people's wall. I mean I just think it gets ridiculous... At some point, people have to realize they are being hugely creepy and just stop trying to be "buddy, buddy" with these guys. Anyway, I'm sure most of you have already seen these first hand, and hopefully agree with me.

Sorry for the out of place post, just venting about this ridiculousness.

Rant over.
 

BGIF

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Didn't really know where to put this, but I just saw a link on DD to Louis Nix' FB page, and I was curious so I followed it. When I was there, I couldn't believe what I saw.

I know that we all enjoy watching the recruiting wars and all, but there are some ridiculous creepy people out there. Like people having conversations about recruiting and about the recruits themselves on people's wall. I mean I just think it gets ridiculous... At some point, people have to realize they are being hugely creepy and just stop trying to be "buddy, buddy" with these guys. Anyway, I'm sure most of you have already seen these first hand, and hopefully agree with me.

Sorry for the out of place post, just venting about this ridiculousness.

Rant over.

I do.
 

TerryTate

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The entire recruiting process has become ridiculous and seemingly unregulated. Coaches can say/promise anything to these 18 year olds and get away with it. I understand that all the programs are playing the game so you have to be that way to stay competitive, but stories about Urban Meyer claiming he'd had divine intervention in his dreams to get players to enroll is sickening. The NCAA is in no position to react to issues in a normal timespan so these things can play out for years before investigations yield results (Reggie Bush). I understand that recruiting has become this way as a result of the money & pressure in college football, but the NCAA is failing to enforce the need an athlete to commit to an institution of higher learning and not just a football team.
 

BGIF

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The entire recruiting process has become ridiculous and seemingly unregulated. Coaches can say/promise anything to these 18 year olds and get away with it. I understand that all the programs are playing the game so you have to be that way to stay competitive, but stories about Urban Meyer claiming he'd had divine intervention in his dreams to get players to enroll is sickening. The NCAA is in no position to react to issues in a normal timespan so these things can play out for years before investigations yield results (Reggie Bush). I understand that recruiting has become this way as a result of the money & pressure in college football, but the NCAA is failing to enforce the need an athlete to commit to an institution of higher learning and not just a football team.

The process has become unregulated? Speak to a coach, the NCAA recruiting regs are as voluminous as the IRS Code. And the NCAA regs were a reaction to active abuses. Let's go back to the 20's and 30's when players were openly played and didn't attend class. The 80's when the Southwest Conference had everybody but Rice on probation. The 90's when Alabama got caught buying a player. Bear Bryant used to pack the Track Team, Baseball Team, and whatever other team he could use to get scholarships to football players - to keep them from the competition.

Have you ever watched "The Program"? Do you think James Caan southern charm, and religious quotations were an accident? Or that is team had gold helmets and garnet jerseys? Urban Meyer did invent any of the guile and disception in recruiting. He's just imitating The Masters of Decpetion that came before him.
 

TerryTate

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The process has become unregulated? Speak to a coach, the NCAA recruiting regs are as voluminous as the IRS Code. And the NCAA regs were a reaction to active abuses. Let's go back to the 20's and 30's when players were openly played and didn't attend class. The 80's when the Southwest Conference had everybody but Rice on probation. The 90's when Alabama got caught buying a player. Bear Bryant used to pack the Track Team, Baseball Team, and whatever other team he could use to get scholarships to football players - to keep them from the competition.

Have you ever watched "The Program"? Do you think James Caan southern charm, and religious quotations were an accident? Or that is team had gold helmets and garnet jerseys? Urban Meyer did invent any of the guile and disception in recruiting. He's just imitating The Masters of Decpetion that came before him.

You raise valid points, recruiting is an art. I'm not disagreeing with you, but just because the regulatory process has improved since the 80's doesn't mean it fits the current landscape. I know that all coaches that recruit have have to go through a certification process. I'm talking about the enforcement of those policies. I know that many claims of infractions may be unsubstantiated, but the fact that the Reggie Bush investigation began in 2006 and has still not concluded tells me that the NCAA can't respond in an appropriate time frame.
 

BGIF

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You raise valid points, recruiting is an art. I'm not disagreeing with you, but just because the regulatory process has improved since the 80's doesn't mean it fits the current landscape. I know that all coaches that recruit have have to go through a certification process. I'm talking about the enforcement of those policies. I know that many claims of infractions may be unsubstantiated, but the fact that the Reggie Bush investigation began in 2006 and has still not concluded tells me that the NCAA can't respond in an appropriate time frame.

The NCAA isn't the Department of Justice. They don't have unlimited subpoena power nor do they have any authority over a athlete or coach who is not at a member instititution. The NCAA is member organization and has as much enforcement powers as its members school president's wish it to have.

The NCAA is Southern Cal, Alabama, Oklahoma, Miami, Texas, Auburn, SMU, Tennessee, Notre Dame and all the rest of the bad boys that have drawn sanctions and probations - some a whole lot more than others.
 

alleycat9

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Didn't really know where to put this, but I just saw a link on DD to Louis Nix' FB page, and I was curious so I followed it. When I was there, I couldn't believe what I saw.

I know that we all enjoy watching the recruiting wars and all, but there are some ridiculous creepy people out there. Like people having conversations about recruiting and about the recruits themselves on people's wall. I mean I just think it gets ridiculous... At some point, people have to realize they are being hugely creepy and just stop trying to be "buddy, buddy" with these guys. Anyway, I'm sure most of you have already seen these first hand, and hopefully agree with me.

Sorry for the out of place post, just venting about this ridiculousness.

Rant over.

it is this way across most of entertainment. people are nuts and create false gods out of kids and grown adults. i had the opportunity to watch the show cribs on mtv a few weeks ago.... i had the tv on and was busy doing something else it was as a background noise type situation and every once in awhile i would look over and see one of these mansions that an athlete or rock star or rapper were living in.

it honestly made me say why am i giving my hard earned money to this idiot? so he can do THAT with it? but this is what we have created with putting them up on a pedestal like they are gods.

places like espn dont help, no high school kid needs to be on national tv for a regular season football or basketball game. but they arent stupid they know that some of these kids will be big time players at some point and they can say they were there, it also is lucrative, sure not as lucrative as college sports but there are people who watch these games.

and they will swoon over them as soon as they know they are good.
 

irishtrain

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it is this way across most of entertainment. people are nuts and create false gods out of kids and grown adults. i had the opportunity to watch the show cribs on mtv a few weeks ago.... i had the tv on and was busy doing something else it was as a background noise type situation and every once in awhile i would look over and see one of these mansions that an athlete or rock star or rapper were living in.

it honestly made me say why am i giving my hard earned money to this idiot? so he can do THAT with it? but this is what we have created with putting them up on a pedestal like they are gods.

places like espn dont help, no high school kid needs to be on national tv for a regular season football or basketball game. but they arent stupid they know that some of these kids will be big time players at some point and they can say they were there, it also is lucrative, sure not as lucrative as college sports but there are people who watch these games.

and they will swoon over them as soon as they know they are good.
I say here here to this post. I coach baseball and the way some of these young men are made to feel special is wrong and very self defeating to them at their age. Do you think Reggie Bush got anywhere near an education, do you think any of these young men get any good out of being on national T V as a high schooler. It does promote arrogance and self entitlement. I was introduced to a young man to talk baseball by a friend who intro'd me as a former major league player. He wanted me to talk about getting an education to the young man before pro baseball ( not the way I did it ). The kid looked at me like I was some know-nothing clown. I see the arrogance that we produce in these guys by making them a regional household name. It happens on this board with the so and so watch. We shouldnt do this as we are crippling them with fame and entitlement. Lemming/espn/scout/rivals/etc are making $$$$$$ thats the reason they do this. These kids are not mature enough to understand the game being played, and if they do understand it we are maturing them to fast. The ones who fall short will have to make an excuse-injuries/coaching/social problems etc because werent you Mr Cant Miss. I hear it all the time when someone finds out I was fortunate enough (hell just plain lucky) to play in the big leagues as they tell me they were all city/district etc but got a bad break. Once again we have the cart before the horse. This recruiting deal is way out of hand, the people that run them are doing nothing but making $$$$$$, we had bowl games, great teams, all americans, good athletes finding their way long before they came on the seen. Its just a way to produce a living for they guy who owns the service.
 
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BGIF

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1/31 Noon Scorecard

3 Wins

  • Luke Massa QB
  • Derek Roback QB recruited as H-Back
  • Bruce Heggie DE
1 Miss
  • Brandon Bourbon RB Decommitted from Stanford and verballed to Kansas.
Sill Pondering

  • Kona Schwenke DE made it to ND and will visit Washington on his way back to Hawaii. So no decision should be expected today.
  • Seantrel Henderson OT had a good visit to Miami (He's reported a good visit everywhere). NSD decision.
 
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