Chicago Bears address

[NDFAN420]

George McCaskey and Kevin Warren are complete embarrassments.

I'm not defending those two by saying this, but they are dealing with bigger embarrassments and classic, truly "old style" political machines in Chicago and Springfield. Just let this game of chicken play out. Taking sides is kind of silly when most things are happening behind closed doors and what's making the headlines is just to keep the rage bait at maximum.

 

[Irishdwarte]

 

[Irishdwarte]

He’s a fucking clown.

 

[Jiggafini19Deux]

I'm not defending those two by saying this, but they are dealing with bigger embarrassments and classic, truly "old style" political machines in Chicago and Springfield. Just let this game of chicken play out. Taking sides is kind of silly when most things are happening behind closed doors and what's making the headlines is just to keep the rage bait at maximum.

I'm good. Thank you, though.

 

[Jiggafini19Deux]

He’s a fucking clown.

Correct.

The lack of a staffed and funding media is keeping the majority of the public in the dark about what has actually happened and is happening to this point. Roger Goodell is having conversations with the state of Illinois. The Bears are playing the "blue state bad" game with the public and in large part are getting away with that. There are a couple of decent journalists left and a few independent outlets getting the story correct.

Again, it helps if the Bears let Illinois what it is they want, which to this point they have not. The last lawmaking session the Bears didn't even have anyone in Springfield, IL. Hard to get what you want and need when you're not in the room where it happens.

 

[Bantry19]

I'm not defending those two by saying this, but they are dealing with bigger embarrassments and classic, truly "old style" political machines in Chicago and Springfield. Just let this game of chicken play out. Taking sides is kind of silly when most things are happening behind closed doors and what's making the headlines is just to keep the rage bait at maximum.

The fact that the Bears are asking for almost $1B in public financing for infrastructure upgrades for the Arlington stadium, and didn’t so much as run a traffic study, should tell you all you need to know.

 

[Jiggafini19Deux]

The fact that the Bears are asking for almost $1B in public financing for infrastructure upgrades for the Arlington stadium, and didn’t so much as run a traffic study, should tell you all you need to know.

The Chicago "machine" is also out of the picture at this point, too.

This entire process has been inept from the jump, and all they keep doing is holding press conferences every couple of months talking about Indiana. Every friend, neighbor and co-worker thinks it is a done deal when they have no land in Hammond to build on.

It's a combination of a lot of moving parts that are leaving people extremely uninformed about the situation.

The fact that Goodell is talking to the Illinois State Legislature says a lot.

 

[pumpdog20]

If they aren't staying in the city, what difference if it's Arlington Heights or Hammond.

 

[sfk324]

The Chicago "machine" is also out of the picture at this point, too.

This entire process has been inept from the jump, and all they keep doing is holding press conferences every couple of months talking about Indiana. Every friend, neighbor and co-worker thinks it is a done deal when they have no land in Hammond to build on.

It's a combination of a lot of moving parts that are leaving people extremely uninformed about the situation.

The fact that Goodell is talking to the Illinois State Legislature says a lot.

The state has arguably done their part. There are two live bills that address what the Bears claim are their issues : property tax certainty (whatever the fuck that means) and infrastructure spending. The Bears have done jack shit to say what in either bill works or doesn't work. They want the state to bid against itself, and the state has told them no, tell us what you actually want. The Bears just continue to say the same horseshit.

If Indiana wants to write a blank check for debt that they will never recoup before the Bears come asking for money again, good for Indiana. That doesn't require Illinois to do the same. Fool me once and all that.

It's a poorly run franchise controlled by a bunch of people who don't know what they are doing and would have been fired from the most menial of jobs in the real world except for the fact Mugs Halas died before his father, leaving Virginia the Enabler as the sole heir.

 

[Jiggafini19Deux]

The state has arguably done their part. There are two live bills that address what the Bears claim are their issues : property tax certainty (whatever the fuck that means) and infrastructure spending. The Bears have done jack shit to say what in either bill works or doesn't work. They want the state to bid against itself, and the state has told them no, tell us what you actually want. The Bears just continue to say the same horseshit.

If Indiana wants to write a blank check for debt that they will never recoup before the Bears come asking for money again, good for Indiana. That doesn't require Illinois to do the same. Fool me once and all that.

It's a poorly run franchise controlled by a bunch of people who don't know what they are doing and would have been fired from the most menial of jobs in the real world except for the fact Mugs Halas died before his father, leaving Virginia the Enabler as the sole heir.

100%.

 

[Jiggafini19Deux]

If they aren't staying in the city, what difference if it's Arlington Heights or Hammond.

They paid $200M for land they now own in one and have no land in the other.

Significant difference.

 

[pumpdog20]

Fair enough from a Bears fiscal stupidity perspective. My question was more from a fan point of view, as that's most of the angst I see online.

 

[Jiggafini19Deux]

Fair enough from a Bears fiscal stupidity perspective. My question was more from a fan point of view, as that's most of the angst I see online.

You have the meatballs that don't want them to play anywhere other than in Chicago and you have the people that don't want them to leave Illinois. Arlington Heights makes the most sense for a number of reasons.

I personally feel they should be playing in Arlington Heights because they paid for the land five years ago and are not doing anything with it. I have no preference one way or another as long as I don't have to pay for it with my tax dollars. The Chicago Fire were able to get a deal done on a stadium without all of these shenanigans.

 

[PolishDomer]

If they aren't staying in the city, what difference if it's Arlington Heights or Hammond.

Air Quality...Property crime

 

[Jiggafini19Deux]

It isn't the state government's job to help the Bears build a new stadium. They are a private business worth $10B and there are 31 others in the world just like them. Seems like an easy civics lesson, but they don't really teach civics anymore, and the media has done a galactically stupid job of covering this when the reality is it is a bigger story than it's getting credit for. This storied NFL franchise doesn't have the money to build a new stadium on land they already own and they are looking for a handout from Illinois. It's gotten so dysfunctional that Roger Goodell is meeting with Illinois lawmakers on his own, without the Bears.

George McCaskey and Kevin Warren have done a good job of feeding red meat to people who are not informed and creating a political divide that makes people believe "the state isn't doing it's job" to keep the Bears in Illinois. Government, at any level, does not owe the Bears anything. They're a private entity that owns a $200M piece of land in Arlington Heights, IL that used to be racetrack. They should have a stadium built there already.

Owning an NFL team is a billionaires game. The McCaskeys are not billionaires. Really feels like it's time for them to sell the team, and I hope Roger Goodell begins the process of compelling them to do so soon.

 

[Irish#1]

Fair enough from a Bears fiscal stupidity perspective. My question was more from a fan point of view, as that's most of the angst I see online.

It doesn't matter where they play, but from a fans perspective it's treason if they were to play in Hammond. NY felt betrayed when they built the Meadowlands, but the teams never changed their names and the fans kept being fans. I still don't believe the Bears will end up playing in Hammond, but if they do, I'm pretty sure Bear fans will still be Bear fans.

If they were looking to relocate away from the Chicago area, like the Cardinals, Titans or Raiders did when they moved, then I could see the argument.

 

[Bantry19]

It's in the realm of possibility that NFL executives and owners are telling the Bears they won't approve a move to Hammond, Indiana, @ProFootballTalk told @mullyhaugh. "That's something that they're never going to declare publicly because it blows up the leverage," Florio says

 

[Crazy Balki]

I'm going to give the Warren/Bears dogpiling a pass (not that they don't deserve it) and focus on the city and state.

Because at the end of the day, they are infinitely more responsible for this mess.

The state of Soldier Field over the past 25 years has been and continues to be a complete and utter embarrassment. It is, without question, the worst run stadium in the league. BY. FAR.

And it's almost entirely due to the absolute incompetence and downright laziness of the Chicago Park District.

The way the agreement works, the city owns Soldier Field. That's their prerogative, but if you're going to own the stadium, you better take care of the fucking stadium. And what do we end up with? The most logistically asinine and aesthetically vomit-inducing stadium in the NFL, with turf that makes the abandoned ditch behind my apartment look like Pebble Beach.

You don't want the Bears to leave? How's about you stop giving them a stadium to play in that is so downright substandard and unacceptable for one of the founding franchises of the goddamn sport. Otherwise, sell the stadium to them or shut the fuck up.

I'm just beyond tired of this city's government and their total and utter incompetence and Soldier Field exemplifies it to a T. It also doesn't benefit the Bears to stay in Soldier Field merely from a logistical perspective, because there's just no room to expand, and the state/city have been unwilling to make the situation better for the Bears to stay in the city, so why would they? Soldier Field is just not a viable place for the Bears to remain. It's too small, it's ugly, and it caps the organization's growth.

I'm just tired of people dogpiling the franchise for this when all of this is 100% on the city's incompetence. The way they financed the stadium, the way they maintain it, the way they gridlocked it. It was all a complete and utter clusterfuck and it's all on the city. I want the Bears to remain in Chicago and in Illinois, I really do. I'm sure the state and city want the Bears to stay, and hell I'm sure the Bears want to stay too. But at the end of the day, the Bears are a business and they need to do what's best for the business. And the state can't afford to keep them due to years upon years of fiscal irresponsibility.

I had to vent on this. A lot of flak going around about the Bears ownership (much of it justified), but at the end of the day, the city and state aren't getting anywhere near enough when they are far and away the main reason this is coming to a head.

 

[Jiggafini19Deux]

I'm going to give the Warren/Bears dogpiling a pass (not that they don't deserve it) and focus on the city and state.

Because at the end of the day, they are infinitely more responsible for this mess.

The state of Soldier Field over the past 25 years has been and continues to be a complete and utter embarrassment. It is, without question, the worst run stadium in the league. BY. FAR.

And it's almost entirely due to the absolute incompetence and downright laziness of the Chicago Park District.

The way the agreement works, the city owns Soldier Field. That's their prerogative, but if you're going to own the stadium, you better take care of the fucking stadium. And what do we end up with? The most logistically asinine and aesthetically vomit-inducing stadium in the NFL, with turf that makes the abandoned ditch behind my apartment look like Pebble Beach.

You don't want the Bears to leave? How's about you stop giving them a stadium to play in that is so downright substandard and unacceptable for one of the founding franchises of the goddamn sport. Otherwise, sell the stadium to them or shut the fuck up.

I'm just beyond tired of this city's government and their total and utter incompetence and Soldier Field exemplifies it to a T. It also doesn't benefit the Bears to stay in Soldier Field merely from a logistical perspective, because there's just no room to expand, and the state/city have been unwilling to make the situation better for the Bears to stay in the city, so why would they? Soldier Field is just not a viable place for the Bears to remain. It's too small, it's ugly, and it caps the organization's growth.

I'm just tired of people dogpiling the franchise for this when all of this is 100% on the city's incompetence. The way they financed the stadium, the way they maintain it, the way they gridlocked it. It was all a complete and utter clusterfuck and it's all on the city. I want the Bears to remain in Chicago and in Illinois, I really do. I'm sure the state and city want the Bears to stay, and hell I'm sure the Bears want to stay too. But at the end of the day, the Bears are a business and they need to do what's best for the business. And the state can't afford to keep them due to years upon years of fiscal irresponsibility.

I had to vent on this. A lot of flak going around about the Bears ownership (much of it justified), but at the end of the day, the city and state aren't getting anywhere near enough when they are far and away the main reason this is coming to a head.

The Bears don't have any money to build a stadium. That isn't any government's fault. Sure as hell isn't my problem as a tax paying resident of the state. Building a new stadium for the Bears is not Illinois' job. It isn't Indiana's job either.

Northwestern got a new stadium. The Chicago Fire are getting one. These are in Illinois. Jerry Reinsdorf went to the state about a new baseball stadium. They said thanks but no to whatever he proposed. At least the old man went down there and went into a room. George and Kevin won't do the work. That's not the state's fault. Governor Pritzker told them a few months ago: do the work. Tell us what you want. The state is willing to work with them. They're not giving them a plan.

It probably would have been a good idea for George and Kevin to have been in Springfield during that final legislative session, but I'm not part of a private business of which there are only 32 of a kind, so maybe that was a smart tactic on their part. To not be around and get something done. When you haven't really said what it is you want to begin with. They also purchased land for $200M and have not done anything with it for half a decade. That's their fault. No one else's.

In the end, yes, the Bears are a business. The city and state don't have to do anything for them or give them anything.

 

[Chicago Domer]

If they aren't staying in the city, what difference if it's Arlington Heights or Hammond.

Huge difference.

 

[Chicago Domer]

I personally would hate for them to stay in Chicago, which has become a complete shit show under the last 2 administrations.

 

[Irish#1]

It's in the realm of possibility that NFL executives and owners are telling the Bears they won't approve a move to Hammond, Indiana, @ProFootballTalk told @mullyhaugh. "That's something that they're never going to declare publicly because it blows up the leverage," Florio says

The NFL told Al Davis he couldn't move the Raiders and he told them to go F@#$ themselves. Different time back then, but there is precedence.

 

[Jiggafini19Deux]

I personally would hate for them to stay in Chicago, which has become a complete shit show under the last 2 administrations.

Violent crime is down in the city, probably because arrests are up, but whatever. If Hammond is the alternative, that's very McCaskey.

They have no money to build a stadium. Anywhere. Either sell the team or renew the lease at Soldier Field.

 

[Jiggafini19Deux]

It's in the realm of possibility that NFL executives and owners are telling the Bears they won't approve a move to Hammond, Indiana, @ProFootballTalk told @mullyhaugh. "That's something that they're never going to declare publicly because it blows up the leverage," Florio says

The NFL told Al Davis he couldn't move the Raiders and he told them to go F@#$ themselves. Different time back then, but there is precedence.

Different scenarios.

The team isn't moving. They're trying to build a stadium. This ends with them being the Chicago Bears.

The league doesn't want them to build this stadium in Hammond.

 

[Bantry19]

I personally would hate for them to stay in Chicago, which has become a complete shit show under the last 2 administrations.

No defense of Lightfoot and Johnson, shit show is apt for those two, but this sounds like someone who doesn’t spend a whole lot of time on the city.

 

[RDU Irish]

Richest billionaires in Illinois - Capitol City Now

For a city like Chicago - this is a meh list. Your billionaires would rather run for office than lead a franchise to glory.

Fins owned by Detroit native who went to Michigan. Jags owned by Illinois grad from Pakistan.

 

[sfk324]

Richest billionaires in Illinois - Capitol City Now

For a city like Chicago - this is a meh list. Your billionaires would rather run for office than lead a franchise to glory.

Fins owned by Detroit native who went to Michigan. Jags owned by Illinois grad from Pakistan.

I take it you just don't recognize the names on the list outside of the Pritzkers and maybe the Uihliens.

#3 on that list is the largest non-McCaskey owner of the Bears, and has about 20% of the team. He is also the "Ryan" in Ryan Field at Northwestern.

#5 -- is the primary owner of the Dodgers and is the majority owner of the Lakers, pending the sale to Bob Iger and Josh Kushner.

#8 is a minority owner of the White Sox and is in line to become the majority owner in the future based on an agreement with th current ownership. He is also part owner of the Phoenix Suns, Phoenix Mercury, and the Nashville MLS team.

#13 owns the Fire and is building their new stadium in the South Loop.

The issue isn't that the billionaires aren't interested in the teams. It's that the prominent teams are owned by skinflint Jerry Reinsdorf (and before the Ricketts family bought the Cubs, the Tribune Company) and the clueless nepobaby McCaskey family, and they don't want to sell.

 

[Jiggafini19Deux]

The McCaskeys' worth is all tied up into the Bears. They have not grown their net worth whatsoever. They're not football people, business people or political people. They're related to George Halas. That's really it.

Professional sports franchises are worth so much that it gets to the point that only a very small number of people can afford to own them. I would assume Nobody is going to want to partner with the McCaskeys, for obvious reasons, because you'd have to deal with them going forward. It would make sense that someone comes in and builds them a stadium while taking over a majority of the team, but I seriously doubt that's going to happen.

In a perfect world, fire Kevin Warren, then sell. New owners can afford to build a stadium on Arlington Heights land already purchased by team.

 

[Katzenboyer]

I have absolutely no dog in this fight, but I think it's a travesty if the Bears move to Hammond.

I'm of the personal opinion that if you own a football team, you should have the financial ability to finance your own stadium. If you can't do that - and it's pretty clear the Bears ownership cannot - then you should sell the team.

Just my worthless $0.02.

 

[Irish#1]

Different scenarios.

The team isn't moving. They're trying to build a stadium. This ends with them being the Chicago Bears.

The league doesn't want them to build this stadium in Hammond.

Yes and no. I was speaking about a team going against the NFL's wishes. Moving a team to another city without NFL approval took more balls than a team playing 32 miles away. They're still staying in the same media market (Giants/Jets) unlike the Raiders going to LA. I still think Indiana is wasting a lot of taxpayer money trying to lure the Bears. It's not going to happen IMO.

I found this interesting.

1. The Interstate Revenue Split
The NFL isn't worried about losing TV viewers; it's worried about the state tax battle. If the Bears build a multi-billion dollar stadium district in Hammond, all player income taxes (jock taxes), sales taxes, hotel taxes, and stadium event revenues shift completely from Illinois to Indiana. Illinois politicians are fighting aggressively to keep that massive revenue stream in their backyard. [1, 2, 3, 4, 5]

2. Cross-Border Politics and Funding
The move involves a political showdown between two different state governments. Indiana legislators have already moved aggressively, passing a bill to cover roughly 60% of the stadium development costs to lure the team over. Meanwhile, NFL Commissioner Roger Goodell has continued meeting privately with Illinois lawmakers to see if the state can match or beat Indiana’s incentives to prevent a historic franchise from physically leaving. [1, 2, 3]