‘23 VA ATH Brandyn Hillman (Michigan Verbal)

[Irishdrunk]

Reading through everything, I think @Luckylucci and @Crazy Balki are yelling at each other for no reason, because you’re essentially arguing different points, and you’re both correct about the primary points you’re trying to make.

Lucky thinks Freeman doesn’t get any of the “benefit of the doubt” that Kelly got, because Kelly won a lot of games over 12 years, while we still don’t technically know if Freeman is more than an average head coach. That’s valid and fair, even if I don’t necessarily agree with it (I take the stance that correcting the course after the Marshall debacle and despite having Pyne at QB is a sign that he’s at least an above average leader/CEO). Until MFMF proves his coaching chops with a couple more 10+ win seasons, and maybe a playoff appearance thrown in (with the caveat many will make being that the expanded playoff is easier to get into, because ND should be in every year at 10-2, but we’ll cross that bridge when we get there), we can’t debate the handcuffs that are going to hypothetically keep him from getting over the top and winning a natty.

On the flip side, Balki is absolutely 100% correct that Freeman’s primary strength has been given an artificial ceiling that BK didn’t have to deal with, because it was never BK’s strength to begin with. BK was hired to be a program builder, and he did deal with obstacles of his own in that regard, but many were of his own making. Freeman was hired to be an ace recruiter and put a ready-made roster over the top by being a good man who connects with young people. We knew NIL would be a thorn, but no one guessed the extent to which the problem would hamstring a guy like MFMF. It was terribly unlucky timing that he got hired exactly when major changes happened, AND when the NCAA finally decided to lay down and pretend it has zero authority.

You’re both right! Freeman needs to win now, regardless, but we can also acknowledge that it’s been made a much more difficult task for him specifically in regards to what he does best. Maybe measuring him against BK’s first three years isn’t the smartest idea in that context… perhaps we should just wait and see how things unfold in the context of “Marcus Freeman’s ND Football,” and not based on hypotheticals and context based around a guy that left for an easier road to travel.

Great Post Lion, except for "Freeman needs to win now, regardless." comment. False and total BS.

Do you think Swarbrick who has Freeman as his bitch, will ever fire him as long as he maintains a Top 25 program? The Admin - what makes you think anyone will put heat on Freeman to win more than 8 games or ELSE? They don't give a fuck. And they certainly are not going to can Freeman for not making the CFP.

Freeman has none of Kelly's gravitas due to a total lack of HC resume that Kelly brought. But, he is more likeable than Kelly and the Admin can control him so he has a nice comfy position. Just don't expect to compete like we did under Kelly. Think Top 25, not Top 10.

 

[Irishdrunk]

It's easier for some here to focus on 2 bad losses by a first year coach than to face the fact that ND's admin isn't serious about winning a national championship.

Unfortunately, both can be true.

 

[Irishdrunk]

I just found out: Swarbrick decided he didn't want Hillman. He thinks Freeman should get him 3 new Safety Recruits' academic profiles and he will let him know which Top 1,000 prospect will work within his system.....

 

[Luckylucci]

Lloyd said the coaching staff had nothing to do with any of this. So the blame spectrum has Brandyn on one side and the admin on the other. Considering ND reportedly "could have admitted him and didn't" I'm going to move that slider pretty close to the admin side.

And, to get his "sources" back within the program Loy would huff Freeman's farts out of a bus seat if he asked him too.

This is no different than the coaching fiasco. Loy will run what Freeman and Company tell him too.

 

[StPaul_Irish]

And, to get his "sources" back within the program Loy would huff Freeman's farts out of a bus seat if he asked him too.

This is no different than the coaching fiasco. Loy will run what Freeman and Company tell him too.

Could this be Freeman taking a shot at the Admin?

 

[Crazy Balki]

And, to get his "sources" back within the program Loy would huff Freeman's farts out of a bus seat if he asked him too.

This is no different than the coaching fiasco. Loy will run what Freeman and Company tell him too.

1) If this were true, why would Freeman and Co. want it out that ND could have made it work but chose not to? That doesn't benefit anybody.

2) I fail to see how a coach had any say in the admissions process. Either ND admits him or they don't. Freeman isn't part of that decision.

Overall, multiple sources appear to be in agreement that ND's admissions is doing the football program zero favors.

 

[TorontoGold]

I don't think Freeman needs to win in the CFP to get a serious look at OSU. Call me the Dumb Moron but there is tremendous desire (and pressure) to have diversity in the college ranks. Freeman is an OSU NFL alum....

And OSU knows ND isn't serious about chasing Nattys like they are. Their recruiting platform and support is 10X ND's and they will give Freeman a break on recruiting on par with Kelly.

OSU is an S-tier level program, they will do anything to win. They aren't going to make a hire that isn't solely focused on winning now. Again, they hired Urban Meyer.

 

[Jiggafini19Deux]

Disappointed Hillman's not coming.

 

[IrishTusker]

'That dude' now has a Brian Kelly level class because of ND. It doesn't matter who the coach is, it's the same University.

You don't sandbag the new guy and say 'win a bunch and games and we will talk'. Especially when the guy before bolted because of it. And he didnt WANT to be here for 12 years. He tried to leave multiple times because of ND. And Freeman won't be here long enough to even have that conversation. He'll be gone as soon as OSU or another big dog comes calling. And he should.

What is it with some of you who love the fact that ND sandbags the program and sabotages it whenever it can? Dp you enjoy being skull dragged when it coynts? Do you think it's a coincidence that Kelly beats Alabama as soon as he got away from ND?

Good grief. Bama wasn't 2012 or 2020 Bama last year. How did he do against Georgia?

 

[ulukinatme]

The University of Michigan as a whole is an academic issue

It's funny that about a decade ago Harbaugh was complaining that his alma mater was shuffling football players into joke majors to keep them eligible, and now he's at said school and reaping the benefits.

 

[IrishTusker]

Congratulations.

As a result of their 'compromise', Michigan is still a top 25 university nationwide. I doubt it's made any sort of legitimate impact on their credentials in the slightest.

The fact that Michigan is willing to make it work but ND is not, isn't an indication of superiority, it's an indication of ignorance, elitism and unwillingness to conform.

It isn't about rankings, it's about not admitting students who are unlikely to graduate. I've graded the work of ND football players. Believe me, ND is not limiting the pool that much. I don't know the details of this situation and so I won't comment on this specific case. But my impression is that admissions is rarely a barrier to getting students here, at this point.

I hear Duke degrees are worthless now because of their basketball program 🤣

Duke degrees aren't worthless for the typical student. But there are athletes with degrees from these other schools who legitimately cannot read. That doesn't happen at ND.

Don't bag on them to make you feel better about ND screwing it's football program.

It's an elite university that actually works with their flagship athletics program.

No, it's an elite university that does not have academic standards for athletes. There are plenty of other examples of this (Michigan, Berkeley, UCLA, Texas, UNC).

 

[Me2SouthBend]

Great Post Lion, except for "Freeman needs to win now, regardless." comment. False and total BS.

Do you think Swarbrick who has Freeman as his bitch, will ever fire him as long as he maintains a Top 25 program? The Admin - what makes you think anyone will put heat on Freeman to win more than 8 games or ELSE? They don't give a fuck. And they certainly are not going to can Freeman for not making the CFP.

Freeman has none of Kelly's gravitas due to a total lack of HC resume that Kelly brought. But, he is more likeable than Kelly and the Admin can control him so he has a nice comfy position. Just don't expect to compete like we did under Kelly. Think Top 25, not Top 10.

So you think they are a top 25 program? Where have I heard that before?

 

[dublinirish]

 

[Sea Turtle]

r

He better jump on that. That's the big time.

 

[Irishdrunk]

No, it's an elite university that does not have academic standards for athletes. There are plenty of other examples of this (Michigan, Berkeley, UCLA, Texas, UNC).

It seems that it has really worked out for

He better jump on that. That's the big time.
[/QUOTE]

Oh and I am sure OSU waited until he was out of his NLI before they tampered, err, spoke to him.

That is a program that wants the Natty so fucking bad. They gotta hate UGA and Bama so bad.

 

[Irishnuke]

"hey son, you're too stupid to get into ND. Come to Michigan"

more like “hey son, sorry Notre Dame knew about your academics, recruited you anyway, let you commit and sign your NLI, and now won’t let you enroll.” You know that’s exactly what coaches are going to say and kids will eat it up. It’s a bad look regardless of whether it’s Hillman, Freeman, or admissions to blame.

 

[AKRowdy]

"No doubt there is some blame on Hillman but I'm disappointed in ND's handling of this one. Just my two cents.

Put it this way: I'm told they could have admitted him and chose not to." - Loy

If this is the case it’s disappointing. I understand the academic rigors of attending ND but I get extremely frustrated with the pompous attitude of ND. Or the acting of entitlement from the administration. If this is the case it’s extremely disappointing.

 

[IrishTusker]

Put it this way: I'm told they could have admitted him and chose not to." - Loy

What does that mean? That's true of every applicant.

 

[rtrn2glory]

Just so sad right now

 

[Sea Turtle]

This off-season has done nothing but make ND look cheap,, unprofessional, petty and rigid and a place that even alum coaches use as a stepping stone.

You don't have to negative recruit ND. It negative recruits itself.

Amateur hour.

 

[ThePiombino]

Just one of the endless reminders that ND simply isn't serious about football. How much longer until we're considered a women's basketball school?

 

[Jiggafini19Deux]

Just one of the endless reminders that ND simply isn't serious about football. How much longer until we're considered a women's basketball school?

Long enough for hyperbole to still be alive and well.

 

[FWIrish4]

ND also could have admitted me and chose not to. No shit Loy.

Yea but do you run a 4.4?!

 

[FWIrish4]

"I’m disappointed Notre Dame didn’t make more of an effort to get this kid into school. Simple as that."

Lloyd.

Matt Freeman echoed this on the Power Hour pod. Even highlighted some of his first offers after his release were Michigan, Vanderbilt, BC, Virginia, etc.

I get we have standards that are communicated to kids they have to hit. But what is the hurdle ND has that these other above average academic schools don’t require?

 

[irishog77]

Just one of the endless reminders that ND simply isn't serious about football. How much longer until we're considered a women's basketball school?

Good news- it’ll still be quite a while still. 99.9% of the world’s knowledge concerning women’s college basketball is that it simply exists.

 

[Irish4life]

BK learned this lesson early, and simply gave up on most of the borderline cases. Limited his recruiting pool probably a bit too far, but it prevented true holes from forming on the roster.

They used Bill Rees and developed a legit way of casting a net that was realistic, and good enough to build a playoff-caliber roster.

We'll see how far Freeman calibrates his own approach, because he will with another example or two like this.

There are a couple "borderline cases" that are on campus right now. And plenty of them have succeeded at ND (yes even under BK). If you're willing to put the work in and you have the classes, it doesn't matter where you come from, you can succeed at ND. Hillman either didn't have the classes he needed, or wasn't able to get the grade he needed. Which is what it is. Doesn't mean he's a bad kid or anything, just life.

 

[Sea Turtle]

Matt Freeman echoed this on the Power Hour pod. Even highlighted some of his first offers after his release were Michigan, Vanderbilt, BC, Virginia, etc.

I get we have standards that are communicated to kids they have to hit. But what is the hurdle ND has that these other above average academic schools don’t require?

VANDERBILT?

wtf...

 

[NDPhilly]

We only had a "playoff caliber" roster under Kelly bc we never played elite teams outside of the playoffs. Our only win over a season-end top 10 team in '18 and '20 was Clemson with DJ U in double OT...and we saw what they did to us with Trevor.

Advanced stats show the 2018 and 2020 teams were closer to #10 than top 4. Unfortunately, looks like we'll be playing a hell of a lot of top 10 teams in the near future.

 

[rtrn2glory]

Yeah this is one where the more I marinate on it I need some answers too

 

[BoredIrish]

Maybe Peyton Bowen will re-consider us if he doesn't pass Oklahoma's rigorous admissions criteria