USF Presser

[tankjeep]

You mean unlike Holding, Clipping, and Pass Interference, among others. Holding could be called on probably every play.

Unlike those plays which usually happen with almost 2 dozen players making contact across the field, all eyes in the stadium will be on the ball carrier 10 yards in front of the nearest defender, with nothing but green in front of him who turns at the 5 yard line to wave at a trailing defender.

If he keeps his head toward the end zone, drops the ball after crossing the goal line or hands it to an official, as the rule from several years ago stipulates, there is no official is going to call a penalty. There are too many eyes and too many cameras focused on the play.

If the ball carrier choses to wave at a defender like Shark did, do the Tomahawk to the FSU crowd ala Battle, or put his hands to helmet like their antlers or wings ala Bobby Brown, he's gonna get called.

...

if i remember correctly didn't armando allen get called for taunting and it ended up being a crucial call vs. michigan. and from what i can recollect, allen did nothing to deserve the flag. so yes, i can see a referee making that kind of call even when it isn't warranted.

i agree, the players need to put their head down and run in the endzone and do as barry sanders and walter payton did....just hand the ball to the referee. but i still think that a referee is still being given more power than necessary. and it could come back and bite any college team in the butt.

i personally don't like the rule. taking points off the board should not be a power given to the referees when the player clearly scores a touchdown (even if he taunts). assess the penalty on the kickoff.

also keep in mind that we've had reviews that were clearly in our favor reversed....and all eyes from tv land saw that and nothing was done about it. so again, a referee can make a judgment call that could change the outcome of a game with a rule change like this no matter how many people see his mistake.

 

[nlroma1o]

i personally don't like the rule. taking points off the board should not be a power given to the referees when the player clearly scores a touchdown (even if he taunts). access the penalty on the kickoff.

Thank you! Thats all ive been trying to say! Dont give them the ability to take points off the scoreboard!

 

[military_irish]

I agree with both of you NDinLA and BGIF I was just speaking of the subjectivity of the whole thing.

Something else I thought of was the Desean Jackson play when they played the Giants. He was about to score the winning TD but instead or running directly into the endzone he ran parrallel to the goal line to run the clock out. Would that be a play where he is flagged and a TD taken away? One ref may think so and all hell would break loose.

I know there was/is a rule that you can not taunt verbally either. So what if a player is running into the endzone where the opposing student section sits and just screams, in excitement of course. Nothing vulgar just something like "thats what I am talkin' about" while looking into the opposing student section. Would that be "taunting" the crowd?
Maybe I am looking too much into it but I know how some refs may do the same thing, unless a specific video is or set of specific actions are outlined to determine what is classified as taunting to have a TD taken away.

 

[kmoose]

i personally don't like the rule. taking points off the board should not be a power given to the referees when the player clearly scores a touchdown (even if he taunts). assess the penalty on the kickoff.

They already have that power.... Pass Interference (Defensive OR Offensive) is a judgement call. If the official thinks he saw the receiver push off, on a TD pass, the points come off the board.

 

[tankjeep]

They already have that power.... Pass Interference (Defensive OR Offensive) is a judgement call. If the official thinks he saw the receiver push off, on a TD pass, the points come off the board.

exactly, so why give them even more power? we aren't talking about an infraction that can be seen as a player gaining an advantage like pass interference, holding, etc.

those calls are understandable and missed as well. i'm just saying, why give them another call to make that can be easily missed or not missed that could have a big impact on a game?

again, this is an unnecessary rule.

 

[Rhode Irish]

Other judgment calls, such as holding and pass interference, have to do with situations that impact the game. If you hold or interfere with a receiver making a catch, you are creating an unfair advantage that impacts the outcome of the game. Taunting has no such impact. It should be up to coaches, school administrators and the players themselves to govern conduct during a game.

As I said before, I am in no way supporting taunting or poor sportsmanship. I wouldn't engage in that behavior, and I would hope the teams I root for wouldn't either. I just don't believe we should get into the practice of imposing our behavioral standards on others, regardless of the context. If you don't like taunting, don't taunt and don't support those who chose to do it. But it has NOTHING to do with the game itself, in terms of points scored, field position, and ultimately wins and losses.

If you want to get on your soap box and moralize about taunting, fine. But I think it is outrageous to expect your sensitivities to be codified in the rules of the game.

You don't like taunting, and I don't like people who park their cars too close to the parking space lines. If I don't like your parking job, can I steal your car or slash your tires? No, I just get a little aggravated and like you a little less. The same thing should apply here.

I don't want any part of a society that attempts to micromanage behavior and imposes the majority's norms on everyone. It isn't right.

 

[IrishJayhawk]

As I said before, I am in no way supporting taunting or poor sportsmanship. I wouldn't engage in that behavior, and I would hope the teams I root for wouldn't either. I just don't believe we should get into the practice of imposing our behavioral standards on others, regardless of the context. If you don't like taunting, don't taunt and don't support those who chose to do it. But it has NOTHING to do with the game itself, in terms of points scored, field position, and ultimately wins and losses.

If you want to get on your soap box and moralize about taunting, fine. But I think it is outrageous to expect your sensitivities to be codified in the rules of the game.

I understand where you're coming from. You're not coming off as supporting taunting.

But, the NCAA gets to govern the type of product that is on the field. They get to set the expected morality of their member institutions. So do lots of organizations. A coach partying it up with a bunch of 21-year-old coeds and drinking Natty Light doesn't affect how he does his job. It's not illegal. But, a university can fire that coach for not living up to their standards. (A stretch of an analogy? Maybe...)

The fact is, if the NCAA think that taunting hurts their brand (marketing-wise, family value-wise, etc), they can impose a stiff penalty to make sure that it doesn't happen.

 

[Rhode Irish]

I understand where you're coming from. You're not coming off as supporting taunting.

But, the NCAA gets to govern the type of product that is on the field. They get to set the expected morality of their member institutions. So do lots of organizations. A coach partying it up with a bunch of 21-year-old coeds and drinking Natty Light doesn't affect how he does his job. It's not illegal. But, a university can fire that coach for not living up to their standards. (A stretch of an analogy? Maybe...)

The fact is, if the NCAA think that taunting hurts their brand (marketing-wise, family value-wise, etc), they can impose a stiff penalty to make sure that it doesn't happen.

I agree with that. I guess I'm really arguing two different points here. (1) If the NCAA decides it has to do something to protect its brand, that is fine with me. I may not agree with it in principle, but that is their right.

But, (2) once they decide they are going to punish taunting, it seems asinine to me that they would take points off the board - points that the whole teams worked towards getting, that could mean peoples' jobs, etc. - rather than punish the individual player by making him ineligible for a series or throwing him out of the game or suspending him.

 

[amgarvey]

I am in the actual minority here. I dislike this rule intensely. I will never understand the whole "act as if you've been there" thing as it applies to celebrating. Many of these kids haven't! The same people that say this often have a set concept of how a celebration should take place. I have no problem with spontaneous displays of emotion. I don't want to hear that drop the ball and go celebrate with your teammates crap. It reminds me of when Weis was doing those kicks at the end of practice to avoid running and forced the team to go celebrate when the kicker made it. Everything was so scripted. I've never seen people look less excited about getting out of running. If you remove the spontanaeity, you remove the emotion, if you remove the emotion you have crappy college football. Sometimes players will go over the line. I thought the previous rule sufficiently addressed that.
I would like to point out that any high school or college grads we have are likely to have done a bit of excessive celebrating themselves. Perhaps rather than tossing our mortarboards in the air we should act like we've already graduated from college, leave them on our heads where they belong and go to dinner with our families. After all what purpose is served by launching them in the air?

 

[amgarvey]

On an unrelated note I would like to add that is always great to hear opposing coaches talk about your players. Especially if they refer to them as "super stars" with long term NFL potential. You would never ever ever hear those words come out of one of our coaches mouths.

 

[clashmore_mike]

<iframe src="http://player.vimeo.com/video/28422060" width="400" height="225" frameborder="0"></iframe><p><a href="http://vimeo.com/28422060">Crist ready to prove it</a> from <a href="http://vimeo.com/irishillustrated">Irish Illustrated</a> on <a href="http://vimeo.com">Vimeo</a>.</p>

<iframe src="http://player.vimeo.com/video/28422491" width="400" height="225" frameborder="0"></iframe><p><a href="http://vimeo.com/28422491">Looking back</a> from <a href="http://vimeo.com/irishillustrated">Irish Illustrated</a> on <a href="http://vimeo.com">Vimeo</a>.</p>

 

[clashmore_mike]

<iframe src="http://player.vimeo.com/video/28408656" width="400" height="225" frameborder="0"></iframe><p><a href="http://vimeo.com/28408656">Diaco stays in the moment</a> from <a href="http://vimeo.com/irishillustrated">Irish Illustrated</a> on <a href="http://vimeo.com">Vimeo</a>.</p>

 

[IrishJayhawk]

I am in the actual minority here. I dislike this rule intensely. I will never understand the whole "act as if you've been there" thing as it applies to celebrating. Many of these kids haven't! The same people that say this often have a set concept of how a celebration should take place. I have no problem with spontaneous displays of emotion. I don't want to hear that drop the ball and go celebrate with your teammates crap. It reminds me of when Weis was doing those kicks at the end of practice to avoid running and forced the team to go celebrate when the kicker made it. Everything was so scripted. I've never seen people look less excited about getting out of running. If you remove the spontanaeity, you remove the emotion, if you remove the emotion you have crappy college football. Sometimes players will go over the line. I thought the previous rule sufficiently addressed that.
I would like to point out that any high school or college grads we have are likely to have done a bit of excessive celebrating themselves. Perhaps rather than tossing our mortarboards in the air we should act like we've already graduated from college, leave them on our heads where they belong and go to dinner with our families. After all what purpose is served by launching them in the air?

You're also talking about things that happen after the TD has already been scored. In that case, it's a penalty, but the points stay up. The rule refers to an infraction (I know you don't think it's an infraction) that happens before he crosses the goal line, thus making the play dead.

But, on the dead ball, after-the-fact celebrations, I'm curious...what do you think about Joe Horn, TO, or Ocho Cinco celebrating (all pros, I know)? Those are entirely scripted celebrations.

And, FWIW, I didn't throw my mortarboard when I graduated.

 

[Rhode Irish]

Presented without comment.

 

[amgarvey]

You're also talking about things that happen after the TD has already been scored. In that case, it's a penalty, but the points stay up. The rule refers to an infraction (I know you don't think it's an infraction) that happens before he crosses the goal line, thus making the play dead.

But, on the dead ball, after-the-fact celebrations, I'm curious...what do you think about Joe Horn, TO, or Ocho Cinco celebrating (all pros, I know)? Those are entirely scripted celebrations.

And, FWIW, I didn't throw my mortarboard when I graduated.

The thing is I also really don't have a problem with some of the other stuff that happens pre crossing the line. Looking at Sharks taunt for example- Thats not something I want to see our players doing all the time, but under the right conditions (we don't know what kind of yapping he was listening to all game) it doesn't really irk me. High stepping is another thing that really doesn't bother me at all. If a guys that open and wants to cadillac a little bit cool. Do you really thing the other players are thinking, "Man look at that guy celebrating his touchdown not a team touchdown." Nope, their lovin' it.

As for the NFLers you referred to I just find their "routines" to be boring and a little bit pathetic.