'12 MD ATH Ronald Darby (Florida State Signee)

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koonja

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CurtisCandy said:
What's this "SEC speed" I keep hearing so much about?


...Oh yea, it's that stuff that's just a tick slower than ND speed...
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SEC speed is having great speed at every position... We're excited because we have one guy that runs a legit sub 4.4.That just goes to show how far away we are from an SEC team when it comes to speed. You have to start somewhere though, and who better to start with then Darby.
 
woolybug25

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kuehnja said:
SEC speed is having great speed at every position... We're excited because we have one guy that runs a legit sub 4.4.That just goes to show how far away we are from an SEC team when it comes to speed. You have to start somewhere though, and who better to start with then Darby.
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At every position? Show me one SEC nostackle that runs a 4.4. Or a longsnapper for that matter.

I think you meant, "many (because not all SEC schools are equal. See Vandy) SEC schools have sub 4.4 forty guys at most of their skill positions."

If I am wrong, and you truly believe that there is an SEC school where ALL (or even most for that matter) of their players run 4.4's, then we are simply talking on different wave lenghts.
 
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koonja

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woolybug25 said:
At every position? Show me one SEC nostackle that runs a 4.4. Or a longsnapper for that matter.

I think you meant, "many (because not all SEC schools are equal. See Vandy) SEC schools have sub 4.4 forty guys at most of their skill positions."

If I am wrong, and you truly believe that there is an SEC school where ALL (or even most for that matter) of their players run 4.4's, then we are simply talking on different wave lenghts.
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Look at the language of what I wrote... I never said SEC teams have 4.4 speed at every position, I said they have 'great speed at every position'. You'd have a difficult time making an argument against that. And when I, and probably anyone else mentions 'SEC football', it's usually understood that we're talking about the Floridas, the LSUs, the Alabamas, etc... Not the Vanderbilts, Kentuckys, etc
 
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IrishLax

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kuehnja said:
SEC speed is having great speed at every position... We're excited because we have one guy that runs a legit sub 4.4.That just goes to show how far away we are from an SEC team when it comes to speed. You have to start somewhere though, and who better to start with then Darby.
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SEC speed is a myth. Let me say that again, to make sure everyone is on the same page, SEC SPEED IS A MYTH.

Go check out the NFL 40 times some UF studs have posted the last couple years if you don't believe me. The reason SEC defenses are nasty has nothing to do with their guys actually having tons of pure foot speed. It has everything to do with the fact that they play hard and have "quick" (read: good reaction, lateral agility, 5/10 yard speed, whatever you want to call...) guys who pursue the ball well as a team. "SEC speed" was invented by talking heads as an explanation for why the SEC shut down teams from other conferences repeatedly in big time bowl games. It really has no basis in fact.

Darby is hardly the first fast guy on our roster. George and Josh Atkinson are both quite fast in their own right... not to mention guys like Bennett Jackson. And I know I'm probably forgetting some guys. Notre Dame's defensive problems never had anything to do with "speed" they had to do with scheme, player development, the S&C program that emphasized getting big, etc.
 
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koonja

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IrishLax said:
SEC speed is a myth. Let me say that again, to make sure everyone is on the same page, SEC SPEED IS A MYTH.

Go check out the NFL 40 times some UF studs have posted the last couple years if you don't believe me. The reason SEC defenses are nasty has nothing to do with their guys actually having tons of pure foot speed. It has everything to do with the fact that they play hard and have "quick" (read: good reaction, lateral agility, 5/10 yard speed, whatever you want to call...) guys who pursue the ball well as a team. "SEC speed" was invented by talking heads as an explanation for why the SEC shut down teams from other conferences repeatedly in big time bowl games. It really has no basis in fact.

Darby is hardly the first fast guy on our roster. George and Josh Atkinson are both quite fast in their own right... not to mention guys like Bennett Jackson. And I know I'm probably forgetting some guys. Notre Dame's defensive problems never had anything to do with "speed" they had to do with scheme, player development, the S&C program that emphasized getting big, etc.
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I couldn't disagree with you more about ND's defensive problems not stemming from lack of speed in the past... Did you see us during the Weis era? Giving up big play after big play... And I'm honestly not sure that we have a guy on the roster that runs a legit sub 4.4. Golden Tate didn't even do it at the combine! (4.41)

And if 'SEC speed' doesn't get mentioned at least 100 times this year during College Gameday, maybe then I'll believe it's just some 'myth' as you call it, and that they aren't actually faster than the other conferences.

We haven't been as fast as the SEC teams in the past. If you believe that, then you're drinking way too much homer kool-aid. But Darby is a step in the right direction.
 
Rocket89

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Hey, remember when UF's Brandon Spikes ran a 5.09 40-time at the combine?

Just having some fun on a Friday! IrishLax and kuehnja are both right to a degree.
 
military_irish

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kuehnja said:
I couldn't disagree with you more about ND's defensive problems not stemming from lack of speed in the past... Did you see us during the Weis era? Giving up big play after big play... And I'm honestly not sure that we have a guy on the roster that runs a legit sub 4.4. Golden Tate didn't even do it at the combine! (4.41)

And if 'SEC speed' doesn't get mentioned at least 100 times this year during College Gameday, maybe then I'll believe it's just some 'myth' as you call it, and that they aren't actually faster than the other conferences.

We haven't been as fast as the SEC teams in the past. If you believe that, then you're drinking way too much homer kool-aid. But Darby is a step in the right direction.
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Well Darrin Walls did run a 4.39 Terrail Lambert also ran somewhere around a 4.37 (yes i know he was here a couple years ago) and last I checked Eric Berry(Tennessee) who was pretty good ran a 4.47 and Major Wright(Florida) ran a 4.48 in 2010 combine, and Will Hill(Florida) ran a 4.6 and Ahmad Black(Florida) ran a 4.7. Just a couple quick names I looked up and they were considered pretty good in college and the SEC speed.

Also many players in the defensive backfield were clocked at 4.4 speed but those are from recruiting sites, so not sure how accurate those times can be.

Very rare do guys run sub 4.4, most of the time their is maybe 10-15 in the whole combine and maybe half or less are from the SEC.
 
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koonja

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military_irish said:
Well Darrin Walls did run a 4.39 Terrail Lambert also ran somewhere around a 4.37 (yes i know he was here a couple years ago) and last I checked Eric Berry(Tennessee) who was pretty good ran a 4.47 and Major Wright(Florida) ran a 4.48 in 2010 combine, and Will Hill(Florida) ran a 4.6 and Ahmad Black(Florida) ran a 4.7. Just a couple quick names I looked up and they were considered pretty good in college and the SEC speed.

Also many players in the defensive backfield were clocked at 4.4 speed but those are from recruiting sites, so not sure how accurate those times can be.
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I'm not talking about the exceptions. Anyone who says ND has recently been as fast as the top SEC teams is wrong. I'm talking about at every position... Not just the players who go to the combine or the draft, I'm talking all 11 positions on offense and defense, special teams, and back ups. SEC teams have been faster (or quicker to get to the ball) however you want to put it. I'm glad we got Darby, it's a step in the right direction.
 
military_irish

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kuehnja said:
I'm not talking about the exceptions. Anyone who says ND has recently been as fast as the top SEC teams is wrong. I'm talking about at every position... Not just the players who go to the combine or the draft, I'm talking all 11 positions on offense and defense, special teams, and back ups. SEC teams have been faster (or quicker to get to the ball) however you want to put it. I'm glad we got Darby, it's a step in the right direction.
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Yeah I agree Notre Dame may not be on par, yet, with the speed of some of the SEC teams, but they are far from head and shoulders over ND's speed. If on every broadcast all the announcers talk about speed speed speed and how much faster the SEC is. Everyone will have that engrained in their head.

With the addition of Darby, he is just another puzzle piece to having a National Championshop caliber team
 
IrishLax

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Let's take it out of the recruit's thread, I'm making a new post now.
 
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koonja

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military_irish said:
Yeah I agree Notre Dame may not be on par, yet, with the speed of some of the SEC teams, but they are far from head and shoulders over ND's speed. If on every broadcast all the announcers talk about speed speed speed and how much faster the SEC is. Everyone will have that engrained in their head.

With the addition of Darby, he is just another puzzle piece to having a National Championshop caliber team
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I totally agree. We had a great class last year and this year is starting out good too. We're on the right track.
 
woolybug25

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kuehnja said:
I'm not talking about the exceptions. Anyone who says ND has recently been as fast as the top SEC teams is wrong. I'm talking about at every position... Not just the players who go to the combine or the draft, I'm talking all 11 positions on offense and defense, special teams, and back ups. SEC teams have been faster (or quicker to get to the ball) however you want to put it. I'm glad we got Darby, it's a step in the right direction.
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So SEC teams have been faster at positions like G,T,C,LS,K, NT,DT? Even if so, why in the hell would it matter at those positions?
 
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koonja

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woolybug25 said:
So SEC teams have been faster at positions like G,T,C,LS,K, NT,DT? Even if so, why in the hell would it matter at those positions?
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Not necessarily, but faster at DE, OLB, MLB, CB, S, FB, RB, QB, WR, TE, PR, KR, Punt-gunner, Special teams in general, yes. No one's going to argue that SEC teams haven't been faster than ND teams in the past. Can we move on sticklers?
 
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Hey, there is fast and there is football fast. If you have both it is even better. And Kelly is getting it. Darby has it, Ishaq has it, Aaron has it, Manti already had it, the twins have it, Andrew and Everett have it, Lo has it, Eliar has it, etc.

We are getting it. It would have been nice to add it in Noor. But, the crew is being built. I love this team, and I love the direction.

And what I love even more is that others are feeling very uncomfortable arond the nation, especially Irish Haters. They know if we start winning at that high level again, the best players will start to come once again. We have already seen it with just the change in direction with Darby, the Twins, Tuitt, Ishaq, Aaron, Tee, DD, etc

The ND wave is coming, get on the wave or get taken out!!!!! :)
 
woolybug25

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kuehnja said:
Not necessarily, but faster at DE, OLB, MLB, CB, S, FB, RB, QB, WR, TE, PR, KR, Punt-gunner, Special teams in general, yes. No one's going to argue that SEC teams haven't been faster than ND teams in the past. Can we move on sticklers?
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Or corner, I suppose?

NFL Draft 40 Times

Vance Cuff (Georgia) - 4.55
Chris Culliver (SC) - 4.4
Patrick Peterson (LSU) - 4.34

- other elite corners

Prince Amukumara (Neb) - 4.43
Jimmy Smith (CO) - 4.46
Brandon Harris (MIA) - 4.45

Then there is good ol' Darrin Walls.... 4.43


TE?

Weslye Saunders (SC) - 4.85
Luke Stocker (TN) - 4.79
DJ Williams (Ark) - 4.67

Good ol' Kyle Rudolph - 4.78

I can go back and see how players like Tate, D Walker, Quinn, Stovall, etc did comparatively in their drafts if you like? I'm not saying that SEC teams havent had OVERALL faster players than ND lately, but saying that all positions (which was your original argument was) or even at every skill position is faster in the SEC, just doesn't holds water.
 
IrishLax

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WTF is wrong with you people! TAKE IT TO THE NEW THREAD! (Mod please move everything?)
 
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koonja

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woolybug25 said:
Or corner, I suppose?

NFL Draft 40 Times

Vance Cuff (Georgia) - 4.55
Chris Culliver (SC) - 4.4
Patrick Peterson (LSU) - 4.34

- other elite corners

Prince Amukumara (Neb) - 4.43
Jimmy Smith (CO) - 4.46
Brandon Harris (MIA) - 4.45

Then there is good ol' Darrin Walls.... 4.43


TE?

Weslye Saunders (SC) - 4.85
Luke Stocker (TN) - 4.79
DJ Williams (Ark) - 4.67

Good ol' Kyle Rudolph - 4.78

I can go back and see how players like Tate, D Walker, Quinn, Stovall, etc did comparatively in their drafts if you like? I'm not saying that SEC teams havent had OVERALL faster players than ND lately, but saying that all positions (which was your original argument was) or even at every skill position is faster in the SEC, just doesn't holds water.
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Again, you're looking at exceptions. Overall, at every position, top SEC schools have had faster players than ND has had. When's the last time you've heard someone say 'ND speed'? How about 'SEC speed'?

If you want to go through and look at exceptions from every year, be my guest. You must be taking the Noor Davis commitment to Stanford pretty hard. Have a cold one.
 
woolybug25

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kuehnja said:
Again, you're looking at exceptions. Overall, at every position, top SEC schools have had faster players than ND has had. When's the last time you've heard someone say 'ND speed'? How about 'SEC speed'?

If you want to go through and look at exceptions from every year, be my guest. You must be taking the Noor Davis commitment to Stanford pretty hard. Have a cold one.
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Your whole argument is filled with holes. Every year we have several players that have speed comparable to their SEC counterparts at their position... Every year. So like I said, I wont argue that the SEC's "Overall Team Speed" has been better (which you have just now backed down to, it was not your argument until this post), but that is not what you have been saying. You have been saying that they are consistently faster at all skill positions, which is false.

LAX.... where is this thread?
 
IrishLax

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woolybug25 said:
Your whole argument is filled with holes. Every year we have several players that have speed comparable to their SEC counterparts at their position... Every year. So like I said, I wont argue that the SEC's "Overall Team Speed" has been better (which you have just now backed down to, it was not your argument until this post), but that is not what you have been saying. You have been saying that they are consistently faster at all skill positions, which is false.

LAX.... where is this thread?
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Entitled "SEC Speed"... go to the front page or other college football forum.
 
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