'23 MO CB Christian Gray (Notre Dame Signee)

[PutuporShutup]

I think Gray was exhausted on the long bomb because he was playing man on motioning and streaking WRs all night with very few snaps off. Riley may be a bad HC but he's a great OC. He was doing to Gray what he did last year. Making him run 50 yard sprints following motions and horizontal routes and then dialing up a go route.

Saying that Gray wasn't putting forth effort is a complete trash take.

He was moving somewhat out there so that is a level of effort

Saying he went all out is disrespectful to the other 16 defenders that were actually going all out in the game.

There was a reason freeman had to get into him during the game and he almost never does that.

Please re watch the game before you disrespect NDs other defensive players like that.

His crappy effort started from the first series of the game. He was down on himself and absolutely gave up until he got the lucky interception on a terrible throw where his guy was wide open again.

I get it, he plays for ND so we want to believe something positive that isn’t true. I sure wish he was what we expected he would be after his frosh year. It just didn’t happen. We’re in a pickle because of his regression and lack of ability.

 

[Dale]

For giving up a 60 yard TD, I have a hard time beating Gray up on the play. He got beat for sure. But it was also an elite throw by Maiva that included holding Tae with his eyes till the last second before dropping it in a bucket. They only rushed three and doubled Lemon who basically didn’t run a route on the play. The best way to stop so a long route with a QB - WR of that caliber is to get pressure.

 

[Dale]

Gray has been targeted 27 in two games against USC, one of the better passing attacks in the country. ND has given him a breather for exactly zero snaps in those two games.

The lack of depth at CB is a far bigger glaring weakness than Gray himself.

 

[Te'o4Heisman]

For giving up a 60 yard TD, I have a hard time beating Gray up on the play. He got beat for sure. But it was also an elite throw by Maiva that included holding Tae with his eyes till the last second before dropping it in a bucket. They only rushed three and doubled Lemon who basically didn’t run a route on the play. The best way to stop so a long route with a QB - WR of that caliber is to get pressure.

Agree. Gray was pretty sticky all night even though he gave up some catches. The only play I was unhappy with him on was the one long play Lemon had with Gray covering him, and it was hard to tell if it was lack of effort or confusion/mental lapse on his part thinking he had somebody over the stop. He just kind of let Lemon run free in man and trailed 10-12 yards behind him.

 

[Ophiocordyceps]

Agree. Gray was pretty sticky all night even though he gave up some catches. The only play I was unhappy with him on was the one long play Lemon had with Gray covering him, and it was hard to tell if it was lack of effort or confusion/mental lapse on his part thinking he had somebody over the stop. He just kind of let Lemon run free in man and trailed 10-12 yards behind him.

Sticky? Gray was targeted 15 times and gave up seven receptions for 155 yards and one touchdown (could have been more). He was also flagged for two pass interferences and gave up a two point conversion. He did see redemption with the interception, but i wouldn’t say sticky. I would reserve that for Leonard Moore on Lemon.

 

[Te'o4Heisman]

Sticky? Gray was targeted 15 times and gave up seven receptions for 155 yards and one touchdown (could have been more). He was also flagged for two pass interferences and gave up a two point conversion. He did see redemption with the interception, but i wouldn’t say sticky. I would reserve that for Leonard Moore on Lemon.

86 of those yards were on two plays including the 27 yarder to Lemon I mentioned. He played on an island with single high safety much of the night and Maiava who came into the game at 72% and one of the highest rated/most efficient QBs in the country was at 47% when throwing at Gray. There were always going to be yards in the air to be had but he also had an INT and nearly a second and a couple of the completions took perfect throws. 90% of D1 corners are not asked to do what Christian Gray is asked to do on a game by game basis. He has admirable mental and physical stamina to do what he does.

Can he be better? Absolutely. Does he need to be better? Absolutely, but he played a competitive game against arguably the best passing attack in the country. Watched the game from 35 rows up at the 50…Gray was sticky much of the game.

 

[Ophiocordyceps]

86 of those yards were on two plays including the 27 yarder to Lemon I mentioned. He played on an island with single high safety much of the night and Maiava who came into the game at 72% and one of the highest rated/mist efficient QBs in the country was at 47% when throwing at Gray. There were always going to be yards in the air to be had but he also had an INT and nearly a second and a couple of the completions took perfect throws. 90% of D1 corners are not asked to do what Christian Gray is asked to do on a game by game basis. He has admirable mental and physical stamina to do what he does.

Can he be better? Absolutely. Does he need to be better? Absolutely, but he played a competitive game against arguable the best passing attack in the country. Watched the game from 35 rows up at the 50…Gray was sticky much of the game.

Good reply.

 

[Te'o4Heisman]

Sticky? Gray was targeted 15 times and gave up seven receptions for 155 yards and one touchdown (could have been more). He was also flagged for two pass interferences and gave up a two point conversion. He did see redemption with the interception, but i wouldn’t say sticky. I would reserve that for Leonard Moore on Lemon.

Gray had a play in the 1st Qtr where he was step for step with his man and deflected the pass high.
He had another of the same where Tae also was coming over the top and Gray jumped and almost had another interception.
He was shown in several zoomed out graphics where he had his man blanketed, including one where the broadcast mentioned great coverage by the entire secondary.
Then he had the nice interception but got beat on the TD.
Gray is a battler. He doesnt have to be Leonard Moore. This team is better because of guys like Christian Gray.

 

[NDPhilly]

I think a lot of CBs would look like shit if they had a guy like Moore who literally shuts down the other side of the field and forces the QB to target them.

 

[PutuporShutup]

Upon re watching I believe gray was responsible for the early “Hail Mary” while in zone. He jumped and doubled the tight end when he should have realized Hines was in his zone behind him. That was another 25 yards.

Did gray have a few good reps. Yes. Was gray the worst player on the field for either team. Yes. It’s not even close. Who he was covering was the first look every time other than screen plays.

 

[InKellyWeTrust]

Upon re watching I believe gray was responsible for the early “Hail Mary” while in zone. He jumped and doubled the tight end when he should have realized Hines was in his zone behind him. That was another 25 yards.

Did gray have a few good reps. Yes. Was gray the worst player on the field for either team. Yes. It’s not even close. Who he was covering was the first look every time other than screen plays.

Having an opinion doesn't make you right.

 

[Ophiocordyceps]

Gray had a play in the 1st Qtr where he was step for step with his man and deflected the pass high.
He had another of the same where Tae also was coming over the top and Gray jumped and almost had another interception.
He was shown in several zoomed out graphics where he had his man blanketed, including one where the broadcast mentioned great coverage by the entire secondary.
Then he had the nice interception but got beat on the TD.
Gray is a battler. He doesnt have to be Leonard Moore. This team is better because of guys like Christian Gray.

The only thing I would add was the interception was a badly throw ball which was behind the receiver. Gray was trailing on the play and would have been a completion if ball placement was accurate. Would people be so forgiving to him if ND lost the game? None of that matters as he did make the interception which was huge for momentum at that point in the game. I can’t help but cheer for a guy who never gives up, but he drives me (probably coaches as well) crazy sometimes. You are probably right that he makes the team better overall.

 

[PutuporShutup]

Having an opinion doesn't make you right.

Agree, but it doesn't make me wrong either.

Announcers said it over and over that USC was targeting whomever gray was covering as the first option all night. It worked out really well until they got into the red zone. It was much easier to provide help to gray down there. That's why the long TD pass was so frustrating to give up one so easy. He couldn't even re route or provide any coverage on players without grabbing.

Someone on here said gray was running like a baby giraffe. I can't think of a more accurate description. Since we won, we can laugh.

 

[PutuporShutup]

The only thing I would add was the interception was a badly throw ball which was behind the receiver. Gray was trailing on the play and would have been a completion if ball placement was accurate. Would people be so forgiving to him if ND lost the game? None of that matters as he did make the interception which was huge for momentum at that point in the game. I can’t help but cheer for a guy who never gives up, but he drives me (probably coaches as well) crazy sometimes. You are probably right that he makes the team better overall.

Agree with all of this until your last 2 sentences. He 100% gave up until freeman got on him. He didn't even attempt to run him down or defend 2 pt conversion.



You can clearly see he had middle of the field deep help. So i'm somewhat ok with him being so slow and allowing him free release and no re routing to the middle. But you cannot get beat deep back outside. Lane isn't a burner, and he got absolutely smoked back outside where he needed to be even with him. It's as bad as you can play the position, and the majority of the issue is effort from the snap. Gray already had a PI on the 2nd play of the drive. I believe (opinion) based on body language and effort that after the PI, he was so mentally out of it.

I personally would be giving hobbs/zackery some of his snaps to at minimum keep that position fresh, and take away that excuse.

 

[InKellyWeTrust]

Agree with all of this until your last 2 sentences. He 100% gave up until freeman got on him. He didn't even attempt to run him down or defend 2 pt conversion.



You can clearly see he had middle of the field deep help. So i'm somewhat ok with him being so slow and allowing him free release and no re routing to the middle. But you cannot get beat deep back outside. Lane isn't a burner, and he got absolutely smoked back outside where he needed to be even with him. It's as bad as you can play the position, and the majority of the issue is effort from the snap. Gray already had a PI on the 2nd play of the drive. I believe (opinion) based on body language and effort that after the PI, he was so mentally out of it.

I personally would be giving hobbs/zackery some of his snaps to at minimum keep that position fresh, and take away that excuse.

Can someone forward this to Chris Ash please?

 

[Jiggafini19Deux]

I think playing with Leonard Moore doesn't really make anyone else look good. That said, Gray has some faults, but he makes up for them with resilience. You're ready to give up on the guy and then he makes a big play.

Still think he's going to play a major role in the wars to come.

 

[FightingIrishLover7]

I personally would be giving hobbs/zackery some of his snaps to at minimum keep that position fresh, and take away that excuse.

Well, good news for you - they're going to be getting a shit ton of snaps really soon with the competition coming up.
Gray had a heck of an effort. He is not as talented as the USC WRs are on paper. He was gassed, and he still responded. That's what we needed. It can be better, but it was good enough.

 

[Irish du Nord]

Agree with all of this until your last 2 sentences. He 100% gave up until freeman got on him. He didn't even attempt to run him down or defend 2 pt conversion.



You can clearly see he had middle of the field deep help. So i'm somewhat ok with him being so slow and allowing him free release and no re routing to the middle. But you cannot get beat deep back outside. Lane isn't a burner, and he got absolutely smoked back outside where he needed to be even with him. It's as bad as you can play the position, and the majority of the issue is effort from the snap. Gray already had a PI on the 2nd play of the drive. I believe (opinion) based on body language and effort that after the PI, he was so mentally out of it.

I personally would be giving hobbs/zackery some of his snaps to at minimum keep that position fresh, and take away that excuse.

Big win and guess who shows up to bitch about a player with an INT and two PBUs?

 

[Me2SouthBend]

Upon re watching I believe gray was responsible for the early “Hail Mary” while in zone. He jumped and doubled the tight end when he should have realized Hines was in his zone behind him. That was another 25 yards.

Did gray have a few good reps. Yes. Was gray the worst player on the field for either team. Yes. It’s not even close. Who he was covering was the first look every time other than screen plays.

We figured this is your take after the first 50 times you wrote it. Give it a fucking break.

 

[KPENN]

We figured this is your take after the first 50 times you wrote it. Give it a fucking break.

Hey now, don’t talk like that to Mr. Genius Football man

 

[PutuporShutup]

We figured this is your take after the first 50 times you wrote it. Give it a fucking break.

What's disappointing is it's still the main issue that needs fixed, again, and again, and again, therefore it's relevant to continue talking about. ND had a great shot to make a statement saturday, and we didn't because of him. Happy with the win, but there's a reason we only moved up one in the AP.

We can get to the playoffs with him, but he's the weakest link if/when we play a team with 2 good WRs in the playoff.

I can't comprehend how people that want ND to win it all aren't pushing/hoping he gets benched or at minimum significantly reduced PT Everything is always an excuse for him, "his shoulder is sore so he can't tackle", "he must have a leg injury that's why he's so slow and running like a baby giraffe", "he played every snap so he's gassed, that's why he gave no effort".

Our next 2 games opponents have terrible WRs so he may not be an issue for a few weeks!!!!!

 

[Dale]

You gotta be some kinda dumb to blame our AP ranking on Christian Gray

 

[FightingIrishLover7]

We can get to the playoffs with him, but he's the weakest link if/when we play a team with 2 good WRs in the playoff.

Are you trying to suggest Gray isn't as good as Moore!? - cool it down, these hot takes are getting me worked up

 

[Old Man Mike]

I am over-the-Moon happy that we have Christian Gray on our football team.

And I wonder ... in the NFL, a lot of QBs are expected to have completion percentages WAY over 50%.
They must be throwing against really crummy cornerbacks I suppose, to have success rates like that?
Those NFL cornerbacks --- wow --- didn't realize till now how bad they (almost) all are. What bums!

... or is it that modern passing offenses and Uber-athlete receivers are REALLY hard to stop ... hmmm ... ?

 

[Ophiocordyceps]

Agree with all of this until your last 2 sentences. He 100% gave up until freeman got on him. He didn't even attempt to run him down or defend 2 pt conversion.



You can clearly see he had middle of the field deep help. So i'm somewhat ok with him being so slow and allowing him free release and no re routing to the middle. But you cannot get beat deep back outside. Lane isn't a burner, and he got absolutely smoked back outside where he needed to be even with him. It's as bad as you can play the position, and the majority of the issue is effort from the snap. Gray already had a PI on the 2nd play of the drive. I believe (opinion) based on body language and effort that after the PI, he was so mentally out of it.

I personally would be giving hobbs/zackery some of his snaps to at minimum keep that position fresh, and take away that excuse.

Hobbs? If an oral gummy goes not kick in right away, wait and don’t eat another.

 

[IrishSpartan]

I think he is hurt and playing through it

 

[Jeffwantpoppers]

The only team with better WRs than USC is Ohio State, so that’s a positive for future opponents.

 

[DCK_1981]

2 things: 1) playing with Moore is gonna mean more targets towards him. If USC can only get Lemon open a few times against Moore very few teams will throw his way. 2) apparently we are extremely thin at corner. When USC was slinging it as much as they were we shouldn’t have to expect our starters to play every snap. We should be good the last 4 games but after that I’m worried at our depth

 

[OrlaNDomer]

I love Christian Gray. That is all.

 

[PutuporShutup]

We figured this is your take after the first 50 times you wrote it. Give it a fucking break.

What's disappointing is it's still the main issue that needs fixed, again, and again, and again, therefore it's relevant to continue talking about. ND had a great shot to make a statement saturday, and we didn't because of him. Happy with the win, but there's a reason we only moved up one in the AP.

We can get to the playoffs with him, but he's the weakest link if/when we play a team with 2 good WRs in the playoff.

I can't comprehend how people that want ND to win it all aren't pushing/hoping he gets benched or at minimum significantly reduced PT Everything is always an excuse for him, "his shoulder is sore so he can't tackle", "he must have a leg injury that's why he's so slow and running like a baby giraffe", "he played every snap so he's gassed, that's why he gave no effort".

Our next 2 games opponents have terrible WRs so he may not be an issue for a few weeks!!!!!

You gotta be some kinda dumb to blame our AP ranking on Christian Gray

Blaming it on the eye test that is gray plus the result that is 34-24 when it should have been about 40-13 the way the rest of our D played and run game played. If we would have hammered USC like we should have (gray, short yardage, kicking) i have no doubt our AP is 10 or 11. It's not going to prevent us from getting in the CFP.

Are you trying to suggest Gray isn't as good as Moore!? - cool it down, these hot takes are getting me worked up

I'm not only suggesting he's not as good as moore, i'm also suggesting he's not as good as golden, or the other 13 ND defenders that played in the game, or the 18 USC defenders that played for them in the game.

Hobbs? If an oral gummy goes not kick in right away, wait and don’t eat another.

I didn't think an ND corner could play worse than Hobbs did vs A&M, but then Gray part 2 vs USC happened. At least Hobbs was trying to defend 2 WRs significantly more difficult to cover than Lane.