Politics

Politics

  • Obama

    Votes: 4 1.1%
  • Romney

    Votes: 172 48.9%
  • Other

    Votes: 46 13.1%
  • a:3:{i:1637;a:5:{s:12:"polloptionid";i:1637;s:6:"nodeid";s:7:"2882145";s:5:"title";s:5:"Obama";s:5:"

    Votes: 130 36.9%

  • Total voters
    352

Bishop2b5

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Apparently I struck a nerve and hurt some feelings with my insightful observation about our leftist friends here.

From 1/26/2024 2:00 pm
You're attempting to use facts and reason with emotional thinkers. It's like trying to explain calculus to a cat.

From 1/27/2024 5:13 pm
You're attempting to use facts and reason with emotional thinkers. It's like trying to explain calculus to a cat.

From 1/28/2024 10:58 pm
You're attempting to use facts and reason with emotional thinkers. It's like trying to explain calculus to a cat.
 

GATTACA!

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Yeah, because doctors pushing opioids was so long ago. Trust the doctors, they wouldn't cover up the truth to dissuade a patient.

Hey guys, trust the doctors. They always do the right thing.
Fv4w3BNWAAcFnai
Fv4w3BQX0AckCAa
Just a few bad apples. Wish we kept this same energy when discussing bad cops.
 

TorontoGold

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Yeah, because doctors pushing opioids was so long ago. Trust the doctors, they wouldn't cover up the truth to dissuade a patient.

Hey guys, trust the doctors. They always do the right thing.
Fv4w3BNWAAcFnai
Fv4w3BQX0AckCAa

Do you carry any smoke for the healthcare industry outside of kid parts or covid vaccines? Or does it conveniently stop when it's on a "political" matter. Imagine if you channeled your anger towards the handful of trans surgeries and thought about all the poor people that don't have access to healthcare because of the profit focus of the US healthcare system. But you won't because those nasty trans people must be stopped!

I know I know "moral sin is still sin" or whatever, but it's pretty obvious that your advocacy for the healthcare of children is focused solely on their private parts, and not that kids die or their parent's die from access to affordable healthcare.
 

GATTACA!

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The mental gymnastics to claim Biden would fix the border if not for the evil republicans at the same time he is suing the state of Texas for trying to protect their border is some next level shit. I don't know if I should applaud your gaslighting or pity the Idiocracy level mouth breathing.

At least be fair and marvel at the ability of establishment republicans to abuse their base. This epitomizes the reason Trump is even a thing.
I don't think anyone is under the guise that Biden wants to fix the "issue". He obviously doesn't care, this move is intended to show the hypocrisy of the GOP who clearly doesn't care either. If they were serious about fixing it they would pass the bill, but they won't because they need to be able to run on border security for November.

If Texas was serious about illegal immigration they would pass and enforce massive fines for any company employing illegals. But again they won't because they don't care and know illegal immigration is a huge boon for their economy. They get next to free labor and tons of federal funds on top. But they also have to pander to their xenophobic base, thus the 24/7 crying about it.
 

ulukinatme

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Do you carry any smoke for the healthcare industry outside of kid parts or covid vaccines? Or does it conveniently stop when it's on a "political" matter. Imagine if you channeled your anger towards the handful of trans surgeries and thought about all the poor people that don't have access to healthcare because of the profit focus of the US healthcare system. But you won't because those nasty trans people must be stopped!

I know I know "moral sin is still sin" or whatever, but it's pretty obvious that your advocacy for the healthcare of children is focused solely on their private parts, and not that kids die or their parent's die from access to affordable healthcare.

"Primum non nocere." Isn't that the mantra? Seems pretty reasonable, when did we get away from that?

There's a lot of battles to be fought, I'm only one man with limited time and resources. Call me back when you've solved world hunger.
 

TorontoGold

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"Primum non nocere." Isn't that the mantra? Seems pretty reasonable, when did we get away from that?

There's a lot of battles to be fought, I'm only one man with limited time and resources. Call me back when you've solved world hunger.
If your going to require every medical procedure to have 0 complications or 0 risk you aren't going to get anything done.

I'm glad you've decided to advocate for those really pressing issues. Despite paying taxes I don't get to vote, so it warms my heart that you can ensure my representation is spent on fighting unicorns. The easier and more effective path for your humanitarian efforts would be to advocate for greater government protections of citizens against big pharma corps and for better regulations. All those kids you claim to care about would do a lot better if they had better access to affordable healthcare.

For someone that really cares about the minutia of children's issues it's puzzling to me that you're staunchly a GOP supporter. Would have thought you'd support progressives that are pushing for better healthcare and access to children of all backgrounds.
 

drayer54

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I don't think anyone is under the guise that Biden wants to fix the "issue". He obviously doesn't care, this move is intended to show the hypocrisy of the GOP who clearly doesn't care either. If they were serious about fixing it they would pass the bill, but they won't because they need to be able to run on border security for November.

If Texas was serious about illegal immigration they would pass and enforce massive fines for any company employing illegals. But again they won't because they don't care and know illegal immigration is a huge boon for their economy. They get next to free labor and tons of federal funds on top. But they also have to pander to their xenophobic base, thus the 24/7 crying about it.
What can the GOP do right now? Look at what Abbot has done in the one red border state and the Biden admin files lawsuits to keep the border open. Don’t forget the shipped illegals to raise awareness and to prevent virtue signaling coastal elites from ignoring Eagle Pass.
 

PerthDomer

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This completely ignores that Biden can do it now. Biden is the one who is responsible for luring and welcoming millions of migrants. Biden caused it. Biden allowed it to happen. Throwing more money at DHS to “process” is not going to help. Giving Biden a target isn’t going to do anything. He’s defied the law and opened the floodgates. No reason to believe that will stop.

Biden can't do it now. Trump couldn't do it pre COVID (and had rising levels of border crossings). Remember the whole Caravan freakout before the 2018 midterms?
 

Jiggafini19Deux

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Hey guys, I know the trans thing is at the top of everyone's list of important issues, but in case you didn't know....Dems are running an op using Taylor Swift and Travis Kelce to endorse Biden for President at the Super Bowl.

Over 2.4 million followers, 2.2 million and 949k respectively below.





 
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drayer54

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Biden can't do it now. Trump couldn't do it pre COVID (and had rising levels of border crossings). Remember the whole Caravan freakout before the 2018 midterms?
If he held Trump levels, this would be way down the list. Killing remain in Mexico and ignoring the border crossing problem did it in.
 

ulukinatme

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If your going to require every medical procedure to have 0 complications or 0 risk you aren't going to get anything done.

I'm glad you've decided to advocate for those really pressing issues. Despite paying taxes I don't get to vote, so it warms my heart that you can ensure my representation is spent on fighting unicorns. The easier and more effective path for your humanitarian efforts would be to advocate for greater government protections of citizens against big pharma corps and for better regulations. All those kids you claim to care about would do a lot better if they had better access to affordable healthcare.

For someone that really cares about the minutia of children's issues it's puzzling to me that you're staunchly a GOP supporter. Would have thought you'd support progressives that are pushing for better healthcare and access to children of all backgrounds.

There's risks with just about any procedure. Primum non nocere is do no harm. Want and need are two different things. A cardiac victim may need a bypass to save his life. A child may want gender affirming surgery because they've been led to believe it'll make them happy.

Kids already have great access to healthcare in this country. My sister-in-law and her dead beat husband get better care for their kids than my wife and I do, and neither of them has a steady job outside of Doordash. They get free health care that beats what my company offers. They get a ton of free food too, to a point where their freezers are full and they try to take my wife grocery shopping for extra cash. At least kids in this country don't have to wait 27.7 weeks to get treatment like in Canada. Tell us more how we can improve our system.
 

TorontoGold

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There's risks with just about any procedure. Primum non nocere is do no harm. Want and need are two different things. A cardiac victim may need a bypass to save his life. A child may want gender affirming surgery because they've been led to believe it'll make them happy.

Kids already have great access to healthcare in this country. My sister-in-law and her dead beat husband get better care for their kids than my wife and I do, and neither of them has a steady job outside of Doordash. They get free health care that beats what my company offers. They get a ton of free food too, to a point where their freezers are full and they try to take my wife grocery shopping for extra cash. At least kids in this country don't have to wait 27.7 weeks to get treatment like in Canada. Tell us more how we can improve our system.
Lead to believe......by a healthcare team like Perth has wrote before that takes over a year to go through the steps.

And that's wrong? Being poor or a "deadbeat" shouldn't mean you don't receive good healthcare. Part of my political positions is that it's not borne out of a narcissistic "what about me" viewpoint because neoliberalism benefits me way more than being a progressive. Interesting how "family values" and "caring about the community" are thrown out the window as soon as somebody is perceived to be pulling a fast one.

Weird pivot to Canadian healthcare, but I'll bite - I can guarantee that the access to healthcare in Toronto is better than whatever the comparative option is for suburban Ohio/Indiana. What's a bigger number 83 or 77? Don't get me wrong there are many issues with the Canadian healthcare system (funny enough our own conservatives are trying to destroy it) but you can't chide us when you're spending more and getting less. Healthcare is literally a grift in the US - you're getting terrible outcomes for spending so much more than the rest of the world. You could get so much more bang for your buck in other system, but any sort of regulations would be communism or something and that's bad because poor people would live.

life-expectancy-vs-health-expenditure-v0-cmdfzu9m81pb1.png
 

ulukinatme

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Lead to believe......by a healthcare team like Perth has wrote before that takes over a year to go through the steps.

And that's wrong? Being poor or a "deadbeat" shouldn't mean you don't receive good healthcare. Part of my political positions is that it's not borne out of a narcissistic "what about me" viewpoint because neoliberalism benefits me way more than being a progressive. Interesting how "family values" and "caring about the community" are thrown out the window as soon as somebody is perceived to be pulling a fast one.

Weird pivot to Canadian healthcare, but I'll bite - I can guarantee that the access to healthcare in Toronto is better than whatever the comparative option is for suburban Ohio/Indiana. What's a bigger number 83 or 77? Don't get me wrong there are many issues with the Canadian healthcare system (funny enough our own conservatives are trying to destroy it) but you can't chide us when you're spending more and getting less. Healthcare is literally a grift in the US - you're getting terrible outcomes for spending so much more than the rest of the world. You could get so much more bang for your buck in other system, but any sort of regulations would be communism or something and that's bad because poor people would live.

life-expectancy-vs-health-expenditure-v0-cmdfzu9m81pb1.png

Where did I say giving free healthcare to a deadbeat was a problem? You seem to think children have access problems here, I'm just pointing out even the poorest children are taken care of.

Access and treatment aren't the same thing, are they? The average time from referral to treatment in Canada is 27 weeks, as mentioned. The average time in the US is 26 days. Not every system is perfect, but by all means continue to lecture us.
 

TorontoGold

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Where did I say giving free healthcare to a deadbeat was a problem? You seem to think children have access problems here, I'm just pointing out even the poorest children are taken care of.

Access and treatment aren't the same thing, are they? The average time from referral to treatment in Canada is 27 weeks, as mentioned. The average time in the US is 26 days. Not every system is perfect, but by all means continue to lecture us.
They're taken care of by getting shit treatment that leads to a worse life expectancy than every other peer country. They get in one day before a kid in Canada, fire, incredible work. It's like spending more to go to McD's than you would if you waited an extra 15 min for a table at Morton's.

Yeah I am the monolith for all Canadian Healthcare and by virtue of that, anything I say should be measured against the actions of my government. As a US tax payer I'm pissed that my dollars and the money my family and friends spend for care in the US is leading to shitty outcomes. But I guess since my conservative government has further worsened my own healthcare that means my opinion is stupid lol ok buddy, tell us more about how some poor person getting healthcare is working because they can afford to have a full fridge despite one of them working for Door Dash. I can not believe my opinion of "You're paying way too much for shitty care because your government and corporate class has sold you out" is refuted by "Well I know someone who's poor and has a full fridge has better healthcare than me!" and "Haha stupid you have to wait an extra day, therefore....you are wrong!".

You - Methinks that profit is behind doctors are pushing things
Me - So you agree that there should be stronger regulations and controls?
You - Uhhh wait times are long, don't lecture me bucko!
 

GATTACA!

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What can the GOP do right now? Look at what Abbot has done in the one red border state and the Biden admin files lawsuits to keep the border open. Don’t forget the shipped illegals to raise awareness and to prevent virtue signaling coastal elites from ignoring Eagle Pass.
Like I said, on a state by state basis they can remove the incentive for illegals to come there in the first place. If it was impossible for illegals to find employment in Texas they would either stop crossing through the Texas border, or they would come in and pass through to other places without the same laws that they could find jobs in.

They won't do that because they know it would be an economic disaster.
 

ulukinatme

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They're taken care of by getting shit treatment that leads to a worse life expectancy than every other peer country. They get in one day before a kid in Canada, fire, incredible work. It's like spending more to go to McD's than you would if you waited an extra 15 min for a table at Morton's.

Yeah I am the monolith for all Canadian Healthcare and by virtue of that, anything I say should be measured against the actions of my government. As a US tax payer I'm pissed that my dollars and the money my family and friends spend for care in the US is leading to shitty outcomes. But I guess since my conservative government has further worsened my own healthcare that means my opinion is stupid lol ok buddy, tell us more about how some poor person getting healthcare is working because they can afford to have a full fridge despite one of them working for Door Dash. I can not believe my opinion of "You're paying way too much for shitty care because your government and corporate class has sold you out" is refuted by "Well I know someone who's poor and has a full fridge has better healthcare than me!" and "Haha stupid you have to wait an extra day, therefore....you are wrong!".

You - Methinks that profit is behind doctors are pushing things
Me - So you agree that there should be stronger regulations and controls?
You - Uhhh wait times are long, don't lecture me bucko!

One day sooner? I thought you were a math/finance guy? 27 weeks - 26 days != 1 day. You think the healthcare system in the US is why we have a shorter life expectancy than another country? You don't think it might have something to do with our diet and obesity rates, our culture, our lack of exercise, or work habits?

Nobody is refuting your point that we're paying too much for health care in this country. You were the one lamenting the poor kids in this country didn't have good access to affordable health care. Using my sister-in-law as an example I was simply pointing out that free health care is given to the lower class, and it's often better than what us middle class shlubs and our corporate overlords pay for. I haven't looked at the breakdown for this year, but I contribute $200+ a paycheck bimonthly for myself and family while my employer pays at least that much or more on their end. At the end of the day I still have to pay a copay on top of that and the deductible is several thousand. My sister-in-law can take her kids to the same doctor and she doesn't even have a copay. So why you think I'm not agreeing with you on that point about the expensive nature of our health care...yeah, not sure what you're getting at there, I'm in agreement.

Of course, a wise man once said "If you think health care is expensive now, wait until you see what it costs when it's free."
 

GATTACA!

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Of course, a wise man once said "If you think health care is expensive now, wait until you see what it costs when it's free."
That wise man must be an idiot.

It's cheaper. Way cheaper.

 

ulukinatme

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That wise man must be an idiot.

It's cheaper. Way cheaper.


That says nothing about what the costs would be if we switched to socialized medicine in this country. The estimates are at least $1+ trillion increase to medical expenditures for the federal government, and you can guess who is going to foot that bill in the end. This estimate came from the Urban Institute, a liberal think tank. They had other options that included a possible $17.6 trillion option over 10 years.

jacobs11.24.a-768x503.jpg
 

TorontoGold

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One day sooner? I thought you were a math/finance guy? 27 weeks - 26 days != 1 day. You think the healthcare system in the US is why we have a shorter life expectancy than another country? You don't think it might have something to do with our diet and obesity rates, our culture, our lack of exercise, or work habits?

Nobody is refuting your point that we're paying too much for health care in this country. You were the one lamenting the poor kids in this country didn't have good access to affordable health care. Using my sister-in-law as an example I was simply pointing out that free health care is given to the lower class, and it's often better than what us middle class shlubs and our corporate overlords pay for. I haven't looked at the breakdown for this year, but I contribute $200+ a paycheck bimonthly for myself and family while my employer pays at least that much or more on their end. At the end of the day I still have to pay a copay on top of that and the deductible is several thousand. My sister-in-law can take her kids to the same doctor and she doesn't even have a copay. So why you think I'm not agreeing with you on that point about the expensive nature of our health care...yeah, not sure what you're getting at there, I'm in agreement.

Of course, a wise man once said "If you think health care is expensive now, wait until you see what it costs when it's free."
I misread it, that was my bad.

Absolutely part of the reason why life expectancy is much lower. If there was a good healthcare system in place you'd be up to at least where Canada is, as you point out there are still many issues we have. That healthcare that is available to them is clearly not good enough. Infant mortality rates are higher in the US than Canada, that should not be a thing given the greater availability of world class doctors in your borders. 18% higher! Its even worse when you look at Europe which does a lot better than both US/CA. If anyone on the Right actually cared about children and not just using them in culture wars they would try to work at improving that rate to be at least better than Canada which is pretty dogshit compared to the rest of the developed world.

I would encourage that wise man to look at case studies at other countries that exist in the world and take a gander at how those countries are doing. Maybe that wise man can look at the % of GDP that's being spent on healthcare and tell them that other countries are doing just fine spending less per capita. I would encourage those that look at him as a wise man and question whether they are actually wise or just trying to keep the frog comfy as the pot is boiling him to death.
 

ulukinatme

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I misread it, that was my bad.

Absolutely part of the reason why life expectancy is much lower. If there was a good healthcare system in place you'd be up to at least where Canada is, as you point out there are still many issues we have. That healthcare that is available to them is clearly not good enough. Infant mortality rates are higher in the US than Canada, that should not be a thing given the greater availability of world class doctors in your borders. 18% higher! Its even worse when you look at Europe which does a lot better than both US/CA. If anyone on the Right actually cared about children and not just using them in culture wars they would try to work at improving that rate to be at least better than Canada which is pretty dogshit compared to the rest of the developed world.

I would encourage that wise man to look at case studies at other countries that exist in the world and take a gander at how those countries are doing. Maybe that wise man can look at the % of GDP that's being spent on healthcare and tell them that other countries are doing just fine spending less per capita. I would encourage those that look at him as a wise man and question whether they are actually wise or just trying to keep the frog comfy as the pot is boiling him to death.

5.1 deaths in the US vs. 4.3 in Canada per 1,000. Obviously there's room for improvement, but both countries are in the Top 25% globally. We're talking not even a full death per 1,000 in difference, no need really to toot the horn. In the Western Hemisphere only Bermuda is higher than the US and Canada, which lends itself to the European point you made. That said, I'm not sure the European numbers can be trusted, I saw a lot of conflicting numbers on COVID reporting and other medical stats, but I don't want to open a new can of worms.

We're going to have to agree to disagree on the health care being the main factor in life expectancy differences. I'm supposed to see my doctor at least once every 6-12 months for checkups, but I'm the kind of guy that only goes in when somethings wrong. My insurance covers those visits, I just choose not to use them. My doctor tells me I'm overweight, and I know it. I work out when I have time, but it can be streaky depending on the kids' schedules and I couple that with a terrible diet. The point is my doctor can push me all he wants to improve my lifestyle, but if I don't follow through is it my doctor's fault? Obesity, diet, lifestyle, culture, these are things that are hurting Americans' life expectancy, not the billions we overspend on healthcare.
 

TorontoGold

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5.1 deaths in the US vs. 4.3 in Canada per 1,000. Obviously there's room for improvement, but both countries are in the Top 25% globally. We're talking not even a full death per 1,000 in difference, no need really to toot the horn. In the Western Hemisphere only Bermuda is higher than the US and Canada, which lends itself to the European point you made. That said, I'm not sure the European numbers can be trusted, I saw a lot of conflicting numbers on COVID reporting and other medical stats, but I don't want to open a new can of worms.

We're going to have to agree to disagree on the health care being the main factor in life expectancy differences. I'm supposed to see my doctor at least once every 6-12 months for checkups, but I'm the kind of guy that only goes in when somethings wrong. My insurance covers those visits, I just choose not to use them. My doctor tells me I'm overweight, and I know it. I work out when I have time, but it can be streaky depending on the kids' schedules and I couple that with a terrible diet. The point is my doctor can push me all he wants to improve my lifestyle, but if I don't follow through is it my doctor's fault? Obesity, diet, lifestyle, culture, these are things that are hurting Americans' life expectancy, not the billions we overspend on healthcare.

Number of top surgeries done in the US was 282 in 2021 lol.

CDC says there was 3,659,289 so there were ~18,662 deaths at a rate of 5.1, at 4.3 you get ~15,735.

There's more kids dying at birth than are getting top surgery by 10x if you just get to CA's levels, oh and the kids getting top surgery aren't dropping dead after it.

Pretty easy subject for Republicans to voice their concern on it, supposed to be the sanctity of life party, right? All children matter?

This is just an easy showcase that GOP'ers don't care about kids, it's never been more obvious than with trans kids.
 

GATTACA!

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5.1 deaths in the US vs. 4.3 in Canada per 1,000. Obviously there's room for improvement, but both countries are in the Top 25% globally. We're talking not even a full death per 1,000 in difference, no need really to toot the horn. In the Western Hemisphere only Bermuda is higher than the US and Canada, which lends itself to the European point you made. That said, I'm not sure the European numbers can be trusted, I saw a lot of conflicting numbers on COVID reporting and other medical stats, but I don't want to open a new can of worms.
1/1,000 makes it about 10,000x more common than the mutilated trans kids we can't stop hearing about.
We're going to have to agree to disagree on the health care being the main factor in life expectancy differences. I'm supposed to see my doctor at least once every 6-12 months for checkups, but I'm the kind of guy that only goes in when somethings wrong. My insurance covers those visits, I just choose not to use them. My doctor tells me I'm overweight, and I know it. I work out when I have time, but it can be streaky depending on the kids' schedules and I couple that with a terrible diet. The point is my doctor can push me all he wants to improve my lifestyle, but if I don't follow through is it my doctor's fault? Obesity, diet, lifestyle, culture, these are things that are hurting Americans' life expectancy, not the billions we overspend on healthcare.
Just because you don't use your access to healthcare doesn't mean that there are people without that wouldn't use it. Also you say you don't go until something is wrong, lots of people don't even have that option. Or will brush off the obvious signs of something being horribly wrong in the hopes of it going away because they're so scared of going into insane healthcare debt.

Junk food isn't any more prevalent in the US than it is in Canada or the UK. The obvious reason our results are worse is because of access. Big insurance companies have brainwashed people into thinking the American way is the only way because they're the ones that make record breaking profit off of it every year.

That should never be a thing for the greatest country in world.

Edit: Toronto beat me to the punch lol
 
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PerthDomer

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5.1 deaths in the US vs. 4.3 in Canada per 1,000. Obviously there's room for improvement, but both countries are in the Top 25% globally. We're talking not even a full death per 1,000 in difference, no need really to toot the horn. In the Western Hemisphere only Bermuda is higher than the US and Canada, which lends itself to the European point you made. That said, I'm not sure the European numbers can be trusted, I saw a lot of conflicting numbers on COVID reporting and other medical stats, but I don't want to open a new can of worms.

We're going to have to agree to disagree on the health care being the main factor in life expectancy differences. I'm supposed to see my doctor at least once every 6-12 months for checkups, but I'm the kind of guy that only goes in when somethings wrong. My insurance covers those visits, I just choose not to use them. My doctor tells me I'm overweight, and I know it. I work out when I have time, but it can be streaky depending on the kids' schedules and I couple that with a terrible diet. The point is my doctor can push me all he wants to improve my lifestyle, but if I don't follow through is it my doctor's fault? Obesity, diet, lifestyle, culture, these are things that are hurting Americans' life expectancy, not the billions we overspend on healthcare.

A large part of this is true. Our elevated death rates are largely public health failures and primary care coordination issues. America is great at resource intense procedures. If you get into the hospital with cancer and can pay for treatment the US is where you want to be treated. If you land in an ER and can be seen in a timely manner America is where you want to get a cath.

Healthcare is expensive in Anerica because we have an interplay of private and public systems that systemically leads to cost escalation. The government cannot bargain with pharmaceutical companies. Fragmented players (insurers, hospitals) get in billing arms races with each other.

It's a pity the debate on Healthcare focuses on US/Canada/UK. Each has an awful system in different ways. France/Germany/Switzerland/Japan have systems that see lower shortages and cost far less. They're mixed payer with universal care and very strict regulations on insurance providers. They don't massively subsidize subspecialty and neglect primary care.

We spend 17% of GDP on healthcare. The Swiss spend 12% which is just after the US. That means we pay what the Swiss pay plus TWICE THE PERCENT OF GDP WE SPEND ON THE MILITARY. The French system costs less that US medicare/Medicade spending.

If you wonder where the GDP to fix the debt and pay for expanding our military in the face of China would come from, it's fixing healthcare. We literally light our money on fire under our current system.
 

TorontoGold

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A large part of this is true. Our elevated death rates are largely public health failures and primary care coordination issues. America is great at resource intense procedures. If you get into the hospital with cancer and can pay for treatment the US is where you want to be treated. If you land in an ER and can be seen in a timely manner America is where you want to get a cath.

Healthcare is expensive in Anerica because we have an interplay of private and public systems that systemically leads to cost escalation. The government cannot bargain with pharmaceutical companies. Fragmented players (insurers, hospitals) get in billing arms races with each other.

It's a pity the debate on Healthcare focuses on US/Canada/UK. Each has an awful system in different ways. France/Germany/Switzerland/Japan have systems that see lower shortages and cost far less. They're mixed payer with universal care and very strict regulations on insurance providers. They don't massively subsidize subspecialty and neglect primary care.

We spend 17% of GDP on healthcare. The Swiss spend 12% which is just after the US. That means we pay what the Swiss pay plus TWICE THE PERCENT OF GDP WE SPEND ON THE MILITARY. The French system costs less that US medicare/Medicade spending.

If you wonder where the GDP to fix the debt and pay for expanding our military in the face of China would come from, it's fixing healthcare. We literally light our money on fire under our current system.
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Yeah but you know, the "people" with the highest risk profile are....well you know.....ANYWAYS how many trans surgeries can we stop if we start trans-police?
 

fightingirish26

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Number of top surgeries done in the US was 282 in 2021 lol.

CDC says there was 3,659,289 so there were ~18,662 deaths at a rate of 5.1, at 4.3 you get ~15,735.

There's more kids dying at birth than are getting top surgery by 10x if you just get to CA's levels, oh and the kids getting top surgery aren't dropping dead after it.

Pretty easy subject for Republicans to voice their concern on it, supposed to be the sanctity of life party, right? All children matter?

This is just an easy showcase that GOP'ers don't care about kids, it's never been more obvious than with trans kids.
Well done
 

drayer54

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Pretty easy subject for Republicans to voice their concern on it, supposed to be the sanctity of life party, right? All children matter?

This is just an easy showcase that GOP'ers don't care about kids, it's never been more obvious than with trans kids.
What a deranged take. Kids do matter, which is why we tell them they can’t buy a cigarette at age 12 or a rifle or a beer. Chopping their genitals off falls in the same category. Do what you want as an adult. People who actually care about kids don’t hide behind the baseless choice of mutilation or suicide and let kids grow into who they are before making them decide.
 

Irish#1

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If your going to require every medical procedure to have 0 complications or 0 risk you aren't going to get anything done.

I'm glad you've decided to advocate for those really pressing issues. Despite paying taxes I don't get to vote, so it warms my heart that you can ensure my representation is spent on fighting unicorns. The easier and more effective path for your humanitarian efforts would be to advocate for greater government protections of citizens against big pharma corps and for better regulations. All those kids you claim to care about would do a lot better if they had better access to affordable healthcare.

For someone that really cares about the minutia of children's issues it's puzzling to me that you're staunchly a GOP supporter. Would have thought you'd support progressives that are pushing for better healthcare and access to children of all backgrounds.
Stay focused. The discussion was about kids and trans care, not overall healthcare.
 

RDU Irish

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I don't think anyone is under the guise that Biden wants to fix the "issue". He obviously doesn't care, this move is intended to show the hypocrisy of the GOP who clearly doesn't care either. If they were serious about fixing it they would pass the bill, but they won't because they need to be able to run on border security for November.

If Texas was serious about illegal immigration they would pass and enforce massive fines for any company employing illegals. But again they won't because they don't care and know illegal immigration is a huge boon for their economy. They get next to free labor and tons of federal funds on top. But they also have to pander to their xenophobic base, thus the 24/7 crying about it.

Agreed on the first part - If republicans wanted to fix it they would have passed comprehensive reform under Trump. They fought him the whole way and wouldn't even fund the wall.

Vehemently disagree on placing this on businesses - now that one out of ten people in this country are here illegally it is pretty damn ridiculous put the full force of the legal system on businesses and individuals for hiring the people the government enabled across the border. Absurd to let these people in and THEN forbid them from working to support themselves unless they steal someone's identity or work in the black market economy. First act in our country is to break the law (entering illegally) and the system is set up such that they pretty much HAVE to keep breaking the law to support themselves which has no negative consequence for them..... but fine the business - brilliant! And all anyone wants to talk about is pathways to citizenship or else you are a racist xenophobes.

Republicans suck worse than Dems on this issue by a mile - because they stand for nothing. They use the "business hiring illegals" cudgel just as much as Dems b/c they shake down their donors to get feds to look the other way.
 
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