Federal Memo about Information Leaks

[Cackalacky]

I think this deserves its own thread. This makes me sick to my stomach. It is pretty much an Obama policy however I think the roots and justification were laid down in the Patriot Act.

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[ShawneeIrish]

Whenever the government launches a "war" on an ill-defined, broadly classified enemy with no end in sight (i.e. War on Communism, War on Drugs, War on Terror) it is disastrous for civil liberties and the "war" itself often does more damage than the enemy. This is particularly disturbing. I do not think its much of an exaggeration to say we are living in more and more of a police state and that American democracy is on life support if not dead.

 

[Rizzophil]

Both parties are at fault. Will Americans come together?

We are a government for the people!

 

[mgriff]

It seems like everyone I talk to totally agrees with me that this country is and has been on the wrong track. However, how the hell are we still making the same mistakes? My only answer is that the majority of the American public isn't as aware as I am. We have the ability to change the status quo, but enough people haven't woken up, because we are still trying to change the country through the same old channels with the same results. Nothing is changing and until more people become aware, we will continue our downward trajectory.

 

[Cackalacky]

It seems like everyone I talk to totally agrees with me that this country is and has been on the wrong track. However, how the hell are we still making the same mistakes? My only answer is that the majority of the American public isn't as aware as I am. We have the ability to change the status quo, but enough people haven't woken up, because we are still trying to change the country through the same old channels with the same results. Nothing is changing and until more people become aware, we will continue our downward trajectory.

I feel the same way, while trying not to come off as a tinfoil hat guy, I have tried to show my friends and family the stuff that is going on. Most of them only care about the 2nd Amendment and keeping gays from marrying so I am fighting an uphill battle showing how the 1, and 4-10 Amendments are gone, but the effective co-opting of the government and press by corporations is almost complete.

I also am not so sure about what happened to Michael Hastings. Now the Guardian reporter "aided and abetted" Snowden according to a certain Mr. Gibson with a Sunday morning news show. smh

 

[Black Irish]

People won't go for real change if it requires even a modest change in their living standard. Most people are all for making grand things happen as long as they don't have to lift a finger to help.

 

[Fbolt]

I do not think its much of an exaggeration to say we are living in more and more of a police state and that American democracy is on life support if not dead.

Have you ever been to a police state? It's a great combination of words that creates an impact, but I have a sneaking suspicion not many here have actually ever spent time in a police state. Although I may agree that the country is sliding (and has been) down a slippery slope, we aren't close IMO.

 

[cody1smith]

What we have is not great bye any means. But you don't have to spend much time in ANY other country to realize its the best thing going. But I agree, the patriot act and all that are spinning off of it are a huge pull on our rights as Americans.

 

[ShawneeIrish]

Have you ever been to a police state? It's a great combination of words that creates an impact, but I have a sneaking suspicion not many here have actually ever spent time in a police state. Although I may agree that the country is sliding (and has been) down a slippery slope, we aren't close IMO.

Yes, I have been to state's with serious intelligence agencies that monitor their populations extensively. I guess it depends on what you consider a police state, but whatever your definition I think there is a very good chance I've been to a nation that fits your standard. In my opinion a nation that imprisons more of its population than I believe any nation on Earth, monitors an extraordinary amount of communications, has a huge prison industrial complex that is being increasingly privatized, is cracking down on dissent and freedom of the press, has legal authority to detain or kill citizens without trial can qualify as a police state.

Just as an example that not just throwing around catch phrases with no idea what it is like to spend time in a police state, I've been to 10 of 21 on this list including #1, also been to other states that are authoritarian and probably what you have in mind.

The World's Biggest Police States - Business Insider

Just to add clarification I think the methodology of this list in simply calculating police per capita is pretty stupid, but did not have time to seek out a better list.

 

[Fbolt]

Although I did ask you, that was not my intent-I was merely throwing out my belief that not many have spent time in a
"real"police state and therefore it's difficult to judge the US as one. Apologies.

IMO-not many countries on that list are what I would consider to be a police state. I do not have a better list though.

 

[ShawneeIrish]

Although I did ask you, that was not my intent-I was merely throwing out my belief that not many have spent time in a
"real"police state and therefore it's difficult to judge the US as one. Apologies.

IMO-not many countries on that list are what I would consider to be a police state. I do not have a better list though.

OK man, no problem. Sorry if I was overly defensive. I would also agree that is a poor list. I think Egypt and Russia are legitimately considered police states, but while I could be wrong because I do not know enough of their inner workings, I would not think places like France and Spain really qualify. I think it also depends on what metric one is using, for example Colombia has a huge military/police presence but I doubt their surveillance capabilities are very extensive, where as the United Kingdom has more CCTV monitoring than probably any nation on Earth but does not have a heavy handed police force.

 

[BobD]

Begin rant: Wah, wah, wah. I'm so sick of hearing this "we're becoming a police state and the government is out to get us" crap. Tell ya what, try voicing your opinions like you've done here in mainland China or even Russia. Our society is becoming so fkng soft and whiney. This is one of those times when I get fed up and say "if it's that fkn bad, by all means, please feel free to leave". Our government can't make everyone happy and never will. You folks need to realize there are very bad people out there and they enjoy hearing this "poor restricted monitored us" crap. They laugh and hope you succeed in your endeavor to handcuff our government, so they can carry on with their goal of destroying America. End rant.

You guys are all awesome.
Peace

 

[Rhode Irish]

OK, I don't like the idea of the government spying on its citizens, and I usually like the Young Turks' stuff, but this is an overreaction. How many Dept of Agriculture employees have been charged with espionage? If you're a federal employee and you "leak" information that could jeopardize national security then you should be tried for espionage and spend the rest of your life in jail. I don't find that to be an objectionable position for our government to take, and I don't see any evidence that they have overstepped in that regard.

 

[Fbolt]

Agreed

 

[irish1958]

I spent several months working at a hospital in Haiti in 1964 and it was the most peaceful and safe place I have ever been. This was one of the world's most vicious police states at the time. While I was there an occasional person would not show up and would never be heard from again. Nobody would speak a word about the government or its enforcer arm (Tonton Macoute).
There were check points every 20-40 km on every road. The local newspaper had no political or social information. There was no political or social discussion among the hospital staff and any hint was met with icy silence. One day a member of our hospital staff didn't show up for work and hadn't appeared by the time I left for the USA. On the way to the airport to leave, we were returned to our hotel and were told to stay there. There were a lot of gun shots and flashes that night and when we were allowed to leave, there were several bodies hanging on the road to the airport.
I don't think we live in a police state.
I am glad the government tries to identify terrorist before the fact and not after they crash air liners into our cities or plant bombs at the finish lines of races.
As near as I can tell, the same people who cry that we live in a police state and are "profiling" were pissed off at the FBI for not preventing the Boston tragedy.
There are really bad guys out there who do not have your welfare at heart.

 

[kmoose]

Just as an example that not just throwing around catch phrases with no idea what it is like to spend time in a police state, I've been to 10 of 21 on this list including #1, also been to other states that are authoritarian and probably what you have in mind.

The World's Biggest Police States - Business Insider

I've been to 4 [Malta, Cyprus, Bulgaria, Macedonia(x2)], and didn't see ANY indication of a "beaten down" populace. So yeah, the term is kind of subjective.

 

[Buster Bluth]

Whenever the government launches a "war" on an ill-defined, broadly classified enemy with no end in sight (i.e. War on Communism, War on Drugs, War on Terror) it is disastrous for civil liberties and the "war" itself often does more damage than the enemy. This is particularly disturbing. I do not think its much of an exaggeration to say we are living in more and more of a police state and that American democracy is on life support if not dead.

This x1000.