ND players Wonderlic scores????

[IrishSteelhead]

I was discussing Morris Claiborne's epic Wonderlic score (4) last night with a friend, and we got to wondering how Irish players have fared on that particular test at the combine. Does anybody have some info, preferably the highlights and lowlights?

 

[Sherm Sticky]

I was discussing Morris Claiborne's epic Wonderlic score (4) last night with a friend, and we got to wondering how Irish players have fared on that particular test at the combine. Does anybody have some info, preferably the highlights and lowlights?

The scores are usually confidential. But, I do remember Clausen scored in the low 20 I believe.

 

[RyCo1983]

I scored a 32 on the Wonderlic that I had to take for my current employer.
I'd have done better if I wasn't suffering from a sinus infection.
I'm sure that some of the guys on the team who chose ND for academics have done better than I did. There are some intelligent kids on the squad.

 

[Sherm Sticky]

I scored a 32 on the Wonderlic that I had to take for my current employer.
I'd have done better if I wasn't suffering from a sinus infection.
I'm sure that some of the guys on the team who chose ND for academics have done better than I did. There are some intelligent kids on the squad.

32 is still pretty good. You only get 10 minutes right?

 

[GoIrish41]

I think you get a 4 for remembering to breathe during the test.

 

[dublinirish]

Clairborne didnt finish his test though

 

[IrishSteelhead]

Clairborne didnt finish his test though

So he says. If he did in fact quit the test, that is bigger red flag to me than getting a 4. I'll take stupidity over insubordination any day as an employer. Did he walk out of exams at LSU too?

 

[Cackalacky]

Although I understand it looks bad that he did not take it seriously, but really this is all moot. The kid has great instincts and football IQ, is physically gifted and will succeed in the NFL barring any devatstaing injuries. I recently read an article on how outdated the NFL drafting process is anyway. The manner in which people are "drafted" is really pretty outmoded when you think about it. The combine (meat market), wonderlic (no basis in on field performance), pro days... and if I am not mistaken there is some kind of car salesman "foursquare" template used since the 60s or so.

The article I am thinking of was two studies that showed how there really is no difference between players outside the top 15 or so picks and you are basically 50/50 hit or miss with all picks. This was done by financial experts using methods they use to pick stocks. If you look at the teams that historically have done well in the draft (GB, New England etc) they get lots of value for their picks, where as teams like Washington, Dallas, Minnesota historically get terrible value for their picks.

I know Dallas drafted Clairborne but how much "value" did they give up to get him?

I am sorry for the pseudorant, I am not a fan of the draft.

 

[RyCo1983]

32 is still pretty good. You only get 10 minutes right?

12 minutes. 50 questions. Very rarely does anyone finish all 50.
I was angry haha. Freaking sinuses and the meds that cloud the mind when you take them! I have no tolerance for meds.
I'm sure some of the premed and law students have and will rock some pretty impressive scores.

 

[PANDFAN]

they are supposed to be kept confidential as someone already said; however when someone gets a very low score some how it gets leaked

 

[woolybug25]

So he says. If he did in fact quit the test, that is bigger red flag to me than getting a 4. I'll take stupidity over insubordination any day as an employer. Did he walk out of exams at LSU too?

Didn't Claiborne have a learning disability that he didn't want disclosed? I remember something about him showing up and realizing that they weren't going to accommodate his disability so he left?

 

[IrishSteelhead]

Didn't Claiborne have a learning disability that he didn't want disclosed? I remember something about him showing up and realizing that they weren't going to accommodate his disability so he left?

Like I said, the fact that he's a quitter is more harrowing to me than the fact that he's an idiot.

 

[woolybug25]

The I said, the fact that he's a quitter is more harrowing to me than the fact that he's an idiot.

Well, I never saw the dude ever quit on a play. If he truly had a learning disability that wasn't accommodated, then I really don't blame the kid. I don't think that walking out on the wonderlic should be an overhanging judgement on the entirety of his intelligence or character. The Cowboys didn't think so either.

If quitting seems like a concern, then the Wonderlic is a poor judge of that trait. I would look at how he acted on the field, and on the field, the dude was a warrior.

 

[IrishSteelhead]

Well, I never saw the dude ever quit on a play. If he truly had a learning disability that wasn't accommodated, then I really don't blame the kid. I don't think that walking out on the wonderlic should be an overhanging judgement on the entirety of his intelligence or character. The Cowboys didn't think so either.

If quitting seems like a concern, then the Wonderlic is a poor judge of that trait. I would look at how he acted on the field, and on the field, the dude was a warrior.

I would never argue his ability and drive on the field. Guy is a beast, and will make multiple Pro-Bowls.

*I'm just tired of players from clown colleges getting a slew of excuses thrown their way when they bomb that test and prove to be someone who is illiterate.

 

[ohara831]

Well, I never saw the dude ever quit on a play. If he truly had a learning disability that wasn't accommodated, then I really don't blame the kid. I don't think that walking out on the wonderlic should be an overhanging judgement on the entirety of his intelligence or character. The Cowboys didn't think so either.

If quitting seems like a concern, then the Wonderlic is a poor judge of that trait. I would look at how he acted on the field, and on the field, the dude was a warrior.

As I understand it, you are correct. He does have a learning disability which is accommodated in the classroom. It was not for this test, and when it was clear the questions did not have to do with football, he stopped taking it. People who are unfamiliar with learning disabilities should take some time to learn about the matter before condemning the kid. I've seen kids struggle with this my whole life. I'm just glad the young fellow has such God given talent for the game. And I hope for his sake that he is surrounded with family who will make sure he has the fight people around him to help him manage his money.

 

[ohara831]

Like I said, the fact that he's a quitter is more harrowing to me than the fact that he's an idiot.

To call a kid with a learning disability an idiot is heartless and beneath you as a member of IE.

 

[Cackalacky]

*I'm just tired of players from clown colleges getting a slew of excuses thrown their way when they bomb that test and prove to be someone who is illiterate.

This is just wrong on so many levels....

The wonderlic test is about as useful as a grocery cart with no wheels. It is an out dated test and part of an outdated methodology of evaluating an NFL player. This has no bearing on his character, intelligence, or anything else. The fact that someone leaked his score, if in fact that is what it was, is just plain wrong.

He is obviously not illiterate and will not be required to solve differential equations or America's debt problem so I think he will be just fine making millions of dollars blowing recievers up in the NFL.

 

[IrishSteelhead]

This is just wrong on so many levels....

The wonderlic test is about as useful as a grocery cart with no wheels. It is an out dated test and part of an outdated methodology of evaluating an NFL player. This has no bearing on his character, intelligence, or anything else. The fact that someone leaked his score, if in fact that is what it was, is just plain wrong.

He is obviously not illiterate and will not be required to solve differential equations or America's debt problem so I think he will be just fine making millions of dollars blowing recievers up in the NFL.

To say the Wonderlic is useless in determining success in the NFL is something I can agree with, but to say it in no way measures a person's intelligence is short-sighted.

I can personally guarantee a person who scores in the 40's on this test is overall more intelligent than someone who scores in the single digits, and that is indisputable.

 

[Cackalacky]

To say the Wonderlic is useless in determining success in the NFL is something I can agree with, but to say it in no way measures a person's intelligence is short-sighted.

I can personally guarantee a person who scores in the 40's on this test is overall more intelligent than someone who scores in the single digits, and that is indisputable.

I will take you up on that. First of all, i would like to know your definition of intelligence and how it is measured accurately for every person.

 

[JughedJones]

I will take you up on that. First of all, i would like to know your definition of intelligence and how it is measured accurately for every person.

Boom.

This is the (correct IMO) argument against all standardized tests, especially those that attempt to gauge general intelligence.

They're all biased towards upbringing and cultural norms.

Of course they attempt to make them as neutral as possible, but a truly unbiased *standardized* test is, by definition, impossible.

 

[TDHeysus]

intelligence = the ability to learn.

like all abilities (running, jumping, sports, music, academics, etc) some ppl are better at it than others.

 

[Cackalacky]

intelligence = the ability to learn.

like all abilities (running, jumping, sports, music, academics, etc) some ppl are better at it than others.

Just not true and too simple a definition

 

[Cackalacky]

Boom.

This is the (correct IMO) argument against all standardized tests, especially those that attempt to gauge general intelligence.

They're all biased towards upbringing and cultural norms.

Of course they attempt to make them as neutral as possible, but a truly unbiased *standardized* test is, by definition, impossible.

Yes it is impossible to accurately reflect an intangible and subjctive thing such as intelligence. It is merely a reflection of what we hold as a community to be the norm.

Further many people with learning disabilities actually have above average "intelligence" as measured by most standardized tests.

 

[Bogtrotter07]

One guy from Harvard or Yale got a 49 once. Carlson had a really high score, too. I can't remember much else. Oh, yeah that dynamic kinese receiver corps of Maningham and whatshis name from scUM a couple years ago got an 8 and a 6 respectively.

But what is the need to put down someone who maybe just cannot test well? I can, I have one kid who can't, but there ain't that much difference between our functional intelegence if not our standardized IQ's.

I believe that most companies use it as one of a battery of tests to determine how individuals best learn.

I have a mentor and friend who is a PHD Anthropologist, and ND grad, who knows the guy who designed it, and my friend thinks not very highly of it. He thinks people give it to far reaching value and misinterpret the results too easily.

 

[Redbar]

I have heard that all standardized test are inherently culturally biased and the most natural measure of intellect is the ability to acquire languages. CIA has used linguistics and language acquisition as indicators of ability. Which would explain a lot because I can barely speaka inglish real good.

 

[GUknights75]

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[johnnykillz]

Your comment is very good

Random.

 

[irishtrain]

As I understand it, you are correct. He does have a learning disability which is accommodated in the classroom. It was not for this test, and when it was clear the questions did not have to do with football, he stopped taking it. People who are unfamiliar with learning disabilities should take some time to learn about the matter before condemning the kid. I've seen kids struggle with this my whole life. I'm just glad the young fellow has such God given talent for the game. And I hope for his sake that he is surrounded with family who will make sure he has the fight people around him to help him manage his money.

Let me get this straight you're telling me this guy with a learning disability belongs in a university and playing college football and should be catered to so he can get thru by any means to stay eligible for the football team-do I have that correct sir?

 

[Cackalacky]

Let me get this straight you're telling me this guy with a learning disability belongs in a university and playing college football and should be catered to so he can get thru by any means to stay eligible for the football team-do I have that correct sir?

I fully believe any person should be afforded the right to an education and resonable means of attaining it. If that requires a special device to enhance hearing, or a personal computer to be able to read better, or a personal tutor to reinforce classroom material then yes, so be it. And if that is provided at the request and expense of a full ride to the university becasue of their physical gifts then yes even more so. Intelligence and learning does not occur just in the classroom and all intelligence is not derived from books or the educational environment.

I suggest you watch the ESPN special on Johann Olav Koss and his "Right to Play" organization.

Or just read about the role of sport in children's lives in general. Especially those who have nothing else or have had it all taken away