This has got 2 stop...

[Clausen2Kamara]

All of the bashing of CW, I've had enough. If Vince Lombardi were coaching us, it wouldn't be much different. Its not CW's fault JCC forces his throws. I liked his gameplan today. He ran it down their throats as much as he could therefore limiting our mistakes..I agree it was a bit premature to take our starters out but my lord some of you guys are making it painful for me to be an Irish fan. I come on here to talk about ND. Yes, we let 2 games slip away but I'm just happy we've been competitive in all of our games. Remember last year? We could easily be 8-2 but we're 6-4...is that CW's fault? Please pick 6's did us in in both of those games. We have vastly improved since last season and anybody who can not see that, well I do not know what to tell you. Turnovers on the road is the diff btw us being 8-2 and 6-4..Obviously recruits like Shaq Evans keep jumping aboard because they believe in our future, its time for us to start believing in them too.

 

[tko]

it won't stop until we see some results on the field. what we see on the field is a direct result of the coaching provided in practice, period. i was a weis apologist for a long time but i can no longer support him on the field. his recruiting is tremendous but he can't get it done between the lines. every team who is well coached owns us as evidenced by our record against "ranked" teams.

 

[Rocket's Rocket Fan]

Great post C2K.

 

[fishbain19]

You've had enough Weis bashing ? Well get used to it, because it isn't going to stop unless Weis can learn to coach real soon.

 

[WaveDomer]

Yeah, I don't know anymore. At what point can you assign blame to Weis, a person who molds QBs, for mistakes that Clausen makes? At some point coaching has got to take hold. College coaching is about teaching and inspiring. Coaching in college is about a lot more than X's and O's. I think ND is between a rock and a hard place no matter what they decide to do.

 

[Clausen2Kamara]

it won't stop until we see some results on the field. what we see on the field is a direct result of the coaching provided in practice, period. i was a weis apologist for a long time but i can no longer support him on the field. his recruiting is tremendous but he can't get it done between the lines. every team who is well coached owns us as evidenced by our record against "ranked" teams.

While I understand your statement, I do not get your logic..If we would have recovered that first on side kick, I think it would be a moot point. CW and co have put this team in a position to win if just about every game. Its errors by our young talent that has done us in, not our coaching..Go look at Matt Staffords stats last year, very comparable to JC this year..I think this team has a very bright future and can play with anybody..In 2009, if we do not win 9 games, then I agree with all of you naysayers, until then, I will take a 7-5 record with a bowl win and momentum going into 2009..All of our playmakers are fresh and soph..we are only gonna get better.

 

[TC_57]

How many coaches does ND have to fire before someone realizes that there is more broken here than just the coaching. Everyone is waiting for this great savior to come down from the heavens and lift ND to its former greatness. Not even Lou could get it "done" anymore towards the end of his tenure.

 

[WaveDomer]

How many coaches does ND have to fire before someone realizes that there is more broken here than just the coaching. Everyone is waiting for this great savior to come down from the heavens and lift ND to its former greatness. Not even Lou could get it "done" anymore towards the end of his tenure.

What's broken? You have a great education. You have a boatload of support and money. You have recruiting that is lights out. You have an awesome facility. You have national exposure every week. What's broken?

 

[fishbain19]

How many coaches does ND have to fire before someone realizes that there is more broken here than just the coaching. Everyone is waiting for this great savior to come down from the heavens and lift ND to its former greatness. Not even Lou could get it "done" anymore towards the end of his tenure.

You're right it's not just the coaches, it's the administration too. ND has become a hideous breed of loser, thanks to Monk.

 

[roto-stud]

Was it Weis's fault when R. Parrish hits the ball out of bounds and then laughs about it before he gets trucked on the next kick. Was it Weis fault that when the second team defense got a chance to play and Navy went through them like butter... The second team O Line had a chance to score and couldn't push it through from the three yard line... Jonas Gray gets a chance to play and coughs it up... these second team players were not ready to play and in future games keep them benched.
and in the end we won... we dominated the game until our "hands team" never put there hands on the football... having Hughs in Floyds spot really hurt... C2K nice post...

 

[WaveDomer]

Was it Weis's fault when R. Parrish hits the ball out of bounds and then laughs about it before he gets trucked on the next kick. Was it Weis fault that when the second team defense got a chance to play and Navy went through them like butter... The second team O Line had a chance to score and couldn't push it through from the three yard line... Jonas Gray gets a chance to play and coughs it up... these second team players were not ready to play and in future games keep them benched.
and in the end we won... we dominated the game until our "hands team" never put there hands on the football... having Hughs in Floyds spot really hurt... C2K nice post...

Sorry to say, but it is the coach's job to know who is ready to play and who isn't. If a player is undisciplined he either needs to get discipline or not play. If players aren't ready to make the plays on the field, they shouldn't be on the field. They don't put themselves in to play.

 

[jakerbluegold]

I'm on the fence. If CW wins us a bowl game, he's in, if not, maybe we need to go a different direction. I don't know guys, it's just frustrating as hell. This is way better than last year, but I have an empty feeling realizing that we haven't beaten anyone worth a shite.

 

[fortwayne_nd]

Perhaps this will be a better test if CW is the man...which program returns to national prominence first, Notre Dame or Michigan? The Fatman has a head start on DickRod. Time will tell.

 

[kmoose]

Not even Lou could get it "done" anymore towards the end of his tenure.

I don't condone calling for Weis' head, but Lou certainly was still getting it done, towards the end of his tenure.

He won 9(1995) and 8(1996) games in his last two years, losing only 3 in each of those years. They finished ranked both years.

 

[TC_57]

Wavedomer, all the examples that you just gave are reasons why I love ND. But also, with all that going for them, when was the last bowl victory? When was the last NC? When was the last time ND hired it's 1st coaching choice? With all this great institution has going for it, it shouldn't be that hard to field a dominant team from year to year. Something is broken and if I knew how to fix it, I would be very rich right now. But it ain't just the coaching.

 

[nd1988]

You've had enough Weis bashing ? Well get used to it, because it isn't going to stop unless Weis can learn to coach real soon.

agree......time to take off the irish beer googles and see what is really happening...he can't motivate his players...

 

[TC_57]

Kmoose, I was not trying to call out Lou. My point was that someone made the decision that his services were no longer needed and that Davie was the answer at that time. I think 8 or 9 wins is a good year, but obviously there are those who felt it was not good enough.

 

[WaveDomer]

Wavedomer, all the examples that you just gave are reasons why I love ND. But also, with all that going for them, when was the last bowl victory? When was the last NC? When was the last time ND hired it's 1st coaching choice? With all this great institution has going for it, it shouldn't be that hard to field a dominant team from year to year. Something is broken and if I knew how to fix it, I would be very rich right now. But it ain't just the coaching.

The main excuses I always hear are: academics too hard and bad location. These are blown out of the water when you see Weis's recruiting classes. Money is no problem because they shoveled a ton at Weis. Exposure is never a problem. Good kids want to go and play there. I think the other problems, like getting top first choice coaches, is due to being in a rut and coaches like Urban Meyer thinking, "If Davie and Willingham couldn't recruit there, I'm not going to try." So I think most of those complaints are just excuses.

 

[IrishAddiction]

Yeah, i think we should fire Charlie right after the team won the game and became bowl eligible!!!! that makes sense right? (sarcasm implied).............. nice post C2K, its good to know some other people can see good things down the road.

 

[WaveDomer]

Kmoose, I was not trying to call out Lou. My point was that someone made the decision that his services were no longer needed and that Davie was the answer at that time. I think 8 or 9 wins is a good year, but obviously there are those who felt it was not good enough.

I think there was more to Lou going then just the win count.

 

[kmoose]

Kmoose, I was not trying to call out Lou. My point was that someone made the decision that his services were no longer needed and that Davie was the answer at that time. I think 8 or 9 wins is a good year, but obviously there are those who felt it was not good enough.

That's an assumption on your part, unless you were involved in the process? Other people are of the opinion that Lou was forced out, before he could surpass Rockne as ND's all time winningest coach. I don't know which one is true, but I can buy either perspective.

 

[Bubba]

I am tired of the bashing also. But, I'm not happy with his coaching either. Here's my 2 cents. He needs to let these kids play with emotion and passion. I know that can lead to mistakes and penalties, but we're already doing that...so let these kids have fun. And, he needs to prove that he meant what he said when he said we'd be a mean and nasty football team. I did like our running game today, but we need to prove we can do that against a bigger d-line. We need to win in the trenches!

I'm being very patient. But, I say he's got one more year. If we don't win at least 10 games next year, he needs to go. Until then I'm going to support this team no matter what. After that, I'll re-evaluate next year.

 

[kmoose]

The main excuses I always hear are: academics too hard and bad location. These are blown out of the water when you see Weis's recruiting classes. Money is no problem because they shoveled a ton at Weis. Exposure is never a problem. Good kids want to go and play there. I think the other problems, like getting top first choice coaches, is due to being in a rut and coaches like Urban Meyer thinking, "If Davie and Willingham couldn't recruit there, I'm not going to try." So I think most of those complaints are just excuses.

The thing is...........Meyer, as I hear it, wanted to come. The story I heard goes that Meyer wanted ND to suspend the "no JC transfer" rule, for two players a year. The Administration refused, and Meyer moved on to Florida. I'm ok with that. I would prefer that ND NOT majorly compromise their academic standards, just to win football games. Meyer apparently pointed to Tony Rice, a Prop 48 student who Holtz managed to get admitted to the University, as precedent for his request. The thing was...........NO ONE questioned Holtz's commitment to academics. Especially not after Rice graduated in four years, just as Holtz had promised the Administration that he would do.

 

[ARALOU]

There were many reasons to blame for Lou leaving. He says that he got burned out. I have heard it was partly because the new AD increased admission requirements, and would not let Lou recruit a kid until he gave his blessing. I also heard it had something to with Lou and the AD not getting along at all. I also heard that Lou's wife was in bad health at the time and could not devote as much as he needed to the program. I dont how many or if any of these are true but I surmise that some of it is.

 

[ARALOU]

The thing is...........Meyer, as I hear it, wanted to come. The story I heard goes that Meyer wanted ND to suspend the "no JC transfer" rule, for two players a year. The Administration refused, and Meyer moved on to Florida. I'm ok with that. I would prefer that ND NOT majorly compromise their academic standards, just to win football games. Meyer apparently pointed to Tony Rice, a Prop 48 student who Holtz managed to get admitted to the University, as precedent for his request. The thing was...........NO ONE questioned Holtz's commitment to academics. Especially not after Rice graduated in four years, just as Holtz had promised the Administration that he would do.

Was Bettis a prop48? I was thinking either he or Waters was. That is another thing that Lou did not like ... No more JUCO's or Prop 48s. Not sure how many he had but he had a bunch at South Carolina. Just like Alabama this year and Florida 3 years ago. Not sure about when ND ever let them in or just stopped. I always heard that Holy Cross sort of helped some players become "eligible". (someone else may be more accurate in their knowledge)

 

[TC_57]

Never made any excuses about recruiting or anything else. But with all that this institution has going for it, why is it such a struggle to reach that elite status and stay there? If it is all do to the coaching, why is it so difficult to find the right coach? CW was not ND's first choice. Why isn't anyone drooling over the opportunity to coach in South Bend?

 

[NDFLA]

OK, I have calmed down a little bit after feeding my new daughter and I have a few things that I would like to post and then I will see you all next week.
First, I am happy with a win, because we are now Bowl eligible and I look forward to seeing the Irish play in the Gator Bowl. A win, isn't a win, but this one was important and they pulled it out. We are pretty much guaranteed a winnning season and that is a great improvement from last year.
Second, we all new that this year was where we would start to rebuild, and I think some early success made us all a little greedy. One week we are going to be unstoppable and the next, we will never be winners again. We have improved, even if it doesn't seem like it as of late, and this team will win next year. Charlie isn't going anywhere, no matter how much we bitch on this site. So let's just relax and see if he can correct HIS mistakes and make this team better.
That being said, Charlie definately has to change a few things to make this team the huge success that we have all come to expect. He needs to learn to motivate and inspire these kids. That is what Lou was truly great at. I heard him speak once and I felt that I could go out on the feild and crush the opponent myself. Charlie doesn't have that. He wants it, just doen't have it. He also needs to forget about going easy and letting off the gas. We need to score as fast and as often as possible. Blowouts are fun for players and helps them get confidence. Confidence breeds emotional play.
This year has been rough, but the Irish are right where alot of you thought they would be. A bowl win is what we need now to consider this year a success. It will be extremely tough, but it can definately happen.

Still trying to keep the faith, since I have no choice anyway. Go Irish!!!

 

[ARALOU]

Never made any excuses about recruiting or anything else. But with all that this institution has going for it, why is it such a struggle to reach that elite status and stay there? If it is all do to the coaching, why is it so difficult to find the right coach? CW was not ND's first choice. Why isn't anyone drooling over the opportunity to coach in South Bend?

Incredible pressure to compete for NCs and the recruiting pool is limited by academics. Plain and simple. I am not saying we cant win this way. I am just saying that is why coaches no longer beat down the door to coach there. I remember when several had "Notre Dame" clauses in their contract. One fun thing to do is check and see how many successful current coaches and asst. coaches passed through Notre Dame
(as assistants) . A few of the names might surprise you.

 

[kmoose]

Was Bettis a prop48? I was thinking either he or Waters was. That is another thing that Lou did not like ... No more JUCO's or Prop 48s. Not sure how many he had but he had a bunch at South Carolina. Just like Alabama this year and Florida 3 years ago. Not sure about when ND ever let them in or just stopped. I always heard that Holy Cross sort of helped some players become "eligible". (someone else may be more accurate in their knowledge)

As far as I know, and I am by no means a historian on such things, Tony Rice was the only Prop 48 kid ever to play for the Irish.

 

[NeuteredDoomer]

All of the bashing of CW, I've had enough. If Vince Lombardi were coaching us, it wouldn't be much different. Its not CW's fault JCC forces his throws. I liked his gameplan today. He ran it down their throats as much as he could therefore limiting our mistakes..I agree it was a bit premature to take our starters out but my lord some of you guys are making it painful for me to be an Irish fan. I come on here to talk about ND. Yes, we let 2 games slip away but I'm just happy we've been competitive in all of our games. Remember last year? We could easily be 8-2 but we're 6-4...is that CW's fault? Please pick 6's did us in in both of those games. We have vastly improved since last season and anybody who can not see that, well I do not know what to tell you. Turnovers on the road is the diff btw us being 8-2 and 6-4..Obviously recruits like Shaq Evans keep jumping aboard because they believe in our future, its time for us to start believing in them too.

Otherwise good post, but why would some other fan's opinion affect your diehardoness for ND?

(Curious - and you don't need to answer, but, have you ever played a single down of tackle football?)