Lebron vs. Jordan

[anarin]

LeBron wasted 7 years of his career with key pieces like Larry Hughes, Booby Gibson, and Sasha Pavlovic.

Horrible Examples! Way to twist it so it sounds good.

Pavlovic - played 6 seasons and only played more then 20 minutes per game in 2 of those.
Hughes - played 2 1/2 seasons and averaged around 14 pts a game.
Gibson - Played 4 seasons and only started 52 games total. Managed to average 10 points a game in the year he started 26 games.

Now how about the players that actually played:

The year that Lebron went to the finals with the Cavs, his top supporting cast of Hughes, Ilgauskas, Pavlovic and Gooden provided him roughly 47 points per game, his 27 points average put them at 74 points for a starting group.

You say, well 47 points from a supporting cast sucks right?

I bring you to to the 03-04 World Champion Pistons who had ZERO superstars and were built on solid players that played like a team. Hamilton, Billups, Prince, Wallace and the other Wallace came up with 68 points a game.

Well that's the Pistons, it doesn't count.

The first time Jordan won a championship, his supporting cast of Grant, Pippen, Paxson, and Cartwright gave him roughly 49 points per game, his 31 points average put them up to 80 points a game.

So whats the argument here? Championship teams normally have 1 superstar player with a supporting cast. If the Cavs team was THAT bad then there is no way they make it to the Finals. You talk as if he played on a sub .500 team and was stuck in mediocrity.

 

[clashmore_mike]

Mavericks, Pistons, and maybe the Rockets of the 90s are the only teams since the 80s that have one "superstar" and won a title.

Lakers Kobe/Shaq plus great role players, Lakers fell off when Shaq left, didn't win again until Gasol/Artest were added.

Celtics Garnett/Allen/Pierce/Rondo

Spurs Duncan/Ginobili/Parker and Duncan/Robinson

Heat Wade/kind of Shaq

Bulls Jordan/Pippen plus Rodman/Kukoc (what happened when Jordan took two years off? Did they make playoffs or set all kinds of records for futility?)

Detroit Thomas/Dumars/Rodman/Laimbeer

Shall I continue or is that enough? Its laughable to think LeBron or anyone could win with the collection of bums he had in Cleveland. Maybe you didn't watch those teams, but the rosters were bad.

 

[Grahambo]

Mavericks, Pistons, and maybe the Rockets of the 90s are the only teams since the 80s that have one "superstar" and won a title.

Lakers Kobe/Shaq plus great role players, Lakers fell off when Shaq left, didn't win again until Gasol/Artest were added.

Celtics Garnett/Allen/Pierce/Rondo

Spurs Duncan/Ginobili/Parker and Duncan/Robinson

Heat Wade/kind of Shaq

Bulls Jordan/Pippen plus Rodman/Kukoc (what happened when Jordan took two years off? Did they make playoffs or set all kinds of records for futility?)

Detroit Thomas/Dumars/Rodman/Laimbeer

Shall I continue or is that enough? Its laughable to think LeBron or anyone could win with the collection of bums he had in Cleveland. Maybe you didn't watch those teams, but the rosters were bad.

Excuse me, 3 years at UNC not 4.

If you take a look at the 9'0-'91 Bulls (MJ's first title) and the '06-'07 Cavs (LBJ's first title appearance), the Bulls defense was far worse then the Cavs but offense was far superior. Offensively, the Bulls were about 14 points better but on defense were about 10 points worse. Looking at the supporting cast, Cleveland did not have a bad cast. They had more players (4) to average double digit points then the Bulls (3). The Cavs also had 4 players average 6.7 rebounds a game or more while the Bulls had only 2 average higher then 6.7. Without getting further in depth, the reason the Bulls won was because of MJ. He averaged 31.5 PPG, 5.5 APG, and 6 RPG. Everything from FG% to TO, MJ was superior to MJ at. LBJ even averaged 3.9 more minutes then MJ did.

I'd argue the Cavs got to the Finals BECAUSE of the supporting cast.

'90-'91 Bulls: 1990-91 Chicago Bulls Roster and Statistics | Basketball-Reference.com

'06-'07 Cavs: 2006-07 Cleveland Cavaliers Roster and Statistics | Basketball-Reference.com

 

[clashmore_mike]

I'd argue the Cavs got to the Finals BECAUSE of the supporting cast.

I'd argue you are insane.

 

[PerthDomer]

Your points Jordan points Lebron points supporting casts comparison is bogus. Jordan was a more pure scorer than Lebron, Lebron is a much better passer than Jordan. It therefore stands to reason that Lebron is going to account for more overall team scoring than Jordan.

Cavs-Lebron=worst NBA team

Bulls-Jordan=Playoffs

QED

 

[polishjuice4]

Your points Jordan points Lebron points supporting casts comparison is bogus. Jordan was a more pure scorer than Lebron, Lebron is a much better passer than Jordan. It therefore stands to reason that Lebron is going to account for more overall team scoring than Jordan.

Cavs-Lebron=worst NBA team

Bulls-Jordan=Playoffs

QED

Colts-Manning=worst NFL team
49ers-Montana=Playoffs
I guess that makes Manning the greatest quarterback of all time. He is not, although he is very good, top five. That does not make him the best player but more valuable to the team.

 

[JDAtlanta]

Passing to Kerr or Paxson, two great 3-point shooters, is slightly different from passing to Udonis Haslem for a 20-footer.

Miami spent all their money on three guys.

 

[Redbar]

Say something...anything...tell me a joke...post a pick up line...post a gif...or a video, just for the love of M&M's quit talking about political nonsense. And go!

I get it...

I just wanted to read something that wasn't political!

I totally get it...

Jordan

/end thread

This! It is sort of a tongue-in-cheek thread and I love it for that. It is not really a debatable question except for people who never saw Jordan, or maybe people from Cleveland, or maybe a Heat fan. Jordan was the most dominant player, (in a sport where one player can dominate more than any other team sport), the game has seen in the modern era. It was as if everyone else was there just as a stage and props for MJ. He was head and shoulders above everyone in his day and it is painful to my ears to hear someone try to equate LBJ or even Kobe (who is IMO more deserving) to the one and only Air Jordan.

P.S. (My tongue was in my cheek, not for the veracity of the statement, only in the indignant tone.)