Clausen leaving early??

[irishandy]

So I have been reading many posts and people are making comments that Clausen could leave early?? I think that he will stay all 4 years. What does everyone else think??

 

[IrishAlum1997]

I think he stays 4 years, particularly if he ends next season as a top-10 Heisman guy. I think he would like the hardware.

 

[Ultimate Penn St. Hater]

Lets get through his Sophomore year. Way early to be talking early entry for the draft. Kinda ridiculous if you ask me.

 

[Irishlew]

him and Floyd will stay all 4. This isn't Miami.

 

[BDIrish4ever]

Lets get through his Sophomore year. Way early to be talking early entry for the draft. Kinda ridiculous if you ask me.

UPS is right. Can we at least get through his Sophomore year before we start to this kind of speculation?

 

[NeuteredDoomer]

UPS is right. Can we at least get through his Sophomore year before we start to this kind of speculation?

No.

Even if my team goes 4 and a bunch, this guy is freegin special.

I will say right now that I have never in my life seen (only after the 3 games that I have watched) a more accurate passer. He comes from QB royalty, from a University with an equally proud football history. Incidentally, I estimate I have driven through about 42 U.S states, and my drive through Tennessee was the first breathtaking and amazing state I ever drove through. I freegin believed God was braggin when I drove through that state. (There was a drive between New Mexico/Arizona that also drew the angel's voices, but...back to the point).

JC is being coached by the best in Weis, Haywood, and especially Powlus. (I would have to call Powlus my favorite ND athlete of all time, just above Clements. If I knew how to start a thread, I would explain why).

He showed grit last year, and this year he is unbelievable. After only 4 games.

He is a year or two older than his classmates.

He has been correctly groomed to be the next great QB anywhere, anytime. This guy is special.

I hope he doesn't fall the way of USC's roboqb Todd Marinovich.

(Message to Claws-on) Stay humble and hungry dude. You were QB in ND's worst and most pathetic season in its gloried history. Stay at ND and redeem yourself. Avoid the drugs. Use a condom. Use a trojan to avoid Marinovich's pitfall. lol

 

[NDMontana]

No.

Even if my team goes 4 and a bunch, this guy is freegin special.

I will say right now that I have never in my life seen a more accurate passer. He comes from QB royalty, and is being coached by the best in Weis, Haywood, and especially Powlus. (I would have to call Powlus my favorite ND athlete of all time, just above Clements. If I knew how to start a thread, I would explain why).

He showed grit last year, and this year he is unbelievable.

He is a year or two older than his classmates.

He has been correctly groomed to be the next great QB anywhere, anytime. This guy is special.

I hope he doesn't fall the way of USC's roboqb Todd Marinovich.

Stay humble and hungry dude. You were QB in ND's worst and most pathetic season in its gloried history. Stay at ND and redeem yourself. Avoid the drugs. Use a condom. Use a trojan to avoid Marinovich's pitfall. lol

No, the Mannings (as much as I hate those fucking shills) are QB Royalty. The Clausens are nobles but not royalty. His brothers weren't that good. Jimmy is by far the best of the Clausen brothers and the smartest, evidenced by his fine decision to matriculate at Notre Dame.

 

[NDinL.A.]

him and Floyd will stay all 4. This isn't Miami.

That's what they used to say about Duke. NOBODY left Duke early. Then came Maggette and Brand, and Avery and Williams, and the rest is history. I hope they all stay, and it's possible they all will. But I also see that it is very possible that they leave (Clausen and Floyd, and hell, even Tate). It's not always the best decision, but we're not in their shoes to be able to turn down millions of dollars.

2 more things: 1) Someone mentioned he doesn't need the $$, but neither did Kevin Love, and many other athletes that turn pro. It's about the prestige, the ego (Jimmy has a nice sized ego for sure), the chance to play at the highest level, and the $$. I'm not saying I would leave the college life to work, but I'm just saying what many of these guys think.

Also, #2), Jimmy is old guys. He was held back a grade when he was young so he could mature and be even more prepared for h.s. ball. It was a big story out here in SoCal even when he was a young kid, whether or not it was right/fair for his parents to do so. So he's not a young sophomore at all. Damn, just look at his hairline!


I love Jimmy, and after just 2 great games, I can see why people are telling us to chill. But like NeuteredDomer just said, damn this kid is good. He's just a special, special QB, and I could easily see him leaving after next year. Good Lord I hope not though...

 

[NeuteredDoomer]

No, the Mannings (as much as I hate those fucking shills) are QB Royalty. The Clausens are nobles but not royalty. His brothers weren't that good. Jimmy is by far the best of the Clausen brothers and the smartest, evidenced by his fine decision to matriculate at Notre Dame.

"No?"

Yourself.

Don't tell me "no."

("Know yourself" pun was not intended, but in afterthought, maybe it was...)

I don't give a shit about Pro football. (But I love the Manning commercials. Best thing on T.V.)

Who else but the Mannings and Clausens have reached greatness and drawn crowds at stadiums and rave rankings and remainded (perceived) decent?

Give Jimmy time. He is already a good QB. His potential is unbelievable, even if ND loses out the rest of the year. Heavan forbid.

 

[Irishlew]

"NeuteredDoomer
Who else but the Mannings and Clausens have reached greatness and drawn crowds at stadiums and rave rankings and remainded (perceived) decent?"

hmmm i think the Vicks trump the Clausens, Ty and Koy Detmer, and i know they aren't quarterbacks but Qadry and Raghib Ismail beat all...lol

 

[NDMontana]

"No?"

Yourself.

("Know yourself" pun was not intended, but in afterthought, maybe it was...)

I don't give a shit about Pro football. (But I love the Manning commercials. Best thing on T.V.)

Who else but the Mannings and Clausens have reached greatness and drawn crowds at stadiums and rave rankings and remainded (perceived) decent?

Give Jimmy time. He is already a good QB. His potential is unbelievable, even if ND loses out the rest of the year. Heavan forbid.

Neither of his brothers were shit in the NFL which, like it or not, is how people come to be "royalty". If ascension to a successful pro career is not a measure of royalty than I suppose that the Leaf brothers are legends too? As far as the Mannings remaining "decent"....how about Eli refusing to play for San Diego or the way Peyton Manning pouts and blames his lineman when the Colts lose.

Slow down with the greatness talk about the Clausens while you're at it. JC looks really good, he's come far but it's only two games. His brother Rick started five games in college and never played in the NFL....greatness? His brother Casey failed to win an SEC Title Game and appeared in the Cotton, Citrus and Peach Bowl (twice), losing 3 of those 4 games....greatness? I wouldn't say so but I've seen some of your other theories so fire away.

 

[TX_Irish]

itd be dumb if he did

 

[SteveM]

Spark of Sanity

Spark of Sanity

No.

Even if my team goes 4 and a bunch, this guy is freegin special.

I will say right now that I have never in my life seen (only after the 3 games that I have watched) a more accurate passer. He comes from QB royalty, from a University with an equally proud football history. Incidentally, I estimate I have driven through about 42 U.S states, and my drive through Tennessee was the first breathtaking and amazing state I ever drove through. I freegin believed God was braggin when I drove through that state. (There was a drive between New Mexico/Arizona that also drew the angel's voices, but...back to the point).

JC is being coached by the best in Weis, Haywood, and especially Powlus. (I would have to call Powlus my favorite ND athlete of all time, just above Clements. If I knew how to start a thread, I would explain why).

He showed grit last year, and this year he is unbelievable. After only 4 games.

He is a year or two older than his classmates.

He has been correctly groomed to be the next great QB anywhere, anytime. This guy is special.

I hope he doesn't fall the way of USC's roboqb Todd Marinovich.

(Message to Claws-on) Stay humble and hungry dude. You were QB in ND's worst and most pathetic season in its gloried history. Stay at ND and redeem yourself. Avoid the drugs. Use a condom. Use a trojan to avoid Marinovich's pitfall. lol

NeuteredDoomer,

I can only rub my eyes as I read these phantasmagorical assertions.

Clausen is playing better on an ND team that's playing better. That's it. Nothing special. (Yet) The number of quarterback busts in the NFL would fill volumes. Remember Rick Mirer? I have Heath Shuler stories to tell you here in DC. And those guys were the real deal on the college teams they played for, demonstrating a ton more than Clausen has.

And Clausen has nowhere near generated the productivity of Theismann, Clements, Montana, Mirer, Powlus, Quinn. Even guys like Steve Beuerlein and Tony Rice. Not that he eventually won't. He just hasn't shown that kind of "specialness" yet except in the gauzy visions of the faithful after a few beers.

Projecting out Jimmy at this stage is either ridiculous, or crazed. Pick one.

So come out early? What, is Darious Walker giving him advice?

SteveM

P.S. I of course do want Jimmy to be great. But if I were a GM, I probably wouldn't draft him higher than a throw away pick. (It's just business at that level.)

 

[fraymont]

hes got a lot to prove....1/4 of the season is over...

 

[mick2]

he came to this school to become the best qb he could be and get picked in the first round of the nfl draft like brady quinn, why would he skip any tutelage he could gain from weis?

he will be here all 4 years, he's still a bit raw and undersized for pro-ball. let him train bulk up a bit and he'll leave after he graduates. breaking a bunch of records while he's at it, and then handing the reigns over to dayne crist.

 

[JeremyND07]

WOW! I go out of town for a couple of days and come back to all this Clausen, Floyd, and Rudolph leaving early BS! This is not OSU, Miami, LSU, etc...most of the time our kids graduate and I do not see that changing anytime soon!!! I know Floyd is playing good but lets see what he does the rest of this year and next before talking about him leaving early!! Look at how far Kamara has dropped after a good year last season! Unless we win a NC next year JC is going NO where!!!!

 

[NDinL.A.]

NeuteredDoomer,

I can only rub my eyes as I read these phantasmagorical assertions.

Clausen is playing better on an ND team that's playing better. That's it. Nothing special. (Yet) The number of quarterback busts in the NFL would fill volumes. Remember Rick Mirer? I have Heath Shuler stories to tell you here in DC. And those guys were the real deal on the college teams they played for, demonstrating a ton more than Clausen has.

And Clausen has nowhere near generated the productivity of Theismann, Clements, Montana, Mirer, Powlus, Quinn. Even guys like Steve Beuerlein and Tony Rice. Not that he eventually won't. He just hasn't shown that kind of "specialness" yet except in the gauzy visions of the faithful after a few beers.

Projecting out Jimmy at this stage is either ridiculous, or crazed. Pick one.

So come out early? What, is Darious Walker giving him advice?

SteveM

P.S. I of course do want Jimmy to be great. But if I were a GM, I probably wouldn't draft him higher than a throw away pick. (It's just business at that level.)

I can see your point about projecting too early, and that he's only had a couple of great games, so we should slow down a bit. I get that completely.

Where I disagree is that you don't see the 'specialness' that is so clearly evident with this kid. I said it after the MSU game (in which he didn't play all that great yet), that this kid is special, and it's even more evident now. NFL arm, NFL poise, can throw every single ball a QB needs to throw, understands a pro offense and is going through his progressions now, etc. He's got specialness written all over him. Now, he'll have his bad games, and we shouldn't annoint him yet, but just judging by a critical eye, you should be able to see by now that the kid is a rare breed.

I'll tell you what his renowned QB coach, Steve Clarkson, said about him after his sophomore year. Remember, Clarkson works with college and NFL QB's. He said that college guys didn't even want to be on the same field working out w/ Clausen, he was so good. He would every single throw Clarkson would ask, and do it way better than the college guys (and I'm not talking college and pro scrubs; Clarkson works with the best). He was that special back then, and he continues to be now.

I will also agree that he's not prototypical NFL size. He's amller than I thought. However, how many 6'5" robotic dorks have failed in the NFL? Dan McGuire anyone? Steve Young, Joe Montana, etc those guys weren't 6'5" and they did alright for themselves. The QB positin is so much more about brains than it is raw talent (you need the talent of course, but you want a Jeff George or a Tom Brady?).

Finally, I'll say it again: Duke said the same thing about their basketball athletes in the last 90's. "We're Duke, our athletes are different - they don't go pro early." And then they started dropping like flies. Same thing COULD happen here. Not saying it will happen, but it could happen; we shouldn't be that dense to just automatically think kids are going to ignore millions just to stay at ND. Smart kids love money too! I hope they don't, but when you are recruiting guys like Floyd and Clausen, you run that risk. BTW, Floyd is much, much better than Kamara. Kamara was dropping balls last year as well. You can't teach Floyd's feel for the game, plus his smarts and athleticism.

Almost game day baby! CRANK...................ME..................UP!!!!!!!

 

[SteveM]

Stark Reality

Stark Reality

I can see your point about projecting too early, and that he's only had a couple of great games, so we should slow down a bit. I get that completely.

Where I disagree is that you don't see the 'specialness' that is so clearly evident with this kid. I said it after the MSU game (in which he didn't play all that great yet), that this kid is special, and it's even more evident now. NFL arm, NFL poise, can throw every single ball a QB needs to throw, understands a pro offense and is going through his progressions now, etc. He's got specialness written all over him. Now, he'll have his bad games, and we shouldn't annoint him yet, but just judging by a critical eye, you should be able to see by now that the kid is a rare breed.

I'll tell you what his renowned QB coach, Steve Clarkson, said about him after his sophomore year. Remember, Clarkson works with college and NFL QB's. He said that college guys didn't even want to be on the same field working out w/ Clausen, he was so good. He would every single throw Clarkson would ask, and do it way better than the college guys (and I'm not talking college and pro scrubs; Clarkson works with the best). He was that special back then, and he continues to be now.

I will also agree that he's not prototypical NFL size. He's amller than I thought. However, how many 6'5" robotic dorks have failed in the NFL? Dan McGuire anyone? Steve Young, Joe Montana, etc those guys weren't 6'5" and they did alright for themselves. The QB positin is so much more about brains than it is raw talent (you need the talent of course, but you want a Jeff George or a Tom Brady?).

Almost game day baby! CRANK...................ME..................UP!!!!!!!

Left Coastie,

Look, I acknowledge the skills and growth Clausen has demonstrated. But from a no-shit analytical assessment:

• he does have that hitch in his throw
• he does not have very good feet
• he has not demonstrated that he can feel the rush and step up in the pocket rather than bail (FBI)
• his ability to find secondary receivers is still undeveloped
• and he's undersized.

That's it. That's why he's not special.

Will he be? As an ND fan, I hope so. Wearing a GM hat, I'd say the odds are against him because the historic failure rate is so high.

SteveM

 

[NDinL.A.]

Left Coastie,

Look, I acknowledge the skills and growth Clausen has demonstrated. But from a no-shit analytical assessment:

• he does have that hitch in his throw
• he does not have very good feet
• he has not demonstrated that he can feel the rush and step up in the pocket rather than bail (FBI)
• his ability to find secondary receivers is still undeveloped
• and he's undersized.

That's it. That's why he's not special.

Will he be? As an ND fan, I hope so. Wearing a GM hat, I'd say the odds are against him because the historic failure rate is so high.

SteveM

East Coast(Bias)er:

You pretty much ignored every good thing I said about him, from a no-shit analytical perspective, and just focused on the negative. Fine. Here you go, from a no-shit analytical perspective:

* NFL arm, makes every throw in the book.
* NFL-type progressions in an NFL-style offense
* You underrate his feet, vastly. He's not fast, no, but he gets away from pressure excellently. You don't need to be Michael Vick, but you need to escape pressure, and last year he got incredible practice at that. This year, he's become excellent at it.
* Undersized, true, again, if you want the 'protoypical 6'-5" robotic dork who can't read defenses or can't move for crap. Is he getting passes batted down all the time, a la David Booty? No. I'll take a 6'2" QB with a brain and an arm over those guys any day of the week.
* Watch last week's game again (I saw it twice), and tell me he can't find secondary receivers yet. Overcourse it's underdeveloped, BECAUSE HE'S ONLY A TRUE SOPH, but he's already going through reads better than many 5th year senior QB's.

Lots of his game is underdeveloped, because of his inexperience. That's not the point of the discussion. The point is if he exhibits 'specialness'. I think he oozes it. The top QB coach in the country feels the same way.

Finally, the historical failure rate I absolutely agree with. I'd definitely draft him. The question is, where do you take him, and how good will he be in 2-3 years when he enters the draft? Taking QB's number 1 overall has proved many times to be an awful investment (mostly because they go to awful teams that need them to be saviors right away), but taking QB's later has it's advantages. But I don't even want to get that far yet.

I may turn out to be wrong, but I think he's a special football player, and he'll continue to develop and prove it...

 

[NDMontana]

East Coast(Bias)er:

You pretty much ignored every good thing I said about him, from a no-shit analytical perspective, and just focused on the negative. Fine. Here you go, from a no-shit analytical perspective:

* NFL arm, makes every throw in the book.
* NFL-type progressions in an NFL-style offense
* You underrate his feet, vastly. He's not fast, no, but he gets away from pressure excellently. You don't need to be Michael Vick, but you need to escape pressure, and last year he got incredible practice at that. This year, he's become excellent at it.
* Undersized, true, again, if you want the 'protoypical 6'-5" robotic dork who can't read defenses or can't move for crap. I'll take a 6'2" QB with a brain and an arm over those guys any day of the week.
* Watch last week's game again (I saw it twice), and tell me he can't find secondary receivers yet. Overcourse it's underdeveloped, BECAUSE HE'S ONLY A TRUE SOPH, but he's already going through reads better than many 5th year senior QB's.

Lots of his game is underdeveloped, because of his inexperience. That's not the point of the discussion. The point is if he exhibits 'specialness'. I think he oozes it. The top QB coach in the country feels the same way.

Finally, the historical failure rate I absolutely agree with. I'd definitely draft him. The question is, where do you take him, and how good will he be in 2-3 years when he enters the draft? Taking QB's number 1 overall has proved many times to be an awful investment (mostly because they go to awful teams that need them to be saviors right away), but taking QB's later has it's advantages. But I don't even want to get that far yet.

He's a special football player, and he'll continue to develop and prove it...

As happy as I am with JC and as much as my opinion of him has changed, for the good, in the last couple of weeks, I have to disagree with you on one or two points.

1) I don't know that he's all that good at reading through progressions. He's gotten better at audibling but he still seems to lock on to one receiver and throw it there. I think it will come but it's not there yet, IMO. He seems to lock onto one receiver and if it's not there than he dumps it to his safety valve (AA). That's not quite progression but it's an improvement and better than what some QB's can do.

2) He was much better at stepping up last week and even ran a few times but I wouldn't deem his escapability as "excellent".

The rest, you're right about. He has been making every throw. I would still like to see him throw a deep ball with less air under it but this receiving corps allows him the luxury of floating his passes. He could, in all likelihood, make a throw like that but I haven't seen it....yet.

 

[NDinL.A.]

As happy as I am with JC and as much as my opinion of him has changed, for the good, in the last couple of weeks, I have to disagree with you on one or two points.

1) I don't know that he's all that good at reading through progressions. He's gotten better at audibling but he still seems to lock on to one receiver and throw it there. I think it will come but it's not there yet, IMO. He seems to lock onto one receiver and if it's not there than he dumps it to his safety valve (AA). That's not quite progression but it's an improvement and better than what some QB's can do.

2) He was much better at stepping up last week and even ran a few times but I wouldn't deem his escapability as "excellent".

The rest, you're right about. He has been making every throw. I would still like to see him throw a deep ball with less air under it but this receiving corps allows him the luxury of floating his passes. He could, in all likelihood, make a throw like that but I haven't seen it....yet.

I can see your points. I still think he's excellent at escaping the pressure, but that might be my Irish eyes talking. I also agree with Steve M. that he needs to step UP in the pocket and
not sideways. I forgot to mention that. He's still very young, with only a handful of starts under his belt. The specialness is there (God I hope he shows it this weekend!!!). I'll be here to eat crow if I'm wrong...

 

[SteveM]

No Way...

No Way...

I can see your points. I still think he's excellent at escaping the pressure, but that might be my Irish eyes talking. I also agree with Steve M. that he needs to step UP in the pocket and
not sideways. I forgot to mention that. He's still very young, with only a handful of starts under his belt. The specialness is there (God I hope he shows it this weekend!!!). I'll be here to eat crow if I'm wrong...

All you guys,

If you are talking pro ball, being deficient in one critical area is a deal killer. The game is not zero sum. Being superior in one element does not cancel out deficits in another. If Jimmy has a great arm but mediocre FBI, that makes him not good. If he does not find secondary and tertiary receivers, that makes him not good. Pro linebackers and even defensive linemen are super quick. Where Clausen is now with his foot speed, they'd run him down and crush him.

A GM sees just one major deficit and would write him off. And why wouldn't he?

Gus Ferrotte was drafted by the Redskins. Has a great arm. (Better than Clausen's) and throws a great ball. But can't do the other stuff, so he's a journeyman.

Donovan McNab, great athlete, but never matured from a thrower to a great passer. So he is where he is in his career.

You can go on and on with guys who had demonstratably superior skill sets than Clausen and were busts in the pros. Jimmy is nowhere near those guys yet even in the areas he's good at. Arm strength is not productivity.

I'm conceding fully that he is young and maturing. But I'm also saying that the assumed extrapolation is undeserved at this point.

I don't know where you get your mushrooms, but put me down for a pound.

SteveM

 

[NDinL.A.]

All you guys,

If you are talking pro ball, being deficient in one critical area is a deal killer. The game is not zero sum. Being superior in one element does not cancel out deficits in another. If Jimmy has a great arm but mediocre FBI, that makes him not good. If he does not find secondary and tertiary receivers, that makes him not good.

Pro linebackers and even defensive linemen are super quick. Where Clausen is now with his foot speed, they'd run him down and crush him.

A GM sees just one major deficit and would write him off. And why wouldn't he?

Gus Ferrotte was drafted by the Redskins. Has a great arm. (Better than Clausen's) and throws a great ball. But can't do the other stuff, so he's a journeyman.

Donovan McNab, great athlete, but never matured from a thrower to a great passer. So he is where he is in his career.

You can go on and on with guys who had demonstratably superior skill sets than Clausen and were busts in the pros. Jimmy is nowhere near those guys yet even in the areas he's good at. Arm strength is not productivity.

I'm conceding fully that he is young and maturing. But I'm also saying that the assumed extrapolation is undeserved at this point.

I don't know where you get your mushrooms, but put me down for a pound.

SteveM

I think I need to find where you're stashing your stuff, because it is potently stronger than ours, that is for sure.

Frerotte's arm is stronger than Clausen's? I saw Frerotte play in college, and I see Jimmy play, and you are dead wrong there. Dead wrong. Gus's arm strength was very good, but he still can't make the throws that Jimmy is already making.

You conceed that he's young, but then you rip him for parts that he needs time to mature in. Do you think any pro star QB was already polished enough that no GM could pick out one flaw in his game? Are you serious? Think about that for a second. His flaws are not major, he has the tools and the work ethic. Progressions and hitting secondary and third targets are things that come with experience and time in an offense. He's getting that and there is growth there already. Do you really expect a soph in his 4th game of the year to hit his 4th read in an offense every time he drops back? Of course not. That's ridiculous.

Pro linebackers and even defensive linemen are super quick. Where Clausen is now with his foot speed, they'd run him down and crush him.

Ummm, they'd do the same thing to Tom Brady and Peyton Manning if that's what you are talking about.

QB play in the pocket, again, is not all about speed, it's about feel. That comes with experience, but Jimmy has already improved immensely in that area. He'll keep getting better too.

Again, the talent and the 'it' factor are there, inside of him. You want to ignore it and talk about what he does wrong, fine, but the 'specialness' is there. I'm not calling him all-universe it this point, or even all-american yet. But when you prodigious talent, you can't ignore that. It's a blessing for ND, and we should all be happy. And it's not just some blowhard in L.A. saying it, it's the top QB coach in the country saying it as well...

 

[SoCalDomer]

2) He was much better at stepping up last week and even ran a few times but I wouldn't deem his escapability as "excellent".

that is probably true. when the OL gets a good horseshoe pocket around him he does a pretty good job of stepping up. but when it collapses or comes from one side, he does that spin around thing where he runs first away from the LOS, losing yards, then he runs, gets close to escaping, but gets caught, only to make an ugly throw away at the last second that sometimes doesn't reach the LOS resulting in intentional gounding.

he's been getting better at most other aspects, so i suspect he'll get better with more experience at this too.

 

[IrishFan4Life]

I hope not it would def be a dumb move.

 

[SteveM]

Origin of Species

Origin of Species

I think I need to find where you're stashing your stuff, because it is potently stronger than ours, that is for sure.

Frerotte's arm is stronger than Clausen's? I saw Frerotte play in college, and I see Jimmy play, and you are dead wrong there. Dead wrong. Gus's arm strength was very good, but he still can't make the throws that Jimmy is already making.

You conceed that he's young, but then you rip him for parts that he needs time to mature in. Do you think any pro star QB was already polished enough that no GM could pick out one flaw in his game? Are you serious? Think about that for a second. His flaws are not major, he has the tools and the work ethic. Progressions and hitting secondary and third targets are things that come with experience and time in an offense. He's getting that and there is growth there already. Do you really expect a soph in his 4th game of the year to hit his 4th read in an offense every time he drops back? Of course not. That's ridiculous.



Ummm, they'd do the same thing to Tom Brady and Peyton Manning if that's what you are talking about.

QB play in the pocket, again, is not all about speed, it's about feel. That comes with experience, but Jimmy has already improved immensely in that area. He'll keep getting better too.

Again, the talent and the 'it' factor are there, inside of him. You want to ignore it and talk about what he does wrong, fine, but the 'specialness' is there. I'm not calling him all-universe it this point, or even all-american yet. But when you prodigious talent, you can't ignore that. It's a blessing for ND, and we should all be happy. And it's not just some blowhard in L.A. saying it, it's the top QB coach in the country saying it as well...

Look, this thread starts off with Jimmy turning pro and I'm telling you guys that he's not there yet. And you get spun up because I take a pro perspective and focus on his total play. Not where he's gonna be, but where he actually is. Because that's the context of the thread!

Pro football is absolutely Darwinian. A guy can either do it or he can't. Your happy forecast of Clausen's idyllic end state is meaningless in the context of how he'd be evaluated by a pro scout right now. The scout would say exactly what I said. He'd focus on what Clausen does both right and wrong and then tell you to call him when he has those deficits fixed because they are too pronounced.

What has Jimmy actually demonstrated as a pro prospect? He's good, but he ain't that good. 6th round, maybe.

SteveM

 

[WaveDomer]

From the King of the Chuck it Up and Pray to the guy ready to leave college early. Nice turnaround. This is something you can't even worry about. It's way too early to be talking about this and there are too many variables. On a good note, I hope everyone remembers this thread after we lose a game and throws some picks.
NDinLA, I get your points about Duke. However, Rocket left early and the flood gates didn't open. I think it's hard to compare football and basketball on this point. No way can a kid go from high school to the NFL, but that happens in basketball.

 

[NDinL.A.]

Look, this thread starts off with Jimmy turning pro and I'm telling you guys that he's not there yet. And you get spun up because I take a pro perspective and focus on his total play. Not where he's gonna be, but where he actually is. Because that's the context of the thread!

Pro football is absolutely Darwinian. A guy can either do it or he can't. Your happy forecast of Clausen's idyllic end state is meaningless in the context of how he'd be evaluated by a pro scout right now. The scout would say exactly what I said. He'd focus on what Clausen does both right and wrong and then tell you to call him when he has those deficits fixed because they are too pronounced.

What has Jimmy actually demonstrated as a pro prospect? He's good, but he ain't that good. 6th round, maybe.

SteveM

Let's see, he has a horrible line, has ZERO running game, has to run for his life too many times (although the line has improved immensely at pass-blocking), and yet he still has been winging it all over the place. 6th round??? Are you kidding me?

What has he demonstrated? Ummm, he can and has made every throw you need to make as a QB. He makes audible calls that lead to TD's. He never calls out teammates when they play horribly, and is already known as a team leader. What GM wouldn't like those things? I know you're a smart guy SteveM, but that was a stupid statement. He has DEMONSTRATED all those things. What games are you watching?

As for your first statement, who in the world is talking about him turning pro now? Any conversation about him turning pro (after his jr year) revolves around the understood fact that he is going to progress at or about the same rate. Does that really need to be stated? Where he is now is damn f-*** good, and he's only going to get better. Therefore, at his rate of progression, he'll be an f-*** great college QB by the time his college career is over. A GM will will evaluate him then on how good he is.

6th round right now, fine, but he ain't getting drafted right now so who gives a rip. He'll be drafted when he turns pro, and i guarantee you, barring injury, it'll be higher than the 6th round. Tarvaris friggin' Jackson was drafted in the 2nd round for Pete's sake. I guarantee you a GM recognizes his talent and takes him waaaaaayyyyy higher than the 6th round. And if you insist on saying right now he's a 6th round pick, again, who cares? He's not turning pro yet. He'll grow and mature, trust that...

 

[NDinL.A.]

NDinLA, I get your points about Duke. However, Rocket left early and the flood gates didn't open. I think it's hard to compare football and basketball on this point. No way can a kid go from high school to the NFL, but that happens in basketball. QUOTE]

I don't remember saying flood gates opening, but if I did then I either misspoke and I am flat-out wrong (or did you misremember? ).

What I mean is that it could happen to a singular player, a la Rocket, and it wouldn't surprise me in the least. Lots of money on the table. You're absolutely right, it wouldn't open the flood gates at all. Football is too violent a sport for underdeveloped players to try and make the leap...

 

[WaveDomer]

don't remember saying flood gates opening, but if I did then I either misspoke and I am flat-out wrong (or did you misremember? ).

What I mean is that it could happen to a singular player, a la Rocket, and it wouldn't surprise me in the least. Lots of money on the table. You're absolutely right, it wouldn't open the flood gates at all. Football is too violent a sport for underdeveloped players to try and make the leap...

No you didn't use the term "flood gates" but you made reference to Magette and then went on to name a number of other players from there. The gist from your post was that Duke thought it was different then one big named player left and others followed. Semantics aside, I don't think it is worth worrying about at this point or any point really.