ND Academics Vs. Ohio St.

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Bogtrotter07

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As a postscript to to this discussion: It is veritably a mathematical formula used by many "football factories," rating the usefulness of players versus the pain encountered while keeping them eligible. Bad boys are gone, but Butkus Award winners, that are quietly missing classes are kept. This is why schools like Michigan drop a couple of All-Big Ten wide receivers into the NFL combine that score the equivalent of functionally illiterate, (6 and 7) on the Wonderlic Cognitive Ability Test, (IQ = 2WCAT + 60). This is why some SEC schools flood the bench with intelligent non-minority student athletes, thus increasing the disparity of graduation rates between minority and non-minority students, all for the sake of higher overall graduation rates.
 
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Buster Bluth

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OSU admits 52% of all applicants. That might be selective for a large public university, but not on an objective scale. ND, for instance, admits only ~28%.

I have taught for years and many students who were not super high caliber students have ended up at OSU. Also the students who cannot hack it at Miami OH and other schools end up transfering to OSU. If OSU were so tough there would not be as many that I know that went there. On another note I only have known two that went to ND and a few of the Ivy league schools.

Well you need to accept that it is a massive public university. They deal with the whole gamut of intelligence levels.

You cannot simply look at the acceptance rate, or anecdotal accounts of people you know who go there, and expect to accurately describe a student body of 64,000.

Any Ohio resident can get into Ohio State-Columbus, you just deferred to a regional campus first (similar to the way Rudy spent time at Holy Cross in the movie). Getting into the Columbus campus directly out of high school is becoming exponentially more difficult. I don't remember off the top of my head, but I know for a fact that the freshmen class was both the largest and smartest in history. I know the ACT score had a median of 29, and I think the size was ~12,000. That means there are literally thousands of students there with 30+ on their ACT, which is impressive and is why Ohio State's academic reputation, whether you like it or not, is rising steadily.

This is all because of the billions Dr. Gee is pumping into the facilities and programs. $115m for a new student Union, $140m for a new recreation center--rated the best in the country, $108 million for a massive library renovation/expansion, hundreds of millions to completely rebuild the Fisher College of Business, another tens of millions to build a completely new Knowlton School or Architecture (where I go). They are building a new $1.5 billion cancer hospital, which according to the architects I talked to is unlike any in the world. The new South Campus Gateway is transforming the neighboring areas and cost a pretty penny. Then there's the not-as-neat dorm construction, physics building, etc. etc. etc.

The new hospital:
ProjectONE_day.jpg


Rebuilt Business College:
aerial.jpg


New Architecture School:
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I could go on, but I doubt many of you care.

Simply put, if you returned to campus after a fifteen-year hiatus, the place would be unrecognizable. The same is true with the academic status of the school. Make no mistake, while there are hundreds of partying education majors, there are a ton of engineers, architects, med students, business students, etc., that are extremely bright.

THAT SAID, what they do with the football players is an absolute joke. This place is a factory and the football team is no exception. you can literally have half of a brain and get by here as a football player taking communications or something. The Glenville kids they bring in wouldn't be able to cut it at an institution that required them to be academically responsible. There is no better university anywhere in the country when it comes to educating football players than Notre Dame. End of story. Ohio State is a fine institution, but it's a moot point because it doesn't normally apply to the football players.
 
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rtrn2glory

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the academic standards have killed us for years...i know they won't be changed, but as a person who loves the football program 100X more than I love the university in general i would prefer a more lenient admission scale, but it's beating a dead horse
 
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Buster Bluth

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the academic standards have killed us for years...i know they won't be changed, but as a person who loves the football program 100X more than I love the university in general i would prefer a more lenient admission scale, but it's beating a dead horse

****. No.

The academic standards have not hurt Notre Dame very much. Coaching, and coaching alone, is what has put Notre Dame in their decade-long funk and is what will get them out of it. Notre Dame can get kids who aren't Einstein (I know some personally); they just don't go after dipshits like the SEC teams do, or players with criminal records.

The idea of easing the standards literally makes me want to throw up; and being a fan of the football team but not the university is asinine in my opinion--IT'S A GREAT UNIVERSITY!! I don't understand how you can love the team without loving, or greatly respecting, the university.
 
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Whiskeyjack

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Apologies if I gave offense, Buster. OSU is undoubtedly among the best public universities in the nation. I was merely trying to address some of the hand-waving about how "insanely difficult" it is to get accepted into OSU these days.

Harvard only accepts 7% of all applicants. ND accepts 29%. The most recent statistic I can find for OSU is 52%. If there's a different figure out there for how many applicants get accepted directly into the Colombus campus, I'd love to see it.
 
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Buster Bluth

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No offense taken. I will gladly help when it's against the football team. :)

As for the acceptance rate, I'm not sure. I know it is dropping sharply. I mean, consider this: ten years ago any Ohio State resident that graduated high school with a 2.0+ GPA was admitted. How insane is that? They've come a long, long way.
 

rtrn2glory

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****. No.

The academic standards have not hurt Notre Dame very much. Coaching, and coaching alone, is what has put Notre Dame in their decade-long funk and is what will get them out of it. Notre Dame can get kids who aren't Einstein (I know some personally); they just don't go after dipshits like the SEC teams do, or players with criminal records.

The idea of easing the standards literally makes me want to throw up; and being a fan of the football team but not the university is asinine in my opinion--IT'S A GREAT UNIVERSITY!! I don't understand how you can love the team without loving, or greatly respecting, the university.

never said i didn't like the university or respect it...have a tremendous amount of respect for the students who go threre...i know it isn't easy, but i for one will always love the football program much more than the university. simply a matter of allegiance to the football program, but you're entitled to you're opinion as am i
 

IrishLax

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Anyone ever heard the coloring book joke about Ohio State? I've heard it on literally every tour of a Big Ten campus I've ever done.
 
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Bogtrotter07

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I could go on, but I doubt many of you care.

Simply put, if you returned to campus after a fifteen-year hiatus, the place would be unrecognizable. The same is true with the academic status of the school. Make no mistake, while there are hundreds of partying education majors, there are a ton of engineers, architects, med students, business students, etc., that are extremely bright.

THAT SAID, what they do with the football players is an absolute joke. This place is a factory and the football team is no exception. you can literally have half of a brain and get by here as a football player taking communications or something. The Glenville kids they bring in wouldn't be able to cut it at an institution that required them to be academically responsible. There is no equal anywhere in the country when it comes to educating football players than Notre Dame (outside of I guess the academies). End of story. Ohio State is a fine institution, but it's a moot point because it doesn't normally apply to the football players.

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Last edited by Buster Bluth; Today at 03:01 PM..

I always really appreciated the nursing students. I mean I really appreciated as many of the nursing students as I could. I mean those were always some appreciation-worthy students, those nursing students.
 
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Buster Bluth

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US News & World Report Rankings:

#13 Northwestern
#29 Michigan
#45 Wisconsin
#47 Penn State
#47 Illinois
#56 Ohio State
#56 Purdue
#64 Minnesota
#72 Iowa
#75 Indiana
#79 Michigan State
#104 Nebraska

I don't think the jokes have caught up with recent progress. (To sound like Indiana's coach on the radio haha)

I always really appreciated the nursing students. I mean I really appreciated as many of the nursing students as I could. I mean those were always some appreciation-worthy students, those nursing students.

Can't say that I haven't appreciated some nursing students! :)
 
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Bogtrotter07

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Now that's what I'm talking about! See something we can all agree upon.

Considering I am more that old enough to be your Dad. In fact, I bet I knew your Dad, (or uncle).
 
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Bogtrotter07

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They are all a bunch of smart @sses aren't they?

I will send you a message offline. Half of Oregon, Northwood, etc.
 

BCSorBust

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I've written this elsewhere that I was a tutor of athletes at ND. They do let some kids in who obviously would not have gotten in otherwise. However they expect the same out of these kids as they do everyone else, but then they give them the tools and resources to succeed. I witnessed this first hand and that is why I'll defend nds program always. I was so impressed that the kids who were just like the kids I grew up with in Detroit who were never pushed to succeed in academics were pushed so hard and almost always responded impressively.
 
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Buster Bluth

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They do let some kids in who obviously would not have gotten in otherwise.

And that's completely acceptable. The fact that Notre Dame graduates them all speaks volumes for the system in place there. It boggles my mind how other programs don't learn from it and raise their standards.

I don't think you can really criticize Notre Dame's admissions when they turn around and graduate them all.
 
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