Our real problem is our EXPECTATIONS being skewed by Scouts and Rivals

[McInator]

Every year we actually think these "services" actually mean something. That some nerd working in a cubicle who saw a 17 year old kid play twice can "grade" him as a 4 star and we think we are going to win a NC because we bring in more of these graded kids. The whole system is ludicrous.

If we started basing our expectations ON THE PLAY ON THE FIELD, we wouldn't delude ourselves every off season.

It isn't the coaches and players fault entirely - we are equally as culpable with our ridiculous expectations not based in reality, but based on the nerd in the cubicle.

 

[Jason Pham]

I'm not sure that the expectation of an out of touch fanbase has any correlation to production on the field. Coaches, I would think, aren't relying on recruiting services to guide their recruiting processes. If anything, the recruiting services are relying on the expertise of coaches to in part determine their own rankings. Look at the scholarship offers of our recruits and you will find that we have a team with above average potential, and, given time, practice, and competent coaching, we should expect above average production.

 

[Riddickulous]

No.

Our problem is that we had inflated expectations for Kelly. We looked at his track record and actually thought he could turn the Charlie Weis disaster around in one year. It's going to take several years. We may not see any solid results until Kelly's fourth or fifth year, when his recruiting classes start to dominate the depth chart.

Weis did a TERRIBLE job here at Notre Dame. Kelly inherited a lazy, uninspired football team with atrocious fundamentals, poor strength and conditioning, and a load of unrealized potential.

 

[kmoose]

Weis did a TERRIBLE job here at Notre Dame. Kelly inherited a lazy, uninspired football team with atrocious fundamentals, poor strength and conditioning, and a load of unrealized potential.

It's not just that easy, though. Kelly also inherited a WR that was on the fast track to superstardom.......... and that guy has pretty much disappeared. I've noticed something, the last couple of games: Under Weis, everyone in the country knew how good Michael Floyd was. But, Floyd still had room to run, once he caught the ball. The past couple of games, it is a rare occassion that there are not 3 or 4 defenders in the immediate area, as soon as he gets the ball in his hands. Perhaps there actually WAS at least a little bit of a schematic advantage, under Weis?

 

[GreatGolson]

No schematic advantage, just a system that called for a lot of long bombs to the endzone, which was a strong point for floyd (and tate)

 

[Shamrocks and Shenanigans]

It's not just that easy, though. Kelly also inherited a WR that was on the fast track to superstardom.......... and that guy has pretty much disappeared. I've noticed something, the last couple of games: Under Weis, everyone in the country knew how good Michael Floyd was. But, Floyd still had room to run, once he caught the ball. The past couple of games, it is a rare occassion that there are not 3 or 4 defenders in the immediate area, as soon as he gets the ball in his hands. Perhaps there actually WAS at least a little bit of a schematic advantage, under Weis?

Yes. It was called Golden Tate and Jimmy Clausen. Floyd was the secondary receiver last year. Teams focused on stopping Tate first. Plus, Jimmy was the most accurate passer I have seen at ND in a very long time. Crist is not there yet, and may never be. I think that this has alot to do with the fall off in Michael Floyds play. Go Irish!

 

[kmoose]

[/B]

Yes. It was called Golden Tate and Jimmy Clausen. Floyd was the secondary receiver last year.

Floyd started the season as the primary guy. I know he got hurt in, what, the 2nd or 3rd game? But he was tearing college football up, the first 2 or 3 games. Golden Tate didn't become the primary option until Floyd got hurt.

 

[Shamrocks and Shenanigans]

Floyd started the season as the primary guy. I know he got hurt in, what, the 2nd or 3rd game? But he was tearing college football up, the first 2 or 3 games. Golden Tate didn't become the primary option until Floyd got hurt.

I believe that he was tearing it up for the exact reason I stated above. Golden, did step it up even more after Floyd was hurt, but that is not my point. Floyd had people around him that made him great. He will be the reason, one of the younger guys, like Riddick will step up into the spotlight. He doesn't have weapons to help him out this year is all that I am saying. Also, he didn't exactly run all over the feild last year either. It was either a jump ball in the endzone, or the long bomb that hit him dead in the hands on the run. Crist can't hit him on either of those patterns yet. Things are just different. Go Irish!

 

[kmoose]

I believe that he was tearing it up for the exact reason I stated above. Golden, did step it up even more after Floyd was hurt, but that is not my point. Floyd had people around him that made him great. He will be the reason, one of the younger guys, like Riddick will step up into the spotlight. He doesn't have weapons to help him out this year is all that I am saying. Also, he didn't exactly run all over the feild last year either. It was either a jump ball in the endzone, or the long bomb that hit him dead in the hands on the run. Crist can't hit him on either of those patterns yet. Things are just different. Go Irish!

Sure, I can see that. But you have to admit that Kelly inherited one of the most talented WRs in college football, and that guy has practically disappeared. My point is that it isn't just as easy as "Weis was terrible, and Kelly has to repair all of that damage." If a terrible coach like Weis was able to utilize Floyd's talent, why can't a great coach like Kelly figure it out?

 

[Shamrocks and Shenanigans]

Sure, I can see that. But you have to admit that Kelly inherited one of the most talented WRs in college football, and that guy has practically disappeared. My point is that it isn't just as easy as "Weis was terrible, and Kelly has to repair all of that damage." If a terrible coach like Weis was able to utilize Floyd's talent, why can't a great coach like Kelly figure it out?

I agree with you 100%. I was a big Weis supporter, we are from the same area of Jersey. I think the biggest challenge with Floyd's production is that Crist doesn't have the confidence to get the ball to him in the way that Jimmy did. I don't think it is Kelly's fault. Weis definately didn't leave the program dry, when it comes to talent, but it was a different game plan. Floyd needs to adjust his style to match the ability of Crist right now. I think that if Crist could hit the long man, like Jimmy did, Kelly would be a moron not to utilize that. That being said, you have watched the games, he doesn't have the confidence in his arm yet. Go Irish!

 

[kmoose]

I agree with you 100%. I was a big Weis supporter, we are from the same area of Jersey. I think the biggest challenge with Floyd's production is that Crist doesn't have the confidence to get the ball to him in the way that Jimmy did. I don't think it is Kelly's fault. Weis definately didn't leave the program dry, when it comes to talent, but it was a different game plan. Floyd needs to adjust his style to match the ability of Crist right now. I think that if Crist could hit the long man, like Jimmy did, Kelly would be a moron not to utilize that. That being said, you have watched the games, he doesn't have the confidence in his arm yet. Go Irish!

I think that was really the point I was trying to make: people are still trying to blame Weis for the lack of wins at ND. "Charlie couldn't develop talent.....", etc. But the disappearance of Michael Floyd highlights something: I think we all agree that the absence of Clausen and Tate are major factors in Floyd's lack of production this year. Well, Golden Tate came to ND as a running back. Weis developed Golden Tate into one of the best receivers in the country. Clausen had all of the acclaim, coming in, but we all saw how bad he looked, in his freshman and sophomore seasons. (There were myriad reasons for this, but that's not the point) Weis turned Clausen into one of the best QBs in the country. So let's not let people blame everything on Weis.

 

[Shamrocks and Shenanigans]

I think that was really the point I was trying to make: people are still trying to blame Weis for the lack of wins at ND. "Charlie couldn't develop talent.....", etc. But the disappearance of Michael Floyd highlights something: I think we all agree that the absence of Clausen and Tate are major factors in Floyd's lack of production this year. Well, Golden Tate came to ND as a running back. Weis developed Golden Tate into one of the best receivers in the country. Clausen had all of the acclaim, coming in, but we all saw how bad he looked, in his freshman and sophomore seasons. (There were myriad reasons for this, but that's not the point) Weis turned Clausen into one of the best QBs in the country. So let's not let people blame everything on Weis.

For whatever reason, that is the path of the ND fan. We always blame the coach before the present leader of the team. I actually remember people bashing Lou for Davie's short comings. It is just part of being a FANatic. We need to blame it on someone, so Weis gets the **** for now. He did go to 2 BCS games though, so I tend to agree with you. Back off Weis and move on, I'm sure Kelly doesn't sit in the Gug and complain about the lack of talent he was left. Nice posting with you Kmoose, + reps. Go Irish!

 

[irish1958]

Our problem is lack of development of the "non-skilled" players due to poor coaching in the past 15 years, not just with Charlie Weis.
Blaming Kelly for the mess he inherited is similar to blaming Obama for the mess he inherited from Bush.
It will take two or three years to straighten out, not tow or three months.

 

[dsotm]

"Look at the scholarship offers of our recruits and you will find that we have a team with above average potential, and, given time, practice, and competent coaching, we should expect above average production."


I keep hearing this ad nauseam, for decades now. It simply isn't true, by and large. Even if the stars aligned and all our players, right now, played to the absolute best of their potential, teams like Alabama, Biose, Arkansas, right now, would run right over us. It's the hard truth. Blame Weis, Blame Kelly, blame whomever you wish- you will not beat teams consistently until you can recuit a real top draft class. I know everyone will chime in now and tell me we always have a top 10 class, and we just don't develop. Save it. It's nonsense. We don't have the horses and haven't in some time. Sometimes we get one or two good combo's, like Quinn and Samardja (I can't spell it), and that will get us to 10-2 every so often. However, at this point, I've lost faith in this program. I give up. It's a disgrace, and the best I can tell, most of you are fine with it. We were an elite school. Now we're bottom tier. There is no debating it. Maybe when we beat a ranked opponent I'll believe things have changed. Until then, it's just more nonsense, more talk, more of the same. Season over in week 2.

 

[irish4ever]

Our problem is that we had inflated expectations for Kelly. We looked at his track record and actually thought he could turn the Charlie Weis disaster around in one year. It's going to take several years.

No, just the koolaid drinkers thought that. Posters on this board w/ a REALISTIC mind knew up front that it was going to take some time to get this ship going in the right direction! New staff, new QB, new offensive scheme, no depth in many key defensive sport, etc. It definitely wasn't an "all inlcusive" listing of ND fans that thought as you state it!

 

[PANDFAN]

"Look at the scholarship offers of our recruits and you will find that we have a team with above average potential, and, given time, practice, and competent coaching, we should expect above average production."


I keep hearing this ad nauseam, for decades now. It simply isn't true, by and large. Even if the stars aligned and all our players, right now, played to the absolute best of their potential, teams like Alabama, Biose, Arkansas, right now, would run right over us. It's the hard truth. Blame Weis, Blame Kelly, blame whomever you wish- you will not beat teams consistently until you can recuit a real top draft class. I know everyone will chime in now and tell me we always have a top 10 class, and we just don't develop. Save it. It's nonsense. We don't have the horses and haven't in some time. Sometimes we get one or two good combo's, like Quinn and Samardja (I can't spell it), and that will get us to 10-2 every so often. However, at this point, I've lost faith in this program. I give up. It's a disgrace, and the best I can tell, most of you are fine with it. We were an elite school. Now we're bottom tier. There is no debating it. Maybe when we beat a ranked opponent I'll believe things have changed. Until then, it's just more nonsense, more talk, more of the same. Season over in week 2.

speed is what is killing us! without it on def we get torched, can't contain....on offense we arn't hitting wr's in stride....when i watch an sec school...when they catch the ball, they are flying around the field making highlight reels catching just a 10-20 yarder and then making moves....i think since the departure of lou ND has been avg...we didn't go from elite to bottom tier in 1 year...it has been a work in progress...but in order for a system to work, the players need to be there...have faith....the end is not a far as you think

 

[Irish Man3]

Sure, I can see that. But you have to admit that Kelly inherited one of the most talented WRs in college football, and that guy has practically disappeared. My point is that it isn't just as easy as "Weis was terrible, and Kelly has to repair all of that damage." If a terrible coach like Weis was able to utilize Floyd's talent, why can't a great coach like Kelly figure it out?

Im not to sure why or how you can say that Michael Floyd has disappeared.

In 2008- 48 catches for 719 yards and 7 touchdowns.
In 2009- 44 catches for 795 yards and 9 touchdowns.

So far in 2010 Michael Floyd has 24 catches for 339 yards and 2 touchdowns. If he were to continue to put up these numbers throughout the season, his final stats would look like this:
72 catches for 1017 yards and 6 touchdowns.

I understand that his injury altered his potential numbers from a year ago but to say that he has disappeared is a little bit of an exaggeration. Whats been dissapointing is his mental errors. His turnovers in the red zone and his route running have been concerning thus far. I think his numbers are right where they should be considering he is catching his passes from a first year starter who he does not have a lot of chemistry with. As the season goes on and he builds chemistry with Dayne, he will "appear" more and more.

 

[dsotm]

speed is what is killing us! without it on def we get torched, can't contain....on offense we arn't hitting wr's in stride....when i watch an sec school...when they catch the ball, they are flying around the field making highlight reels catching just a 10-20 yarder and then making moves....i think since the departure of lou ND has been avg...we didn't go from elite to bottom tier in 1 year...it has been a work in progress...but in order for a system to work, the players need to be there...have faith....the end is not a far as you think

Speed is definitely part of the problem. Yet, it's just a part of the overall issue. Generally, the better players are bigger, fast, stronger, and we don't have 'em! We haven't had them, overall, in quite a while. The end is very far off, I'm afraid. The problem is once you realized you have a mediocre team on the field- it's too late. It takes years to fix, not a season. And, regrettably we can't get the players anymore to fix it.

I saw an article yesterday saying the most players in the NFL come from California, Florida, and Texas- in that order. And, I might add, by a large margin. The 4th state with the most players has half of the 3rd state. That means three of the Elite programs in the country don't even have to leave their backyard to produce NFL ready talent in college. And we think we are going to get to the top how? Guess where those players are looking to play? Hint- it ain't ND! You start solving that problem- and you'll start seeing better talent at ND. Until then we'll just keep playing this little game amongst ourselves while we get beaten by Purdue and BC.

 

[Irish Houstonian]

speed is what is killing us! without it on def we get torched, can't contain....on offense we arn't hitting wr's in stride....when i watch an sec school...when they catch the ball, they are flying around the field making highlight reels catching just a 10-20 yarder and then making moves....i think since the departure of lou ND has been avg...we didn't go from elite to bottom tier in 1 year...it has been a work in progress...but in order for a system to work, the players need to be there...have faith....the end is not a far as you think

Just out of curiosity, below are the players who have graduated from ND in the last 10 years and played in the NFL (not including this year). Given that our record over the same period is probably about 65% (I don't know the exact number), I think it's consistent with the thesis that over the last decade the team has underperformed relative to the players' skill.

Granted, you don't see a ton of pro-bowlers, but it seems like an impressive list relative to many other schools. For example, I would like to see a similar list for Purdue, seeing as how their record over the same period is about the same.


Abiamiri, Victor (2007 - 2009)
Battle, Arnaz (2003 - 2009)
Black, Jordan (2003 - 2009)
Boiman, Rocky (2002 - 2009)
Brown, Bobby (2000 - 2000)
Carlson, John (2008 - 2009)
Collins, Jerome (2005 - 2007)
Cooper, Deke (2002 - 2007)
Denman, Anthony (2001 - 2002)
Driver, Tony (2001 - 2002)
Earl, Glenn (2004 - 2006)
Faine, Jeff (2003 - 2009)
Fasano, Anthony (2006 - 2009)
Fisher, Tony (2002 - 2006)
Gandy, Mike (2002 - 2009)
Givens, David (2002 - 2006)
Goodspeed, Joey (2002 - 2004)
Goolsby, Mike (2005 - 2005)
Grant, Ryan (2007 - 2009)
Harper, Deveron (2000 - 2004)
Harris, Ryan (2007 - 2009)
Harrison, Tyreo (2002 - 2003)
Holiday, Carlyle (2005 - 2007)
Holloway, Jabari (2002 - 2003)
Howard, Bobbie (2001 - 2003)
Hunter, Javin (2002 - 2002)
Irons, Grant (2002 - 2006)
Israel, Ron (2003 - 2003)
Jackson, Jarious (2000 - 2003)
Jones, Julius (2004 - 2009)
Landri, Derek (2007 - 2009)
Laws, Trevor (2008 - 2009)
Legree, Lance (2001 - 2006)
LeVoir, Mark (2007 - 2009)
Lopienski, Tom (2003 - 2004)
Mahan, Sean (2003 - 2009)
Mays, Corey (2006 - 2009)
Minor, Kory (2000 - 2002)
Molinaro, Jim (2004 - 2006)
Ndukwe, Chinedum (2007 - 2008)
O'leary, Dan (2001 - 2002)
Owens, John (2002 - 2009)
Roehl, Jeff (2003 - 2003)
Santucci, Dan (2007 - 2007)
Sapp, Gerome (2003 - 2007)
Stovall, Maurice (2006 - 2009)
Taylor, Jamaar (2004 - 2005)
Tuck, Justin (2005 - 2009)
Vollers, Kurt (2002 - 2005)
Walker, Darius (2007 - 2007)
Walton, Shane (2003 - 2003)
Watson, Courtney (2004 - 2005)
Weaver, Anthony (2002 - 2008)
Williams, Brock (2003 - 2004)
Zbikowski, Tom (2008 - 2009)

 

[Irish Man3]

Speed is definitely part of the problem. Yet, it's just a part of the overall issue. Generally, the better players are bigger, fast, stronger, and we don't have 'em! We haven't had them, overall, in quite a while. The end is very far off, I'm afraid. The problem is once you realized you have a mediocre team on the field- it's too late. It takes years to fix, not a season. And, regrettably we can't get the players anymore to fix it.

I saw an article yesterday saying the most players in the NFL come from California, Florida, and Texas- in that order. And, I might add, by a large margin. The 4th state with the most players has half of the 3rd state. That means three of the Elite programs in the country don't even have to leave their backyard to produce NFL ready talent in college. And we think we are going to get to the top how? Guess where those players are looking to play? Hint- it ain't ND! You start solving that problem- and you'll start seeing better talent at ND. Until then we'll just keep playing this little game amongst ourselves while we get beaten by Purdue and BC.

Last I saw.... it is Notre Dame!

2011 Notre Dame verbals:
Aaron Lynch- FLORIDA
Clay Burton- FLORIDA
Jordan Prestwood- FLORIDA
Anthony Rabasa- FLORIDA
Geoge Atkinson- CALIFORNIA
Josh Atkinson- CALIFORNIA
Jalen Brown- TEXAS

Still considering Notre Dame:
Wayne Lyons- FLORIDA
Jacoby Brissett- FLORIDA
Marcus Roberson- FLORIDA
Troy Niklas- CALIFORNIA
Quincy Aldridge- TEXAS

Maybe you can remember a few other "pretty good players" from these states:
Jimmy Clausen- CALIFORNIA
Shaq Evans- CALIFORNIA
Cierre Wood- CALIFORNIA
Dayne Crist- CALIFORNIA
Konrad Reuland- CALIFORNIA
Sam Young- FLORIDA
Ian Williams- FLORIDA

My "hint" to you would be to look up some kind of information to back your posts. Notre Dame has always been able to nationally recruit. That has never been the problem. The problem lies in what we do with them when they get on campus. They haven't been coached correctly.

 

[WaveDomer]

I think people need to take a step back and realize how difficult it really is to be a consistent top tier football program on a consistent basis. Everything is a cycle. Some schools are able to get back in the thick of it quicker than others. Sometimes it depends on coaching, but even Joe Pa has been up and down as was Bowden. What the hell ever happened to Colorado? Texas stunk it up for years. USC stunk for years. What ever happened to Texas A&M? Most of the time it is just a cycle. Alabama will not be that good forever.

Today, parity is unreal. As a great player you can go virtually anywhere and get exposure nowadays. Didn't Flacco go to Delaware or some similar school? That's why you see D II beating D I now.

I know it's frustrating to be a Notre Dame fan right now, but in order to be a top tier school, everything has to fall into place. You have to have the horses on the field. You have to avoid injury. You have to avoid academic problems. You have to have a good coach and a good staff. You have to have an administration that supports it the right way. In the end, you have to even get the calls on the field. All of that just hasn't fallen in place for ND for a long time. It sucks, but it's reality. It doesn't mean it isn't going to happen. I think it will. You don't just stop being a good coach. Kelly is a good coach.

Enjoy the ride. When ND becomes a contender again, you will remember these years and the fight. The victories will be all that much sweeter.

 

[PANDFAN]

Just out of curiosity, below are the players who have graduated from ND in the last 10 years and played in the NFL (not including this year). Given that our record over the same period is probably about 65% (I don't know the exact number), I think it's consistent with the thesis that over the last decade the team has underperformed relative to the players' skill.

Granted, you don't see a ton of pro-bowlers, but it seems like an impressive list relative to many other schools. For example, I would like to see a similar list for Purdue, seeing as how their record over the same period is about the same.


Abiamiri, Victor (2007 - 2009)
Battle, Arnaz (2003 - 2009)
Black, Jordan (2003 - 2009)
Boiman, Rocky (2002 - 2009)
Brown, Bobby (2000 - 2000)
Carlson, John (2008 - 2009)
Collins, Jerome (2005 - 2007)
Cooper, Deke (2002 - 2007)
Denman, Anthony (2001 - 2002)
Driver, Tony (2001 - 2002)
Earl, Glenn (2004 - 2006)
Faine, Jeff (2003 - 2009)
Fasano, Anthony (2006 - 2009)
Fisher, Tony (2002 - 2006)
Gandy, Mike (2002 - 2009)
Givens, David (2002 - 2006)
Goodspeed, Joey (2002 - 2004)
Goolsby, Mike (2005 - 2005)
Grant, Ryan (2007 - 2009)
Harper, Deveron (2000 - 2004)
Harris, Ryan (2007 - 2009)
Harrison, Tyreo (2002 - 2003)
Holiday, Carlyle (2005 - 2007)
Holloway, Jabari (2002 - 2003)
Howard, Bobbie (2001 - 2003)
Hunter, Javin (2002 - 2002)
Irons, Grant (2002 - 2006)
Israel, Ron (2003 - 2003)
Jackson, Jarious (2000 - 2003)
Jones, Julius (2004 - 2009)
Landri, Derek (2007 - 2009)
Laws, Trevor (2008 - 2009)
Legree, Lance (2001 - 2006)
LeVoir, Mark (2007 - 2009)
Lopienski, Tom (2003 - 2004)
Mahan, Sean (2003 - 2009)
Mays, Corey (2006 - 2009)
Minor, Kory (2000 - 2002)
Molinaro, Jim (2004 - 2006)
Ndukwe, Chinedum (2007 - 2008)
O'leary, Dan (2001 - 2002)
Owens, John (2002 - 2009)
Roehl, Jeff (2003 - 2003)
Santucci, Dan (2007 - 2007)
Sapp, Gerome (2003 - 2007)
Stovall, Maurice (2006 - 2009)
Taylor, Jamaar (2004 - 2005)
Tuck, Justin (2005 - 2009)
Vollers, Kurt (2002 - 2005)
Walker, Darius (2007 - 2007)
Walton, Shane (2003 - 2003)
Watson, Courtney (2004 - 2005)
Weaver, Anthony (2002 - 2008)
Williams, Brock (2003 - 2004)
Zbikowski, Tom (2008 - 2009)

most of them arn't even in the league anymore...not saying we don't have some that did/do play at a higher level in the nfl ie tuck, brown, ryan grant, but they were not certainly anything that other teams had to plan their whole game plan around....we get them every so often but not like other teams...brown, rocket, smardjia, tate and you can toss floyd in there but look at the gaps in years

 

[goldandblue]

Sure, I can see that. But you have to admit that Kelly inherited one of the most talented WRs in college football, and that guy has practically disappeared. My point is that it isn't just as easy as "Weis was terrible, and Kelly has to repair all of that damage." If a terrible coach like Weis was able to utilize Floyd's talent, why can't a great coach like Kelly figure it out?

Ha Ha ha... do you know what your talking about???

Let's take a look at Floyd's production...

Total receptions
2008 - 48 - lost time due to injury
2009 - 44 - lost time due to injury
2010 - 24 - currently. - avg. 6 per game. if he continues on his avg he will have app. 72

Avg receptions per game.
2008 - 4.8
2009 - 6.28
2010 - 6 - currently.

Avg yards per catch
2008 - 15.0
2009 - 18.1
2010 - 14.1 - currently

Total receiving yards.
2008 - 719
2009 - 795
2010 - 339 - currently. If he continues on with averages 1017 yards would be projected.

Touchdowns
2008 - 7
2009 - 9
2010 - 2 - currently avg. .5 per game would lead him to have 6 touchdowns at the end.

My question for you is.... Is this a Floyd problem or a Crist problem?? IMO it is a Crist problem primarily. Clausen was one hell of a deep ball passer. He had the balls to sling it out there and faith in his receivers to come down with it not to mention he was a more accurate passer. This is the reason you see Floyd's yards per catch and touchdowns higher the last two years than this year. Honestly, how many catchable deep balls have been thrown to Floyd this year?? One obvious difference for Floyd this year is that he is the #1 go to wideout and inherently picks up additional coverages from opposing defenses. I will knock on Floyd about one thing though.... The fumbles in the RedZone have got to go... Both of those could have equalled wins for us.

One more thing to add...
Jimmy Clausen
2009
attempts - 425
completions - 289
completion % - 68.0
yards - 3,722
touchdowns - 28
Interceptions - 4
rating - 161.4

Dayne Crist
2010 - current
attempts - 150
completions - 89
completion % - 59.3
yards - 1,155
touchdowns - 8
interceptions - 3
rating - 137.6

2010 end of season on current avgs.
attempts - 450
completions - 267
completion % - 59.3
yards - 3,465
touchdowns - 24
interceptions - 9
rating - 137.6

It's a little easier for Floyd to have better numbers when A... you have Golden Tate lined up on the other side of the field and B.... your quarterback is better.....

 

[Irish Man3]

Thank god you posted what I already posted an hour ago.

 

[goldandblue]

Thank god you posted what I already posted an hour ago.

yeah, I just saw it. didn't mean to trample your post.

 

[Irish Man3]

yeah, I just saw it. didn't mean to trample your post.

Just messing with you man. Its valid information that needs to be out there. Great minds think alike.

 

[dsotm]

Last I saw.... it is Notre Dame!

2011 Notre Dame verbals:
Aaron Lynch- FLORIDA
Clay Burton- FLORIDA
Jordan Prestwood- FLORIDA
Anthony Rabasa- FLORIDA
Geoge Atkinson- CALIFORNIA
Josh Atkinson- CALIFORNIA
Jalen Brown- TEXAS

Still considering Notre Dame:
Wayne Lyons- FLORIDA
Jacoby Brissett- FLORIDA
Marcus Roberson- FLORIDA
Troy Niklas- CALIFORNIA
Quincy Aldridge- TEXAS

Maybe you can remember a few other "pretty good players" from these states:
Jimmy Clausen- CALIFORNIA
Shaq Evans- CALIFORNIA
Cierre Wood- CALIFORNIA
Dayne Crist- CALIFORNIA
Konrad Reuland- CALIFORNIA
Sam Young- FLORIDA
Ian Williams- FLORIDA

My "hint" to you would be to look up some kind of information to back your posts. Notre Dame has always been able to nationally recruit. That has never been the problem. The problem lies in what we do with them when they get on campus. They haven't been coached correctly.

Wha? You name mostly guys who are still in college, and 2 who are unproved in the NFL as proof ND recruits well? Then you give me verbals from this year, and some PENDING Verbals. God help us. Let me know when ND has a Heisman candidate or an NFL player who threatens MVP. Did you by any chance look up the stats regarding how many ND graduates int he last 10 years drafted- are still in the NFL? Good job.

 

[goldandblue]

Just messing with you man. Its valid information that needs to be out there. Great minds think alike.

agreed!

 

[dsotm]

I think people need to take a step back and realize how difficult it really is to be a consistent top tier football program on a consistent basis. Everything is a cycle. Some schools are able to get back in the thick of it quicker than others. Sometimes it depends on coaching, but even Joe Pa has been up and down as was Bowden. What the hell ever happened to Colorado? Texas stunk it up for years. USC stunk for years. What ever happened to Texas A&M? Most of the time it is just a cycle. Alabama will not be that good forever.

Today, parity is unreal. As a great player you can go virtually anywhere and get exposure nowadays. Didn't Flacco go to Delaware or some similar school? That's why you see D II beating D I now.

How long is the ND cycle? It's been 22 years- that's one heck of a cycle for a supposed elite team. I'm all for parity. However, we're not even contenders. That's not parity. We are ND, of course we're not supposed to win a NC every year- but we are supposed to be relevant. We're not. When was the last time we were relevant? I don't mean ranked- we all know the ND points- I mean REALLY relevant? You have to go back pretty far. That's some cycle.

 

[Irish Man3]

Wha? You name mostly guys who are still in college, and 2 who are unproved in the NFL as proof ND recruits well? Then you give me verbals from this year, and some PENDING Verbals. God help us. Let me know when ND has a Heisman candidate or an NFL player who threatens MVP. Did you by any chance look up the stats regarding how many ND graduates int he last 10 years drafted- are still in the NFL? Good job.

You noted that our problem was that Notre Dame didnt attract national recruits from the Florida, Texas, and California hotbeds. You brought up the NFL and then touched on COLLEGE recruiting. Re-read your own post. It made no sense. Your exact staement:
"Guess where those players are looking to play?"
The players in the NFL that have come from those three states have no always played for those 3 colleges. if you read the entire ESPN article, you may understand that. Where they are born and where they go to highschool and where they go to college are not always the same. Your post is very flawed and you clearly misunderstood the point of that ESPN article.