Possible Staff Under Kelly
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Maddog77
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ISD reporting that we will all know soon and the names that we've heard should be the ones he names as his first staff at ND.
I'll let BGIF update his chart since he has the best spreadsheet skillset here.
One note, I didn't see Genyk anywhere mentioned, so it's possible he is out.
I'll let BGIF update his chart since he has the best spreadsheet skillset here.
One note, I didn't see Genyk anywhere mentioned, so it's possible he is out.
I think the ISD list is a tad bit questionable, though. I wonder if this is them trying to reveal the staff first after rivals reported many of the coaches (like Denbrock and Marriner) first.
The one thing I find odd is that Hinton is on the list instead of Genyk. Weird since Alford is going to coach RBs (Hinton's former position). The other position Hinton might coach is LBs, (which he coaches before coaching RBs) but that is likely filled by Diaco or Martin (whichever isn't DC). So where would Hinton fit?
ALSO: The list of coaches doesn't seem to have a qualified QB coach on the list. Is this something Kelly would cover? I hope not since he's going to have to be the OC (although probably not in title).
If this is the staff I think several question marks should be raised. For instance, who is going to recruit California - which was a gold mine for us this past season? None of these coaches seem to have any history of recruiting there.
The one thing I find odd is that Hinton is on the list instead of Genyk. Weird since Alford is going to coach RBs (Hinton's former position). The other position Hinton might coach is LBs, (which he coaches before coaching RBs) but that is likely filled by Diaco or Martin (whichever isn't DC). So where would Hinton fit?
ALSO: The list of coaches doesn't seem to have a qualified QB coach on the list. Is this something Kelly would cover? I hope not since he's going to have to be the OC (although probably not in title).
If this is the staff I think several question marks should be raised. For instance, who is going to recruit California - which was a gold mine for us this past season? None of these coaches seem to have any history of recruiting there.
I haven't update the spreadsheet as I don't know how to assign slots. Mike Frank's list has two RB coachs. Hinton has coached LBs in his past and has been RC as well. Keep in mind the NCAA does not allow a full time RC. Hinton has to coach a postion and Alford was the first hire at the RB slot. Also keep in mind that Alford has done nothing but coach RBs. Hinton's not a QB coach nor a OC. Genyk does both those things. Browing is also an OC as well as OLine coach and I assumed he went by the wayside over Genyk being a better fit with Kelly's spread.
Mike Frank has Kerry Cooks coaching LBs yet if Cooks resume clealy shows he's never coached anything but DBs. He also played DB in college. It makes more sense to put Martin on the LBs than Cooks as Martin has extensive diverse experience at a multitude of positions. I was never impressed with either Corwin Brown nor Polian as COACHES but I would have kept both of them rather than bring in two guys I know but that will need Postion On The Job Training.
I'm trying to keep an open mind but I'm underimpressed by this collection of coaches for what's supposed to be a major program. Right now I'd say coachingwise, Kelly's UC staff looked like a better fit than this group which looks "thrown together" to me. As Browing is supposedly joining Inanello at Akron, he didn't turn Kelly down for a better offer, Kelly chose Warinner over Browning.
I understand Kelly's comment about coaches not just being recruiters and having responsiblility to acutalyl coach a position. At the same time you have to have the athletes to coach. All the coaching expertise in the nation isn't going to get a team of Rudys to beat Southern Cal. Just because a coach recruited a 3 star OL from Texas doesn't mean he knows his way around Texas HS football. Alford was around when Nix pulled the trigger but I doubt any recruiting service is going to list Alford as one of the top recruiters in Florida.
If I have a heart attack I want the EMT team that show up to be knowledgeable medics but I also want the one driving the ambulance to know his way to the Emergency Room and when he gets there I don't expect him to have to introduce himself to the ER staff before they can get started on the original mission.
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]Here's the list of Assistant Coaches from Mike Frank at ISD.[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif][/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]Bob Diaco---DC.[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]Chuck Martin---most likely DBscoach.[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]Mike Elston---DLline.[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]Charley Molnar---WR most likely.[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]Tim Hinton----not sure where Hinton will coach.[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]Mike Denbrock---TEs most likely, maybe OTs.[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]Kerry Cooks----most likely LBs[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]Ed Warriner----OLine.[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]Tony Alford----RBs. [/FONT]
Note that list has no OC, no QB coach, two RB coaches, two DB coaches, no Special Teams Coach, and no RC.
I'll assume Hinton is the RC. Elston has done RC but I expect he'll have DLine and ST. Many of the coaches in this group have ST experience. Diaco as DC could also handle LBs.
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif][/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]Bob Diaco---DC.[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]Chuck Martin---most likely DBscoach.[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]Mike Elston---DLline.[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]Charley Molnar---WR most likely.[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]Tim Hinton----not sure where Hinton will coach.[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]Mike Denbrock---TEs most likely, maybe OTs.[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]Kerry Cooks----most likely LBs[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]Ed Warriner----OLine.[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]Tony Alford----RBs. [/FONT]
Note that list has no OC, no QB coach, two RB coaches, two DB coaches, no Special Teams Coach, and no RC.
I'll assume Hinton is the RC. Elston has done RC but I expect he'll have DLine and ST. Many of the coaches in this group have ST experience. Diaco as DC could also handle LBs.
tankdawgirish32
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I glad you said all this cause when I say it people jump down your throat. We all know Kiffen is cheating in recruiting for Tenn but some of those defensive player are going there because his dad is a proven winner and they think he can get them to the pros so why aren't we going after a great Def. Cord.?
NDinL.A.
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I don't follow coaching as closely as you do so I'm certainly not qualified to say this coaching staff is great or they suck or whatever might be the case. But I will say that I think we can all agree that the previous coaching staff was pretty damn good at recruiting, correct? Well, almost every one of those guys coming in was not known as an elite recruiter, with the exception of Ianello.
Brown was considered good at Virginia but not elite. CW hadn't been around the college game for almost 2 decades. Haywood was not considered a great recruiter at TX by their fans (and seriously, it isn't hard to recruit at TX...you just pick who you want). Polian wasn't considered elite at all and he turned out to possibly be our best recruiter.
My point is that as much as I want the big name guys, I'm hoping that this coaching staff coaches better than the old staff, gets along better and 'meshes' better than the old staff, and they recruit just as hard as the old staff. The man 2 things, besides winning of course, that all recruiters must do is work their asses off to establish relationships, and have a personality that kids can relate to in some way. For the first time for many of these guys, they have a national name (ND) to back them. They already have a foot in the door with these kids. Then if they work hard and establish relationships, they'll have 2 feet in the door.
And finally, these assistants are backed by a head coach with almost 20 years in the business, a proven winner who by all accounts has a dynamic and energetic persona trying the seal the deal on these recruits. If he can close on Barr and one more elite guy (James, Henderson, Jones, etc), then that will answer a lot of questions for me.
Looking at this list, I don't blame people for being apprehensive at all. What I like is that he took his time and put together a staff he feels will mesh together and build an elite team. Weis didn't have that luxury when he was hired, and you saw the results (bad fits or just bad coaches - Jappy, Latina, and even Tenuta). Hopefully, this will be a staff that Kelly envisions - good coaches as well as good recruiters...
There's an article on Tim Hinton on ISD: Notre Dame Football - Hinton Hopes To Fit In
He seems to be a good coach, based on the fact that he, like Alford, was the only one retained by Kelly when he went to Cincy. However, the shift from RB coach to QB coach would surprise me slightly. Hinton has coached RBs, WRs, DL, LBs, and special teams before, as well as being an experienced high school head coach. However, to be a QB coach, you would think he would need some prior experience at the position. This makes me think that, if Kelly does put Hinton at the QB coach position, Kelly figures he will be doing a lot of the coaching of the QBs. I believe he did this quite a bit at Cincy, too, so it does make sense.
As Hinton was also the recruiting coordinator for Cincy, it may make sense that he would assume that position again here at Notre Dame - whether he is officially named it or not.
Well, I believe that tomorrow or the next couple days will answer many of our questions, so I guess we just wait and see... It certainly is an interesting time to be an Irish fan.
He seems to be a good coach, based on the fact that he, like Alford, was the only one retained by Kelly when he went to Cincy. However, the shift from RB coach to QB coach would surprise me slightly. Hinton has coached RBs, WRs, DL, LBs, and special teams before, as well as being an experienced high school head coach. However, to be a QB coach, you would think he would need some prior experience at the position. This makes me think that, if Kelly does put Hinton at the QB coach position, Kelly figures he will be doing a lot of the coaching of the QBs. I believe he did this quite a bit at Cincy, too, so it does make sense.
As Hinton was also the recruiting coordinator for Cincy, it may make sense that he would assume that position again here at Notre Dame - whether he is officially named it or not.
Well, I believe that tomorrow or the next couple days will answer many of our questions, so I guess we just wait and see... It certainly is an interesting time to be an Irish fan.
Hinton acting as RC and QB coach would be really odd to me. Surely there's an elite recruiter out there somewhere who has experience coaching QBs. If some of the things speculated come to fruition, it will really make me wonder if Kelly is being too loyal to former coaches (Diaco, Hinton) rather than thinking of what's best for this program.
SoJerseyIrish
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C'mon guys......you act like recruiting is something that can only be done by a handful of people.......it is not rocket science.....it is building relationships, selling the school and staying in touch with kids, families and coaches.....relax......BK will get the job done.....
Also.....I bet Alford is RC.......
Also.....I bet Alford is RC.......
diaco would be a terrible choice for dc. of those mentioned i would take my chances on martin. somone of bumpas's stature would have been the superior choice. defese has been our problem for 5 years.and i don't see this groupimproving us .my initial elation with kelly is gone.
hershey
hershey
tankdawgirish32
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Not worried about BK worried about Diaco
I think recruiting is like anything. Some people just having a knack for it. I don't think you can undervalue the importance of a strong recruiter. Just think: without Polian there probably would be no Manti Teo, no Shaq Evans, no Cierre Wood, no Dayne Crist, no Kyle Rudolph and maybe no Jimmy Claussen. (According to Rivals recruiting history.)
Completely agree, Hershey. I'm not sure why Swarbrick wouldn't have made this more of a mandatory as part of Kelly being hired.
I'm starting to really wonder if the pool of money negotiated for assistant coaches is dramatically lower than it should be. If it isn't the case, then based on the experience and resumes of some of these coaches hired we may be overpaying for them.
Domina Nostra
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Does anyone know what they are being paid? My guess is that Kelly is getting who he wants and will pay fair market value. Kelly's approach is to make player development primary. From this angle the coaching staff looks great. Martin's presence on the defensive side gives me a lot of confidence if Diaco, rather than Martin, is named the DC. (I tend to think that the way people are reporting the various assignments does not make a lot of sense).
If Diaco is the DC, I think he looks fine. He is a young and hungry and has Kelly's confidence. I think this is important considering Kelly has been around the block. PLus, UC did not just replace 10 starters on defense, they literally had to use a ND back-up QB as a LB. The cupbard was BARE. Alabama has a young DC is of comparable age and experience (it is a little better and the HC is a defense guy). Their OC is not a big name guy either. This is not to say we should get similar results, it is just to say that young smart guys up-and-comers are recognizable to experienced HCs.
As far as recruiting goes- patience!!! We are in a dead period (NO CONTACT) right now and Kelly is waiting for his staff to get through bowl games. again, they cannot contact anyone right now. Those guys will be out working it in a matter of days. They all look they have the requisite energy and ambition. The fact is that Kelly is a salesman through and through. He will be a very good recruiter. He was a Saturn salesman who now gets to sell Mercedes. - not only is ND a very compelling sell, UC is one of the least interesting schools imaginable. Kelly is not going to entrust his sales to incompotent assistants.
And Kelly is not stupid. Everyone on Earth knows that you win championships with great athletes (guys that ussually get recognized as 4 and 5 stars). When I hear him talk about "beauty pagents" and the "right kind of guys" I think Rocket and Tim Brown rather than Randy Moss or Mauice Clarett. There are guys that are just not worth the trouble for a school like ND. You have to push the Michael Floyds and let the Julio Joneses go on their way. Carroll and Mack Brown always recruit a few diamonds in the rough (2-3 stars) each year, Kelly will do the same. He will also recruit 3 stars that will be re-evaluated after peopoe see what he sees.
If Diaco is the DC, I think he looks fine. He is a young and hungry and has Kelly's confidence. I think this is important considering Kelly has been around the block. PLus, UC did not just replace 10 starters on defense, they literally had to use a ND back-up QB as a LB. The cupbard was BARE. Alabama has a young DC is of comparable age and experience (it is a little better and the HC is a defense guy). Their OC is not a big name guy either. This is not to say we should get similar results, it is just to say that young smart guys up-and-comers are recognizable to experienced HCs.
As far as recruiting goes- patience!!! We are in a dead period (NO CONTACT) right now and Kelly is waiting for his staff to get through bowl games. again, they cannot contact anyone right now. Those guys will be out working it in a matter of days. They all look they have the requisite energy and ambition. The fact is that Kelly is a salesman through and through. He will be a very good recruiter. He was a Saturn salesman who now gets to sell Mercedes. - not only is ND a very compelling sell, UC is one of the least interesting schools imaginable. Kelly is not going to entrust his sales to incompotent assistants.
And Kelly is not stupid. Everyone on Earth knows that you win championships with great athletes (guys that ussually get recognized as 4 and 5 stars). When I hear him talk about "beauty pagents" and the "right kind of guys" I think Rocket and Tim Brown rather than Randy Moss or Mauice Clarett. There are guys that are just not worth the trouble for a school like ND. You have to push the Michael Floyds and let the Julio Joneses go on their way. Carroll and Mack Brown always recruit a few diamonds in the rough (2-3 stars) each year, Kelly will do the same. He will also recruit 3 stars that will be re-evaluated after peopoe see what he sees.
I agree that people shouldn't criticize his recruiting as of yet, it is way too premature and unfounded, frankly. However, your assertion that this is a dead period - meaning "NO CONTACT" - is not totally true. Coaches can talk to each recruit once a week, so when you say "again, they cannot contact anyone right now," that's not totally true. I hope they are using their one call a week on Christian Jones, Barr, and Matt James, certainly.
NDinL.A.
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How do you know that? First of all, Clausen came specifically because of Weis. I could have been the lead recruiter on Clausen and Weis would have still got him to ND. The same can be said for Crist, who had ND written all over him. Who was Polian before he got to ND? Was he a proven name? Nope. By your definition, you would have been complaining about him when Weis hired him. He was the lead recruiter at CFU, and he didn't land one big time recruit for them. So does that mean he was a bad hire? Of course not...nobody lands big time recruits there.
To say that ND would not have gotten those guys if not for Polian is short-sighted. We don't know what would have happened. What we do know is that Polian was a hard-working, hungry recruiter, backed by a brand name that allowed him to get in the front door. If these new coaches work extremely hard (and that's 90% of recruiting really...as long as you're backed by a good school that wins), they have a chance to be just as successful as Polian.
If you write these guys off already, that means you're the same guy who would have written off Polian. Look at how he turned out. We're just going to have to wait and see with these guys and hope for the best.
Oh, and Rivals is wrong, Polian didn't recruit Rudolph, that was Corwin Brown. And in Rudolph's case, it was really Notre Dame that recruited him. He committed very early in the process...
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Colts baby!
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I agree completely
I agree completely
It is very likely that Kelly knows what he is doing. I've got to trust his judgment on this. No one here is an expert anyway. Great post, LA.
I agree completely
It is very likely that Kelly knows what he is doing. I've got to trust his judgment on this. No one here is an expert anyway. Great post, LA.
Most of Lou's best teams, 1988 and 1993 were not laden with 5* recruits. They were kids who believed in Lou and his program and would do anything to win. Change positions, share time, whatever. Lou and his staff turned them into great players. No one wanted Rice as a QB. He ends up what 27 - 1. He put many people in the pros because the listened to him and his staff and improved their themselves over the course of the ND careers. We get caught up in this rating game. BK knows he needs players that are going to buy into his program and want to be at ND and want to win. If he get a bunch of 3* that want to learn and become a team, I have a feeling wins will follow.
NDOM
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YES!!!!!! Thank you sir. Well said. You.....You.....You brought a tear to my eye..............or that coulda been the bong smoke. Daaaaaaaaamn..........(NDOM being distracted) this chick online is so hot I wanna suck a fart outta her ass and hold it like a bong hit. Anyway. Well said. Carry on.
NDOM
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Go to forums and start the thread under the correct category. Its pretty simple once ya get the hang of it. Once ya click on forums then ya click on new thread.
vernfootball1
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Thanks man, appreciate it
NDOM
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No problem. Need any other help you can alway pm a mod or you can pm me too. I will be glad to try and help.
The Polish Irishman
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chelow3000
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Dont know if this has been posted yet bvut just in case it hasn't
Introducing Notre Dame's Expected Hires to Fill Brian Kelly's Coaching Staff | Bleacher Report
Introducing Notre Dame's Expected Hires to Fill Brian Kelly's Coaching Staff | Bleacher Report
The article makes no mention of what position Cooks will coach at ND. The title of the article merely mentions "Irish poach secondary coach Cooks" and it notes he coached Wisconsin's secondary.
Notre Dame Football - Hinton Hopes To Fit In
In his coaching career which has been spent entirely Ohio, high school and college, Hinton has coached RBs, LBs, WRs, and DLine so for ND it appears he will be coaching QBs as there is no QB coach on Kelly's staff.
And people wonder was Hendrix was deliberating.
In his coaching career which has been spent entirely Ohio, high school and college, Hinton has coached RBs, LBs, WRs, and DLine so for ND it appears he will be coaching QBs as there is no QB coach on Kelly's staff.
And people wonder was Hendrix was deliberating.
Domina Nostra
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Four things:
1) The coaches have not been named yet. No need to speculate on how decisions that have not even been made reflect poorly on the coach or are scaring recruits.
2) While Kelly has not been a coach at this level, he has been a HC for a long time and won big everywhere that he has been-- Kelly knows what he is doing. Why assume that he will recklessly set himself up for failure? The names people seem sure about, Cooks, Warriner, Martin all look extremely solid to me. The other guys will be assigned based on competency. Kelly wants to win!
3) Kelly is just as aware as anyone how his decisions will appear to the outside world. At the very, very least, he knows what he had to accomplish to be considered by ND: winning big everywhere he went, turning programs around, conference championships, top 25 finishes, BCS births, undefeated seasons. If these are the criteria for him, why would he assume that his boss would be indiffernt to hiring mediocre coaches for loyalty, convenience, or ego reasons. If he puts Diaco as the DC over Martin (or someone else out there), Kelly knows that this will look like a risky move. We can trust that--based on personal experience--he thinks it will help ND win DESPITE the appearance that it will create.
4) Kelly has stated numerous times that the buck on offense and defense stops with him. This is not like Weis who let the D do its thing. Therefore, there are no independent coaches (like Tenuta seemed to be). We play a 3-4 which creates hybrid positions. It could bet that Cooks coaches the backfeild players (CBs/FS), Martin Coaches the SSs/LBs (co-DC?), Diaco coaches the OLBs and the DEs (co-DC?) , and Elston coaches the down DLmen (and perhaps be the STC). On offense You could have Kelly as the primary QB coach with Hinton assisting him. Charley Molnar would coach WRs and be the passing game coordinator, Ed Warriner would coach the OL and be the running game coordinator (maybe OC as well). Mike Denbrock would coach the TEs and maybe OTs. Tony Alford would coach the RBs and be the Rexruiting Coordinator. That would look really good to me.
1) The coaches have not been named yet. No need to speculate on how decisions that have not even been made reflect poorly on the coach or are scaring recruits.
2) While Kelly has not been a coach at this level, he has been a HC for a long time and won big everywhere that he has been-- Kelly knows what he is doing. Why assume that he will recklessly set himself up for failure? The names people seem sure about, Cooks, Warriner, Martin all look extremely solid to me. The other guys will be assigned based on competency. Kelly wants to win!
3) Kelly is just as aware as anyone how his decisions will appear to the outside world. At the very, very least, he knows what he had to accomplish to be considered by ND: winning big everywhere he went, turning programs around, conference championships, top 25 finishes, BCS births, undefeated seasons. If these are the criteria for him, why would he assume that his boss would be indiffernt to hiring mediocre coaches for loyalty, convenience, or ego reasons. If he puts Diaco as the DC over Martin (or someone else out there), Kelly knows that this will look like a risky move. We can trust that--based on personal experience--he thinks it will help ND win DESPITE the appearance that it will create.
4) Kelly has stated numerous times that the buck on offense and defense stops with him. This is not like Weis who let the D do its thing. Therefore, there are no independent coaches (like Tenuta seemed to be). We play a 3-4 which creates hybrid positions. It could bet that Cooks coaches the backfeild players (CBs/FS), Martin Coaches the SSs/LBs (co-DC?), Diaco coaches the OLBs and the DEs (co-DC?) , and Elston coaches the down DLmen (and perhaps be the STC). On offense You could have Kelly as the primary QB coach with Hinton assisting him. Charley Molnar would coach WRs and be the passing game coordinator, Ed Warriner would coach the OL and be the running game coordinator (maybe OC as well). Mike Denbrock would coach the TEs and maybe OTs. Tony Alford would coach the RBs and be the Rexruiting Coordinator. That would look really good to me.