offensive line, defensive line i am completely disgusted

[alleycat9]

both of these units have plenty of "talent" neither one of these units play with ANY kind of heart or desire. i have watched an undersized msu dline run right around our oline too many times today. i have watched that same line completely blow up our line on just about every single run that we have attempted, to the point that running the ball was completely fruitless. an average of 0.4 YPC and thats WITH a 24 yard run from golden tate.

on the other side our dline has been trapped and blasted out of holes all day, no pressure on the qb. the dbs are making all the tackles as the front 7 in general is completely getting handled.

there appears to be plenty of talent on the offensive side in the skill positions but they will never be great without that damn line making at least a couple blocks!!!!!!


i dont want to hear about turnovers or missed field goals when we cant even move a guy off the line or make a hole or handle a little bity de rushing right around both of our offensive tackles. shit there was one play they ran a stunt and the OG stood there like oh wait was i supposed to block that guy?

 

[Junkhead]

Coaching, strength and conditioning, and most of all, motivation should all be looked at.

 

[ACamp1900]

I agree the oline play is horrid in the running game... whats funny is they have come together as a passing unit... I don't want to hear about sacks today... when you don't run you give up sacks... over all they played well

but the running game is unreal... all that talent and nothing

 

[LOVEMYIRISH]

We all knew the DL is a weakness for us. If they are not true freshmen, then they are only 2 or 3 star players.

To expect more of them is foolish. They are already playing above their expected ability.

 

[Golden_Domer88]

Talent? Yeah HIGH SCHOOL talent!

Only really talented COLLEGE players we have are Tate, Floyd, Brian Smith, Allen and Bruton. Everyone else was a great HIGH SCHOOL football player. We dont have the coaches to convert them to good college football players. Does it ever work out when a college coach goes to the pros? NO! Does it ever work out when a Pro coach goes down to the college level? NO!

Pro coaches are coaching players that already know the game of football and are physically ready to play in the NFL. They teach them the speed of the game and schemes....thats it!

College coaches....well good college coaches know how to develope a HS player into the college level. Look at USC, Florida, Oklahoma, Texas, Georgia, Missouri. All great COLLEGE coaches.

Time to switch it up and get a new coach. Go ahead and say give Weis another year. Well hes had what 4 years now to turn this program around with three Top 10 recruting classes? What the hell is going on? Yeah blame willingham for poor recruiting and blah blah blah.

You cant teach talent but you sure can develope it.

 

[LOVEMYIRISH]

Does it ever work out when a Pro coach goes down to the college level? NO!

Pro coaches are coaching players that already know the game of football and are physically ready to play in the NFL. They teach them the speed of the game and schemes....thats it!

This man could not agree with you more!!!

http://ciotoolkit.files.wordpress.com/2008/03/t1_carroll.jpg

 

[ACamp1900]

This man could not agree with you more!!!

http://ciotoolkit.files.wordpress.com/2008/03/t1_carroll.jpg

beat me to it

same for Dan Devine... Bill Walsh... Jimmy Johnson... Lou Holtz... list goes on

 

[GreenGoblin]

Our defensive linemen, especially the defensive tackles in a 3-4 system need to be BIG to be effective, we have some of the smallest 3-4 defensive linemen I have ever seen. Whats even worse is we are recruiting defensive tackles with sizes ranging from 6'1-6'3. In a 3-4 defense? Your linebackers should be 6'2 in a 3-4 defense.

Some of the recruiting tactics and as mentioned about fitness and strength should also come into question.

 

[jonesman]

Guys,
Come on get your heads up. The reality is that our DLine is just not that talented. Tell me one player on the front 4 who is going to play that the next level. Kuntz-no, Brown-no, Ryan-no, Neal-probably not, Williams-maybe. There is no difference maker in the group. Further, I believe Ryan will be benched next season once Fleming gets a year to grow and mature.
As for the Oline, it is simple simple math. 5 cannot block 7 or 8 guys. I even heard the commentators make this point a couple times. Our running game is sooo slow to develop and soo vanilla that the D knows just what is coming. If our coaches do not create some misdirection, we will never have a running game.

 

[GreenGoblin]

Guys,
Come on get your heads up. The reality is that our DLine is just not that talented. Tell me one player on the front 4 who is going to play that the next level. Kuntz-no, Brown-no, Ryan-no, Neal-probably not, Williams-maybe. There is no difference maker in the group. Further, I believe Ryan will be benched next season once Fleming gets a year to grow and mature.
As for the Oline, it is simple simple math. 5 cannot block 7 or 8 guys. I even heard the commentators make this point a couple times. Our running game is sooo slow to develop and soo vanilla that the D knows just what is coming. If our coaches do not create some misdirection, we will never have a running game.

Front 3 my man, front 3.

What I want to know is why isn't John Tenuta our defensive coordinator? I understand hes the "assistant head coach" but why couldn't we give him the defensive coordinator as well? His Georgia Tech defenses were tenacious, ferocious and downright scary with a mediocre talent level. This is another mistake from up top being made in my opinion.

 

[jonesman]

Trust me this D will be very very good in the next couple years. We are still very young on D.

 

[jonesman]

Hey Goblin,
The front 5 are your horses who need to clog up things. We don't have big enough horses yet.

 

[SoCalDomer]

Our defensive linemen, especially the defensive tackles in a 3-4 system need to be BIG to be effective, we have some of the smallest 3-4 defensive linemen I have ever seen. Whats even worse is we are recruiting defensive tackles with sizes ranging from 6'1-6'3. In a 3-4 defense? Your linebackers should be 6'2 in a 3-4 defense.

i think this is why they've been using more 4-man fronts. however, it seems to me they're just using a 3-man line with a OLB with his hand down. i think it's time they realize this won't work without bigger and better true lineman.

it's time to go to a dedicated 4-man, true line with Williams and Kuntz in the middle, Justin brown and Ethan Jonson on the ends.

LBs should be Mo Crum, B Johnson and Neal on the outside. On running downs, they could rotate in Scott Smith who is said to be better on run stopping. on passing downs, they could rotate in better pass LBs or even have Harrison Smith in there fore more speed.

 

[patman1868]

i think this is why they've been using more 4-man fronts. however, it seems to me they're just using a 3-man line with a OLB with his hand down. i think it's time they realize this won't work without bigger and better true lineman.

it's time to go to a dedicated 4-man, true line with Williams and Kuntz in the middle, Justin brown and Ethan Jonson on the ends.

LBs should be Mo Crum, B Johnson and Neal on the outside. On running downs, they could rotate in Scott Smith who is said to be better on run stopping. on passing downs, they could rotate in better pass LBs or even have Harrison Smith in there fore more speed.

I agree that they should go to a more of a 4-3 base defense, and maybe mix in some 3-4 if they want to change it up a bit. I just think that I would keep Neal out on the edge sometimes because he just comes with speed and athleticism off the edge that no one else really can. Also it creates somewhat of a rotation at D-end to keep the guys fresh. That way you can leave Harrison Smith in at OLB which I think he looks pretty good at.

 

[ndftbl]

DL weak; OL weaker

DL weak; OL weaker

Weis said it best after the game.

But coaching has to be a big part of this.

 

[ndftbl]

The sadest part is . . .

The sadest part is . . .

(sorry, saddest.)

on the offensive line, these guys are all juniors or above. can 't cry we're too young anymore.

and there is not a whole lot below them.

and our recruiting in this area this year is not going well.

really hasn't gone that well the last two years, either.

talk about depressed.

 

[GoIrish41]

Everyone is throwing the OL under the bus. Maybe it is time to consider the possibility that our backs may not be that great. When is the last time we've seen a 40+ gain from a ND RB - 10 years? Our OL is playing decent (not great, but decent) but still the RBs are not producing. I, for one, am tired of getting excited about 12 or 14 yard runs. Every week, I watch RBs from other teams taking it 40, 50, 60 yards to the house, and watch ND backs average under 4 ypc. It's not all the line's fault, is it?

 

[GreenGoblin]

What ever happened to James Aldridge? The guy was a 5 Star prospect and just disappeared. Lets hope the same doesn't happen for our newest 5 star prospect, Cierre Wood.

 

[Junkhead]

Everyone is throwing the OL under the bus. Maybe it is time to consider the possibility that our backs may not be that great. When is the last time we've seen a 40+ gain from a ND RB - 10 years? Our OL is playing decent (not great, but decent) but still the RBs are not producing. I, for one, am tired of getting excited about 12 or 14 yard runs. Every week, I watch RBs from other teams taking it 40, 50, 60 yards to the house, and watch ND backs average under 4 ypc. It's not all the line's fault, is it?

Did you watch the game? Did you see one play where there was a big hole that the RBs missed? Out of AA, RH, and JA, the long run was 9. There is nowhere to go. You could put Walter Payton in his prime back there and he would lose yards.

 

[LOVEMYIRISH]

(sorry, saddest.)
on the offensive line, these guys are all juniors or above. can 't cry we're too young anymore.

Actually, it is youth to a degree...

The Class That Wasn't (5th year Seniors)
None...that's right...none on the team

The Elders (True Seniors)
Turkovich
Duncan

Just now upperclassmen (True Juniors)Olsen
Wegner
Stewart
Young

Behind them (True Sophs)Nuss
Romine
Dever
Nwanko

Behind them (the True Freshmen)
Cave
Clelland
Golic
Robinson

So basically you have a team that is comprised of RedShirt Sophomores and BELOW. Name one team in NCAA DivI ball like that...go ahead and try.

 

[GreenGoblin]

Actually, it is youth to a degree...

The Class That Wasn't (5th year Seniors)
None...that's right...none on the team

The Elders (True Seniors)
Turkovich
Duncan

Just now upperclassmen (True Juniors)Olsen
Wegner
Stewart
Young

Behind them (True Sophs)Nuss
Romine
Dever
Nwanko

Behind them (the True Freshmen)
Cave
Clelland
Golic
Robinson

So basically you have a team that is comprised of RedShirt Sophomores and BELOW. Name one team in NCAA DivI ball like that...go ahead and try.

We have four juniors and a senior starting, and thats what matters. That is far from young.

 

[LOVEMYIRISH]

We have four juniors and a senior starting, and thats what matters. That is far from young.

Let's translate that into BCS team speak.

We have 3 RedShirt Sophomores, 1 Junior, and 1 red-shirt Junior starting.

So, I ask again...what team has an OL that young besides us?

 

[Junkhead]

Let's translate that into BCS team speak.

We have 3 RedShirt Sophomores, 1 Junior, and 1 red-shirt Junior starting.

So, I ask again...what team has an OL that young besides us?

I understand what you are saying, but Florida Atlantic even had 82 yds rushing against MSU, and we could only manage 16? Does FLA have 4-5 star recruits? Even 2 star for that matter? Point is NDs OL sucks, and is young, but they should NOT suck as bad as they do, and there is no way to rationalize it anymore.

 

[NDMontana]

USC has three sophmores, one junior and one senior starting.

 

[LOVEMYIRISH]

USC has three sophmores, one junior and one senior starting.

I am seeing older guys than that...

http://www.uscblitz.com/roster.php

5th Year = Byers
Junior = Lewis
Junior = Heberer/Parsons
Senior = Brown
Soph = O'Dowd

2008 USC FOOTBALL ALPHABETICAL ROSTER ::

 

[LOVEMYIRISH]

I understand what you are saying, but Florida Atlantic even had 82 yds rushing against MSU, and we could only manage 16? Does FLA have 4-5 star recruits? Even 2 star for that matter? Point is NDs OL sucks, and is young, but they should NOT suck as bad as they do, and there is no way to rationalize it anymore.

They had 82 yards on 27 carries...if you eliminate sacks 26 carries and 105 yards.

They better be able to run, they threw 8 for 34.

We had 16 yards on 22 rushes...if you eliminate sacks: 53 yards on 17 att.

We simply did not try. 17 rushes total...that's all.

Hard to compare apples to apples that way.

 

[NDMontana]

I am seeing older guys than that...

http://www.uscblitz.com/roster.php

5th Year = Byers
Junior = Lewis
Junior = Heberer/Parsons
Senior = Brown
Soph = O'Dowd

2008 USC FOOTBALL ALPHABETICAL ROSTER ::

Go back out and find a depth chart: College Player Database - Depth Chart
LT: Charles Brown, JR.
LG: Jeff Byers, SR.
C:Kristofer O'Dowd, SO (how did a guy w/ a name like that not end up at ND?)
RG: Zach Heberger, SO
RT: Butch Lewis, SO.

I don't care about the guys on the sidelines; they don't matter to ND or USC or any other team. We're talking about the guys on the field who produce or do not produce. We have 4 JRs and 1 SR as starters. You asked for a younger OL....there you go. The No. 1 team in the country has a younger OL than we have.

 

[NDMontana]

They had 82 yards on 27 carries...if you eliminate sacks 26 carries and 105 yards.

They better be able to run, they threw 8 for 34.

We had 16 yards on 22 rushes...if you eliminate sacks: 53 yards on 17 att.

We simply did not try. 17 rushes total...that's all.

Hard to compare apples to apples that way.

Subtract one end around by Golden Tate and we had 29 yards on 16 attempts. We tried and failed.

 

[brentlycat]

nobody needs to hit the panic button,wishful thinking that we would compete at high level this year.Next year we're top 5 or weis is out

 

[brentlycat]

next year

next year

Front 3 my man, front 3.

What I want to know is why isn't John Tenuta our defensive coordinator? I understand hes the "assistant head coach" but why couldn't we give him the defensive coordinator as well? His Georgia Tech defenses were tenacious, ferocious and downright scary with a mediocre talent level. This is another mistake from up top being made in my opinion.

there is marked improvement in all phases of play,we're still 1 year away,having said that if we're not top 5 next year weis is done!