Golden Tate should be on the field more...

[Moostache]

Everyone knows the "issues" that keep him on the sidelines - route running,position switch from HS, blocking technique, etc. - but this guy would create space for underneath routes just by lining up and running 10 or 12 go routes a game...and its not like we still have Shark and Stovall killing it on downfield blocks any more anyway. The guys on the field - West and Grimes in particular - have not shown me anything that makes me think they are running precise routes and laying the wood on CBs and Safeties either. If the ones on the field aren't getting it done, then its time to give the most athletically gifted players chances to make plays!

If the defense does not rotate a safety over to help, then bomb it deep and see if he can make a play (provided Clausen can get the ball out there - which he did not look too bad doing on his 40th attempt of the game last week)...

If the defense does pay extra attention to Tate, then the dig route to Kamara or Parris, or a seam route to Carlson would be likely in single coverage...

It just seems that among the many errors made this year, leaving Grimes on the field in the 11th week, when he does not bring anything (size, speed, hands) to the table is among the most egregious....

 

[stonebreakerwasgod]

I think we gotta find more ways to get Tate and AA the ball. Period.

 

[johnnd05]

Baby steps, my friend. Baby steps. Right now we need downfield blocking and precise route running, not to mention the fact that the last few "Golden Go's" haven't, well, gone all that great. He'll get his chance, but for now we need to work on establishing the running game and completing some passes across the middle.

 

[stonebreakerwasgod]

Wait a sec there, John....you mean we can't line Tate or AA in the slot and throw some quick slants to them ala Shark or Rocket? That's all I'm asking for.

 

[IrishRamMan10]

touche

 

[johnnd05]

Wait a sec there, John....you mean we can't line Tate or AA in the slot and throw some quick slants to them ala Shark or Rocket? That's all I'm asking for.

When they learn to run the routes and make the catches with the necessary consistency, sure. Try it one or two times a game, for all I care. It's just that this offense doesn't need to be digging holes for itself with broken pass plays.

 

[Irish52]

All the comments related to playcalling can be summarized in a few words; there is no imagination or creativity in the plays called. Suggest our coaching staff reviews the plays being called at Florida where all, and I mean all, get a chance at handling the ball. In short, it's time to swallow our pride and see what other coaches are doing so successfully.

 

[stonebreakerwasgod]

I feel ya John, but what irks me even more is seeing ACE run on first down and getting his requisite two yards. Always leaving a 2nd and 8. I don't blame him, it is just one of the many things that Mr. Weis and I need to chat about. I'm waiting for his secretary to get back to me.

 

[JeremyND07]

When they learn to run the routes and make the catches with the necessary consistency, sure. Try it one or two times a game, for all I care. It's just that this offense doesn't need to be digging holes for itself with broken pass plays.

Yeah he needs to learn how to catch from Grimes :smilewink

He cannot hurt the offense is all I am saying...throw in a few plays for this kid. One deep ball a game is not enough!!!!

 

[Axl Rose]

Everyone knows the "issues" that keep him on the sidelines - route running,position switch from HS, blocking technique, etc. - but this guy would create space for underneath routes just by lining up and running 10 or 12 go routes a game...and its not like we still have Shark and Stovall killing it on downfield blocks any more anyway. The guys on the field - West and Grimes in particular - have not shown me anything that makes me think they are running precise routes and laying the wood on CBs and Safeties either. If the ones on the field aren't getting it done, then its time to give the most athletically gifted players chances to make plays!

If the defense does not rotate a safety over to help, then bomb it deep and see if he can make a play (provided Clausen can get the ball out there - which he did not look too bad doing on his 40th attempt of the game last week)...

If the defense does pay extra attention to Tate, then the dig route to Kamara or Parris, or a seam route to Carlson would be likely in single coverage...

It just seems that among the many errors made this year, leaving Grimes on the field in the 11th week, when he does not bring anything (size, speed, hands) to the table is among the most egregious....

I agree, Tate is a play maker and needs to see the field more. If corners give him to much cushion then Charlie should start calling those quick passes that he did so often with Samarijda and let Tate work his magic. If they try to press Tate then let him use his speed to burn him.

Kamara and Tate compliment each other perfectly and should start next year. Parris just can't seem to get open, West tries hard but isn't that talented, Grimes would be a fine 3rd receiver but not a primary one, ect.

 

[bbrennan]

I think the first problem with pigeon-holing Tate as the "go route" receiver is that to me he is better served playing the slot. Put the size, speed and strength of Kamara out wide. Let Tate run the slant or the wide receiver screen and use his quickness and moves to break these 4-6 yard passes into 25-35 yard gains. This is the same problem with Grimes. He is not a wideout, he is a slot receiver. Grimes' problems are the hands of stone and the lack of quickness compared to Tate. West might have the quickness to be a good slot receiver but we haven't really seen what he can do.

Next year I say Kamara, Parris and Floyd out wide and Tate in the slot along with West.

 

[SoCalDomer]

I say we get everyone playing solid fundamental football. Then, it doesn't matter what route any player runs. Let's go Irish

 

[WeisWeisBaby]

I agree, once the team gels and understands the fundamentals then we will be prepared to try some other stuff... when CW is conformtable wasting a play on a go route for Tate, that is when CW feels he can get a first down regardless...that just isn't the case right now.

 

[kmoose]

I say we get everyone playing solid fundamental football. Then, it doesn't matter what route any player runs. Let's go Irish

Good point. Everyone seems to want the Freshman QB to play and learn as he goes, while the Frosh and Soph receivers play and learn as they go, while the Frosh and Soph tailbacks play and learn as they go, while the underclassmen linemen play and learn as they go. "BUT WIN 8-9-10 GAMES IN THE PROCESS, CHARLIE!!!"

This is not backyard football. If the kids aren't ready yet, then they aren't ready yet.

 

[goirish#1]

Golden is flat out speed and he needs to be more involved! what more could go wrong, they mine as well give it a shot!

 

[OrangeIrish]

What's up with Harrison Smith, he was a good recruit. Is he redshirting?

 

[notredomer23]

yes, yes he is OI

 

[Junkhead]

yes, yes he is OI

OI?

 

[notredomer23]

OI?

OrangeIrish asked the question.

and damn junk you have a lot of vbucks

 

[stonebreakerwasgod]

He doesn't waste his buying....uh...stuff.

 

[Wham]

Baby steps, my friend. Baby steps...

Not meant at you John - just a good point to discuss...

There is a difference between "baby steps", which involves encouraging a "crawler" to walk, and treating someone like a baby...

"Baby steps" are those things a parent does when trying to get the baby to improve from baby's current "crawl status". Assuming ND "top-of-the-line" athletes are at "crawl status", "baby steps" should involve improving on the athletes' top-of-the-line-status. CW is not taking baby steps in his coaching style. He is sticking his athletes back in the womb.

Do you really think it is that difficult to run a "go" route full speed? Is it that difficult to snap to the qb in shotgun? It becomes tough when you make up a play for every situation the defense might give you. Your offense becomes a reactionary "thinking" offense instead of a well greased machine that forces the defense to stop your basic well practiced friggen qb sneak. ND can't even do that.

Something is not right. Growing pains sure are ugly.

 

[WaveDomer]

This point was brought up on UHND after the Air Force game. I don't think there are CBs on Duke, Air Force, Navy, or Stanford that can compete with the speed of Tate. However, I agree with the argument that we don't need 2nd and 10 to go. Once we start getting nice chunks on 1st down, then you have a down to waste, so to speak. That being said, we have 1 win with 2 games left. Throw it all at the wall and see what sticks. How about Golden on a few reverses? Flee Flicker anyone?

 

[Moostache]

This point was brought up on UHND after the Air Force game. I don't think there are CBs on Duke, Air Force, Navy, or Stanford that can compete with the speed of Tate. However, I agree with the argument that we don't need 2nd and 10 to go. Once we start getting nice chunks on 1st down, then you have a down to waste, so to speak. That being said, we have 1 win with 2 games left. Throw it all at the wall and see what sticks. How about Golden on a few reverses? Flee Flicker anyone?

I think this may have been a bit misconstrued....I don't mean put GT on the field and necessarily THROW 10-12 go-routes a game! (And certainly not always on 1st down either...)

I mean everyone knows that Weis has said repeatedly that Golden is not playing more due to his route running and makign the shift to WR. That is common knowledge to fans and more importantly to opposing coaches and coordinators. USE IT AGAINST THEM! Put Tate on the field and call more combination option routes that rely on the QB to read one thing - how many people follow Tate. If Tate is one-on-one and open, throw it to him...if he is doubled, look to a WR or TE cutting off of that route to the middle or the sidelines....if Tate is singled up by covered, dump the ball ball to a RB on a swing pass. Just do these things enough to keep a defense off guard.

One of my biggest frustrations this year is the ungodly tendancy to see a certain grouping of players on the field and already KNOW the play that is about to get stuffed or blown up. How many times this year has anyone else looked at the formation, seen 2 TE, Swapp and Thomas in the game and just KNEW we were about to run a HB Slam that was going to gain nothing?

At least by putting Golden on the field and allowing him to serve as a decoy (or if ignored to serve as a potential downfield shot to flip field position or ignite the team (I think in a large way the brief offensive explosion against Purdue in the second half was fueled by exactly Golden Tate's plays)...at any rate, others have said it in here, and I agree, at this point things CAN'T get worse, so why not try it out in live action and see what happens or get it on film for use as a teaching aid in the off-season???

 

[jonesman]

Guys,
The fact is that if we cannot get a guy to run about a half dozen routes by the 11th game of the season there is a serious problem with either the player or coaching. I am seriously leaning in the way of coaching. This is not a complicated situation. I trully believe that CW makes things way too complicated. If Golden could run an out, slant and go, he gives a a great run after catch potential. Remember when Lou used to run the center screen with the Rocket??? Tell me someone with Golden's speed and elusiveness would not be perfect for that. The fact is guys, we are running the same plays out of the same formations that we have for the last 3 years. It is so predictable that my 5 year old can figure it out. I am sure most of you who watch every week know the play before the ball is snapped.

 

[Wham]

And none of it has been practiced live. Practiced only in theory.

 

[goldenlid]

Other coaches respect his speed make it work for you, and few dump off and then something long.The kid gets ten yards to play with everytime he steps on the field.

 

[elkona]

I think the first problem with pigeon-holing Tate as the "go route" receiver is that to me he is better served playing the slot. Put the size, speed and strength of Kamara out wide. Let Tate run the slant or the wide receiver screen and use his quickness and moves to break these 4-6 yard passes into 25-35 yard gains. This is the same problem with Grimes. He is not a wideout, he is a slot receiver. Grimes' problems are the hands of stone and the lack of quickness compared to Tate. West might have the quickness to be a good slot receiver but we haven't really seen what he can do.

Next year I say Kamara, Parris and Floyd out wide and Tate in the slot along with West.

Spot on.
You should be Coach.