What does ND do if we finish 1-11?

[goldenlid]

Think of guys like the Pats coach or SC's coach they were not that great at the 1st HC job they got but they got alot better with time. This is CW 1st bad year and yes it is awful but sometimes things take time. Guys will say some coaches are good like Zook,Caroll(SC coach),Saban and many others coaches but most of those guy are on 2nd and 3rd headcoaching jobs, how about we give CW some time and see what he has learned.

 

[SoCalDomer]

(This was in response to a post by goldenlid, but it appears with all the technical difficulties his post ins't here as i respond.)

I am willing to give time, but how do we judge progress? The only way I know how is to compare the performance on the field. I still don't see much improvement. If I didn't know anything about where college players come from, i would guess our guys have never played football before with the number of dropped passes, missed tackles, missed blitzes and fumbles.

If we played GT, Purdue, Mich State, and BC again, I think the results would be nearly identical as the results when we played them earlier this year. GT has turned out to be a mediocre team. So has Mich State and Purdue. BC has shown it was not a top 10 team.

These last two games have been hanging on, not competing.

The only change I see CW has made so far (besides numerous depth chart shake-ups) is to defer the kick-off once this season. That's it. He went "back" to fundamentals (I question how much time in the spring and summer was devoted to fundamentals) for a week or two, but then reverted to his NFL practice style and has the guys playing in shorts and pushing blocking pads, not real defenders.

I want to see improvement and eventually competing. I could care less about wins this season. But these last two games have been frustrating because the talent void and experience should not have been a factor in these two games. Yet the product on the field by the team as a whole (a few players have really impressed me with their effort and skill) is hardly more impessive than what was put on the field to begin the season.

 

[kmoose]

An interesting question for all of those clamoring for Weis' dismissal.............

Who would you suggest bringing in to replace him?

 

[johnnd05]

An interesting question for all of those clamoring for Weis' dismissal.............

Who would you suggest bringing to replace him?

Corwin Brown.

I don't think they should/will/can fire Weis, but there's your answer right there.

 

[kmoose]

Corwin Brown.

I don't think they should/will/can fire Weis, but there's your answer right there.

Just for the sake of argument (because I think Brown will get things righted on the defensive side of the ball):

You want to hire another NFL guy with no head coaching experience, whose defense couldn't even stop Air Force from marching up and down the field on it?

 

[SoCalDomer]

An interesting question for all of those clamoring for Weis' dismissal.............

Who would you suggest bringing in to replace him?

I really hope they don't fire him. I just don't want to hear about it again and again on sportscenter and from every other unintelligent sports writer. Not to mention the harm it would do to recruiting, the prgoram, and luring future coaches.

John, i question whether CB would take it. He could remain loyal to Weis and not appreciate the school firing him. Plus, the school would definitely have created a 3 years and out policy, and I don't know if he would want that kind of pressure.

 

[johnnd05]

Just for the sake of argument (because I think Brown will get things righted on the defensive side of the ball):

You want to hire another NFL guy with no head coaching experience, whose defense couldn't even stop Air Force from marching up and down the field on it?

No, I don't want that, which is of course tied into my not wanting them to fire Weis. I'm just saying he'd make for the least-traumatic transition, and would be able to keep a lot of the recruits/players on board. But no, I don't /want/ to see it happen.

 

[kmoose]

No, I don't want that, which is of course tied into my not wanting them to fire Weis. I'm just saying he'd make for the least-traumatic transition, and would be able to keep a lot of the recruits/players on board. But no, I don't /want/ to see it happen.

*nods* I get that, john. I was just trying to point out that it's not like there is a dearth of good candidates to replace Weis, if ND cans him. Some people are just angry, and looking for a scapegoat. That's not a frame of mind that lends itself to making good, intelligent decisions.

 

[howlingthunder]

I think this is a conversation that all Irish fans are having now - openly. I recently was on a business trip taking me to both Little Rock and DC, and in both places was able to find an Irish Pub with actual Irish fans. Weis leaving came up, more than once...

I don't think that he should go, but by the end of this season if he does not definitively demonstrate that both he (his staff) and the players have a direction and purpose then the clock might start ticking.

My best friend just changed his MySpace name to "the IRISH are HURTING". I think that sums it up. I think it's time for these men to remember what it takes to be a football player.

I think it's time for these men to remember why we are call the FIGHTING IRISH.

 

[stonebreakerwasgod]

What will we do if we only win 1 game?? I'll tell you, Work the recruits hard, get them to stick, and work hard in the offseason to make sure our blocking is where it should be. If that isn't our main push next year, we're in trouble.

 

[johnnd05]

Great post, howlingthunder.

W/r/t the question of how we evaluate next year: a bunch of people have tried to say that this team is like Illinois in 2006 - just biding their time, waiting to break out. Obviously that comparison is inapt, since Illinois was actually competitive in most games last year, even to really good teams, and they lost a bunch of squeakers.

A better place to look is Illinois in 2005, when they sucked royally and were blown out almost weekly on their way to a 2-10 year. The next year, their record didn't look much better but their play clearly did: and that's what we have to look for as well.

In other words, and it pains me to say this: at this point, it's not about how many wins this team has in 2008. If they win seven or eight games and look good doing it, GREAT - but if they look sloppy, tentative, and lethargic every week and end up with a bunch of wins against a weak schedule, we've got problems. And correlatively, if they don't win more than a few games but SHOW US SOMETHING in the meantime, I'll be back on the Weis Wagon.

My problem with this team has NOT been the wins and losses; it's the way they've come. Weis has got to show that he's a coach, not just a "teacher". Right now I have my doubts. Here's to turning this ship around.

 

[IHateMarkMay]

I think the Charlie Weis bashing needs to slow down. Look at Nebraska, everyone in husker nation is looking for callahans head and look what happens with the recruiting, it suffers. A lot of recruits these days go to schools for the coaching staff, if there is any sign of that staff leaving, they will go to a different school. I dont want that, im sure no fan wants that. We need to stick behind Charlie through the bad times as well as the good.

 

[SoCalDomer]

You want us to stick what to Charlie's behind? grin:

 

[IHateMarkMay]

sticking behind him.... stay behind, sticking with, all synonymous

 

[SoCalDomer]

I know, I was just messing with the order of your words.

 

[BeatSC]

Mark May

Mark May

Mark and Lou didn't have too much to say about the game but Mark did say that CW did need to accept that this is a rebuilding year (duh). I think he has toned down his ND bashing (I think he almost feels sorry for ND). I am behind CW (Even though I started this thread). If it weren't for a few fumbles and a few plays and at least 10 dropped passes this would have been the ND team we were hoping to have show up.

 

[SouthernIrish]

My father, the ND fan-Former Marine-Baseball Coach summed it up for me. He said "Well, I guess next fall we will see what they (coach and team) are made of. They will either pull together as a team and work their tails off or they will point fingers and curl up and die."
He thinks that there is a whole lot of mental issues going on with this team and not just lack of talent. The older not as good players versus the younger but no experience ones can be a big problem according to my ex coach daddy.

He also thinks that this team has the potential to join the legends of Notre Dame by coming together and showing the world. I hope he is right.

 

[kmoose]

My father, the ND fan-Former Marine-Baseball Coach summed it up for me. He said "Well, I guess next fall we will see what they (coach and team) are made of. They will either pull together as a team and work their tails off or they will point fingers and curl up and die."
He thinks that there is a whole lot of mental issues going on with this team and not just lack of talent. The older not as good players versus the younger but no experience ones can be a big problem according to my ex coach daddy.

He also thinks that this team has the potential to join the legends of Notre Dame by coming together and showing the world. I hope he is right.

I hope you did something nice for him, today. It's Veteran's Day, ya know?

 

[SouthernIrish]

Oh yes, Veterans Day AND his birthday. Sent him a big order of Omaha Steals and called him. And what did we talk about...Notre Dame football and Indiana U basketball

and laughed about Ohio State

 

[SoCalDomer]

I hope you did something nice for him, today. It's Veteran's Day, ya know?

An autographed picture of Cris Collinsworth??

 

[notredomer23]

and laughed about Ohio State

and laughed and laughed and laughed and laughed some more

 

[SouthernIrish]

An autographed picture of Cris Collinsworth??

that ship sailed

 

[IHateMarkMay]

Oh yes, Veterans Day AND his birthday. Sent him a big order of Omaha Steals and called him. And what did we talk about...Notre Dame football and Indiana U basketball

and laughed about Ohio State

Im glad to see im not the only ND football fan and IU basketball fan. I tell people that and they look at me weird.

 

[SouthernIrish]

I tell people there is a clause that says going to IU automatically entitles you to being a Notre Dame fan during football season. and if you are a born Hoosier and Catholic, its a law
I went to more ND football games in college than I did IU football games

 

[IrishAlum1997]

My father, the ND fan-Former Marine-Baseball Coach summed it up for me. He said "Well, I guess next fall we will see what they (coach and team) are made of. They will either pull together as a team and work their tails off or they will point fingers and curl up and die."
He thinks that there is a whole lot of mental issues going on with this team and not just lack of talent. The older not as good players versus the younger but no experience ones can be a big problem according to my ex coach daddy.

He also thinks that this team has the potential to join the legends of Notre Dame by coming together and showing the world. I hope he is right.

I think with the exception of maybe Mo Crum, it is time to say 'thank you and good night' to all of our 4th year seniors. Unfortunately, all of the 'experience' our underclassmen are getting this season is in how to lose in embarassing fashion week after week. It is inevitable that many of the upperclassmen are frustrated with this season after 2005 and 2006, and could very well be infusing negative energy into the team dynamic. There's never been any substantiated proof to this, so only a humble opinion here. Let the young bucks run.

In addition, the best way to bring back the swagger and get heads screwed back on straight for next season is for CW to name Jimmy the starter BEFORE the Blue-Gold game in the spring. No controversy, no competition. He is the starter, ES is our Paul Failla. The 'knock' on Jimmy regarding his perceived arrogance may actually be a blessing in disguise for this team, as I think it is apparent that he has not let this season put him in the tank. He can get our young studs at the skill positions to not only believe we can win again, but expect to win.

 

[WaveDomer]

He thinks that there is a whole lot of mental issues going on with this team and not just lack of talent.

I would agree with this. Fumbling handoffs and dropping easy passes and missing easy blocks are all mental. At this point in the season, it is just a giant snowball 3/4 of the way down the mountain, still gaining speed. However, the scary part for me is that mental problems should be taken care of in the locker room and at practice. For some reason this isn't happening. I still think next year is going to be a nice year. The freshman who stick through this meatgrinder of a season are going to be hardened and ready to kick some butt. That may not translate into wins, but it doesn't hurt.

 

[KamaraPolice]

Really, Notre Dame might go 1-11 this year? I cant believe it, that's just crazy. Back when I used to watch notre dame, they were a top 5 team with old timers like Brady Quinn, Shark, and D-Walk.

 

[BleedinOrange]

These "Fire Charlie" threads are getting rather tiresome. I don't know what people expected this year. We lost quite a few players and gained some new blood. These guys are either just out of high school or had very limited playing experience last year. I didn't expect a powerhouse team this year. We've had one of the most difficult schedules in CF and played with very few experienced players. I'm not about to jump on the "Fire Charlie" bandwagon, and I doubt I'll be willing to do it next season either.

As far as I'm concerned, anyone wanting ND to get rid of Charlie isn't a true Fightin' Irish fan.

No question, ND sucks this year and things need to turn around. Talent and experience are what is going to get us through. Experience goes for coaching too. CW will take his licks this year, and he'll apply the lessons to next year. I think ND improves vastly next year. This is a team that has forgotten how to win. It's going to be a long hard offseason, and those who remember how bad this year will work their butts off so they never have to go through this again. That's why recruiting high character guys is so important. This team, Charlie included, will use this season as a stepping stone to better things to come. If there is anyone who doesn't believe that CW is WAAAAY more upset about this season than anyone, I'm sure they are wrong. The guy knows football better than any of the fans and that's why he's the coach. We need to have faith. I'm not drinking KoolAid here. I just know that CW is a smart guy and he'll find a way to put all the talent he's brought in to good use. ND will return to the top of CFB.

Things like this are exactly why you Notre Dame fans are drinking the Kool-Aid. I don't care what kind of rebuilding you guys thought you were going to do but to get beat by 2 service academies on your home field that don't have half the atheltes you guys have is coaching. Spin it any way you want but it's coaching. Not players. Navy and Air Force don't have near the athletes you guys have and please don't tell me they do. Charlie Weis is a fraud, FACE IT.

 

[goldandblue]

Well there goes it, Fulmer isn't worth a shit either so don't talk too much crap. The only reason that team is still afloat is Cutcliff.

 

[GoIrish41]

Did you just come here to check in on all of the recruits we pulled away from the Vols last year?