BCS deal not looking so good now

[solo]

When our deal with the BCS was renegotiated, we took guaranteed money for a much smaller payout. We now get $1M every season in BCS money whether we go to a BCS Bowl or not. But we only get $4.5M when we do go to a BCS bowl rather than the $15M that our opponent gets.

With Weis having us in BCS bowls for 2 straight years and poised to be in many more to come, this isn't looking like such a great deal. After Weis wins a title White should renegotiate this deal.

 

[roto-stud]

I agree with your thinking....with the recruits Weis is bringing in, we should continue to be a player for future BCS games....I always questioned this move since a 14 million dollar payout pales to a guaranteed 1.5 million.

 

[GREENJERSEYS'07]

this deal is over a year old solo.We were even talking about it last year as it was the last year notre dame got the 12+ million.
It did however put notre dame at a guaranteed spot of bcs#8 oppossed to #6.All conference commisssioners and kevin white were involved in this.It basically is saying that notre dame's payout in a bcs bowl game is about the equevelant that any one team in a conference would recieve with a second conference team going to a bcs bowl.

to be honest with you I could care less how much money notre dame makes in a bcs bowl.They make enough money drawing interest on the money they take from everyone in the pool for the bowl tickets.
also,if they don't beat lsu this year then it didn't mean squat either!!!!
(this is just my opinion and if anyone has a problem with it...i don't want to hear about it)

 

[solo]

this deal is over a year old solo.We were even talking about it last year as it was the last year notre dame got the 12+ million.
It did however put notre dame at a guaranteed spot of bcs#8 oppossed to #6.All conference commisssioners and kevin white were involved in this.It basically is saying that notre dame's payout in a bcs bowl game is about the equevelant that any one team in a conference would recieve with a second conference team going to a bcs bowl.

to be honest with you I could care less how much money notre dame makes in a bcs bowl.They make enough money drawing interest on the money they take from everyone in the pool for the bowl tickets.
also,if they don't beat lsu this year then it didn't mean squat either!!!!
(this is just my opinion and if anyone has a problem with it...i don't want to hear about it)

I gotta think that ND was strong armed into this deal. Had we been a contender year in and year out, I doubt these discussions would have ever taken place. In any case, I am aware that this is not "new news". However, it is interesting to discuss what appeared to be an OK deal when we rarely went to BCS bowls, doesn't seem like such a good deal now that we are going to appear in them regularly.

On the flip side, it does make us even MORE attractive as a BCS pick. We not only fill the stadium and get great TV ratings, but we cost the bowl $10M less in payouts.

 

[Fighting_Irish9]

White got the best deal possible......

NO WAY wa the BCS going to continue paying us a full payout....every time they did this, it cost each conference Millions of dollars....and as the conferences are the ones making the rules....do you really think they were going to continue to allow themselves to lose millions????

They decided to set ND up with the same payouts as the average BCS team gets.....and I'm sure it was the best deal possible...

 

[Fighting_Irish9]

On the flip side, it does make us even MORE attractive as a BCS pick. We not only fill the stadium and get great TV ratings, but we cost the bowl $10M less in payouts.

The Bowls still pay the money out, it just goes to the BCS conferences instead

 

[solo]

The Bowls still pay the money out, it just goes to the BCS conferences instead

So is that $10M split equally among the 6 BCS conferences?

 

[LOVEMYIRISH]

When our deal with the BCS was renegotiated, we took guaranteed money for a much smaller payout. We now get $1M every season in BCS money whether we go to a BCS Bowl or not. But we only get $4.5M when we do go to a BCS bowl rather than the $15M that our opponent gets.

With Weis having us in BCS bowls for 2 straight years and poised to be in many more to come, this isn't looking like such a great deal. After Weis wins a title White should renegotiate this deal.

In SOME ways, this was a better deal. We get more money that nearly ANY OTHER school.

Remember that the BCS Bowl teams that get 15M don't get to keep it...they have to share it with their conference members.

However, we would have made more money before...we are now GUARANTEED money. It's not quite as lucrative...but it's fair.

 

[A2McGowan]

LSU has to share that money with the SEC.....as does every team that belongs in a conference.

 

[simontonlake]

Re: the other 10 million..

Re: the other 10 million..

I know LSU shares their 15 million payout with the rest of the SEC teams.

But, who gets the remainder of ND's 10 million after the Irish get their 4.5 mil share?

 

[BGIF]

... After Weis wins a title White should renegotiate this deal.

Yeah, ND controls sooo many votes on the BCS and has sooo many contracts with Bowls locking in guaranteed slots that the BCS will jump at the chance to renegotiate more bucks ND's way.

And when the BCS says no, ND can take its football and strike out on its own and play in which bowl the next year?

The Solo Bowl?

 

[solo]

Yeah, ND controls sooo many votes on the BCS and has sooo many contracts with Bowls locking in guaranteed slots that the BCS will jump at the chance to renegotiate more bucks ND's way.

And when the BCS says no, ND can take its football and strike out on its own and play in which bowl the next year?

The Solo Bowl?

Well, why do you think ND is included in the BCS at all? It's because ND offers what no other team can promise....a full stadium and great ratings. And the bowls are all about making money. Why do you think ND has a TV contract with NBC? Do we have execs on that board? It's all about green and I'm not talking jerseys.

ND was in no position to negotiate and the BCS knew it. After years of mediocrity, hiring mistakes, blowout losses in big games, and in general negative press, there was somewhat of an "ND backlash" mentality developing. That will change as the demand for the ND brand gets higher and higher with Weis' success.

By the way, does ND need the BCS money? Of course not. ND football is incredibly profitable every season, bowl game or not. So don't think that ND doesn't bring any clout to the negotiating table. ND doesn't need the BCS money and has the most sought after brand name in college football. Don't underestimate that.

 

[Fighting_Irish9]

Well, why do you think ND is included in the BCS at all? It's because ND offers what no other team can promise....a full stadium and great ratings. And the bowls are all about making money. Why do you think ND has a TV contract with NBC? Do we have execs on that board? It's all about green and I'm not talking jerseys.

ND was in no position to negotiate and the BCS knew it. After years of mediocrity, hiring mistakes, blowout losses in big games, and in general negative press, there was somewhat of an "ND backlash" mentality developing. That will change as the demand for the ND brand gets higher and higher with Weis' success.

By the way, does ND need the BCS money? Of course not. ND football is incredibly profitable every season, bowl game or not. So don't think that ND doesn't bring any clout to the negotiating table. ND doesn't need the BCS money and has the most sought after brand name in college football. Don't underestimate that.

You act like there is a BCS bowl that isn't selling out without ND there.....sorry but the BCS bowls will get the ratings and the people in the seats ND or not...its not like ND is the only draw...

Not to mention, why would mediocre seasons be the cause of a lesser payout in the Bowls.....those down seasons actually put ND in a BETTER negotiation spot, as they weren't exactly taking advantage of the BCS payout....

Think about it....you are basicly saying, because ND hadn't gone to a BCS bowl in a while and the options weren't looking good for ND in BCS bowls, the BCS all the sudden decided....hey, lets start giving ND some money if they go to a BCS or not....PLEASE....

Its very simple...if ND was going to BCS bowl after BCS bowl...do you really think this deal wouldn't have taken place....you think the Conferences were happy with one School taking all their money....You do realize they have more votes than us right?????

And yes, when ND goes to a BCS, the remaining 10 or so million gets split up among the conferences....thus they get some of their money that they would lose every time ND goes...

If ND was going to MORE BCS BOWLS when they made the deal, ND might not have gotten as good of a deal as they got...

 

[solo]

You act like there is a BCS bowl that isn't selling out without ND there.....sorry but the BCS bowls will get the ratings and the people in the seats ND or not...its not like ND is the only draw...

Not to mention, why would mediocre seasons be the cause of a lesser payout in the Bowls.....those down seasons actually put ND in a BETTER negotiation spot, as they weren't exactly taking advantage of the BCS payout....

Think about it....you are basicly saying, because ND hadn't gone to a BCS bowl in a while and the options weren't looking good for ND in BCS bowls, the BCS all the sudden decided....hey, lets start giving ND some money if they go to a BCS or not....PLEASE....

Its very simple...if ND was going to BCS bowl after BCS bowl...do you really think this deal wouldn't have taken place....you think the Conferences were happy with one School taking all their money....You do realize they have more votes than us right?????

And yes, when ND goes to a BCS, the remaining 10 or so million gets split up among the conferences....thus they get some of their money that they would lose every time ND goes...

If ND was going to MORE BCS BOWLS when they made the deal, ND might not have gotten as good of a deal as they got...

I disagree with this line of thinking 100%.

In my opinion, this deal was the BCS taking advanatge of ND while we were down. They saw an opportunity to make more money for the conferences and figured that ND was in no position to walk away from guaranteed money every year as we weren't regularly going to BCS games anyway. So they offer ND a lesser payout on the BCS games, which didn't make much difference to ND as we weren't going to those games anyway. In return, ND got a guaranteed $1M or $1.5M per season and a guaranteed BCS bid if we finish int he top 8.

Had ND been finishing in the top 5 year in and year out, going to BCS games every year and delivering exciting games, full stadiums, and high ratings, the BCS wouldn't want to risk ND walking away and ND wouldn't accept a lower payout. ND would have viewed this deal as the slap in the face that it was had we been negotiating from a position of strength.

If the BCS is only interested in feeding the 6 BCS conferences, why include ND at all? Just cut them out completely and force them to join a conference if they want a piece of the pie. I think you are overlooking what ND brings to the table. The ND program was realing and the BCS took advantage. I just can't see this happening when ND is peaking. When the public is clamoring to have ND in the BCS games, you really think the BCS would negotiate a deal that is less attractive to ND? A perennial top 5 ND could host their own bowl game. Heck, we already have our own TV contract. Don't you think NBC would be chomping at the bit to air that bowl game?

 

[jerseyborn1971]

I see it very simply. ND now gets roughly the same payout as any individual team in a BCS game. That is fair. The remaining 10 million gets spread out among the 6 BCS conferences instead of the one conference had ND not played in that bowl game. That's fair. ND gets an automatic bid if the finish 8th or higher. Considering most BCS conference champs will finish in the Top 8, this is the equivalent of ND winning a conference. That's fair. ND gets 1.5 million if they don't make it to a BCS bowl game. That actually is a benefit ND has that no other team has. In all, I think ND came out on top considering what is available to all other teams.

 

[solo]

I see it very simply. ND now gets roughly the same payout as any individual team in a BCS game. That is fair. The remaining 10 million gets spread out among the 6 BCS conferences instead of the one conference had ND not played in that bowl game. That's fair. ND gets an automatic bid if the finish 8th or higher. Considering most BCS conference champs will finish in the Top 8, this is the equivalent of ND winning a conference. That's fair. ND gets 1.5 million if they don't make it to a BCS bowl game. That actually is a benefit ND has that no other team has. In all, I think ND came out on top considering what is available to all other teams.

I never said it wasn't fair. It is fair. I totally agree. It just isn't nearly as good as the deal that we had.

 

[lax7782]

I disagree with this line of thinking 100%.

In my opinion, this deal was the BCS taking advanatge of ND while we were down. They saw an opportunity to make more money for the conferences and figured that ND was in no position to walk away from guaranteed money every year as we weren't regularly going to BCS games anyway. So they offer ND a lesser payout on the BCS games, which didn't make much difference to ND as we weren't going to those games anyway. In return, ND got a guaranteed $1M or $1.5M per season and a guaranteed BCS bid if we finish int he top 8.

Had ND been finishing in the top 5 year in and year out, going to BCS games every year and delivering exciting games, full stadiums, and high ratings, the BCS wouldn't want to risk ND walking away and ND wouldn't accept a lower payout. ND would have viewed this deal as the slap in the face that it was had we been negotiating from a position of strength.

If the BCS is only interested in feeding the 6 BCS conferences, why include ND at all? Just cut them out completely and force them to join a conference if they want a piece of the pie. I think you are overlooking what ND brings to the table. The ND program was realing and the BCS took advantage. I just can't see this happening when ND is peaking. When the public is clamoring to have ND in the BCS games, you really think the BCS would negotiate a deal that is less attractive to ND? A perennial top 5 ND could host their own bowl game. Heck, we already have our own TV contract. Don't you think NBC would be chomping at the bit to air that bowl game?

It was said before, but I'm going to say it again...Your argument seems to suggest that any BCS game that does not includue Notre Dame gets bad television ratings and is not sold out. That is clearly not the case. I am watching the Fiesta Bowl right now, and the place is packed (including the 12,000 seats that were added for this game) and is pulling hard for Boise State - the team that was supposed to be killing the BCS because of their lack of a big following.

The revised deal was not a power move by the BCS, and it was not a sign of weakness by Notre Dame. The changes were made to make the annual payouts to Notre Dame more similar to those of other major conference teams. Also, you better believe there was some compromise involved as well, because while the payout was scaled back quite a bit, Notre Dame's automatic bid requirement was actually loosened. Previously, we needed to be in the top six of the BCS standings for an auto-bid, and now only need to be in the top eight.

Before these changes were made, Notre Dame was being treated as if they were an entire conference, and any Notre Dame fan should openly admit how rediculous that really was.

 

[solo]

It was said before, but I'm going to say it again...Your argument seems to suggest that any BCS game that does not includue Notre Dame gets bad television ratings and is not sold out. That is clearly not the case. I am watching the Fiesta Bowl right now, and the place is packed (including the 12,000 seats that were added for this game) and is pulling hard for Boise State - the team that was supposed to be killing the BCS because of their lack of a big following.

The revised deal was not a power move by the BCS, and it was not a sign of weakness by Notre Dame. The changes were made to make the annual payouts to Notre Dame more similar to those of other major conference teams. Also, you better believe there was some compromise involved as well, because while the payout was scaled back quite a bit, Notre Dame's automatic bid requirement was actually loosened. Previously, we needed to be in the top six of the BCS standings for an auto-bid, and now only need to be in the top eight.

Before these changes were made, Notre Dame was being treated as if they were an entire conference, and any Notre Dame fan should openly admit how rediculous that really was.

Well, everyone will have their opinions as to why this deal went down. Who knows who is right? All I can say, is that if I had the choice, I would choose the deal we used to have rather than the deal we have now.

 

[jerseyborn1971]

I never said it wasn't fair. It is fair. I totally agree. It just isn't nearly as good as the deal that we had.

Our deal before was better. We were just robbing people. The conferences finally wised up unfortunately.

 

[FleaFlicker]

I few notes, after reading the whole thread.

1. ND is not the only team in CFB. ND is not the only team that generates attention. They generate a lot of attention, sure. But it isn't like the BCS bowls were going to cry if ND wasn't a perrenial power. There will always be another team that is wanting to step up.

2. This deal adds another thing to the equation. It doesn't piss off the other conferences anywhere near as much as before. I don't care if it is a better or worse deal for Notre Dame, it is the right deal. Us gettign a full 14 mil before, was flat out stupid. If I was UM or a school like that, with a better program in recent years, I'd be pissed that a ND team can have an average season, get an at-large bid to the BCS, and then take every dime.

 

[solo]

I few notes, after reading the whole thread.

1. ND is not the only team in CFB. ND is not the only team that generates attention. They generate a lot of attention, sure. But it isn't like the BCS bowls were going to cry if ND wasn't a perrenial power. There will always be another team that is wanting to step up.

2. This deal adds another thing to the equation. It doesn't piss off the other conferences anywhere near as much as before. I don't care if it is a better or worse deal for Notre Dame, it is the right deal. Us gettign a full 14 mil before, was flat out stupid. If I was UM or a school like that, with a better program in recent years, I'd be pissed that a ND team can have an average season, get an at-large bid to the BCS, and then take every dime.

My responses:

1. I do agree that this deal is more fair for all involved and probably good for college football as that it will certainly develop less resentment towards ND.

2. The BCS bowls and EVERY other bowl want ND to be a perennial power. The bowls love ND. We generate more fanfare than any other team out there. We are themost loved and the most hated. We have the most recognized brand ina ll of football. Every bowl wants that kind of press. Every bowl wants to know they will sell out and get great ratings. The bowls do want ND to be a perennial power and in the past have gone out of their way to invite us to particpate even when we weent a power (like in 1994 when a 6-4-1 ND team was invited to play 10-1 Colorado). The BCS bowls definitely want ND to be a power and have made sure to include us in their little love fest with the other 6 BCS conferences.

 

[lax7782]

My responses:

1. I do agree that this deal is more fair for all involved and probably good for college football as that it will certainly develop less resentment towards ND.

2. The BCS bowls and EVERY other bowl want ND to be a perennial power. The bowls love ND. We generate more fanfare than any other team out there. We are themost loved and the most hated. We have the most recognized brand ina ll of football. Every bowl wants that kind of press. Every bowl wants to know they will sell out and get great ratings. The bowls do want ND to be a perennial power and in the past have gone out of their way to invite us to particpate even when we weent a power (like in 1994 when a 6-4-1 ND team was invited to play 10-1 Colorado). The BCS bowls definitely want ND to be a power and have made sure to include us in their little love fest with the other 6 BCS conferences.

You still seem to be saying that bowl games don't sell out or rate well if they don't have Notre Dame playing, which is clearly not the case. Sure, we bring a nationwide audience everywhere we go, but the bowl games - especially the BCS games - do just fine without us.

Also, the BCS selection committees are not scared to take teams they feel are more deserving than Notre Dame in a given year. We have now been BCS eligible four times, and have been selected three times. This year, only West Virginia was eligible for the final spot after the other seven were filled, and they had already accepted the Gator Bowl. Last year, we earned an automatic berth by finishing in the top 6 as the rules stated prior to this season. We played in the 2001 Fiesta Bowl after finishing the season with a long winning streak. But do you recall when, in Tyrone Willingham's first season, a 10-2 eligible Notre Dame team was passed in favor of Iowa? Iowa was more deserving, but they certainly don't have the following that Notre Dame has, yet Iowa got the nod.

Bottom line is, the games get the money and ratings regardless of who is playing. In that regard, we really had no leverage to try and strong-arm the BCS into letting us keep the status quo. The new system changed to our detriment in one aspect, but to our benefit in another, and our peers (the other Universities) have no real reason for resentment anymore, so I think it was a good deal all around.

 

[jerseyborn1971]

I find it hard to believe that Louisville v Wake Forest tonight would have the same ratings as Louisville v Notre Dame. I'll guess tonight's game has a lower rating than the Outback and Capital One Bowls.

 

[solo]

You still seem to be saying that bowl games don't sell out or rate well if they don't have Notre Dame playing, which is clearly not the case. Sure, we bring a nationwide audience everywhere we go, but the bowl games - especially the BCS games - do just fine without us.

I think you are misunderstanding what i am saying. Nowhere did I say that the BCS bowls don't sell out or get ratings. I am simply stating that they like ND to be in them. The BCS wants ND to be part o the equation. Why make special rules to inlcude us in their money making scheme with the BCS conferences if not? Why go out of their way to invite us in years past(not this year) when there were teams with higher rankings available?

The BCS definitely wants ND to be a part of the equation. We bring something to the table that others schools don't.

 

[lax7782]

I think you are misunderstanding what i am saying. Nowhere did I say that the BCS bowls don't sell out or get ratings. I am simply stating that they like ND to be in them. The BCS wants ND to be part o the equation. Why make special rules to inlcude us in their money making scheme with the BCS conferences if not? Why go out of their way to invite us in years past(not this year) when there were teams with higher rankings available?

The BCS definitely wants ND to be a part of the equation. We bring something to the table that others schools don't.

I understand what you are saying, and I agree to some extent. There is definitely a cluster of teams that fall into that same category, though. USC, OSU, Michigan, Oklahoma, and Texas come immediately to mind.

I think that the underdog feel good story teams cause a great ratings buzz as well though. I know I watched the Fiesta Bowl last night hoping to see exactly what I saw. I'll watch the Orange Bowl tonight for the same reason. Boise State and Wake Forest may not be the biggest draws, but they stir up the excitement a bit when the chance for a stunning upset comes into play. I'd rather watch Wake Forest vs. Louisville than FSU or GT vs. some other similar team.

 

[Timugen]

... the BCS wouldn't want to risk ND walking away and ND wouldn't accept a lower payout. ND would have viewed this deal as the slap in the face that it was had we been negotiating from a position of strength.

Meanwhile, back in the real world, ND would never even consider "walking away" from the BCS, as it would render it immediately impossible to win a psuedo-legitimate MNC.

A perennial top 5 ND could host their own bowl game. Heck, we already have our own TV contract. Don't you think NBC would be chomping at the bit to air that bowl game?

Wow.

 

[solo]

Meanwhile, back in the real world, ND would never even consider "walking away" from the BCS, as it would render it immediately impossible to win a psuedo-legitimate MNC.



Wow.

I take it that you think this opinion is completely unrealistic or not at all grounded in reality?

Well, at the negotiating table if you aren't willing to walk away, you will always be taken. I have seen ND turn down bowls in my lifetime. And I know that even without the bowls, ND football is incredibly profitable. ND could walk away from the BCS and be just fine. They could still win AP titles.

As for ND hosting it's own bowl game, yes, that's a stretch. But didn't Hawaii do this with the Hawaii Bowl?