Politics

Politics

  • Obama

    Votes: 4 1.1%
  • Romney

    Votes: 172 48.9%
  • Other

    Votes: 46 13.1%
  • a:3:{i:1637;a:5:{s:12:"polloptionid";i:1637;s:6:"nodeid";s:7:"2882145";s:5:"title";s:5:"Obama";s:5:"

    Votes: 130 36.9%

  • Total voters
    352
B

Buster Bluth

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Timothy Geithner approved the use of $300 Billion of TARP funds on March 23, 2009, almost two months after Obama was elected. That is one third of the total TARP issuance.


It's funny how conservatives want to use TARP as reasoning for why Obama is an idiot, but then use it as an excuse for why Bush wasn't moments later.

I'm not disagreeing with any of that or even debating the merit of the spending. But chicago's graph would simply lead one to believe that Obama isn't spending a lot of money, and that he's cutting back from the spending increases. That is only the case because Bush's last budget was massive.

Big big big massive....then massive massive massive is not "1.3% increase! Were so fiscally responsible!"
 

chicago51

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Fair enough the numbers are misleading.

To be fair Congress does have to pass the budget and measures to reduce the debt. The president just isn't going to agree to all these cuts until some tax revenue comes back.

The Senate hasn't passed anything in terms of budget so shame on them. The only thing that passed the House was the Ryan budget. The Ryan budget is so unbalanced in terms how it reduces the deficit that 25 republicans voted against. The Ryan budget could not pass today's House of Representatives that has more democrats in it.
 
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chicago51

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Hopefully this embedding works.

Here is a copy of the president's plan.

<iframe src="http://www.slideshare.net/slideshow/embed_code/16706723?rel=0" width="479" height="511" frameborder="0" marginwidth="0" marginheight="0" scrolling="no" style="border:1px solid #CCC;border-width:1px 1px 0;margin-bottom:5px" allowfullscreen webkitallowfullscreen mozallowfullscreen> </iframe> <div style="margin-bottom:5px"> <strong> <a href="http://www.slideshare.net/whitehouse/president-obamas-deficit-plan" title="President Obama's Deficit Plan" target="_blank">President Obama's Deficit Plan</a> </strong> from <strong><a href="http://www.slideshare.net/whitehouse" target="_blank">White House</a></strong> </div>
 
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BobD

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Can the mod that edited the poll please unedit it. Thanks
 

Black Irish

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Hopefully this embedding works.

Here is a copy of the president's plan.

<iframe src="http://www.slideshare.net/slideshow/embed_code/16706723?rel=0" width="479" height="511" frameborder="0" marginwidth="0" marginheight="0" scrolling="no" style="border:1px solid #CCC;border-width:1px 1px 0;margin-bottom:5px" allowfullscreen webkitallowfullscreen mozallowfullscreen> </iframe> <div style="margin-bottom:5px"> <strong> <a href="http://www.slideshare.net/whitehouse/president-obamas-deficit-plan" title="President Obama's Deficit Plan" target="_blank">President Obama's Deficit Plan</a> </strong> from <strong><a href="http://www.slideshare.net/whitehouse" target="_blank">White House</a></strong> </div>

That $600 billion in taxes from the wealthy seems like counting chickens before they are hatched. How long of a period does that cover? If it's 1 year, I may buy it. If it is something like a 10 year projection then it's more like wishful thinking, because it assumes that the tax rate and the base it applies to stays static.
 

chicago51

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I got a couple things to post that people read if they like.

Apparently since the sequester is not going to save us anywhere near the 85 billion. It cuts things that actually help save the government money.

Scott Lilly: Sequestration May Do Little to Reduce the Deficit

This article does not even go into the economic downturn that may occur from job losses/cuts and the lack of spending that will occur in the private sector as a result. So we will be losing demand which drives the economy. Then you the safety net programs that may kick in for some people, which are not cut in the sequester.
 

NDFan4Life

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Obama’s sequester deal-changer

By Bob Woodward, Published: February 22

Bob Woodward (woodwardb@washpost.com) is an associate editor of The Post. His latest book is “The Price of Politics.” Evelyn M. Duffy contributed to this column.

Misunderstanding, misstatements and all the classic contortions of partisan message management surround the sequester, the term for the $85 billion in ugly and largely irrational federal spending cuts set by law to begin Friday.

What is the non-budget wonk to make of this? Who is responsible? What really happened?

The finger-pointing began during the third presidential debate last fall, on Oct. 22, when President Obama blamed Congress. “The sequester is not something that I’ve proposed,” Obama said. “It is something that Congress has proposed.”

The White House chief of staff at the time, Jack Lew, who had been budget director during the negotiations that set up the sequester in 2011, backed up the president two days later.

There was an insistence on the part of Republicans in Congress for there to be some automatic trigger,” Lew said while campaigning in Florida. It “was very much rooted in the Republican congressional insistence that there be an automatic measure.”

The president and Lew had this wrong. My extensive reporting for my book “The Price of Politics” shows that the automatic spending cuts were initiated by the White House and were the brainchild of Lew and White House congressional relations chief Rob Nabors — probably the foremost experts on budget issues in the senior ranks of the federal government.

Obama personally approved of the plan for Lew and Nabors to propose the sequester to Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid (D-Nev.). They did so at 2:30 p.m. July 27, 2011, according to interviews with two senior White House aides who were directly involved.

Nabors has told others that they checked with the president before going to see Reid. A mandatory sequester was the only action-forcing mechanism they could devise. Nabors has said, “We didn’t actually think it would be that hard to convince them” — Reid and the Republicans — to adopt the sequester. “It really was the only thing we had. There was not a lot of other options left on the table.”

A majority of Republicans did vote for the Budget Control Act that summer, which included the sequester. Key Republican staffers said they didn’t even initially know what a sequester was — because the concept stemmed from the budget wars of the 1980s, when they were not in government.

At the Feb. 13 Senate Finance Committee hearing on Lew’s nomination to become Treasury secretary, Sen. Richard Burr (R-N.C.) asked Lew about the account in my book: “Woodward credits you with originating the plan for sequestration. Was he right or wrong?”

“It’s a little more complicated than that,” Lew responded, “and even in his account, it was a little more complicated than that. We were in a negotiation where the failure would have meant the default of the government of the United States.”

“Did you make the suggestion?” Burr asked.

“Well, what I did was said that with all other options closed, we needed to look for an option where we could agree on how to resolve our differences. And we went back to the 1984 plan that Senator [Phil] Gramm and Senator [Warren] Rudman worked on and said that that would be a basis for having a consequence that would be so unacceptable to everyone that we would be able to get action.”

In other words, yes.

But then Burr asked about the president’s statement during the presidential debate, that the Republicans originated it.

Lew, being a good lawyer and a loyal presidential adviser, then shifted to denial mode: “Senator, the demand for an enforcement mechanism was not something that the administration was pushing at that moment.”

That statement was not accurate.

On Tuesday, Obama appeared at the White House with a group of police officers and firefighters to denounce the sequester as a “meat-cleaver approach” that would jeopardize military readiness and investments in education, energy and readiness. He also said it would cost jobs. But, the president said, the substitute would have to include new revenue through tax reform.

At noon that same day, White House press secretary Jay Carney shifted position and accepted sequester paternity.

“The sequester was something that was discussed,” Carney said. Walking back the earlier statements, he added carefully, “and as has been reported, it was an idea that the White House put forward.”

This was an acknowledgment that the president and Lew had been wrong.

Why does this matter?

First, months of White House dissembling further eroded any semblance of trust between Obama and congressional Republicans. (The Republicans are by no means blameless and have had their own episodes of denial and bald-faced message management.)

Second, Lew testified during his confirmation hearing that the Republicans would not go along with new revenue in the portion of the deficit-reduction plan that became the sequester. Reinforcing Lew’s point, a senior White House official said Friday, “The sequester was an option we were forced to take because the Republicans would not do tax increases.”

In fact, the final deal reached between Vice President Biden and Senate Minority Leader Mitch McConnell (R-Ky.) in 2011 included an agreement that there would be no tax increases in the sequester in exchange for what the president was insisting on: an agreement that the nation’s debt ceiling would be increased for 18 months, so Obama would not have to go through another such negotiation in 2012, when he was running for reelection.

So when the president asks that a substitute for the sequester include not just spending cuts but also new revenue, he is moving the goal posts. His call for a balanced approach is reasonable, and he makes a strong case that those in the top income brackets could and should pay more. But that was not the deal he made.

Bob Woodward: Obama’s sequester deal-changer - The Washington Post
 

GoIrish41

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What difference does it make whose idea it was? Shouldn't the focus be on how to end it now that the deadline is almost here?
 

BobD

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What difference does it make whose idea it was? Shouldn't the focus be on how to end it now that the deadline is almost here?

Unfortunately yes it does. The Republicans have become like a bunch of 3rd graders these days. If a Democrat came up with a way to cure all of mankind's suffering, the Republicans would fight against it.
 

NDFan4Life

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What difference does it make whose idea it was? Shouldn't the focus be on how to end it now that the deadline is almost here?

I agree that it shouldn't have come down to sequestration. However, I believe that this shows, that while Republicans aren't blameless, the Democrats aren't exactly squeaky clean as some people have suggested.
 

chicago51

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What difference does it make whose idea it was? Shouldn't the focus be on how to end it now that the deadline is almost here?

Exactly let's turn it off.

Here is my bad analogy: Obama may have helped load the gun but now he is saying don't shoot. The republicans are the one's that are flirting with shooting it. Is Obama guilty for loading the gun? Yes but the GOP is guilty actually firing it on the American people.

Republicans have more to lose on this. Last time I checked Obama can't run for a third. If they somehow think that sequester is going to make Hillary Clinton look bad they are wrong. Hillary is off on the sideline is going to be unharmed by all this the democrats in the Senate are trying to replace the sequester so it is helping their brand. Meanwhile their is heavy risk that Americans will see the GOP as they party that only cares about rich people.

I think this a pointless stunt that will hurt American people. Read the article I posted. It won'tlower the deficit by as much as the cuts are actually for.
 

chicago51

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By the way 76 percent of country want a mix of tax revenue and spending cuts. Exactly what the president has on the table.
 

Ndaccountant

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What difference does it make whose idea it was? Shouldn't the focus be on how to end it now that the deadline is almost here?

Good article here. It puts the blame where it should be placed, on the law that created this mess. This is both a R and D failure.

"If President Barack Obama, the Republican House and the Democratic Senate cannot cut $85 billion from this year’s $3.8 trillion budget without laying off first responders, tying up airport security lines and furloughing food safety inspectors, what good are they?

The answer is: Not much. It turns out we elect lawmakers so they can hold our time and safety hostage. When Congress passed and the president signed the 2011 Budget Control Act, all parties agreed that the act’s $1.2 trillion in “sequester” cuts over 10 years would be so terrible that a bipartisan supercommittee would be forced to present a better plan for deficit reduction.

But the committee failed. The “sequester” cuts were designed to be too terrible for taxpayers, but not for Washington insiders embroiled in the blame game."

http://www.statesmanjournal.com/art...32/Saunders-Sequester-cuts-serve-protect-pork
 
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ND NYC

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that "super committee" wasnt so super after all, now was it?

did it even form? did they have meetings? who was on it?

congress is a joke. we all know that. but now, the kabuki show down there is dangerous to this country short and long term.

is Reid, McConnell, Pelosi, Boehner really the best we've got to lead our Congress?

it is high time for leaders and not politicians
 

chicago51

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The 111th Congress got quite a bit done that of course was when Pelosi ran the House.

People may not agree with everything that came out but they got stuff done. Would have been even more if not for Senate filibusters. Thank you Senate republicans for filibustering the American Jobs Act.

I agree it is disappointing that stuff has not get done. I can only blame the republicans until they prove to me the following: that they will accept one cent in tax revenue remember the fiscal cliff bill was a tax cut from the Clinton taxes as the Bush taxes expired and take up common sense bills in the House like the Violence Against Woman Act.
 
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B

Buster Bluth

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By the way 76 percent of country want a mix of tax revenue and spending cuts. Exactly what the president has on the table.

76 percent of country want a mix of tax revenue and spending cuts

!=

76 percent of country want exactly what the president has on the table
 

chicago51

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76 percent of country want a mix of tax revenue and spending cuts

!=

76 percent of country want exactly what the president has on the table

Dude I don't want exactly what the president has on the table.

I think to ask for no tax revenue from the wealthy is a bit of hard line position. Heck asking for no entitlement changes which I have complained about is a bit of a hard line position.

I think you said that you felt the wealthy should pay more. Protect things like a tax deduction for corporate jets is insane.
 

ND NYC

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we are at the point now where doing nothing (gridlock) will be worse than doing something (getting some sort of deal done).

and no one in congress even talks to each other...they dont even TRY to meet in a mature way behind the scenes to work things out.
bunch of untrustworthy weasels, social misfits and empty suits. it is truly pathetic.
 

Ndaccountant

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A rant....

- First, can we stop politicians from using the word revenue? I am not sure who said last week, but someone said politicans have code words and won't say certain words? Well, revenue has replaced tax. You won't here politicans saying the word tax unless it is something that goes against the other party. It's annoying.

- I am all for tax reform. But, I really do hope that the R's don't cave on taxes on this one. We need to close loopholes (carried interest being one). But, this isn't something we should piecemeal. We have tried to make changes incrementally before to many government policies. It doesn't work Tax reform should be seperated from the sequester debate.

- The more I read about the sequester, the more pissed off I get. This was a doozy that was a ticking time bomb. But, instead of giving themselves flexibiliy, they designed something so rigid to pass debt increases, this is the turd we get. Thanks.

- The R's are sure getting their asses handed to them in shaping this discussion. In the last few years, we have talked endlessly about debt reduction. R's folded their arms and said we need lower spending (including entitlements) and D's said we need the wealthy to pay more taxes. Debt ceilings have been raised with no real plan to reduce spending, except for the sequestor. Yea, we can talk about stopping war spending and hoping Obama care lowers costs as planned, but to me, the war spend isn't a reduction (should be looked at differently then other spending) and health care is a prayer. But R's have largely not gotten what they want and D's have. Now, after tax rates have been raised, R's are still being scolded for an unbalanced approach. It's nonsense but R's are constantly on the defense and D's have controlled the talking points.

- Finally, everyone talks about keeping taxes and spending at a fixed % of GDP. Why? Why do we limit ourselves to that artifical constraint? Shouldn't we have more efficiencies as our GDP increases? Shouldn't we demand them? I wouldn't be happy if I continued to have the same ROS as sales increased year over year and investors in my company wouldn't either. Hell, this is our damn money (and our kids) that they are playing with. Would you invest in the government? I wouldn't.

animal-house-chug-o.gif
 
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Black Irish

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we are at the point now where doing nothing (gridlock) will be worse than doing something (getting some sort of deal done).

and no one in congress even talks to each other...they dont even TRY to meet in a mature way behind the scenes to work things out.
bunch of untrustworthy weasels, social misfits and empty suits. it is truly pathetic.

We're keeping them out of the private sector where they might do some real damage.
 

NDFan4Life

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Jack Torry commentary: No one in Washington will accept responsibility

Monday February 25, 2013 5:43 AM

If you listened carefully to the whining and complaining, you would think nobody in Washington had anything to do with the automatic spending cuts scheduled to go into effect on March 1.

Nobody from the White House thought of the idea. Nobody in the House or Senate voted for it. The president of the United States didn’t sign it into law.

In the world of make-believe known as Washington, it just happened all by itself, prompting former Republican Rep. Steve LaTourette of Bainbridge Township to joke, “How the heck did it happen? Everybody is being too cute by a half.”

As the federal government faces the likelihood of whacking $85 billion from its budget between March 1 and the end of September, President Barack Obama and lawmakers from both parties have responded with the kind of unserious debate we used to have in kindergarten.

The goal of this debate is not to devise a solution to the spending reductions. Instead, the White House and Congress are more concerned about avoiding the blame instead of shouldering the responsibility to govern.

Just take a sample of what was said last week about these automatic spending cuts, which are called a sequester.

In strident and sharp language, Obama assailed the sequester as a “meat cleaver,” and complained it would “eviscerate job-creating investments in education and energy and medical research.”

After the Pentagon warned on Wednesday that it would be forced to temporarily furlough most of its civilian employees, a spokeswoman for Sen. Sherrod Brown, D-Ohio, said he “is concerned about the effects sequestration will have on Ohio as well as our national security.”

That same day, Sen. Rob Portman, R-Ohio, asserted that he has “always said that sequestration was a bad idea,” although he quickly acknowledged “that we need to make cuts.”

Yet here are the facts: White House chief of staff Jack Lew, who soon will be confirmed as Treasury Secretary, originally proposed the idea of a sequester in 2011. The Republican-controlled House and Democratic-controlled Senate both approved it. Portman and Brown voted in favor of it. And Obama signed it into law.

There was a glimmer of logic behind the spending cuts, which amounted to $85 billion this year and $1.2 trillion during the next decade. It was supposed to be an ax hanging over our Washington officials’ heads. If a supercommittee of Democrats and Republicans failed to agree in 2011 to a long-term plan to reduce the deficit, the automatic spending cuts would go forward.

Why anyone believed that in this partisan atmosphere any committee could even agree on the color of the sky, let alone a budget, has never been explained.

When asked why Brown voted for a sequester he now believes is a bad idea, Meghan Dubyak, a Brown spokeswoman, replied that “he voted to use the threat of a sequester to spur bipartisan action on deficit reduction.”

Portman, who held a seat on the supercommittee, said the White House proposed “the sequestration as a backup. But, it’s not the right way to do it, and I think that the president and the Congress agree on that. Most people do.”

In normal times in Washington, both parties would forge a compromise that would gradually reduce the budget deficit. “Everybody would have a sacred cow gored,” LaTourette said. But normal times seem to be just another memory.

The reason? House Republicans simply do not trust Obama enough to engage in any serious negotiations to curb the deficit, while Obama believes that talking to the very conservative Republicans in the House is a waste of time.

So who pays the price? Look no further than the thousands of middle-class civilian workers at the defense facilities in Whitehall who face potential furloughs. That’s because Obama refuses to agree to any restraints in the rapidly growing programs of Medicare, Social Security and Medicaid — which are the causes of the deficit. And Republicans say the White House got its last tax increase in January.

Jack Torry commentary: No one in Washington will accept responsibility | The Columbus Dispatch
 

chicago51

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A rant....

- First, can we stop politicians from using the word revenue? I am not sure who said last week, but someone said politicans have code words and won't say certain words? Well, revenue has replaced tax. You won't here politicans saying the word tax unless it is something that goes against the other party. It's annoying.

- I am all for tax reform. But, I really do hope that the R's don't cave on taxes on this one. We need to close loopholes (carried interest being one). But, this isn't something we should piecemeal. We have tried to make changes incrementally before to many government policies. It doesn't work Tax reform should be seperated from the sequester debate.

- The more I read about the sequester, the more pissed off I get. This was a doozy that was a ticking time bomb. But, instead of giving themselves flexibiliy, they designed something so rigid to pass debt increases, this is the turd we get. Thanks.

- The R's are sure getting their asses handed to them in shaping this discussion. In the last few years, we have talked endlessly about debt reduction. R's folded their arms and said we need lower spending (including entitlements) and D's said we need the wealthy to pay more taxes. Debt ceilings have been raised with no real plan to reduce spending, except for the sequestor. Yea, we can talk about stopping war spending and hoping Obama care lowers costs as planned, but to me, the war spend isn't a reduction (should be looked at differently then other spending) and health care is a prayer. But R's have largely not gotten what they want and D's have. Now, after tax rates have been raised, R's are still being scolded for an unbalanced approach. It's nonsense but R's are constantly on the defense and D's have controlled the talking points.

- Finally, everyone talks about keeping taxes and spending at a fixed % of GDP. Why? Why do we limit ourselves to that artifical constraint? Shouldn't we have more efficiencies as our GDP increases? Shouldn't we demand them? I wouldn't be happy if I continued to have the same ROS as sales increased year over year and investors in my company wouldn't either. Hell, this is our damn money (and our kids) that they are playing with. Would you invest in the government? I wouldn't.

animal-house-chug-o.gif

Interesting rant my friend.

Are you saying you want a big deal and not incremental policy because I am all for that?

Right now the Rs have gotten 1.2 trillion in cuts from Obama while the Ds only got 600-700 billion in taxes and that was from expiring legistration that would have happened anyway.

This is not directed at you or your post but my own personal rant on some things.

My rant:
I am all for putting the end of the use of revenue if we can also put an end to the phrase "job creator". There is no job creating it is called hiring. You hire a worker because the work being done is going to make you money. Rather the worker is building something, or providing a service the company is hiring a worker there is a demand and work is needed to fill that demand.

A billionaire just go "hey I got all this money I am going to hire workers for the sake of hiring workers" his or her line of thought is more on the lines of "I am selling this much of good or service X I need to hire X-amount of workers to make sure I have enough of that to meet demand. Demand drives an economy. Where does demand come from? From the American people having money in their pockets to go out and spend on goods and services.

My rant II: I think a balance plan has enough votes if the House Speaker John Boehner ignores the Hastart rule and just brings it up for a vote. A balance plan will get republican votes it just will not a majority of republican votes. The tea party as the moderate republicans by balls right now.

My rant III:
Why not get tax (notice how I didn't use revenue) from China. Put tariffs on China and other low income coutries imports. We can get some more money into the treasury and help companies that do things in America compete better in terms of prices.

My rant part IV:
Let the people decide our deficit reduction. I say have national special election. Give the American people 4 choices and let them vote:
A- Ryan Budget
B- Simpson Bowles billionaire funded "bipartison" compromise
C - Obama's balanced plan
D - House progressive caucus liberal budget
 
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Ndaccountant

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Interesting rant my friend.

Are you saying you want a big deal and not incremental policy because I am all for that?

Right now the Rs have gotten 1.2 trillion in cuts from Obama while the Ds only got 600-700 billion in taxes and that was from expiring legistration that would have happened anyway.

This is not directed at you or your post but my own personal rant on some things.

My rant:
I am all for putting the end of the use of revenue if we can also put an end to the phrase "job creator". There is no job creating it is called hiring. You hire a worker because the work being done is going to make you money. Rather the worker is building something, or providing a service the company is hiring a worker there is a demand and work is needed to fill that demand.

A billionaire just go "hey I got all this money I am going to hire workers for the sake of hiring workers" his or her line of thought is more on the lines of "I am selling this much of good or service X I need to hire X-amount of workers to make sure I have enough of that to meet demand. Demand drives an economy. Where does demand come from? From the American people having money in their pockets to go out and spend on goods and services.

My rant II: I think a balance plan has enough votes if the House Speaker John Boehner ignores the Hastart rule and just brings it up for a vote. A balance plan will get republican votes it just will not a majority of republican votes. The tea party as the moderate republicans by balls right now.

My rant III:
Why not get tax (notice how I didn't use revenue) from China. Put tariffs on China and other low income coutries imports. We can get some more money into the treasury and help companies that do things in America compete better in terms of prices.

My rant part IV:
Let the people decide our deficit reduction. I say have national special election. Give the American people 4 choices and let them vote:
A- Ryan Budget
B- Simpson Bowles billionaire funded "bipartison" compromise
C - Obama's balanced plan
D - House progressive caucus liberal budget

Just to nit.

Is the obama cuts you reference military and health reduction? If it is, as I said in my post, I don't count those since the health care savings appear to be a pipe dream and winding down the war isn't a cost cut (much like ending the payroll tax holiday wasn't a tax increase in book either).

Also, what is the $600B? Is that the tax increase on rates? If it is, that is ignoring all of the tax increases that went in to Obama care. Those need to be factored in as well.

In the end, I would like to see rates lowered and broaden the base. I think carried interest should go away for hedge fund managers, I think certain reductions in deductions make sense (I would support one house maximum on interest deduction) and I would support removing state income tax reduction for federal returns. But, in return, rates come down. To me, that makes the most sense.
 

chicago51

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Just to nit.

Is the obama cuts you reference military and health reduction? If it is, as I said in my post, I don't count those since the health care savings appear to be a pipe dream and winding down the war isn't a cost cut (much like ending the payroll tax holiday wasn't a tax increase in book either).

Also, what is the $600B? Is that the tax increase on rates? If it is, that is ignoring all of the tax increases that went in to Obama care. Those need to be factored in as well.


In the end, I would like to see rates lowered and broaden the base. I think carried interest should go away for hedge fund managers, I think certain reductions in deductions make sense (I would support one house maximum on interest deduction) and I would support removing state income tax reduction for federal returns. But, in return, rates come down. To me, that makes the most sense.

The Obama cuts are the 1.4 trillion from the 2011 debt ceiling crisis. In addition to the sequester there were caps placed on discretionary spending that require a super majority of congress to change.

The 600 billion comes from expiring Bush tax cuts on income past $400,000 up to 39.6 percent up from 35 percent. Personally I think a hard working small business owner making $500k is taxed enough we a new tax bracket for millionaires and billionares of say 41 percent but that is just me. For what is worth the American Jobs Act would lower taxes on small business.

Other ideas
The carried interest loophole should be closed. So we agree there.

I would enact the buffet rule. If you make more under no circumstances should you end up paying less if make more.

We can lower health care cost if Medicare was allowed to negotiate there perscription drug rates like they do for their other services it would save a good amount of health care coverage. The fact is even with the wars if we would have not had the Bush tax cuts and would have found a way to pay for Medicare Part D we would not have these crazy deficits.

I am warming up to this Chain CPI thing. It lowers Social Security benefits over time by changing what we use to calculate the cost of living. I am kind of okay with if it has protection for the most vulnerable low income seniors.

A wall street transaction tax of .01 percent that is one penny for a hundred dollars would raise 300 billion over 10 years. It would also slow of the speculative trading that goes on. We sales tax everything else why not Wall Street?

The big thing for me. This was something that even Reagan supported is that people should pay the same amount of tax rather it was capital gains (stock dividends or earned income). As much as I rip Reagan even he had the sense that capital gains taxes should be the same as income taxes as the oligarchs make most of their money from capital gains. Executives get around paying income taxes by issuing themselves stock options. So billionair pays a lower tax rate of 20% even before deductions than some who makes 50 grand a year.
 

Black Irish

Wise Guy
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My rant part IV:
Let the people decide our deficit reduction. I say have national special election. Give the American people 4 choices and let them vote:
A- Ryan Budget
B- Simpson Bowles billionaire funded "bipartison" compromise
C - Obama's balanced plan
D - House progressive caucus liberal budget[/QUOTE]

Is it automatically a bad idea because it is funded by billionaires? And is it automatically a good idea because it is proposed by progressive politicians who have likely never spent a minute in the real world of private enterprise? Between the two groups, who amongst them have actually started a business and created jobs? And paid more taxes?
 

chicago51

Well-known member
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My rant part IV:
Let the people decide our deficit reduction. I say have national special election. Give the American people 4 choices and let them vote:
A- Ryan Budget
B- Simpson Bowles billionaire funded "bipartison" compromise
C - Obama's balanced plan
D - House progressive caucus liberal budget

Is it automatically a bad idea because it is funded by billionaires? And is it automatically a good idea because it is proposed by progressive politicians who have likely never spent a minute in the real world of private enterprise? Between the two groups, who amongst them have actually started a business and created jobs? And paid more taxes?[/QUOTE]

You make a fair point. Many billionaires have good ideas that is why they are billionaires. Although we should be aware people usually act in their self interest.

Every gets money from someone. Progressive ideas may be too much of a union giveaway.

One of things would like that would never happen would be to get disclosure of who gets money from where. At least then we will all know were people stand. Instead of wearing suits policticians should wear NASCAR gear to show who they are brought and paid for by.
 

DSully1995

New member
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My rant part IV:
Let the people decide our deficit reduction. I say have national special election. Give the American people 4 choices and let them vote:
A- Ryan Budget
B- Simpson Bowles billionaire funded "bipartison" compromise
C - Obama's balanced plan
D - House progressive caucus liberal budget

Is it automatically a bad idea because it is funded by billionaires? And is it automatically a good idea because it is proposed by progressive politicians who have likely never spent a minute in the real world of private enterprise? Between the two groups, who amongst them have actually started a business and created jobs? And paid more taxes?[/QUOTE]

Or just go canadian style, whenever a budget does not pass,(or any other major legislation) government is dissolved and elections called.
 
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