L O S T

[SouthernIrish]

in the first season didn't the psychic that freaked out at Clair say something about her baby??? i can't remember what was said and can't bear the thought of going on to a LOST board to find it

 

[SoCalDomer]

the pyschic told her to not give the baby up, that she should raise him or something like that.

 

[SouthernIrish]

and so now Kate is raising him. hmmm. that can't be good for our castaways

 

[SoCalDomer]

ya, i don't remember the context that well, but i think he did hint that something bad would happen. but that issue has been essentially silent since then.

one thing i find very frustrating is how quickly the writers will drop some major part of the show.

for example, the numbers. the numbers that Hurley learned from Leonard, who heard them over radio signals broadcasted from the island, that Hurley used on the lottery, that he swore were jinxed, that were used to enter into the computer, that we on all sorts of things on the island like the vials of antidote that Desmond injects himself with.

those haven't been mentioned at all this season and have seemingly dropped off the map. we may never find out their significance, but they were a major plot device throughout season 1 and 2.

another example, Smokey. Other than Locke asking Ben about him, he hasn't been an issue. The last we saw of Snokey he was chasing Kate and Juliet and couldn't go through the sonic perimeter.

 

[SouthernIrish]

yes, and the black rock, that ship, Adam and Eve in the cave, Walt being psychic, a ton of things just not talked about anymore.

but then this happens with Aaron and they bring back something from the first season. so who knows, it may all pull together in the end

 

[phork]

There was a hint to Adam & Eve in one of the first 4 episodes. The BlackRock has been mentioned a lot. Thats the ship the Chistiane I was looking for when they found the 815 wreckage. Some of the numbers have appeared in scenes throughout the first 4 episodes. A lot of stuff is happening, and you will miss it unless you watch it twice, or the recap show with the pop-up video subtitles.

SPOILER ALERT: (highlight below if you want to read it)
Sun & Jin are the last 2 of the O6.

There is a whole lot going on right now. It feels like to me that the show is dropping huge chunks of plot for some reason.

 

[IrishAlum1997]

I took a different way home from the gym tonight...I was hoping to get sucked into a time-space continuum where I was back at the cusp of 1/2 a billion vBucks. I think it worked until I got home.

DAMMIT!!!

 

[phork]

No Vbucks For You !!

 

[SoCalDomer]

yes, and the black rock, that ship, Adam and Eve in the cave, Walt being psychic, a ton of things just not talked about anymore.

but then this happens with Aaron and they bring back something from the first season. so who knows, it may all pull together in the end

hey SI, i think you have Desmond-like powers. Did you see the blackrock mentioned during the auction? Other interesting things were that the auction was for ship's main log regarding its travels, and was put up for auction by the Hanso foundation, the same foundation featuring Dr. Marvin Candle in the videos Desmond had about pushing the button.

So Widmore wanted the book real bad and got it... which confirms my belief that he/his company is the one who may have put the ship team together. Using the book from the blackrock, they could continue searching for the island.

The doctor on the ship who injected the guy on the bed, have we seen him on the show before? He looked familiar.

Ok, so Ben does have someone on the boat, who apparently sabotoged the communications a few days ago. But i still question the logistics of that person (even if it is Mikhail - "Patchy") who has intelligence gathering skills, whether he would be able to learn who everyone was and somehow relay it to Ben before he was captured by Jack.

I liked the episode except for the fact that the writers came out in season 2 and swore up and down that this was not about time travel. I guess they didn't lie, since this was consciousness time travel.

Desmond is by far the most interesting character to me, so even though the story moved only a few hours... or wait, was it days (get it? the time differential ) i liked the episode. The less whiny Kate, the better.

That Penny is quite a filly (think so I married an axe murderer)

 

[phork]

They never outright said it wasn't time travel, what they stated was that time travel in the sense of Heroes was shoddy.

My theory as to Minkowski and the radio equipment.. Naomi was looking for Desmond, so was some of the people on the freighter, including Minkowski. The other people on the freighter found out they were communicating with Naomi and trashed the radio gear.

By the way, isnt it funny how this works out? Minkowski invented this spacetime triangle to graphically illustrate Einstein's space-time invariance. Einstein unified space and time for his theory of relativity, so Minkowski forced them to graphical equality and invariance.

Also we now know that time on the island, is the same off the island.

Scroll down further and you will find a few paragraphs relevant to the show.

 

[SoCalDomer]

They never outright said it wasn't time travel, what they stated was that time travel in the sense of Heroes was shoddy.

Time travel is time travel, whether they meant it in a classic sense or only in a consciousness type of sense.

I found the following on the lost board regarding interviews they gave early on:

"This show isn't 'The X-Files.' Everything that happens to these characters is grounded to reality as we know it. Time and space are not bent."

"What we are trying to do is make sure everything has a very Scully explanation," Fury said, referring to the X-Files character. "This is not a show about the supernatural, despite the fact that we have a very huge creature that likes to eat people. Despite the surreal, bizarre aspects of the island, there will be an explanation for it. It may not come for a very long time, but certain information about the island will explain how things are possible. We'll try to root it in real science or real pseudo-science. There will be no mystical reason or an island of monsters. The island has been around for millennia, and many people have found themselves on it, and as far as we know, nobody has ever gotten off. There is also the possibility of others being on the island, they just haven't seen them yet. And we'll never know how big this island is. It could be enormous, but odd things will keep them from knowing the full length and breadth of it. It's an interesting little allegory. It will be very mysterious."

Now, the fact they may have changed their minds and chosen to written contrary to what they originally said doesn't bother me. It's a show, they can do what they want. It just makes me not want to listen to their "explanations" or interviews since their statements or explanations may not be credible.

 

[IrishAlum1997]

There was a hint to Adam & Eve in one of the first 4 episodes. The BlackRock has been mentioned a lot. Thats the ship the Chistiane I was looking for when they found the 815 wreckage. Some of the numbers have appeared in scenes throughout the first 4 episodes. A lot of stuff is happening, and you will miss it unless you watch it twice, or the recap show with the pop-up video subtitles.

SPOILER ALERT: (highlight below if you want to read it)
Sun & Jin are the last 2 of the O6.

There is a whole lot going on right now. It feels like to me that the show is dropping huge chunks of plot for some reason.

Phork, that spoiler does not jive, as we already know 5.

 

[SoCalDomer]

Unless Kate claims aaron as her son then he could conceivably not be counted as one of the survivors. But I think he is counted as one.

 

[phork]

Phork, that spoiler does not jive, as we already know 5.

Which 5 are you talking about? We know Jack, Kate, Hugo, Sayid. Aaron was not on the manifest and would not be counted as one. Desmond was not on the plane, and we don't even know if he makes it off the freighter.

I'll bet you all your vbucks that the 2 listed in the spoiler are the 5th & 6th.

 

[phork]

Time travel is time travel, whether they meant it in a classic sense or only in a consciousness type of sense.

I found the following on the lost board regarding interviews they gave early on:

Now, the fact they may have changed their minds and chosen to written contrary to what they originally said doesn't bother me. It's a show, they can do what they want. It just makes me not want to listen to their "explanations" or interviews since their statements or explanations may not be credible.

There are many theories regarding time travel and in fact some have basis in reality, I'm really not getting where you are going with this... The show is hardly over at this point, lets give it a chance to play out. Time travel is far from being a theoretical impossibility.

 

[SoCalDomer]

well, they can't get around the statement they made of not bending time/space. but even then, i disagree that time-travel is scientificly explainable. science is the study of that which is demonstrable and repeatable. discussion on time travel takes scientific principles but then goes to a non-empirical level. It is not scientific in the classic sense of it (nor is alot of other things that claim authority under the name of science, such as the study of origin of life, which is more historical theory than scientific, or metaphysics).

i don't have a problem them going down the time-travel road or any other road (unless it becomes incredible). my only point is the writers came out and made certain statements a while ago, and those statements are inconsistent with where they've taken the show.

 

[SoCalDomer]

this could just be a matter of the writers not choosing their words carefully enough. but as people whose profession is using words, i would be surprised if that's the case.

for example:

This is not a show about the supernatural,

then what exactly is the voices people keep hearing, and the appearances of dead people or people who aren't really there (walt, yemi, jacob, jack's dad, charlie, etc...). That's not natural in that sense of the word, those things would absolutely be supernatural.

 

[phork]

And I am sure at some point we'll find out why. All I am saying let it play out. I see no one took my bet about the O6 however.

 

[phork]

Besides, science is not fact based. It is about proofs however. You come up with a Hypothesis and you either prove or disprove it. And like I said, its hard to prove the theoretical improbability of time travel. So it cannot be ruled out based on what you believe alone.

 

[phork]

So no one wants to take me up on my O6 Bet?

 

[Rizzophil]

Phork, what do you want to bet?

 

[phork]

I'd say cash but Utah humped me out of my life savings... Make an offer I guess...
Make me sing Hail To the Victors in my underwear on MSUs campus?

 

[SouthernIrish]

well, they can't get around the statement they made of not bending time/space. but even then, i disagree that time-travel is scientificly explainable. science is the study of that which is demonstrable and repeatable. discussion on time travel takes scientific principles but then goes to a non-empirical level. It is not scientific in the classic sense of it (nor is alot of other things that claim authority under the name of science, such as the study of origin of life, which is more historical theory than scientific, or metaphysics).

i don't have a problem them going down the time-travel road or any other road (unless it becomes incredible). my only point is the writers came out and made certain statements a while ago, and those statements are inconsistent with where they've taken the show.

i'm just going to stick with the magic island theory

 

[Rizzophil]

Phork, that's a deal. If your are wrong about the O6 you have to sing sing Hail To the Victors in my underwear on MSUs campus!

 

[IrishGrizz]

Phork, that's a deal. If your are wrong about the O6 you have to sing sing Hail To the Victors in my underwear on MSUs campus!

Now, that is sick and wrong- but I have to ask- are they clean? Are they superman underroos?

 

[IrishGrizz]

I'd say cash but Utah humped me out of my life savings... Make an offer I guess...
Make me sing Hail To the Victors in my underwear on MSUs campus?

Gutsey bet- did you see what twist rizzo put into the bet- his used under-roos!

 

[phork]

I'll wear a GString, just dont be around because it won't be a pretty sight.

Also it looks like:
Jin dies in a flash forward.

So what are you guys throwing up for your end of the bargain?

 

[phork]

So this week should be the week, I still don't see any takers.

 

[SouthernIrish]

Michael is the Man On The Boat, I am sure. Unless they have started raising the dead. If it turns out to be Paulo i will not be happy.

Edit. If you haven't watched it yet, keep an eye on the cell phones always a giveaway

 

[SoCalDomer]

Ok, so it was Michael as the Man on the Boat, and at least Sun was one of the remaining Oceanic 6. I question whether Jin actually made it off the island, because the flashforward turned out to be a flashback (see ticked off rant below). While you could argue the tombstone in Korea means he did, they could just as easily just purchased a tombstone for him even if he died on the island, just so Sun would have somwhere to go.

One thing that ticked me off about this episode was that Jin's was a flashback (i've only been married two months), Sun's was a flashforward. Now, in the past, the flashbacks were always used to give insight into the person's past or character.

THERE WAS NO FRICKIN POINT TO JIN'S FLASHBACK, WE ALREADY KNEW HE WORKED FOR PAIK AND WAS A DEDICATED WORKER. The only purpose to mixing up the flashforward and the flashback was to screw with the viewers, to get them to think Jin was still alive and he was trying to get to the hospital. That's just stupid writing.

Ok, quick question, because an earlier episode doesn't make sense now. Who's funeral did Jack go to in his first flashforward (end of last season)? The funeral director said no family and no friends showed up. When Jack met up with Kate, he asked her if she went, so it had to be someone they knew in common. But Kate acts like, why would i go to that jerks funeral?

Of the Oceanic 6, Sun lived in Korea and Kate wouldn't have acted that way. Sayid probably would not have had a funeral in LA and Kate wouldn't have reacted that way. Hurley would have had family there and kate wouldn't have acted that way. Jack is alive, and it's obviously not her. That's 5 of the 6.

I guess the answer lies in whether Jin is one of the Oceanic 6. If he is, then there is no answer to this question. If he's not, then that leaves the option that an additional person makes it off the island and Kate would call him a jerk when she found out he died. Sawyer, Michael, or Locke seem like they could evoke that reaction. Though only Michael seems likely to actually leave the island.

I suppose it still could have been Michael's funeral and if he assumed an alias "Kevin" when he got back to the states, no one would consider him a member of the Oceanic 6. Kate would definitely have that kind of reaction to Michael's death. But what about Walt? Wouldn't he have been there?

Michael keeping the name of Kevin would leave open the possibility of another of Oceanic 6. Unless Aaron filled that role. But if Aaron filled that role, then that essentially requires Michael be the one who died, but he kept his alias name and did not leave the island as one of th oceanic 6. But then where is Walt?