Charlie Weis

[IRISHDODGER]

Was the defense really that complicated that everyone needed a wristband?

Yeah I kept wanting to hear a full explanation of the "lack of communication" 2 yrs into Minter's defense. Aren't these guys supposed to be pretty bright guys considering the school they were accepted to? In fact, wasn't Minter forced to simplify his D before last season? Not that it helped. When there are still communication issues by the 10th game of the season, there's a coaching issue & hopefully that's been rectified w/ the hiring of Brown.

 

[Irish52]

The only recruits I want to see commit to ND are those with passion, enthusiasm, honesty, integrity and love for the game of football and, more importantly, openly expressing their gratitude and love for Notre Dame. Show me that recruit and I will show you a future ND star and very successful man after graduation in whatever endeavor he decides to follow. We don't have to cajole, nor should we, any recruit who feels the need to be sold on ND. Our credentials and tradition speak for themselves...period. And if that's not enough, surely one only needs to look at our graduation rates for all of our athletes as compared to the other major football powers with graduation rates running as low as 40%, with most at an average of 60%.

 

[solo]

The only recruits I want to see commit to ND are those with passion, enthusiasm, honesty, integrity and love for the game of football and, more importantly, openly expressing their gratitude and love for Notre Dame. Show me that recruit and I will show you a future ND star and very successful man after graduation in whatever endeavor he decides to follow. We don't have to cajole, nor should we, any recruit who feels the need to be sold on ND. Our credentials and tradition speak for themselves...period. And if that's not enough, surely one only needs to look at our graduation rates for all of our athletes as compared to the other major football powers with graduation rates running as low as 40%, with most at an average of 60%.

The guys making millions in the NFL (who are the type of players we need) don't care about grad rates. And ND does not sell itself. If that were true, Willingham wouldn't have left the cupboard so bare for Weis.

ND is a great University, but that doesn't mean that Weis need not bust his hum selling these recruits ont he virtues of the University. Don't be naive.

 

[Freeman Ara]

ncbcschamps (i singled you out because you sound like a raiders fan too?) and the rest of you all, i couldn't agree more. i hate seeing these fire cw posts already. drive to mcdonalds and get a big mac if you want something that fast. or just hire urban slither to cheat his way into the national spotlight and then leave again in 4 years (nfl calling next...i doubt it...can't buy recruits in that league). give cw a chance...after all he did take ty's recruits to two bcs games, how many other coaches out there could have done that (besides the great snake meyer)? i love cw and im poud he's our coach. i live in tennessee and it has been tough to be a nd fan here for awhile. now they hate us again and im all smiles as the wins pile up. no we havent won a "big" game yet, but remember we are having to dig out of the "davietymes." and those days are gone as we go after 5 and 4 star athletes instead of a 3-star guy being a target.
back to you ncbcschamps, im a raiders fan too...id love to see them trade moss and porter for some offensive line help and take either johnson or russell/quinn, depending on what kind of help they get on the ol. if not they need to take thomas. noakd

Sorry choo choo, but I am not a raiders fan, I am hoping Davis takes anyone but Quinn in the draft. Then I might actually have to become a raiders fan...lol. Heard the rumor about the Moss and Porter for Vick and pick swap trade with atlanta, now that would be interesting.

 

[regele1]

This is crazy CW finally brought some excitement back to ND. With a different Defensive Coordinator things should bet better. If they fire Weis it'll come back to haunt us, he'll be alright just needs a full recruiting cycle. All the haters need to chill out, we could have Davies back.

 

[stonebreakerwasgod]

weis is staying. no one else coming in (that would come) would do any better. although im glad that he got rid of rick minter! (even though i personally liked him at cincinnati and here before). whether ND gets 8 or 9 wins next year, they have got to win one or two big games! recruits we want desire atmosphere, exposure, and a chance to go pro, but most of all they want to continue winning. not just against boston college, georgia tech, stanford, navy, air force, and the like.

 

[Fighting_Irish9]

The guys making millions in the NFL (who are the type of players we need) don't care about grad rates. And ND does not sell itself. If that were true, Willingham wouldn't have left the cupboard so bare for Weis.

ND is a great University, but that doesn't mean that Weis need not bust his hum selling these recruits ont he virtues of the University. Don't be naive.

I will never get this idea that the cupboards were "bare"....Weis had 2 years with exprienced top 15 top 10 talent...mulitple NFL caliber athletes, many who were 3 and 4 year starters....You want to complain about some depth issues, no problem but two years with that set of starters is far from a bare cupboard

 

[PADOMERNUT]

the cupboard was not bare. the problem with nd this past year was when they had to bring in a sub, there was no depth, so as talented as anyone is, they arent going to be as effective when they are gassed

 

[solo]

I will never get this idea that the cupboards were "bare"....Weis had 2 years with exprienced top 15 top 10 talent...mulitple NFL caliber athletes, many who were 3 and 4 year starters....You want to complain about some depth issues, no problem but two years with that set of starters is far from a bare cupboard

Weis inherited an experienced team with no depth and few stars. When you compare the guys playing on our team to their counterparts playing at LSU, how many of our starters would start for them? Not many. Maybe not even the QB. And our backups would probably be 3rd stringers for the best teams.

Weis coached up our offense and squeazed all he could out of the talent on hand. Having a bunch of Juniors and seniors is great. But you must consider the talent level. He didn't inherit a team full of 5 star recrutis that had been coached up for 3 years.

 

[domerfor life]

There should be no talk of firing Charlie Weis. The previous coach was horrible. Charlie came in turned around a team that went 6-6 the previous year, and led them to within 6 points of playing for the NC. Why can't we just accept the fact that last year's team was just better. The numbers don't lie. They were better. The defense wasn't better, but the offense was great. We lost a couple of key guys from that team and I don't think Shark came back the same guy from last year. He was still good, but he was supposed to dominate. He didn't. Brady got killed against good defenses this year. Rewind back to last year. He was pressured some against the better teams, but in most cases had all day to throw. This year he was getting killed against average defenses (i.e. - Purdue) It will take a little time for Charlie to build this program up. The first year spoiled us and preseason expectations were just ridiculously overblown. Some of us are having a little trouble with reality, because of that. Adjust your thinking and understand that this program has to be rebuilt. Charlie showed that they can still win even while trying to rebuild. The double digit losses hurt, but you have to understand that the lack of solid junior and senior classes will not be easy to overcome. It's a good thing that some of the seniors are coming back. We'll need all the help we can get next year.

 

[Stalking_Eagle]

There should be no talk of firing Charlie Weis. The previous coach was horrible. Charlie came in turned around a team that went 6-6 the previous year, and led them to within 6 points of playing for the NC. Why can't we just accept the fact that last year's team was just better. The numbers don't lie. They were better. The defense wasn't better, but the offense was great. We lost a couple of key guys from that team and I don't think Shark came back the same guy from last year. He was still good, but he was supposed to dominate. He didn't. Brady got killed against good defenses this year. Rewind back to last year. He was pressured some against the better teams, but in most cases had all day to throw. This year he was getting killed against average defenses (i.e. - Purdue) It will take a little time for Charlie to build this program up. The first year spoiled us and preseason expectations were just ridiculously overblown. Some of us are having a little trouble with reality, because of that. Adjust your thinking and understand that this program has to be rebuilt. Charlie showed that they can still win even while trying to rebuild. The double digit losses hurt, but you have to understand that the lack of solid junior and senior classes will not be easy to overcome. It's a good thing that some of the seniors are coming back. We'll need all the help we can get next year.

Great Post

 

[The Menace]

success in the pros doesn't = to success in college- clearly, I would like to see what CW does next year. If he cannot beat the "bigs" after another season- he would likewise be deemed "2nd tier"

 

[The Menace]

needs to beat the bigs- or be considered LIKEWISE, 2nd tier as a coach!!!

 

[solo]

success in the pros doesn't = to success in college- clearly, I would like to see what CW does next year. If he cannot beat the "bigs" after another season- he would likewise be deemed "2nd tier"

My early read on Weis (which it is too early to make final judgments) is that he is the second coming of Dan Devine.

 

[Vince Young]

My early read on Weis (which it is too early to make final judgments) is that he is the second coming of Dan Devine.

Devine did pull in a championship though, didn't he?

After Davie and Willingham, I'll take a Devine, thank you.

 

[domerfor life]

needs to beat the bigs- or be considered LIKEWISE, 2nd tier as a coach!!!

I want to just say that I do not think that Charlie is "Robot Genius". I don't think he is the greatest coach that ever lived. I do think he a good coach who is still new. He's only been a head coach for two years. The man is still learning. Yes, he needs to beat the elite teams, but they are not yet on the elite level. He's trying to recruit to make up for a depleted junior and senior class. It's funny how Irish fans say that Ty was a poor recruiter out of one side of their mouth. Then on the other side, "Charlie needs to beat the bigs or be considered 2nd tier as a coach". We're talking out of both sides of our mouth and making no sense in the process. It won't be until his 4th year that we will be able to honestly gauge the direction of the program. Willingham, which only needed three to prove he was inept, put them in such a hole that it's going to take some time and a whole lot of recruiting to get out of it. Our 2nd string RB had to move to LB for Christ's sakes!! I loved how hard the guys played this year, but many of those guys would be on the 2nd and 3rd teams of most of the elite teams out there. You want him to beat the "bigs" without the "bigs" talent? Scheming will only get you so far. At some point it's "can my guy beat your guy?". If my guys can't beat your guys in the one-on-one battles, I can call all the great plays I've even known. They are still not going to work. I think Charlie has this program headed in the right direction. Firing Minter was a great decision. I hated his defensive philosophy. Our corners were consistently 5 and 10 yds back. There was little to no jamming of the receivers to throw off the timing of offenses to allow our DL more time to get to the QB. No, just give them 5-10 yds to make their move and then watch them catch pass after pass. Two freshman set school records against us. I'm glad that clown is gone.

 

[kjones]

success in the pros doesn't = to success in college- clearly, I would like to see what CW does next year. If he cannot beat the "bigs" after another season- he would likewise be deemed "2nd tier"

Ridiculous. What if he doesn't beat the bigs next year, (2nd tier according to you) but then he starts doing it the year after? Is it too late? Put some thought into your posts next time, don't just spout off knee-jerk reactions with no reasoning behind it. I'm sure you have reasoning behind it, but take the time to write some it please!

As others have said, Weis has been working with a football team that is basically bereft of almost two whole recruiting classes. The talent level of those classes is not even up to a mid-major, much less the "bigs". This is why I think we have the best coach for our situation, because there is SO much work to be done. Weis may not be a robot genius, but he is definately a tireless worker. The man comes into the office at 4:30 in the morning every day, and works his butt off to make ND better. With all the work our program needed to recover, I can't say anyone would have done any better. Nobody is perfect, but the magnitude of the task would have drowned a coach with a lesser work ethic. I think we are easily on the right track compared to two years ago, and if we aren't competitive with the top teams in a few years, I will be greatly surprised.

As has been stated before, some people got their expectations overly encouraged by the 2005 season, and the harsh light of reality, where change takes time, has incited the ire of the impatient.

 

[grantland]

Has someone seriously suggested that Charlie Weis should be fired?

 

[FleaFlicker]

Has someone seriously suggested that Charlie Weis should be fired?

Actually, I've seen a number of people that have either said that, or said, "If he doesn't win 9 games next year, he should be fired". It's pretty ridiculous, and some fans think that CFB operates in some sort of bubble where every team has equal athletes every year, and the teams that lose always lose because of their HC...

 

[Fighting_Irish9]

Weis inherited an experienced team with no depth and few stars. When you compare the guys playing on our team to their counterparts playing at LSU, how many of our starters would start for them? Not many. Maybe not even the QB. And our backups would probably be 3rd stringers for the best teams.

Weis coached up our offense and squeazed all he could out of the talent on hand. Having a bunch of Juniors and seniors is great. But you must consider the talent level. He didn't inherit a team full of 5 star recrutis that had been coached up for 3 years.

Actually I believe someone did do a comparison of the ND starters vs the LSU starters and as recruiting goes we had a higher average star rating per starter than LSU did...

ND had plenty of "stars"....them playing on sunday tells you how talented they were on Saturday

 

[irish4life99]

I will never get this idea that the cupboards were "bare"....Weis had 2 years with exprienced top 15 top 10 talent...mulitple NFL caliber athletes, many who were 3 and 4 year starters....You want to complain about some depth issues, no problem but two years with that set of starters is far from a bare cupboard

Seven players left on what was a weak ass class to begin with. We had to convert a good RB to a LB. CUPBOARDS WERE BARE!!!!! TY SUCKS, AND ALWAYS WILL... LET IT GO!!!

 

[kjones]

Actually I believe someone did do a comparison of the ND starters vs the LSU starters and as recruiting goes we had a higher average star rating per starter than LSU did...

ND had plenty of "stars"....them playing on sunday tells you how talented they were on Saturday

Actually I believe someone told you not to post junk like this unless you could back it up, say with a link. Oh, that was me. Right now. First off, stars mean almost crap, second, average star rating doesn't negate the fact our junior class had NO PEOPLE IN IT! And how many played? Can you count on 3 fingers? Third, I'm pretty sure that your memory is serving you falsely, our star rating was lower. I'm not gonna do this in depth, but here's some actual data from Scout.

Year School rank avg stars #of players
2003 LSU 2 3.67 27
2003 ND 5 3.52 21
2004 LSU 2 3.38 29
2004 ND 30 2.94 17
2005 LSU 19 3.69 13
2005 ND 27 3.27 15

Totals (avg)
2003-5 LSU 8 3.58 23
2003-5 ND 20.6 3.24 17

And I'm not even taking out all the transfers, this is just from the recruiting classes. Looking at this, back to back number 2 classes, is it a surprise that they are so good now? No, it's not. Looking at our back to back poor classes with low ratings and low numbers of players, is it surprising we can't hang with elite teams? No, it's not. The head coach can only change these things with time. As for playing on Sunday, a few good players does not a team make. Example: 2006 Fighting Irish. Not much more seems like it needs saying.

Feel free to apologize for being so wrong, I might forgive you if you grovel. :allhail:





(please take in good humor, not trying to fight here...)

 

[Irish52]

I am bewieldered that 2% of fans can get so much discussion (for lack of a better word) out of the 98% who wholeheartedly support Charlie Weis. I completely disregard any comments that are so far out in left field. Charlie is our coach, will be our coach far into the future, and I, for one, am damn proud that he was selected by our outstanding President, Fr. Jenkins. Go Irish.

 

[irishunclebill]

Fighting_Irish9

2 hallmarks- Making himself look stupid every time he posts & Bob Davie, yea he said Bob Davie is his favorite coach. Enough said.

 

[IrishHater]

All I want to say on Charlie is this...

The guy has talent, Notre Dame has history... the two should work well together.

That said, his smug attitude gets to me, his complaining during the season about the Irish's ranking in the polls, after getting beat by 26 to Michigan at home? Where were the Quality wins? At GT?

Beat an bad Penn State team
Squeaked out of East Lansing (more Mich St. fault than anyone elses)
Played the yearly 3-0 games with Powerhouses Army, Navy, Airforce
Beat a bad Stanford team...

Yet still he complained, and spewed sarcasm toward the BCS all season long because his Irish team was not getting the respect he felt they had somehow earned.
WTF?

Charlie, quit complaining...you have a good background, quality all over your football team... Stick to stuffing your face with greasy burgers, and artery clogging sausages... leave the pollsters to their job, and worry about coming up with your excuses for next years inevetable failures. Great QB coming in... at least win a bowl game for crying out loud.

 

[johnnd05]

Just a reminder, folks: to avoid incessant sniping, add shitheads like this to your 'Ignore' list by clicking on their name, then clicking 'Add [Name] to Ignore List', then clicking 'Save'. For the good of the board, if you can't keep from responding, then let technology help you out ...

 

[Vince Young]

Gotta take exception with one statement there:

Beat an bad Penn State team

No, he absolutely DESTROYED a GOOD Penn State team. Lest you forget, Penn State finished ranked (#24 AP and #25 USA Today) and beat everyone they were supposed to beat, plus Tennessee. Yeah, they had 4 losses, but look who they lost to: Michigan at home and Ohio State, Wisconsin and Notre Dame on the road. Not exactly easy games to win.

I just get a little tired of people acting like Penn State was a worthless win this year and repeating the "Charlie's never beaten a ranked team" mantra. Well, Penn State finished ranked, and we destroyed 'em.

Now granted, it's a little sad that beating #24 Penn State is Charlie's "signature win" thus far, sure. But good grief, it's not like Penn State went 2-9 this year either. Ranked with a 9-4 record ain't chopped liver.

Oh, and negative reps just for coming on here with a name like IrishHater. With a name like that, I somehow doubt you came here for intelligent, respectful debate. Go back to ESPN's forums.

 

[IrishHater]

Oh my bad Mr. John,

I didn't realize that this board was just for kissing ND's ass? If all you want to hear is the gospel that is ND then go to church, in the real world some people have far differant oppinions of your beloved irish. I've said nothing thus far to warrant being ignored, but if you want to ignore me then feel free... thanks for letting me get to you so easily.

 

[Vince Young]

Just a reminder, folks: to avoid incessant sniping, add shitheads like this to your 'Ignore' list by clicking on their name, then clicking 'Add [Name] to Ignore List', then clicking 'Save'. For the good of the board, if you can't keep from responding, then let technology help you out ...

Agreed, except that I've seen ND fans on here down-playing the Penn State win too, and I really think Charlie deserves a bit more credit for laying an ass-whooping on a team that finished ranked. I felt compelled to address that one point.

 

[Vince Young]

I didn't realize that this board was just for kissing ND's ass?

It's not. There's plenty of constructive criticism on here on the job Charlie's done. Two of our most respected members are Michigan fans who jab us regularly, but they do so good naturedly and intelligently instead of dropping the same tired old "CHARLEY IS FAT HAHAHAHA!!!" jokes that you really should have outgrown when you were 8 years old. And our technical admin is a Michigan State fan to boot.

Plenty of room on here for dissenting opinion from opposing fans. But be respectful about it. Fat jokes won't get you very far around here.