Board Going Nuts

[tedwick]

So, ND lost to SC. Pretty badly. It hurts. We ALL feel it. That being said...

Gioia isn't the best kicker in the land. We know. Minter's defenses are prone to giving up big plays. We get it. Willingham didn't have great recruiting classes. Whatever. This board is getting out of control with all the negative shit floating around. There's a reason there's a phrase, "but cooler heads prevailed". Maintain perspective. We've got a 10-2 team that's likely going to a BCS bowl. We've got a bright future and a top recruiting class coming in. Weis is one of the premier game-callers in college, despite what Bob Davie says.

I'm sick of people clogging up the boards with FUD (Fear, Uncertainty, and Doubt). A fairweather fan gives up on the players, the coaches, and the program when things go bad. They think drastic measures need to be taken, even if it means doing away with the standards and ideals that make the program special.

Don't be a fairweather fan. Don't be rash. And, to quote Jack Black, Don't be a Douche. Criticism is fine, but nobody should be trashing players or coaches. And the "Fire Coach X" threads should be reserved for teams that don't go to bowl games.

/2cents

 

[Freeman Ara]

So, ND lost to SC. Pretty badly. It hurts. We ALL feel it. That being said...

Gioia isn't the best kicker in the land. We know. Minter's defenses are prone to giving up big plays. We get it. Willingham didn't have great recruiting classes. Whatever. This board is getting out of control with all the negative shit floating around. There's a reason there's a phrase, "but cooler heads prevailed". Maintain perspective. We've got a 10-2 team that's likely going to a BCS bowl. We've got a bright future and a top recruiting class coming in. Weis is one of the premier game-callers in college, despite what Bob Davie says.

I'm sick of people clogging up the boards with FUD (Fear, Uncertainty, and Doubt). A fairweather fan gives up on the players, the coaches, and the program when things go bad. They think drastic measures need to be taken, even if it means doing away with the standards and ideals that make the program special.

Don't be a fairweather fan. Don't be rash. And, to quote Jack Black, Don't be a Douche. Criticism is fine, but nobody should be trashing players or coaches. And the "Fire Coach X" threads should be reserved for teams that don't go to bowl games.

/2cents

Most or all of these problems will be solved by two things...time and talent. Thats all we need get the talent in here and the time for them to mature and be coached up and this team will be elite. We went from being a .500 hundred team 3 out of 4 years to being a back to back BCS Bowl team in all likelyhood. Can't we just enjoy the turn around so far and not get negative about the things that we can't change now anyway?

 

[tommy]

in a fantasyland

 

[ND4life]

definitely agree with time and talent.....CW sees what ol' petey is doing in USC. CW will get ND a top recruiting class every year that he is coach without "lowering standards". calm down about firing coaches, no one even gave credit to USC for picking up 90% of our blitzes. they were a better team than us plain and simple.

the focus of ND fans should be on staying positive with our team going to a BCS bowl and stay up with current recruits wanting to come to ND.

GO IRISH!!!

 

[Vince Young]

Awesome summation, Tedwick.

People on here have obviously forgotten 2003 and 2004, the rock-bottom years for Notre Dame football. Yeah, USC beat us by 20 last night, but they had to make some incredible plays on offense (stopping our blitzes entirely, Jarrett's acrobatic catches), defense (relentless balls-out blitzing) and special teams (the onside kick return), and USC had to overcome several serious mistakes that almost turned the tide of the game along the way. USC had to work hard for this win, and they never really got a chance to relax until that onside kick.

Last year we played them tighter, but that was mainly because their defense wasn't nearly as good last year. USC's improved D proved to be the difference-maker this year.

Now compare last night to Ty's 3 games against USC... the Trojans barely had to break a sweat in those games! And we used to regularly lose "gimmes" to teams like Pitt, Syracuse and BYU on top of that!

Now we win the gimmes, and 4 of our 5 losses under Charlie have been to the top 3 teams. As for Michigan State, the past 2 years they've been a damn talented team cursed with a paranoid delusional maniac for a head coach... a coach who must've remembered to take his meds on game-day last year. So that loss isn't as terrible as it seemed either.

Charlie doesn't have this team where it needs to be yet, but we're playing harder and better than ever. We're looking at a 10-win season with a major bowl game still to be played, an improved record over last year, and the real possibility of another top-10 finish.

Charlie still has work to do, but there's already a lot to be happy about. I've never been one to mope around and cry "Hold me, I'm Irish!" This team has had a helluva run, and the best is yet to come.

"What tho' the odds..."

 

[Clotho]

Bull. Minter is a horrible coach and should go. He's not the man to lead us back, whether he has the horses or not. His defense will never be national title caliber. Never. It never has been and it won't ever be.

Gioia? Annoying, and deserving of whatever people said about him. A kicker is hardly part of the team anyway, and when he can't even KICK and legitimately handicaps the team, then he's certainly going to get torn apart.

You tell us you're tired of "fear, uncertainty and doubt" and then tell us to maintain perspective. Well, what is there to indicate that fear, uncertainty and doubt aren't concomitant with maintaining perspective right now? What leads YOU to believe that ND is going to get back to where they belong? It's all just hope.

I have the same hope, looking at our HC and our recruiting- but then I look at our recruiting on D, and our d coordinator, and fear, uncertainty and doubt creep back in. And I'm maintaining perspective. Right now ND is not a sure thing.

 

[Vince Young]

This message is hidden because Clotho is on your ignore list.

 

[PMac]

whats with this trying to "calm" everyone down thing. It will blow over soon.

 

[smerky]

Hey, we made it through the Faust era. ND will reign as NC's again.

 

[jerseyborn1971]

It is really only a few people who can't let go of their anger because this team had the audacity to actually lose 2 games and not win every other one by 30 points. Unfortunately, they feel it is there duty to try(in vain) to get everyone to agree with them no matter how much we indicate we do not agree.

I'm just going to put them on my ignore list because their constant dribble is getting boring.

 

[tedwick]

Quote:
This message is hidden because Clotho is on your ignore list.

pure bliss. : )

 

[jiggafini19]

People fail to accept that this is a very good team and not a great one. Yet. Then there are those on the board who do accept this, but are perceived as "negative." Some just see things for what they are, while others are belligerent and stupid. The belligerent and stupid don't back up their opinions with FACT. Just ranting. Those people I would recommend not paying attention to. However, if someone is going to provide facts that go deeper than "the defense sucks", I want to listen. We're all ND Football fans, but not everyone wants to ass lick and cheerlead nor does everyone want to find a reason to complain and say moronic things with no subsance to it.

I fail to see when and where it became wrong to talk football and tell it like it is by using facts. You can't have any sort of happy medium? Sink or swim, cheerlead or hate. You either cover it with sugar or spew bile. Sorry, but I just can't do either.

-Last year's sudden rise from 6-6 to 9-3, BCS created a lot of positive reaction. The preseason ranking of #2 got everyone hyped up. Most people bought in. This is an exciting time for Notre Dame right now, but the dust is settling on year two and we need to take a step back to re-evaluate some things. Take off the blue and gold glasses, take off your hater hat and look at this team, this program without positive or negative prejudices.

-As for the SC game, I've had a chance to look it over again and here is what I saw:

Talented WR within elite offenses kill ND's coverage. You can perceive it as soft coverage or bad scheming or whatever you want, but the last three teams to beat Notre Dame have exposed SOMETHING in the pass defense. Those three teams are currently 1, 2, 3 in America, however.

Notre Dame struggled to pressue John David Booty. The offense failed to convert two turnovers when Booty did manage to make a mistake.

The kicking game and kickoff coverage need improvement. You can't go for it on fourth down every time you venture into enemy territory. Touchbacks give your defense 80 yards to defend as opposed to, say, 60. Great football teams are simply not stud quarterbacks in high powered offenses. Defenses and special teams that are consistently above average or great will get you into national championship contention.

Far too many dropped passes, by two players in particular. Elite teams can't do this. Very good ones will get beat badly when they do it too much against an elite team.

Brady Quinn is truly All Day Tough. All things considered, I don't think you can blame him for the Ohio State, Michigan or USC losses.

The offensive line did a pretty decent job from game one to game 12. Next season, dare I say this, they'll be even BETTER despite losing four starters as a unit.

I thought the defense played hard. They had short fields to cover due to poor kickoff coverage and had several sudden changes due to failed fourth down conversions. Mike Richardson and Mo Crum played great games. Landri and Laws will be missed.

Whether you want to believe it or not, USC has a higher level of talent on their roster than Notre Dame does. Right now.

The time for Notre Dame is coming soon. I believe this. I think Weis will get another top ten class in 2007 and I think he'll get another one in 2008. Real difference makers are coming on offense, defense and special teams. The question is, how many of you are willing to wait for this talent to manifest itself?

 

[jerseyborn1971]

The Robot Genius' Evil Plan comes to full fruition in 2009. BWHAHA....BWHAHAHAH...BWHAAHA...BWHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH!

 

[scooper]

Does anybody think jigg's post is too long to make it my signature?

 

[pappy]

Scooper is on fire today.

 

[scooper]

Scooper is on fire today.

Uh uh. Coach Jigga gets all the props for this thread.

 

[domerfor life]

I watched the game Saturday. I was highly disappointed, but the fact of the matter is that we are not an elite team.....yet. We were overrated at the beginning of the season. That has been clear for a while now. This team had too many flaws to overcome (Oline play, lack of consistent pass rush, poor kickoffs, small and inexperienced linebackers, etc.). However, we just won 10 games this year. I'll take it. We were fighting like hell to win 6 games at one point and time. What really killed us against Michigan and SC wasn't the flaws listed above. It was the dropped passes that seem to show up in every game against a big time opponent. TD passes were dropped. Crucial 3rd and 4th down passes were dropped. The Darius fumble inside the 5. It was deflating. Brady Quinn is a freaking warrior. He will make millions in the upcoming years. If it wasn't for him, we would have got our doors blown off Saturday. I was disappointed that the defense came up with several key turnovers and we could not capitalize. Our kicking game hurt us Saturday. Against lesser opponents, it was not a factor. Against SC, it killed us. The kickoffs were short. Charlie didn't have any confidence in Goia. When you get inside the 35, you've got to come away with points. Any points. Anyway, ND is on the up and up. I haven't listen to any sports shows/ radio shows, because I don't want to hear the crap. They were overrated. Yes we know. Is this the first time a team has been overrated? No. Michigan was No. 3 in the country last year. Texas has lost 3 games. They were in the Top 5 at the beginning of the season, but only ND is the fraud? What about WVU? Whatever. ND will be good for years to come. It will be fun to watch and listen to all the gnashing of teeth. GO IRISH!!!

 

[njuneardave]

dont forget the UT vols last season, ranked #2 preseason!

 

[tedwick]

People fail to accept that this is a very good team and not a great one. Yet. Then there are those on the board who do accept this, but are perceived as "negative." Some just see things for what they are, while others are belligerent and stupid. The belligerent and stupid don't back up their opinions with FACT. Just ranting. Those people I would recommend not paying attention to. However, if someone is going to provide facts that go deeper than "the defense sucks", I want to listen. We're all ND Football fans, but not everyone wants to ass lick and cheerlead nor does everyone want to find a reason to complain and say moronic things with no subsance to it.

I fail to see when and where it became wrong to talk football and tell it like it is by using facts. You can't have any sort of happy medium? Sink or swim, cheerlead or hate. You either cover it with sugar or spew bile. Sorry, but I just can't do either.

When I started the thread, this wasn't the situation. People were starting "MINTER SUCKS!!! HIRE SO AND SO!!!" threads left and right. Someone called Gioia a loser. I saw people using BOB DAVIE commentary as evidence of why Weis isn't that good of a play caller. Stuff that bordered on the "we can't get the black athlete" comments of the AF coach last year. It was just getting ridiculous. I'm all for sensible discussion. It was just that the bitching and moaning after a tough loss was getting out of control. There were people that were sensible but negative, and for the most part, those comments were recieved openly by the board. On the other hand, there seemed to be an uprising of the "belligerent and stupid" posters after the USC loss, and I was annoyed. I'm sure you would be able to recognize the change in the board that happened after the SC loss.

That is all. : )

 

[domerfor life]

dont forget the UT vols last season, ranked #2 preseason!

Exactly. We finished 10-2, not 7-5 or 5-7 and we did not lose a game to a team we were supposed to beat. We lose two games to teams that we were picked to lose against and now we are frauds. Whatever, we are a good team who was overrated at the beginning of the season. We should be somewhere between 10-15. We had too many flaws to be a Top 5 team.

 

[njuneardave]

to my defense tedwick...

my post about black athletes and AF academy was a joke.

sarcasm is sometimes hard to portray on internet msg boards D=

 

[TexasDomer]

There are three phases, according to Holtz, that ND went through when he rebuilt them.

1. Become competitive in every game.
2. Believe you can win in every game.
3. Expect to win every game.

I think we are seeing progress along that continuum.

We all bought into the dream at the start of the year, and frankly we didn't know Michigan would be as good as it was, nor did we recognize that 9 returners from a mediocre defense isn't exactly a good thing.

10-2 is a good record, but the next step (after getting over our attrition next year) is for this team to beat the Michigans, OSUs and USCs of the world. I'm willing to give Charlie a mulligan for 2007 from the dreaded "win a NC in year 3" rule, but 2008 and 2009 should see us competing with and beating this caliber of team.

 

[tedwick]

to my defense tedwick...

my post about black athletes and AF academy was a joke.

sarcasm is sometimes hard to portray on internet msg boards D=

I was talking more about the "We need to loosen admissions standards and give inner city kids a chance, no matter what their grades are, if they're not criminals." I actually don't think i caught your post. But I wasn't referring to it here. I'm sure it was quite humorous : D

 

[jiggafini19]

I'm sure you would be able to recognize the change in the board that happened after the SC loss.

Not really.

It has been a lot of the same crap that I've been reading for the previous 11 games.

I will point out a shortcoming as quick as the next guy, but it is usually backed up by some type of substantial statement.

"Missing extra points and not having an accurate field goal kicker could be an issue in a close game."

"Goia sucks."

The frequent posters out here do a good job of making valid points that are supported by substantial, factual information. The regulars have something to say and that is who I listen to. I cut stupidity out of my diet.

 

[Clotho]

It's a football board. You don't want stupidity, go to a literature forum. These people are morons, for the most part. It's par for the course. They like to watch men run into each other real fast and throw a ball around. Most of them don't care about scheming or any of that, which is where the real interest is in football.

Of course you were probably referring to me, but then that's your own bit of stupidity.

 

[domerfor life]

It's a football board. You don't want stupidity, go to a literature forum. These people are morons, for the most part. It's par for the course. They like to watch men run into each other real fast and throw a ball around. Most of them don't care about scheming or any of that, which is where the real interest is in football.

Of course you were probably referring to me, but then that's your own bit of stupidity.

Once again....Clotho with a useless post. Dude you are the champion of adding nothing to a conversation. Keep up the good work.

 

[jiggafini19]

Of course you were probably referring to me, but then that's your own bit of stupidity.

Hey Clotho: it was a blanket statement to everyone. Don't flatter yourself because I can't read your posts unless someone like domerfor life doesn't have you on his ignore list like I do and includes your post in a reply.

This is proof right here that you're just going around looking to start shit. How can I "refer" to you when I can't even see your posts?

"A friend is one before whom I may think aloud." - Ralph Waldo Emerson

 

[domerfor life]

Hey Clotho: it was a blanket statement to everyone. Don't flatter yourself because I can't read your posts unless someone like domerfor life doesn't have you on his ignore list like I do and includes your post in a reply.

This is proof right here that you're just going around looking to start shit. How can I "refer" to you when I can't even see your posts?

"A friend is one before whom I may think aloud." - Ralph Waldo Emerson

How do I put him on my ignore list? Tell me please.

 

[jiggafini19]

All you do is go to the person's profile and it gives you the option. Check the name and save it.

 

[domerfor life]

All you do is go to the person's profile and it gives you the option. Check the name and save it.

Thanks. He's officially ignored.