Website of the Month: November 2004

[Irish Envy]

FireTyWillingham.com

From FireTyWillingham.com - "Let it be known that we still do not believe Ty is the right coach at Notre Dame. He will never win a national championship because of his lack of consistency and game-day preparedness. You need not look any further than the end of last year. The Irish won 3 games in a row (Navy, BYU, Stanford), and then got embarrassed the following week against Syracuse. This year, the Irish won 3 games in a row (Michigan, Mich St., Washington), and then got dominated the following week against Purdue."

IrishEnvy.com Comments - The domain was up for sale, but due to overwhelming response, FireTyWillingham.com will charge on! Be sure to check out the updated site with new pictures of "Fire Ty" signs on campus and more! Bookmark it now and visit often... I'm sure the Fire Ty talk is just now heating up!

URL: http://www.firetywillingham.com

 

[Irish1]

You can't be a good coach, let alone a great one if you have crappy players! we don't necessarily need the best "black" athletes, we need all around better athletes when what we have now...Yeah Ty can get fired.....but the same result will happen next year, Guaranteed!

 

[AlbuquerqueIrishFan]

You can't be a good coach, let alone a great one if you have crappy players! we don't necessarily need the best "black" athletes, we need all around better athletes when what we have now...Yeah Ty can get fired.....but the same result will happen next year, Guaranteed!

I hope you're wrong Irish1, but I suspect you're right and we will probably have a simalar season next year, no matter who the coach is.

I was really hoping that Ty would be able to recruit better athletes, specifically as an African American coach, I thought he could get better "Black" athletes, but I haven't really seen it. I like his principles, but I'd rather have wins at a cost of a few black eyes for the university. If you look at Nebraska and Florida State in the 90's, they had lots of bad publicity, but multiple national titles. The titles are what will be remembered and cemented in history, not the off the field incidents. Just my take.

 

[irishtexan10]

Are you guys crazy? We have great potential talent in a lot of players that just need good coaching! Some of these kids are still teenagers, and if they don't have a good coach they won't succeed.

 

[bmf175]

I agree with irishtexas10

I agree with irishtexas10

I agree with irishtexas10,

Notre Dame is not hurting for talent...there may be some weak points at some positions but nobody can complain about talent.

Brady Quinn who thinks he sucks...nobody, get a better coach and by his senior year he will be one of the best in college football.
Justin Tuck just broke the sacks record...enough said.
Mike Goolsby...Tennesse game enough said.
Anthony Fassano...Matt Shelton...Rhema Mcknight...Maurice Stovall...Ryan Grant...Darius Walker...Tom Zibokowski...Preston Jackson...Brandon Hoyte...Derek Curry all these players are very talented and can be great.

Whenever I look at any team in the top 10 play I always say Notre Dame has the same great talent. The different is being coached better. When I see that running back for OU run, I see O-lineman staying on their blocks I see a better blocking scheme, which comes from coaching. We have a talented O-line too.

Two of our defensive players recieved national recognition for defensive players of the week.

I beleive the fact is...Notre Dame has great potential and should be in the top 10 especially after beating Michigan and Tennesse, but we lost to BYU and BC why??? Because of bad coaching.

Michigan is the only game we won out of the two from good coaching Tennesse should have won. It was a lucky defesive play that saved Willingham.

 

[bmf175]

so much for quick reply

so much for quick reply

Next time Ill write a book.

 

[irishjay]

Haha..it was long, but dead on the money!

 

[Guest]

We still have some talent left especially from Ty's first class, but last years class was not up to ND standards, with this loss to Pitt and another one to USC we'll be lucky to crack the top 25 in recruiting this year. Our class is currently ranked 26th with about only 7 to 10 commits to go. Last years class one of ND's worst ranked 32nd in the country according to rivals, no one really had it in the top 25. Please fire TY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Vince Young]

Website of the month? Please... the guy who runs it is a poseur and a coward, judging from his response to my e-mail last week. I just sent him another one too, which I'll post here. Go ahead and compare what I actually wrote with what he'll probably claim I wrote...

=====

Subject: Here I go, doing your job for you...

There's a story floating around out there about Ty Willingham being interviewed after the Pittsburgh loss and basically responding to one question by nonchalantly stating that we're still guaranteed a winning record and that's that. It's out-of-context, so there could be more to it than on the surface, but on the surface it looks pretty bad. In fact, it's mentioned in one of the very stories you linked to from your site, and I figured you'd pounce on it and run with it. (And rightfully so, I might add. Nobody should be content with 6-5.)

Apparently, you don't even read the stories you link to.

See, that's why your website sucks. You seem utterly incapable of stringing together any sort of argument on your own for why Ty should be fired. All you do is read columns by people who agree with you and parrot their words for your list of reasons. And sometimes you can't even do THAT right.

You're also afraid of any ideas that disagree with yours. Hence your response to me last week, putting words in my mouth, ignoring my actual point, and replacing logic with insults... and being so brave too, splashing my name in boldface up at the top while your own name remains a bigger secret than the President's nuclear launch codes. Am I supposed to be impressed?

Unlike you, I have no fear of ideas I disagree with. That's why I discovered your site in the first place. That's why I read the articles you link to, the ones written by people who are actually capable of logical thought. And that's why even my patience for Ty is starting to wear thin... unlike you, I'm actually capable of admitting when I might be wrong. If Notre Dame went 12-0 next year (hey, I can dream...) I'd be cheering my lungs out. You? You'd still be quoting Ty's winning percentage as "only" .6875, 17th place all-time, and calling for his head. I'm certain of it.

Oh, and since you asked... next year's coach... Urban Meyer? I sure hope not. Gollee, his wide receiver corps sure was red-hot under Lou Holtz and Bob Davie during the golden Irish years of 1996-2000. And wow, what an impressive amount of head coaching experience, 4 whole years combined at Bowling Green and Utah. His 37-8 record against the mighty MAC and MWC conferences sure speaks for itself. And there's no shame in losing to Western Michigan, Miami of Ohio and Northern Illinois, or getting blown-out by powerhouses like South Florida (22-point loss) and Toledo (18-point loss). We can overlook all that, sure! He's the hottest thing since Enron!

As hostile as you were about Ty Willingham's pedigree, it floors me to see you salivating for Urban Meyer. Let him coach in a real conference for a couple of years, and then we'll see if he's really as good as the hype. Maybe he is the real thing, but he needs to prove it before we hand him the Irish coaching job. Otherwise, you're stuck with another Bob Davie or Ron Zook... both of whom also had questionable records as assistant coaches and lackluster head coach experience. Gee, sounds a lot like Urban Meyer. (To be fair, it sounds a lot like Ty as well.)

Alrighty, your turn again. Have fun twisting my words around on your website! Here, I'll even make it easy for you. "Ty Willingham is a f---ing genius." See, you can take it out of context and splash it up on your site, and you don't even have to do any real work!

Sincerely,
Vince Young

 

[irishbukkake]

< good post Mr. Young

Ty is a class act. If you give a high school coach 5 years then you should give Ty 5 years as well as he IS an established COLLEGE coach. We don't have a program like Colorado and Ohio State which are tainted with misconduct.

Any University can bring in talented criminals ( ie. - Miami) and promise them grades cars and girls.......but we have more than that. Coach Willingham raised the bar for what student athletes should be - why is that not something to be proud of.

Wins come and go - HONOR LASTS FOREVER

 

[Vince Young]

Actually, I have to disagree with you on the 5-year thing. People over on ESPN keep saying that if Bob Davie got 5 years, then Ty should've gotten 5 years. Well, why should we have given Bob Davie 5 years to begin with? Heck, if a coach goes 0-11 in their first year and loses every game by at least 20, I'd say you need to fire them after 1 year.

Nobody is entitled to X number of years to coach. You have to earn it. I felt that the victories over Michigan and Tennessee and the improved offense earned Ty a 4th year, albeit with the expectation of a much better record. Obviously, the trustees at Notre Dame felt differently. And while I like Ty, I can't say that I'm all that broken up over his departure. Heck, even TY doesn't seem that upset. In his press conference today, he pointed out that his main job as coach was to win, and he wasn't winning.

Honor is fine. Heck, honor is wonderful. But honor doesn't have to come at the expense of winning. See Knute, Ara and Lou. The ideal coach is one who upholds the honor of Notre Dame AND wins football games. And we can find a coach like that again if we look hard enough.

Good luck, Ty. Make good use of the lessons you learned in South Bend, and hopefully you'll get it right next time. And to the nameless coward behind FTW.com, I hope you don't sprain your shoulder from patting yourself on the back.

 

[NDLyght37]

I think Ty deserved 4 years. No more no less, but you can't evaluate his performance when he hasn't had a full recruiting class to work with. As good as Quinn & Walker have been this year, they would be that much better next year.

Ty will land on his feet, I just hope that ND doesn't make a mistake in hiring Meyer. Meyer is a great coach...but if he's 21-15 after 3 years, will we treat him the same as we have treated Willingham?

The House Of LaPhonso...est. 1990

 

[Vince Young]

In Ty's case, I agree: he deserved a 4th year and a chance to finish what he started.

But does EVERY coach deserve 4 years? No. If the guy goes 0-11 his first season and loses every game by 30, then that 1 year is more than enough to "evaluate his performance." I'm not going give him "a full recruiting class to work with." I'm gonna fire his ass.

 

[Irish Envy]

I think Ty deserved 4 years. No more no less, but you can't evaluate his performance when he hasn't had a full recruiting class to work with. As good as Quinn & Walker have been this year, they would be that much better next year.

Ty will land on his feet, I just hope that ND doesn't make a mistake in hiring Meyer. Meyer is a great coach...but if he's 21-15 after 3 years, will we treat him the same as we have treated Willingham?

The House Of LaPhonso...est. 1990

Excellent points.

 

[AlbuquerqueIrishFan]

< good post Mr. Young

Ty is a class act. If you give a high school coach 5 years then you should give Ty 5 years as well as he IS an established COLLEGE coach. We don't have a program like Colorado and Ohio State which are tainted with misconduct.

Any University can bring in talented criminals ( ie. - Miami) and promise them grades cars and girls.......but we have more than that. Coach Willingham raised the bar for what student athletes should be - why is that not something to be proud of.

Wins come and go - HONOR LASTS FOREVER

I think you have a point here, but it doesn't mean that I wouldn't accept a few off field incidents and black eyes for the university if it meant the program was a national power again. Florida State and Nebraska had many incidents in the 90's that embarassed their programs, but they also collected multiple national titles and that's what will be remembered. That's what will go down in history. With that said, I'd love to win and have good kids too. I like to play both sides, you know.

 

[NDLyght37]

In Ty's case, I agree: he deserved a 4th year and a chance to finish what he started.

But does EVERY coach deserve 4 years? No. If the guy goes 0-11 his first season and loses every game by 30, then that 1 year is more than enough to "evaluate his performance." I'm not going give him "a full recruiting class to work with." I'm gonna fire his ass.

True. With Ty I think the 10-2 in year one might have actually hurt him. I'm not sure if he's a 10-2 coach, but I know he's not a 5-6 coach (I mean he took Stanford to the Rose Bowl...Stanford...lol). The real Ty is probably a solid 8-4, 9-3 coach. A solid but not spectacular coach that graduates kids & gets into bowl games almost every year...and once in a while (every 3 years or so), he has that 10 or 11 win season.

The question is, is that enough these days?

I think Meyer will be a good fit, but with our schedule and our lack of overall team speed can we realistically expect to be in BCS games every year?

 

[irishbukkake]

if you give Bob Davie and Gerry Faust 5 years then why not Ty?? So I white high school coach can do even worse than Ty, but he still gets 5 years.....


furthermore Ty's first recruit class werent even seniors yet

 

[Vince Young]

if you give Bob Davie and Gerry Faust 5 years then why not Ty??

Rather than asking whether Ty had enough time, why isn't anyone asking if Faust and Davie had too MUCH time?

 

[NDLyght37]

Rather than asking whether Ty had enough time, why isn't anyone asking if Faust and Davie had too MUCH time?

That's a very, very good question. But again, the rebuttal is, if you gave those guys 5 years, why couldn't you have given Ty 4 years?

 

[Vince Young]

...and in Ty's case, I agree he'd earned a 4th year. But he didn't earn it just by signing a contract for at least 4 years.

What I'm questioning is the idea that a coach - ANY coach - is entitled to X number of years. All a coach is entitled to is that their contract be honored.

And no, firing someone 3 years into a 5-year contract does not mean that you're not honoring the contract, despite what some on here seem to think. As long as Notre Dame follows whatever clause in the contract deals with early termination, they are honoring the contract every bit as much as if they'd let Ty stay for 5 years.

And we can argue back and forth all night on this (Faust shoulda gotten 1 more year! Davie shoulda been fired after 3! Tastes great! Less filling!), but the bottom line is that if Ty had won more games, he wouldn't have been fired on Tuesday.

Heck, I'll go ahead and dive into the race issue now... let's say Kevin White is secretly a flaming racist. If you're Ty and you don't want to get fired, the first thing you need to do is keep Kevin White from having an excuse. That way, he can't fire you without exposing himself. But instead, Ty handed Kevin White a 6-5 record on a silver platter. Excuse served. Here's your pink slip, and buh-bye.

If Ty wins just 1 game more (BYU, Boston College, Pittsburgh, take your pick), then they're 7-4 and going to, say, the Gator Bowl, and today we're sitting here still arguing about whether or not it's time to fire Ty, while Ty is prepping his team for the bowl and working on recruiting for next year.

But he didn't.

"I've finally found the reason. Now I need an excuse."

-Days Of The New, "Touch, Peel & Stand"

 

[NDLyght37]

Valid points as always...but it's very frustrating to see how it all went down (especially since now it looks like we lost Meyer).

Unless someone like Gruden or Tedford walks through the door, White may be the next person who needs to be relieved of his job.

 

[Vince Young]

...White may be the next person who needs to be relieved of his job.

Now THAT, my friend, is intriguing. Kevin White is essentially the General Manager of Notre Dame. He has consistently fumbled away opportunities at premeire coaches by letting other teams out-maneuver him. I'm kinda glad he let Urban Meyer slip away, actually, since I wasn't convinced he was the go-to guy. But it's the WAY he let him slip away, trying to lure him in with just the shine of the Golden Dome while Florida's GM went, "Pssst! Urban! Whatever he's offering, we'll double it." And now he's lost several days to go after, say, Norm Chow at USC. (The more I read about him, the more I like what I'm reading.)

Just like there comes a time to stop blaming the players and to blame the coach, there comes a time to stop blaming the coach and to blame the GM...

 

[NDLyght37]

Exactly, this makes two coaching searches in a row that were PR nightmares.

Not only does he create a situation that is bad for whoever gets the job, but he makes an atmosphere that makes coaches not want to come to South Bend.

Do you think Tedford or Gruden or Chow or even Hawkins would come here knowing that they might only have 3 years to implement their offense with a team that still has players that were recruited to run the option offense?

Combine that with the scheduling,the academic standards, and an AD that still thinks that we are "The University of College Football in America"...and you have problems.

 

[Guest]

http://donthiredanhawkins.com/

Boise State is scared we'll steal him.