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LOVEMYIRISH

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man alive it seems like you ignore that which does not fit your argument...

1.) yes it has... In Mexico and in tax payer funded clinics all over select states
2.) Yes he has, multiple times
3.) I couldn't care less how ultra liberal policies go over in an ultra liberal state... that's like the far right talking up how well anti gun control policies work in Texas

He has funded clinics that ALSO perform abortions, but he has not forced any to do them.

sorry LMI... you should know I have a ton of respect for you, but this is obviously a agree to disagree situation... I also feel stating the far left is to the anti church as the far right is to the KKK is a gross over reach on your part... but maybe that's jut me lol

You said "radical" I countered with "radical". Not an over-reach, just framing the discussion. If you want to talk about radical left, I am fine with that...but they are not in power, just like the KKK isn't in power.
 

IrishAddiction

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yup, kennedy, hillory clinton, and obama are the ambassador boys of staying near the middle of the political spectrum. hahaha.
 

LOVEMYIRISH

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yup, kennedy, hillory clinton, and obama are the ambassador boys of staying near the middle of the political spectrum. hahaha.

no one ever said that...they are liberal but they are not radical.

Radical leftists would be the Communists. Radical Right would be the Nazis.

In our country, PETA would be radical left in many ways and the KKK would be radical right.
 

IrishAddiction

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actually the nazis never liked religion, guns, or life either so lets place them and hitler in the left along with stalin and mussolini. communism is definately on the left. what type of government is the far extreme right.....probably more along the lines of anarchy. (some would consider it being self sustainable, but you do need SOME government to sustain safety). im not a neocon, but im definately not on the left.

trust me, those in power are far left, even if they try playing that they are in the middle.
 

ACamp1900

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actually the nazis never liked religion, guns, or life either so lets place them and hitler in the left along with stalin and mussolini. communism is definately on the left. what type of government is the far extreme right.....probably more along the lines of anarchy. (some would consider it being self sustainable, but you do need SOME government to sustain safety). im not a neocon, but im definately not on the left.

trust me, those in power are far left, even if they try playing that they are in the middle.

I agree, Obama has a major chip towards anything even remotely right imo... here is one of MANY examples...

the day after the tea parties Obama claimed he hadn't even been aware that such a thing was being planned let alone happened...


wtf?! that means one of two things

A.) You and your advisors are so inept that you don't even know when thousands protest your policies in cities across the country... an admission that in my mind would be proper grounds to question his ability to serve as Commander and Chief... OR

B.) He has such massive embitterment towards anything even slightly right that he would actually go on air and make himself sound like option A rather than simply admit a lot of people don't like his economic "ideals" and that those people might just have something worth listening to...


I can think of no other reason for him to say anything like that... and either option is quite scary
 

IrishAlum1997

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No, a bit extreme is putting yourself in a position to share associations (William Ayers) with a Venezuelan dictator.
 

Junkhead

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A.) You and your advisors are so inept that you don't even know when thousands protest your policies in cities across the country... an admission that in my mind would be proper grounds to question his ability to serve as Commander and Chief... OR

George W. Bush anyone?
 

ACamp1900

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George W. Bush anyone?

blaming past admins for current foul ups????


Obama is that you?


And I would say Bush never pretended to not notice the other side, he just flat gave it the finger... both actions are pretty bad when it comes from the Oval Office, but at least Bush acknowledged the left before dissing it
 
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Junkhead

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blaming past admins for current foul ups????

Just like all the Bushbots with their b..b...but Clinton's all those years. No matter what, most people have made up their mind, and no amount of reason can change it. I thought Bush was a bumbling moron who put us back decades on the world stage. I voted for Obama, since McCain is too old and out of touch. Obama has not impressed me that much so far, and I won't try and defend him. Eight years of foul ups however, is a different story. I can and have voted republican, democrat, independent, etc. I'm sick of the party line fools who can't think for themselves.
 

Honey Nut Irish

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All people think about is, "the right this...", "the left that." Its this polarized mentality that is dragging this country down. Nobody thinks for themselves anymore.
 

LOVEMYIRISH

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actually the nazis never liked religion, guns, or life either so lets place them and hitler in the left along with stalin and mussolini. communism is definately on the left. what type of government is the far extreme right.....probably more along the lines of anarchy. (some would consider it being self sustainable, but you do need SOME government to sustain safety). im not a neocon, but im definately not on the left.

trust me, those in power are far left, even if they try playing that they are in the middle.
Fascism (Nazis) is to the extreme right. Communism is to the left.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/b/b0/Political-spectrum-multiaxis.png

The extreme right is not about anarchy, it's not about political freedom, it's about economic freedom and cultural and political control/order.

Here's a fun little test:
The Political Compass - Test
 

LOVEMYIRISH

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No, a bit extreme is putting yourself in a position to share associations (William Ayers) with a Venezuelan dictator.

Bill Ayers is a well respected professor at UIC...it's not surprising that someone like Obama would associate with him.

He is now a professor in the College of Education at the University of Illinois at Chicago, holding the titles of Distinguished Professor of Education and Senior University Scholar.

What associations with a Venezuelan dictator did Obama have???
 

IrishAlum1997

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IrishAlum1997 - Do you know who I was responding to?

No, no clue. Just trying to incite you. Either of the 2 previous posts to yours would have been relevant to my response. I presumed you were responding to the one immediately preceding yours, as it was 4 minutes later and not quoted, vs. the post an hour earlier.
 

LOVEMYIRISH

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You mean the way his Presidency was put together by NBC and CNN... pot meet kettle

Nothing is filled with more hypocrisy than the Keith Obermans of the world crying about political slants....

Olberman is a commentator, like Hannity. They are just on opposite ends.

When Reporters are listed as sponsors of Tea Parties...and the News Organization itself is promoting them...then it's THEIR Tea Party.

And to say CNN engineered the election is laughable...if they could, then Bush would have been a 1 term President...or 0 terms for that matter.
 

ACamp1900

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To say Obama actions towards the tea parties has been anything but child like is equally so
 

ACamp1900

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And sorry, no CNBC, NBC, CNN, LA Times, NY Times, Boston Globe etc. and there is no President Obama...


fact. They banded together and handed the ticket to him and a silver plater, crushed Hilary and then helped mold a perfect image of their chosen one while McCain ran a piss poor election...


and yes Hannity is shameless and his show is horrific... I will not and have not defended this nations far right
 
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LOVEMYIRISH

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To say Obama actions towards the tea parties has been anything but child like is equally so

I think it was politically calculated for sure. But given that less people attend Tea Parties than say "Earth Day" and the Tea Parties got more coverage, they are very much a politically orchestrated event thus getting a political response.
 

LOVEMYIRISH

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And sorry, no CNBC, NBC, CNN, LA Times, NY Times, Boston Globe etc. and there is no President Obama...


fact. They banded together and handed the ticket to him and a silver plater, crushed Hilary and then helped mold a perfect image of their chosen one while McCain ran a piss poor election...

Oh please.

Maybe 8 years of failed policies and a promise to keep them in place caused that...
 

ACamp1900

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I think it was politically calculated for sure. But given that less people attend Tea Parties than say "Earth Day" and the Tea Parties got more coverage, they are very much a politically orchestrated event thus getting a political response.


I agree to that, but his response to me was more of a microcosm of his entire stance towards the right... It bugged me with Bush and it bugs me now... espec. since both pledged to break down party lines...and to downplay 1 million as smaller than earth day and not respecting a legit response is foolish

Obama has had hundreds of opportunites to give credit to Bush, say for preventing another attack after 9/11... but he dodges it and then immediately spews venom at the the past admin... He has done this many times already... Bush destroyed education and fucked up in Iraq and in forigen affairs... but he did do some good too... I speak from the middle that it would go a long way to hear Obama burry the whole thing and get to work... Instead he has often displayed a vindictive attitude towards anything not far left
 
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ACamp1900

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Oh please.

Maybe 8 years of failed policies and a promise to keep them in place caused that...

Someone didn't watch the Democratic Conventions and debates... that was the biggest fix ever... and I actually like(d) Obama in contrast to Hilary... as if the week long celebration all across the NBC networks weren't enough... but I'll side with IA97 again... anyone who says the media didn't play a MAJOR factor in the past election is wearing serious blinders my friend
 
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LOVEMYIRISH

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Someone didn't watch the Democratic Conventions and debates... that was the biggest fix ever... and I actually like(d) Obama in contrast to Hilary... as if the week long celebration all across the NBC networks weren't enough... but I'll side with IA97 again... anyone who says the media didn't play a MAJOR factor in the past election is wearing serious blinders my friend
Every election cycle I hear they are swinging the election, yet it's been shown that more NEGATIVE press came out on Obama rather than Hillary or McCain.

McCain was a Press celeb. They LOVED him. McCain was the poster child for whom the press wanted. Hell, he was even leading...until the economy took a shit and people asked him "What are you going to do?" His responses were clearly inadequate.

Then his campaign was run like a joke...an utter joke.

When you have guys like Joe the Plumber campaigning for you...You have a major problem.
When you pick Palin over Romney/Giuliani/etc...You have a major problem.
When they economy is taking a huge slide and you say it's fundamentally sound...You have a major problem.
When your policy edict to a long term energy solution and independence from the Middle East is "Drill baby, drill."...You have a major problem.
When your response to people's concerns (including MANY Evangelical Christians) about global warming is to make a joke about Al Gore...You have a major problem.
When people at your rallies response to US Sponsored increasing Terrorist recruiting is to wear a shirt saying "I'd rather be waterboarding."...You have a major problem. [McCain was always against torture by the way]
When your party's response to FIXING illegal immigration is "Sen them all home...You have a major problem.
When your party automatically calls hardvard/Yale grads "elitist" if they disagree with you...You have a major problem.
When your response to bringing home the troops in Iraq is that we could be there 100 years and that "would be fine with me"...You have a major problem.
When your running mates talks about being against a well-known Pork-Barrel project, BUT TAKES THE MONEY ANYWAY...You have a major problem.


These were public issues that bothered centrists and the educated. Bush won college educated voters by 4 points...McCain lost them by 6. PhDs and people making over $200,000/year? Obama by doube-digits. The GOP over the past 10 years has mocked intellectuals, eschewed science, and has spent more time villifying enemies and making up threats, rather than offering vision and direction.

This is in no way saying that Obama's campaign did not have issues. Clearly they did...every campaign does. But to blame the media for convincing people that the last 8 years went badly AND that another 4 years might not be the best thing...well, that's not exactly the media's fault.

Why did Reagan win? A compelling vision and a promise of a better tomorrow.
Why did Clinton win? A compelling vision and a promise of a better tomorrow.
Why did Obama win? A compelling vision and a promise of a better tomorrow.

Offer a vision that is not "anti" but "pro" and you are onto something. Bush tried to offer that in 2000 and people were tired of Clinton, so they moved to Bush...he was no Reagan/Clinton/Obama...but he still offered something:
- Lower spending
- Less government
- No more Nation Building
- Tighten up the border
- Protect personal freedoms
- Revamp Social Security
- Lower Healthcare costs

People bought that hook line and sinker.
 

Junkhead

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Obama has had hundreds of opportunites to give credit to Bush, say for preventing another attack after 9/11...

Preventing ANOTHER attack like the first that happened on his watch when they ignored the warnings. What a hero. lol
 

LOVEMYIRISH

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Preventing ANOTHER attack like the first that happened on his watch when they ignored the warnings. What a hero. lol

In fairness, I think Bush has gone to great lengths to protect the country and has done what he thought was best. It's clear in many cases he got some bad advice, however, in some cases he got good advice and followed through.

Pre-9/11 Bush did not appreciate National Security and his inaction ensured that 9/11 would happen. He might have been able to stop it, he might not have. If Gore had come into office and continued with the Clinton plan to "Roll Back Al Qaeda"...MAYBE things would have been different. Maybe not. So hard to say.

Bush definitely failed nearly all of his National Security tests before 9/11. After 9/11 it's a mixed bag.
 

Junkhead

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In fairness, I think Bush has gone to great lengths to protect the country and has done what he thought was best. It's clear in many cases he got some bad advice, however, in some cases he got good advice and followed through.

Pre-9/11 Bush did not appreciate National Security and his inaction ensured that 9/11 would happen. He might have been able to stop it, he might not have. If Gore had come into office and continued with the Clinton plan to "Roll Back Al Qaeda"...MAYBE things would have been different. Maybe not. So hard to say.

Bush definitely failed nearly all of his National Security tests before 9/11. After 9/11 it's a mixed bag.

I can't argue that. He lost any support from me when he began to ignore the real problem and focus on Iraq though.
 
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