This is what we are missing

[MeanGreen]

Watching the USC/UCLA game and the SEC championship game last night proved to me one more time what we have been missing. Position competition and leadership. In the USC game they were talking about one of USC LB that had to wait 3 years behind last years starter Rivers. The guy is going to be a first or second pick in this years draft and he sat for 3 years. He sat and probably learned his position better and had the benefit of watching a future first round draft pick play. Image if any of our sophomores, who contributed greatly to this team, were able to sit, watch, and learn from an upperclassmen. They guy doesn't have to be a future first round nfl pick, but someone who plays had every play. In the 'Bama game, after their freshmen RB had a difficult time hitting the holes the line made, Saban took him out and went with the senior. Next time that back got in on Bama last TD, he ran straight through the holes and did not dance sides ways behind the line looking for something better. Could CW have taken any of our O-linemen out the past two years when they were not performing up to their potential. Nope, could not have done that with the DB's or D-Linemen either. He could have done that, but replacing one sophomore or first year starter for another, really does not do anyone any good. Until we get not only depth, but quality depth we will always have the problem of throwing the babes to the wolves. Just as CW has had on the job training to be a head coach, many of our players have had OJT on how to play the position in college FB. If our recruiting classes are as good as advertising then we need to start developing them and creating competition for every position.

 

[phgreek]

That makes alot of sense...

As it stands we do not have alot of threads to a good pedigree at any position (maybe tight end...Fasano, Carlson, Yeatman). ...in a sense the last two years (rather lack of talent and leadership or coaching is the cause) have created a huge Chasm between guys that could play, and those who play today. We are really a new football program. Will they re-establish a new pedigree in the winning tradition?

Next year is pivotal for this program...will these Sophs become the leaders we are all hoping to see. If not recruiting will fall off because as nice as it is to have a chance to play in the national spotlight right out of the gate, nobody wants to have their nose shoved in shit every week on national TV.

 

[MeanGreen]

You are correct phgreek, if the guys that have been pushed around for 2 years now, don't start pushing back or demanding more from their teammates, I am not sure where this program will end up.

 

[NDMontana]

Watching the USC/UCLA game and the SEC championship game last night proved to me one more time what we have been missing. Position competition and leadership. In the USC game they were talking about one of USC LB that had to wait 3 years behind last years starter Rivers. The guy is going to be a first or second pick in this years draft and he sat for 3 years. He sat and probably learned his position better and had the benefit of watching a future first round draft pick play. Image if any of our sophomores, who contributed greatly to this team, were able to sit, watch, and learn from an upperclassmen. They guy doesn't have to be a future first round nfl pick, but someone who plays had every play. In the 'Bama game, after their freshmen RB had a difficult time hitting the holes the line made, Saban took him out and went with the senior. Next time that back got in on Bama last TD, he ran straight through the holes and did not dance sides ways behind the line looking for something better. Could CW have taken any of our O-linemen out the past two years when they were not performing up to their potential. Nope, could not have done that with the DB's or D-Linemen either. He could have done that, but replacing one sophomore or first year starter for another, really does not do anyone any good. Until we get not only depth, but quality depth we will always have the problem of throwing the babes to the wolves. Just as CW has had on the job training to be a head coach, many of our players have had OJT on how to play the position in college FB. If our recruiting classes are as good as advertising then we need to start developing them and creating competition for every position.

Competition doesn't make you run any faster and the real differences I saw between ND and USC were speed....and blocking.

 

[NeuteredDoomer]

You are correct phgreek, if the guys that have been pushed around for 2 years now, don't start pushing back or demanding more from their teammates, I am not sure where this program will end up.

The word "push" and football don't mix. Kinda like saying "gently destroy."

Friggen attack kneecaps and concuss a friggen mofo.

Eat venison and throw away the leftovers to your un-nostriled pup.

Oh shit. I'm Bambi, and PETA is parked outside in a pink car full of kittys.

Wait. I'm KERMIT. Quit looking at my legs. Too many relatives have lost theirs and been found on PETA member plates at expensive restaurants.

Shit. Painkiller kickin in....


teehee

 

[NDMontana]

The word "push" and football don't mix. Kinda like saying "gently destroy."

Friggen attack kneecaps and concuss a friggen mofo.

Eat venison and throw away the leftovers to your un-nostriled pup.

Oh shit. I'm Bambi, and PETA is parked outside in a pink car full of kittys.

Wait. I'm KERMIT. Quit looking at my legs. Too many relatives have lost theirs and been found on PETA member plates at expensive restaurants.

Shit. Painkiller kickin in....


teehee

Thank God we're not the Fighting Frenchies (frog eating sons a bitches). You would hate ND.

 

[mooneytostle]

Speed is not the problem

 

[mooneytostle]

This year, what "we've been missing," was proper instruction to an offensive line. While it may be true that there are depth issues on the team, that does not excuse the fact that Notre Dame's offensive line is full of highly recruited/sought after players and they can't push an undersized Syracuse D-line around. These players are poorly coached, on both the Offensive and Defensive Lines, as well as other areas of the team. (i.e. WR blocking / route running). I can't wait for the day until Notre Dame is not forced to rely on freshman and sophomores for depth (let alone significant playing time), but that problem is secondary to the entire team not being taught fundamentals of football. If John Latina is still the line coach next year and he continues to coach/teach the same way - there is no reason why we will be any better than we were this year - despite there being more depth and experience.

 

[mooneytostle]

Watching the USC/UCLA game and the SEC championship game last night proved to me one more time what we have been missing. Position competition and leadership. In the USC game they were talking about one of USC LB that had to wait 3 years behind last years starter Rivers. The guy is going to be a first or second pick in this years draft and he sat for 3 years. He sat and probably learned his position better and had the benefit of watching a future first round draft pick play. Image if any of our sophomores, who contributed greatly to this team, were able to sit, watch, and learn from an upperclassmen. They guy doesn't have to be a future first round nfl pick, but someone who plays had every play. In the 'Bama game, after their freshmen RB had a difficult time hitting the holes the line made, Saban took him out and went with the senior. Next time that back got in on Bama last TD, he ran straight through the holes and did not dance sides ways behind the line looking for something better. Could CW have taken any of our O-linemen out the past two years when they were not performing up to their potential. Nope, could not have done that with the DB's or D-Linemen either. He could have done that, but replacing one sophomore or first year starter for another, really does not do anyone any good. Until we get not only depth, but quality depth we will always have the problem of throwing the babes to the wolves. Just as CW has had on the job training to be a head coach, many of our players have had OJT on how to play the position in college FB. If our recruiting classes are as good as advertising then we need to start developing them and creating competition for every position.

This year, what "we've been missing," was proper instruction to an offensive line. While it may be true that there are depth issues on the team, that does not excuse the fact that Notre Dame's offensive line is full of highly recruited/sought after players and they can't push an undersized Syracuse D-line around. These players are poorly coached, on both the Offensive and Defensive Lines, as well as other areas of the team. (i.e. WR blocking / route running). I can't wait for the day until Notre Dame is not forced to rely on freshman and sophomores for depth (let alone significant playing time), but that problem is secondary to the entire team not being taught fundamentals of football. If John Latina is still the line coach next year and he continues to coach/teach the same way - there is no reason why we will be any better than we were this year - despite there being more depth and experience.

 

[KeepItCatholic]

i agree with the speed post, we need to get our guys on the agility and speed training work outs. Speed kills, a simple but true statement, we must play with longer grass than the SEC teams because they look like they are in fast forward (while at times i checked my tv because our screening offense was clearly going in reverse lol) but speed speed speed and willingness to sell out at all times, is what we need to regain the powerhouse lore in which we once were. oh and of course replace jc with crist, i mean think of the headlining capabilities Crist our Saviour, enough said, (Do not pronounce like Christ)

 

[mooneytostle]

i also want to add that i think Brown/Tenuta did a pretty good job considering the lack of talent they have on the D-Line. That unit should be greatly improved next year.

 

[NDMontana]

Speed is not the problem

Nearly everyone on this board noticed that we had a derth of speed in comparison to USC. You must be right though.

In fact, you should be the head coach. You seem to think that you have the all answers.

 

[NDMontana]

i also want to add that i think Brown/Tenuta did a pretty good job considering the lack of talent they have on the D-Line. That unit should be greatly improved next year.

Here's Blue and Gold's ratings for the "greatly improved" d-line that you see:
BlueandGold.com

 

[phork]

The defense would have shown more improvement if we had actually not gone 3 and out on every series the last half of the season.

 

[goldandblue]

that is true Phork. You can only expect so much from a defense if they are on the field the entire game.

 

[nd1988]

The defense would have shown more improvement if we had actually not gone 3 and out on every series the last half of the season.

Agree to that!!!!

 

[phork]

But I do have to say that the speed difference between ND and some of these top programs is mind blowing.

 

[mick2]

depth is definately the biggest reason we have struggled especially late in the season.

with our restrictions it takes a few years to build the depth of a usc,bama, or florida, we dont have the luxury of jucos or lower sats and gpas.

 

[mooneytostle]

But I do have to say that the speed difference between ND and some of these top programs is mind blowing.

we aren't as fast as USC. true. But players look much faster on both sides of the ball when the lines are dominating. Our linebackers and secondary have to play timid knowing that the defensive line isn't going to stop the opposing running back coming through the line. Our running backs don't hit the holes hard b/c there are no holes to hit. It almost seems the creativity has been coached out of them or something. I'm not disagreeing with you, there are definitely teams that have more speed, but I don't think we are as far off as everyone might believe.

Having said that, I have no confidence that our line play will be any better next year and I fear we will look exactly the same.

 

[dre1919]

When I was watching the $EC title game, they showed that clip of Tim Tebow apologizing for their ONE loss of the season to Ole Miss. He was going on and on about how he was personally sorry, and that the country and Gator Nation would never see a team come together, or work as hard, as this team would from that point forward. My wife saw it and said "What did he do?", half-expecting me to say he stole a car or did something to disgrace the program. "Lost a game" was my reply. "Lost a game?" she said. "Yep". That's how they roll there and THAT is what I think we are missing. It's the culture of winning that we don't have anymore. To Florida, one or two losses is a disaster of a season the likes of which their QB, who is a helluva player and leader (see the bloody nose pics from the FSU game and soon to be back to back Heismans) has to apologize for. We've come to expect this team to lose in a way in which we sit back and grit our teeth, waiting for the moment the bottom drops out. True success, to me, is so distant now that when we play a "real" team I get nervous, waiting for the blowout to begin. I hope that it doesn't come, and that we play well and look like a quality program, but it's no where near the level of confidence a team like Florida or USC when they play another ranked team. They expect to win, and win well. They will accept nothing less.

 

[KeepItCatholic]

our defense actually looked decent against USC at times, they got two stops in a row and got our offense the ball back and we went three and out, after the third straight stop by ND i turned to my friend and said they wont be able to hold again if we go three and out, after we gave the ball right back USC ran in for a TD, the defense was steadily improving but we need a lot of work and like i always say, speeeeeeeeeeeeed

 

[Irish Rogue]

You look on the USC side, you have Cushing/Clay Matthews kid, these guys play balls out. That is what ND needs. They play like Tazmanian devils. We should not miss out on landing these types at ND.

 

[realitycheck]

Clay Matthews Jr. came in as a walk-on too, even more impressive

 

[NeuteredDoomer]

depth is definately the biggest reason we have struggled especially late in the season.

with our restrictions it takes a few years to build the depth of a usc,bama, or florida, we dont have the luxury of jucos or lower sats and gpas.

Probably the biggest problem. Good points all over this thread.

 

[NeuteredDoomer]

...Our running backs don't hit the holes hard b/c there are no holes to hit. It almost seems the creativity has been coached out of them or something...

Sure seems like it sometimes.

Reminds me of a funny coach quote:

"Give me a world class athlete, and I'll coach him down to good"

lol

 

[Irishkid23]

Calabrese

Calabrese

You look on the USC side, you have Cushing/Clay Matthews kid, these guys play balls out. That is what ND needs. They play like Tazmanian devils. We should not miss out on landing these types at ND.

I think Carlo Calabrese is one of those players.

 

[Irish Rogue]

I think Carlo Calabrese is one of those players.

He is a great pick up. Let's hope they properly develop Posluzney as well, his brother Paul is an insane player.

 

[ND.SB]

When I was watching the $EC title game, they showed that clip of Tim Tebow apologizing for their ONE loss of the season to Ole Miss. He was going on and on about how he was personally sorry, and that the country and Gator Nation would never see a team come together, or work as hard, as this team would from that point forward. My wife saw it and said "What did he do?", half-expecting me to say he stole a car or did something to disgrace the program. "Lost a game" was my reply. "Lost a game?" she said. "Yep". That's how they roll there and THAT is what I think we are missing. It's the culture of winning that we don't have anymore. To Florida, one or two losses is a disaster of a season the likes of which their QB, who is a helluva player and leader (see the bloody nose pics from the FSU game and soon to be back to back Heismans) has to apologize for. We've come to expect this team to lose in a way in which we sit back and grit our teeth, waiting for the moment the bottom drops out. True success, to me, is so distant now that when we play a "real" team I get nervous, waiting for the blowout to begin. I hope that it doesn't come, and that we play well and look like a quality program, but it's no where near the level of confidence a team like Florida or USC when they play another ranked team. They expect to win, and win well. They will accept nothing less.

I cannot agree with you more. I HATE the Gators-but I deeply respect Tebow after that. Dude has class and leadership... If I didn't know any better I would've thought he was playing at ND with a leadership spirit like that..just to hear him talk.
ND is on its way. I have no doubts. FL and USC have a rude awakening coming...

 

[phork]

I cannot agree with you more. I HATE the Gators-but I deeply respect Tebow after that. Dude has class and leadership... If I didn't know any better I would've thought he was playing at ND with a leadership spirit like that..just to hear him talk.
ND is on its way. I have no doubts. FL and USC have a rude awakening coming...

No doubts? Did you watch the games this year?

 

[ND.SB]

No doubts? Did you watch the games this year?

I have no doubts that they're on their way. I'm not going to overstate what they're going to do in 09-however, they're getting better-NO DOUBTS ABOUT THAT. USC empire will fall-and the world will make sense again...

CW and the coaching staff has 09 to do something-if it doesn't happen, all the peeps that don't like CW and the staff will be happy-because they're going to be out of there. I got faith in him though...give it one more year.