Hatin' on Ambiguity, Why ND is Cooked Thru 2009 and More!

[Timugen]

Why is my opinion negative? Am I missing something in ND football that you are seeing? I am angry because ND deserves better, is Charlie the answer? Next year will tell his tale. But the fact of the matter is I am not the only one who shares this opinion.

Repeat after me:

"The Emperor's new clothes are absolutely divine."

Then you'll be OK around here.

 

[NDMontana]

I just use other people's logic, because its clear to me that you don't want to listen to a word I say. Anyone can use this arguement in their favor. Few plays from 8-2, a few plays from 3-7. Reality is, we are closer to a few plays from 3-7 than 8-2.

I will no longer reply to these posts. Clearly the horse has been beaten, and its long dead. I think most of us will agree that anything less than 10 Wins (I say 11) and a BCS game is a failure and a new coach should be brought it.

I'm not sure what your logic is. We've won six games and only one of those six wins was in doubt; Ironically, it was the game versus San Diego State. Late game garbage scores are the only reason that the Stanford and Navy games were close contests.

Conversely, only BC and MSU blew us out. We should've beat NC and Pitt. I know, I know, I can shit in one hand and put should haves in the other hand and see which fills first. But it's worth noting that, if it weren't for a few rookie mistakes, we would be 8-2....or maybe 7-3 counting SDSU as a loss.

 

[mick2]

Why is my opinion negative? Am I missing something in ND football that you are seeing? I am angry because ND deserves better, is Charlie the answer? Next year will tell his tale. But the fact of the matter is I am not the only one who shares this opinion.

i thought you were done responding?

why is your opinion negative, because you jumped all over my post and declared that i need to stop defending mediocrity when all i'm doing is defending my team that i knew would be a work in progress, i predicted 8-4 you say you predicted 9-3, in ND football those are mediocre results.

and we actually held navy to 172 yds rushing their lowest since 2006 vs rutgers.

 

[phork]

"Holding" a team to almost 200 yards rushing is embarassing.

 

[mick2]

"Holding" a team to almost 200 yards rushing is embarassing.

we absolutely dominated that team defensively, and they average 300 a game so why is holding them to way less embarassing?? all they do is run?!?!?!

thats less than the vaunted pitt defense allowed.

 

[NDinL.A.]

"Holding" a team to almost 200 yards rushing is embarassing.

C'mon Phork, you're better than that. That is truly an ignorant post. Frustration??? This is a Navy team that hadn't been held to that low of a total in almost 2 years. All they do is run!!! And they run a tricky scheme, so it's not easy to defend, which is why they average over 300 yards per game. They run against EVERYBODY, and for 3 1/2 quarters they couldn't do crap. Only CW's niceness allowed them to finally run on us.

Go look up Navy's stats. Then rewatch the game on Saturday, and how our 'd' just stuffed the shit our of Navy drive after drive. Then tell us again that our defense embarrassed itself by holding Navy to 172 yards rushing. Because now you sound 'The Fan' who just spews hate all the time no matter what the outcome...

 

[irish4ever]

And if pigs could fly we wouldn't have bacon for breakfast....

I'd shoot the damn pig out of the sky and then butcher it to get the bacon!

 

[Sureal]

"Holding" a team to almost 200 yards rushing is embarassing.

Considering their offensive philosophy... No it's not. Defense was not the problem Saturday. Horrific decisions were.

 

[SoCalDomer]

The last time Navy was held to amount of rushing yards was 2006. And that was during a game when they lost their starting QB to injury.

 

[NeuteredDoomer]

I'd shoot the damn pig out of the sky and then butcher it to get the bacon!

Too funny. Made my day. lol. Still laughing.

 

[phork]

The last time Navy was held to amount of rushing yards was 2006. And that was during a game when they lost their starting QB to injury.

Good thing they play Florida, USC and Oklahoma every year. Oh wait that was Towson, VMI and Army.

 

[LOVEMYIRISH]

And back to the "Youth and Beauty" argument. Hear are the class breakouts of ND and BC from the ESPN page:

Freshman - ND: 29, BC:41
Sophs - ND: 25, BC: 23
Juniors - ND 33, BC: 22
Seniors - ND 24, BC: 17

SteveM

Ummm...cute #'s...now show me the scholarship players...

ND has the 3rd youngest Two-Deep roster in DivI-A football.

3rd.

 

[brentlycat]

I like Weis as a person,as a coach not so much.My criteria for this year was to show marked improvement in special teams,less mistakes,toughness up front.I saw none of the above,I believe we have to blowout syr.&usc for him to keep his job

 

[NDinL.A.]

I like Weis as a person,as a coach not so much.My criteria for this year was to show marked improvement in special teams,less mistakes,toughness up front.I saw none of the above,I believe we have to blowout syr.&usc for him to keep his job

We have to blowout USC to keep his job????? Are you for real? Have you been paying attention? The A.D. has repeatedly said that he's very happy with the direction of the program, that he sees progress, and that CW is very safe. Yeah, I don't blame people for being pissed off, but there is progress, esp in special teams, and the program will be alright. Just gotta be patient; the young boys are gonna be men very soon...

 

[brentlycat]

I may be way off here,but what about Mike Shanahan if Denver blows the west,I think he is highly organized,great evaluator of personnel and posseses the mindset to motivate/communicate with younger guys his team is prepared on gameday,something I have rarely seen in the Weis era win or lose,maybe I'm crazy or stupid all I know is I love NOTRE DAME!

 

[phork]

Before anyone suggests any more pro coaches, lets just remember that a motivator of multi-million dollar men is not the same as a motivator of boys playing to get those millions.
Too many failed experiments in the past with pro coaches, the odds are it would not work.
As for Weis losing his job this year? Highly unlikely, about as unlikely as ND blowing out USC. Finish this year 7-5 with a bowl win.

 

[brentlycat]

Before anyone suggests any more pro coaches, lets just remember that a motivator of multi-million dollar men is not the same as a motivator of boys playing to get those millions.
Too many failed experiments in the past with pro coaches, the odds are it would not work.
As for Weis losing his job this year? Highly unlikely, about as unlikely as ND blowing out USC. Finish this year 7-5 with a bowl win.

This team has lacked discipline since his arrival,remember and I quote Weis "we will be a mean,nasty,intelligent football team"Bullshit you can say what you want but the contract is out,the ditch has been dug,the A.D can say whatever and you can believe it but I guarantee the shortlist exists I'm not professing to have the answers that's the coaches job,he seems to be aloof in regards to our program it's disturbing and I like Weis as a person and wish him the best I just wish him the best somewhere else!

 

[mick2]

This team has lacked discipline since his arrival,remember and I quote Weis "we will be a mean,nasty,intelligent football team"Bullshit you can say what you want but the contract is out,the ditch has been dug,the A.D can say whatever and you can believe it but I guarantee the shortlist exists I'm not professing to have the answers that's the coaches job,he seems to be aloof in regards to our program it's disturbing and I like Weis as a person and wish him the best I just wish him the best somewhere else!

the shortlist exists??? and whos on it? tom clements? there are NO big name coaches out there to get. Charlie is here for next year and we compete for a NC next year.

 

[JeremyND07]

the shortlist exists??? and whos on it? tom clements? there are big name coaches out there to get. Charlie is here for next year and we compete for a NC next year.

OK I cannot believe I am typing this but I agree with Mick on the "list". The short list is VERY short and has NO big name coaches on it!!!! See last 3 coaching searches for proof that no one with a GREAT resume wants the HC job at ND. I really think Weis is the best that we can do right now as much as I do not agree with a lot he does. He is an excellant recruiter and with a new OL coach I think he can get the job done eventually.

 

[phork]

the shortlist exists??? and whos on it? tom clements? there are NO big name coaches out there to get. Charlie is here for next year and we compete for a NC next year.

While I agree with you here, the problem for ND is they are going to be ranked so far down the list and with our variety of cup cakes on the agenda for next year, its going to be hard to move up. Unless of course we start dropping C-Notes on teams regularly.

 

[SoCalDomer]

Good thing they play Florida, USC and Oklahoma every year. Oh wait that was Towson, VMI and Army.

Your cherry picking of information is so intellectually dishonest. This year, prior to playing ND, Navy played those teams, but also played:

Sat, Aug 30 Towson W 41-13 Audio
Fri, Sep 5 at Ball State L 23-35 Audio
Sat, Sep 13 at Duke L 31-41 Audio
Sat, Sep 20 Rutgers W 23-21 Audio
Sat, Sep 27 at (16) Wake Forest W 24-17 Audio
Sat, Oct 4 at Air Force W 33-27 Audio
Sat, Oct 18 (23) Pittsburgh L 21-42 Audio
Sat, Oct 25 Southern Methodist W 34-7 Audio
Sat, Nov 1 Temple W 33-27 Audio
Sat, Nov 15 Notre Dame L 21-27 Audio

Granted, those aren't world beaters but that's 4 BCS schools prior to ND's game. Wake Forest and Pittsburg were ranked in the top 25 at the time they played.

In 2007, Navy played:

08/31/07 at Temple Philadelphia, Pa. W, 30-19
09/07/07 at Rutgers Piscataway, N.J. L, 41-24
09/15/07 vs. Ball State Annapolis, Md. L, 34-31 (ot)
09/22/07 vs. Duke Annapolis, Md. W, 46-43
09/29/07 vs. Air Force Annapolis, Md. W, 31-20
10/10/07 at Pittsburgh Pittsburgh, Pa. W, 48-45 (2 ot)
10/20/07 vs. Wake Forest Annapolis, Md. L, 44-24
10/27/07 vs. Delaware Annapolis, Md. L, 59-52
11/03/07 at Notre Dame South Bend, Ind. W, 46-44 (3OT)
11/10/07 at North Texas Denton, Texas W, 74-62
11/17/07 vs. Northern Illinois Annapolis, Md. W, 35-24
12/01/07 vs. Army Baltimore, Md. W, 38-3
12/20/07 vs. Utah San Diego, Calif. L, 35-32

Again, 5 BCS schools, and one of the top non-BCS schools, Utah, in the bowl game.

In 2006, that Rutgers game was the last time Navy was held to as few of yards as ND's defense held them to last Saturday, and that includes the 2006 ND defense.

10/14/06 vs. Rutgers Annapolis, Md. L, 34-0
10/28/06 vs. Notre Dame Baltimore, Md. (M&T Bank Stadium) L, 38-14
11/04/06 at Duke Durham, N.C. W, 38-13
11/11/06 at Eastern Michigan Detroit, Mich. (Ford Field) W, 49-21
11/18/06 vs. Temple Annapolis, Md. W, 42-6
12/02/06 vs. Army Philadelphia, Pa. (Lincoln Financial Field) W, 26-14
12/30/06 vs. Boston College (Meineke Car Care Bowl) Charlotte, N.C. L, 25-24

So by my count, going back to that 2006 Rutgers game, 10 BCS schools and one of the top non-BCS schools (Utah) were not able to hold Navy to as few of yards as the 2008 ND defense did. That includes the 2006 ND defense.

And one of the big reasons Rutgers did hold them in 2006 was because the Navy starting QB went down with injury that game.

 

[LOVEMYIRISH]

I like Weis as a person,as a coach not so much.My criteria for this year was to show marked improvement in special teams,less mistakes,toughness up front.I saw none of the above,I believe we have to blowout syr.&usc for him to keep his job

Are you smoking crack? Kick off return coverage is #1 in the country. Special teams have shown improvement across the board. The DL did not crumble AS EXPECTED with the losses they had. And we have had a TON less mistakes.

58 sacks last year were due to MISTAKES...feel free to check the total now.

We have improved in every area you mentioned...SIGNIFICANTLY.

 

[LOVEMYIRISH]

I may be way off here,but what about Mike Shanahan if Denver blows the west,I think he is highly organized,great evaluator of personnel and posseses the mindset to motivate/communicate with younger guys his team is prepared on gameday,something I have rarely seen in the Weis era win or lose,maybe I'm crazy or stupid all I know is I love NOTRE DAME!

That's what people said about Weis before he came here.

Maybe the NFL thing is a bad idea?

 

[phork]

Your cherry picking of information is so intellectually dishonest. This year, prior to playing ND, Navy played those teams, but also played:

You are correct in that statement, but I still say those teams are not anywhere near the caliber of those teams I mentioned. When using Duke to back up your statements, you truly are stretching things a bit. Lets make a differentiation here.. Just because you are in a BCS conference, does not mean you are BCS caliber talent. Indiana will not be competing for a NC anytime in the foreseeable future as won't those teams you mentioned.

 

[mick2]

You are correct in that statement, but I still say those teams are not anywhere near the caliber of those teams I mentioned. When using Duke to back up your statements, you truly are stretching things a bit. Lets make a differentiation here.. Just because you are in a BCS conference, does not mean you are BCS caliber talent. Indiana will not be competing for a NC anytime in the foreseeable future as won't those teams you mentioned.

but we will.

 

[phork]

but we will.

Time will tell.

 

[SoCalDomer]

You are correct in that statement, but I still say those teams are not anywhere near the caliber of those teams I mentioned. When using Duke to back up your statements, you truly are stretching things a bit. Lets make a differentiation here.. Just because you are in a BCS conference, does not mean you are BCS caliber talent. Indiana will not be competing for a NC anytime in the foreseeable future as won't those teams you mentioned.

Every year, there are only about 10 out of 119 teams who have a realistic shot at competing for the NC. Only about 30 teams have a shot at a BCS bowl (that includes the 8 teams who do not make the NC game). So to use as "going to a NC game" as the benchmark of a good team is just a stupid argument.

Duke in prior years is obviously not much of an opponent. But look at Duke this year. They may end up at .500, which for Duke one year removed from three straight seasons of winning all of 3-games combined. Look at the margin of victory in Duke's wins and the margin of victory in some of their losses.

Be that as it may, if we throw Duke out, how many good BCS teams still were unable to do what ND's defense did since that 2006 Rutgers games? Do you know how many times Navy has been held to a few of yards prior to that 2006 Rutgers game? I don't imagine you do. I don't imagine you care.

Because rather than care about ND, you'd rather piss all over the defensive accomplisments because of your dislike of Weis.

The site has spiraled downward too much for me to tolerate.

 

[phork]

So how is Cutliffe doing it at Duke then? Clearly there is a talent gap between us?